101 Drawbacks to Releasing 4th Edition inside the next 5 years [Archive] - Wizards Community

101 Drawbacks to Releasing 4th Edition inside the next 5 years [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Rogue Shadows
03-25-06, 06:41 PM Gods below I hate those threads, and so do many people.

Let's list why.

1. 3.5 is not broken! Any RPG system is exploitable; that doesn't make it broken.

2. 3.5 is only something like 4 years old! Why do you want a new edition already?

3. There are dozens of books and hundreds of adventures that could still be made before 3.5 becomes saturated.
VictorC
03-25-06, 07:22 PM #4) 4th edition has been known to lead to cancer in laboratory animals.
Alac Luin
03-25-06, 07:24 PM 5) It will then start the speculation wondering when is 5.0 going to be released.
Rogue Shadows
03-25-06, 07:27 PM OH DEAR SWEET GODS NO!
MasterOfPsychic
03-25-06, 07:41 PM D&D consists of so many rules that is automaticly breaks itself.. Chaostheory... Simple as that.. 3.5 is broken...
speeblefreak
03-25-06, 07:42 PM 6. It will make me mad.

7. Incarnum, Tome of Magic, etcetera, prove that a total rules overhaul isn't necessary to follow new rules systems.

8. There are still 3.5 wish lists that Wizards could cater to.

9. Like expanded epic rules.

10. It will make me mad.
sir_dwar
03-25-06, 07:53 PM 12. More revisions means more money needed form us, means angry people..... Not to mention 4th edition isnt anywhere in this years scope.
Rogue Shadows
03-25-06, 07:56 PM 11. 3.0 is modular, that is, the rule system it is based around (the d20) can be adapted to a huge number of other kinds of games besides just D&D - such as Star Wars, d20 Modern, and so on.

13. Because people who want 4th Edition don't dance, and since they don't dance, they're not friends of mine.
kidradical
03-25-06, 09:48 PM The fourth Superman movie sucked.

The fourth Batman movie sucked.

The fourth Star Wars (Phantom Menace) movie sucked.

The athlete who finished fourth in an Olympic event doesn't even get a medal.

The fourth Star Trek movie was pretty good, but unless you're going to get Leonard Nimoy to direct D&D4E, it doesn't count.

The Fourth of July is pretty good, though, so there's always that.

Pax,

ASH
Leatherwood
03-26-06, 12:40 PM 15) All the arguements we had concerning the weakness of certian aspects of the game (rangers, bards, half-orcs) would be rehashed all over again.
16) All the arguements we had concerning the brokenness of certian aspects of the game (polymorph, clerics & druids...) would be rehashed all over again.
17) You'd be turning the folks who started out playing 3.0 into "the old guard". Imagine for a moment a 16 year old saying "well, back in 3rd edition, when the game didn't have all these new fangled things..."
18) We wouldn't have the pleasure of all of these "4th edition" speculation threads.
19) We wouldn't have the pleasure of mocking those who start "4th edition" speculation threads.
Quietus_Silivren
03-26-06, 01:36 PM Gods below I hate those threads, and so do many people.

Let's list why.

1. 3.5 is not broken! Any RPG system is exploitable; that doesn't make it broken.

2. 3.5 is only something like 4 years old! Why do you want a new edition already?

3. There are dozens of books and hundreds of adventures that could still be made before 3.5 becomes saturated.
1. No, it's not broken; it just never worked in the first place. In a system designed to have a rules answer to every "can I" question, the rules aren't good enough. It's incomplete, full of quick-fixes and cop-outs like the sorry excuse for a diplomacy skill (just an example, there are more).

2. See above. It doesn't work, that's why.

3. There is no limit to what could be made to expand upon and take advantage of the 3.5 system, and it would no doubt all (or mostly) be enjoyable. But it could be better, is all.

I find your signature rather ironic. If you don't want people to discuss 4th Ed, don't make 4th Ed. discussion threads. Makes sense, no? And don't get me wrong, I'm not looking for a 4th Edition too terribly soon, either, and I'm still getting plenty of enjoyment out of 3.5 Ed. I just felt like playing the devil's advocate.
Mirikon
03-26-06, 04:28 PM 20) Because we'll have 100+ threads with people whining and complaining that they're being forced at gunpoint to buy the new edition.
21) Because that will make me want to kick their ass.
22) Because that will get me sent to prison.
23) Because i don't think there's a good D&D group in county jail.
24) Because I don't want to have a cell mate named Bubba.
Monkeygod
03-26-06, 04:52 PM 25) because you can never please everybody.

some people wont like 4.0, and demand a return to 3.x or they'll want a 5th edition.

best solution for those of you with problems with 3.x:

fix what u dont like, or play a different version(there are plenty of other phb-esque books out there from other companies)...or play 2nd edition....

sure 4.0 might be great for some people, maybe, but it might suck out loud for alot of others...

then those people will demand 5.0....

ridiculous much??
jokamachi
03-26-06, 06:09 PM 26) Because I won't buy it.
speeblefreak
03-26-06, 07:22 PM 27. Because I don't want to have to spend forever getting my head wrapped around the new rules system.
mathx314
03-26-06, 07:36 PM 28) Because some of us have substantial amounts of money invested in 3.5.
Mirikon
03-26-06, 09:42 PM 28) Because some of us have substantial amounts of money invested in 3.5.

Um, just a thought, but if they, say, changed over five years from now, wouldn't you have even more money invested in it by then?
Valkaun_Dain
03-26-06, 11:16 PM (29) They'll screw it up with a bunch of Ebberon crap and remove references to Greyhawk. Then again that might not be bad as it might free up Greyhawk to be liscensed to an independant publisher. Scratch #29 and make this #1 for why I want them to do it! For more on that check this out:

http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=488063 (http://)

It's my 4th Edition scoop from Ed Greenwood at GenCon05. Enjoy.
Aeolus91
03-27-06, 04:31 PM 30. With each new edition, the books get more and more expensive, so by fourth edition,we should be up to the point where you need to have a high six-figure income to play the hobby.

31. All the third-party books made with the d20 OGL will be obsolete,

32. And so it will make literally HUNDREDS of books obsolete.

Yet again...

Reason 2 for why they SHOULD: Because I'll keep playing 3.5 and all the books will be way cheaper.

Rawr!
:dragon:
Arrowhen
03-27-06, 09:50 PM In a system designed to have a rules answer to every "can I" question, the rules aren't good enough.
Replace "aren't" with "can't ever possibly be". WotC's continued efforts to make the DM obsolete have ensured an endless series of rules arguments that they can eventually point to as evidence that a new edition is needed.

With each new edition, the books get more and more expensive, so by fourth edition,we should be up to the point where you need to have a high six-figure income to play the hobby.
In any edition you only need the core rules. The price of those hasn't gone up any faster than the price of any other comparably sized books. What every edition does need, however, is a large enough contingent of players who do think you need all the supplements. Despite the "hell no, we won't upgrade!" sentiments one occasionally sees on the boards, WotC knows that it has enough loyal consumers to support another edition, which is why you will see one as soon they run out of "must have" supplements for the current one.

All the third-party books made with the d20 OGL will be obsolete
There are those who belive that this was one of the motives behind the switch to 3.5. I don't know that I believe it or not, but the change did hurt a number of third party publishers.
Frostbrand
03-27-06, 10:11 PM Riots and Killings..... nuff said.
WizO_Cat
03-27-06, 10:19 PM Let's give the 4th edition talk a break for a while. It's just lead to numerous flame wars and it's based on speculation. Thanks.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Rogue Shadows 03-25-06, 06:41 PM	Gods below I hate those threads, and so do many people. Let's list why. 1. 3.5 is not broken! Any RPG system is exploitable; that doesn't make it broken. 2. 3.5 is only something like 4 years old! Why do you want a new edition already? 3. There are dozens of books and hundreds of adventures that could still be made before 3.5 becomes saturated.
VictorC 03-25-06, 07:22 PM	#4) 4th edition has been known to lead to cancer in laboratory animals.
Alac Luin 03-25-06, 07:24 PM	5) It will then start the speculation wondering when is 5.0 going to be released.
Rogue Shadows 03-25-06, 07:27 PM	OH DEAR SWEET GODS NO!
MasterOfPsychic 03-25-06, 07:41 PM	D&D consists of so many rules that is automaticly breaks itself.. Chaostheory... Simple as that.. 3.5 is broken...
speeblefreak 03-25-06, 07:42 PM	6. It will make me mad. 7. Incarnum, Tome of Magic, etcetera, prove that a total rules overhaul isn't necessary to follow new rules systems. 8. There are still 3.5 wish lists that Wizards could cater to. 9. Like expanded epic rules. 10. It will make me mad.
sir_dwar 03-25-06, 07:53 PM	12. More revisions means more money needed form us, means angry people..... Not to mention 4th edition isnt anywhere in this years scope.
Rogue Shadows 03-25-06, 07:56 PM	11. 3.0 is modular, that is, the rule system it is based around (the d20) can be adapted to a huge number of other kinds of games besides just D&D - such as Star Wars, d20 Modern, and so on. 13. Because people who want 4th Edition don't dance, and since they don't dance, they're not friends of mine.
kidradical 03-25-06, 09:48 PM	The fourth Superman movie sucked. The fourth Batman movie sucked. The fourth Star Wars (Phantom Menace) movie sucked. The athlete who finished fourth in an Olympic event doesn't even get a medal. The fourth Star Trek movie was pretty good, but unless you're going to get Leonard Nimoy to direct D&D4E, it doesn't count. The Fourth of July is pretty good, though, so there's always that. Pax, ASH
Leatherwood 03-26-06, 12:40 PM	15) All the arguements we had concerning the weakness of certian aspects of the game (rangers, bards, half-orcs) would be rehashed all over again. 16) All the arguements we had concerning the brokenness of certian aspects of the game (polymorph, clerics & druids...) would be rehashed all over again. 17) You'd be turning the folks who started out playing 3.0 into "the old guard". Imagine for a moment a 16 year old saying "well, back in 3rd edition, when the game didn't have all these new fangled things..." 18) We wouldn't have the pleasure of all of these "4th edition" speculation threads. 19) We wouldn't have the pleasure of mocking those who start "4th edition" speculation threads.
Quietus_Silivren 03-26-06, 01:36 PM	Gods below I hate those threads, and so do many people. Let's list why. 1. 3.5 is not broken! Any RPG system is exploitable; that doesn't make it broken. 2. 3.5 is only something like 4 years old! Why do you want a new edition already? 3. There are dozens of books and hundreds of adventures that could still be made before 3.5 becomes saturated. 1. No, it's not broken; it just never worked in the first place. In a system designed to have a rules answer to every "can I" question, the rules aren't good enough. It's incomplete, full of quick-fixes and cop-outs like the sorry excuse for a diplomacy skill (just an example, there are more). 2. See above. It doesn't work, that's why. 3. There is no limit to what could be made to expand upon and take advantage of the 3.5 system, and it would no doubt all (or mostly) be enjoyable. But it could be better, is all. I find your signature rather ironic. If you don't want people to discuss 4th Ed, don't make 4th Ed. discussion threads. Makes sense, no? And don't get me wrong, I'm not looking for a 4th Edition too terribly soon, either, and I'm still getting plenty of enjoyment out of 3.5 Ed. I just felt like playing the devil's advocate.
Mirikon 03-26-06, 04:28 PM	20) Because we'll have 100+ threads with people whining and complaining that they're being forced at gunpoint to buy the new edition. 21) Because that will make me want to kick their ass. 22) Because that will get me sent to prison. 23) Because i don't think there's a good D&D group in county jail. 24) Because I don't want to have a cell mate named Bubba.
Monkeygod 03-26-06, 04:52 PM	25) because you can never please everybody. some people wont like 4.0, and demand a return to 3.x or they'll want a 5th edition. best solution for those of you with problems with 3.x: fix what u dont like, or play a different version(there are plenty of other phb-esque books out there from other companies)...or play 2nd edition.... sure 4.0 might be great for some people, maybe, but it might suck out loud for alot of others... then those people will demand 5.0.... ridiculous much??
jokamachi 03-26-06, 06:09 PM	26) Because I won't buy it.
speeblefreak 03-26-06, 07:22 PM	27. Because I don't want to have to spend forever getting my head wrapped around the new rules system.
mathx314 03-26-06, 07:36 PM	28) Because some of us have substantial amounts of money invested in 3.5.
Mirikon 03-26-06, 09:42 PM	28) Because some of us have substantial amounts of money invested in 3.5. Um, just a thought, but if they, say, changed over five years from now, wouldn't you have even more money invested in it by then?
Valkaun_Dain 03-26-06, 11:16 PM	(29) They'll screw it up with a bunch of Ebberon crap and remove references to Greyhawk. Then again that might not be bad as it might free up Greyhawk to be liscensed to an independant publisher. Scratch #29 and make this #1 for why I want them to do it! For more on that check this out: http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=488063 (http://) It's my 4th Edition scoop from Ed Greenwood at GenCon05. Enjoy.
Aeolus91 03-27-06, 04:31 PM	30. With each new edition, the books get more and more expensive, so by fourth edition,we should be up to the point where you need to have a high six-figure income to play the hobby. 31. All the third-party books made with the d20 OGL will be obsolete, 32. And so it will make literally HUNDREDS of books obsolete. Yet again... Reason 2 for why they SHOULD: Because I'll keep playing 3.5 and all the books will be way cheaper. Rawr! :dragon:
Arrowhen 03-27-06, 09:50 PM	In a system designed to have a rules answer to every "can I" question, the rules aren't good enough. Replace "aren't" with "can't ever possibly be". WotC's continued efforts to make the DM obsolete have ensured an endless series of rules arguments that they can eventually point to as evidence that a new edition is needed. With each new edition, the books get more and more expensive, so by fourth edition,we should be up to the point where you need to have a high six-figure income to play the hobby. In any edition you only need the core rules. The price of those hasn't gone up any faster than the price of any other comparably sized books. What every edition does need, however, is a large enough contingent of players who do think you need all the supplements. Despite the "hell no, we won't upgrade!" sentiments one occasionally sees on the boards, WotC knows that it has enough loyal consumers to support another edition, which is why you will see one as soon they run out of "must have" supplements for the current one. All the third-party books made with the d20 OGL will be obsolete There are those who belive that this was one of the motives behind the switch to 3.5. I don't know that I believe it or not, but the change did hurt a number of third party publishers.
Frostbrand 03-27-06, 10:11 PM	Riots and Killings..... nuff said.
WizO_Cat 03-27-06, 10:19 PM	Let's give the 4th edition talk a break for a while. It's just lead to numerous flame wars and it's based on speculation. Thanks.