Post/Author/DateTime	Post
WotC_Bart 10-27-05, 05:50 PM	We're back! On 10/28, Design & Development returns, with the results of the first "You Craft the Creature" vote, and the start of the second -- based on tomorrow's article topic. Look for it at: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/dd/20051028a.
BrianCritchley 10-28-05, 12:18 AM	ugh an abberation hwo making one of these suckers stand out is gonna be tricky. this is why after some thought I voted Mobster. most abberations are eaither the mastermind or other simielr things, a "mobster arrrbiration" would be intresting and provide a nifty alternative to the orc.
blargney the second 10-28-05, 12:20 AM	I love these design & development articles! I've recently started DMing an increasing amount, and I'm getting a lot of useful insight about ways to think about the game. Thank you for the continued wonderful support for D&D! -blarg EDIT: What niche do monsters like the Ethereal Filcher fill?
KhanSemus 10-28-05, 12:43 AM	i said nutcracker. i mean, if u all wanted an aberration it might as well kick everybody around
Rocketboy13 10-28-05, 01:47 AM	I don't think there are any mobster Aberrations, and seeing a large group of tentecled monstrousities at low level would be a good break from the humanoids and monsterous humanoids that define the usual encounters at low levels. :whatsthis "Another orc infested dungeon for the new adventurers in town to cut their teeth on, that is like the 50th one of them, maybe wuld should stop letting them build those things to begin with." Besides having a creature that can be masterminded by the Mindflayer that isn't a Grimlock would be a good switch. :coolcthul
Tyhm 10-28-05, 06:49 AM	I choose Classy. I'd love to see a monster the Mindflayers can release en masse (preferably without consulting XPH) that scares the bejeezus out of everyone but the bard - the reigning master of sonic attacks.
Pervy Hobbit Fancier 10-28-05, 07:48 AM	I voted "Mobster". There are a severe shortage of mobsters in the Aberration group.
Morka 10-28-05, 09:27 AM	I vote classy. The RPG Design Test (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/dd/20050930b) listed many "things to explore," and most are class specific.
InfoStorm 10-28-05, 10:12 AM	I Definately didn't want another "boss" abberation, three of the prima villian types are boos abberations (Aboleth, Mind flayer, Beholder) and existing abberations often takes roles of nutcrackers, Class-strat, & Soft. I was torn between the Mobster, Hard Target, and Spoiler, but thought spoiler would be best. Thinking of something that gained immunities to energy types after being hit by them, and maybe even DR's vs weapon types(pierce/slash/bludgeon), but can have only one immunity & one DR type at 1 time.
mw_shipping 10-28-05, 12:25 PM	I voted for Mobster, not so much for having something the mind flayer could send out en mass (that is what thralls are for after all) but, like others have said, so that you can have a monster other than the run of the mill orc, goblin, hobgoblin filled dungeon for 1st - 5th level characters to deal with..... and who knows, maybe this paves the way for a real nasty mastermind down the road. :plotting: :devil: :schemes: he he he :heehee Stephen
Tyhm 10-28-05, 02:14 PM	I Definately didn't want another "boss" abberation, three of the prima villian types are boos abberations (Aboleth, Mind flayer, Beholder) and existing abberations often takes roles of nutcrackers, Class-strat, & Soft. I was torn between the Mobster, Hard Target, and Spoiler, but thought spoiler would be best. Thinking of something that gained immunities to energy types after being hit by them, and maybe even DR's vs weapon types(pierce/slash/bludgeon), but can have only one immunity & one DR type at 1 time. What, like a skindancer....? And: it was touched on in the article, but mobsters not scaling well is a universal problem. Eventually you reach the problem of They can't fly, they can't see invisibility, and they can't disintegrate forcecages, etc. For that I'd say we need a template like Paragon just for thugs...
InfoStorm 10-28-05, 02:23 PM	What, like a skindancer....? And: it was touched on in the article, but mobsters not scaling well is a universal problem. Eventually you reach the problem of They can't fly, they can't see invisibility, and they can't disintegrate forcecages, etc. For that I'd say we need a template like Paragon just for thugs... Guess that shows I don't have 100% of the stuff memorized. :D
PearlJamaholic 10-28-05, 03:01 PM	mobster for the reason many have already said. something other than goblin, orcs, etc for early levels.
sabrewolf 10-28-05, 03:25 PM	I picked up Hard Target.. something about a big bug of doom in my mind. :plotting: But the mobsterīs reasons make sense so if i the end we get a swarm of small weird-looking bugs of doom, :evillaugh the better... :D
Takasi 10-28-05, 04:53 PM	Dolgrims IMO are solid aberration mobsters. Dolgaunts are decent. That said, I wouldn't mind seeing more creatures like this. We have plenty of aberration masterminds.
Galen_Michael 10-28-05, 05:31 PM	What, like a skindancer....? What is a skindancer? Infostorm: I really like your energy resistance/DR adaption idea. Galen
Lord Doombringer 10-28-05, 05:37 PM	What is a skindancer? Galen Skindancers are from the MMIII. They gain DR based on what weapon last hit them. WOO-HOO for Aberrations! :behold: I voted mastermind/boss because that's how aberrations work best, but my second choice would be for it to be a mobster for an interesting change of pace.
MindWandererB 10-28-05, 06:48 PM	Is it just me, or are these categories kind of odd? Mostly, they're in no way mutually exclusive. Mobsters have good attack bonuses and few, consistent special abilities. Nutcrackers can deal damage irrespective of the character's AC. Spoilers have defenses, like DR and SR, specific against certain attack types. Soft Targets have low AC, lots of hit points, and no DR. Hard Targets have high AC, few hit points, and no DR. Melee Hurters have either a counterattack defensive ability or a mass melee attack. Class Strategy monsters are geared to be easily hurt by certain classes. Masterminds have poor defenses but great special abilities, usually relying on minions for their defense. Note that Mobsters, Nutcrackers, and Masterminds are defined primarily by their offensive capabilities, but Spoilers, Soft Targets, Hard Targets, Class Strategy, and Melee Hurters (effectively) are defined by their defensive capabilities. It is therefore quite possible to have an enemy that is both a Nutcracker and a Soft Target, for example. In fact, I would say that every enemy needs both a defensive category and an offensive category. Furthermore, some monsters fall into more than one offensive category, or even more than one defensive category. Shocker Lizards are some of my favorite Mobster/Nutcrackers, for instance, and Rogue Strategy enemies are sure to be Soft Targets. That being said, some categories interact better than others. Mobsters are more fun to DM as Hard than Soft Targets, since there's fewer HPs to track. Masterminds are more fun as Soft Targets, giving players a feeling of "whittling away" at them. I think we should go for a combination of characteristics that isn't usually seen. Here are my candidates: Mobster/Melee Hurter: It's not a big deal to bust out the ranged weapons and spells against a single monster. It's a lot harder to deal with them en masse. One way of doing this combination is with "exploding" enemies. Mobster/Spoiler: What makes big crowds of enemies harder to deal with? SR and energy resistance, that's what. Mobster/Mastermind: Think Voltron. Wait, bad example. Well, you get the idea. Perhaps "Legion" from the Castlevania games is a better example. This would be a good way of scaling them up so they can deal with flight/invisibility/etc. Mobster/Nutcracker: This is a great way of making mobsters that represent a decent threat at multiple levels. Melee Hurter/Soft Target: It's just begging to be melee'd. Until you actually try it. Wizard Strategy/Mastermind: Nukers usually shine against large numbers, especially minions. A high-DR, low-SR boss forces the warriors and the nukers to switch roles. So here's what I would vote for, if I could enter this in the radio buttons: a Mobster/Nutcracker/Melee Hurter that can combine multiple monsters into one big Mastermind/Soft Target.
Manyfist 10-29-05, 01:29 AM	Don't forget that Elan are abberations as well. They have great potential for a Mastermind, what's a better mastermind, besides the Racial Memory thing, than to live it through your own exp. 1000 years for an Elan is just a blink of an eye, living forever has it's advantages, that's why Vampires are so damn hard to deal with. For they can just keep on coming back for more, and learn from past mistakes, as long they're not in sunlight or crossing over running H20, or having their coffin smashed to pieces by a generic fighter. :D Illithid, I would say would have an entire army of Humanoids, and tons and tons of Belivers. 10 Illithid Thrallherders with a score of 25+ on leadership, would have enough humanoids to conquer even the toughest opponents. That's 1350 lvl 1 belivers, 130 lvl 2 belivers, 70 lvl 3 belivers, 40 lvl 4 belivers, 20 lvl 5 belivers, and 20 lvl 6 Belivers. That's 1700 conscripts, that can be replaced in 24 Hours, as well as 10 lvl 17 thralls, and 10 lvl 16 Thralls. 20 'Generals' that's enough to conquer a nation. Then you got at least 2 charmed body guards (Ogres, maybe even Gaints) per Illithid. That's I would say too many #s, then you got the Ultrathid, and the Elderbrains, that's alot of loving going around the table I say. The ONLY three things stopping a full frontal assasult, Aboelths, The Sun, and Each other.
Lead_rhino 10-29-05, 03:30 PM	I voted for mobster, I can just see the raging abberation mob specializing in ranged weapons. :coolcthul
Prak, the Mad 10-30-05, 02:04 AM	I voted Melee Hurter, I just like the idea of a big aberration lumbering into combat and smashing away the pcs
warlockco 10-30-05, 12:29 PM	I can't believe Dragon came in 2nd place :weep: I'm voting for Mastermind, more behind the scenes masters of everything are cool.
conjurer_lord 10-30-05, 02:37 PM	I can't believe Dragon came in 2nd place :weep: I'm voting for Mastermind, more behind the scenes masters of everything are cool. There are enough aberration masterminds. I went class/strategies. An aberration as the chief general, or primary assassin, or wizard advisor would be cool.
lord_zack 10-30-05, 07:08 PM	Absolutely positively don't vote Mastermind! Mind Flayer, Aboleth, Beholder! There are enough Mastermind Aberrations!
Tyhm 10-31-05, 01:12 AM	Absolutely positively don't vote Mastermind! Mind Flayer, Aboleth, Beholder! There are enough Mastermind Aberrations! Hear hear! I say if that wins, they post the Mindflayer and we start from scratch. I think we've had better ideas HERE than are likely to come from that direction...
Karlindel 11-01-05, 11:06 PM	I'm rather happy aberrations won out. It does leave a lot of design space open, and I like the way things are going so far. MindwandererB has an excellent point that the categories are not mutually exclusive. I'd like to see something a little different from the norm. Let me add to the voices that there are plenty of Mastermind aberrations already. I cast my vote for class/strategies. I'd like to see something that allowed specific classes to shine. I'd particularly like something that could simultaneously allow the monk, paladin, and bard to shine. ;-) A highly mobile enemy with a sonic attack, for example.
Morka 11-02-05, 09:20 AM	Is it just me, or are these categories kind of odd? Mostly, they're in no way mutually exclusive. Mobsters have good attack bonuses and few, consistent special abilities. Nutcrackers can deal damage irrespective of the character's AC. Spoilers have defenses, like DR and SR, specific against certain attack types. Soft Targets have low AC, lots of hit points, and no DR. Hard Targets have high AC, few hit points, and no DR. Melee Hurters have either a counterattack defensive ability or a mass melee attack. Class Strategy monsters are geared to be easily hurt by certain classes. Masterminds have poor defenses but great special abilities, usually relying on minions for their defense. Note that Mobsters, Nutcrackers, and Masterminds are defined primarily by their offensive capabilities, but Spoilers, Soft Targets, Hard Targets, Class Strategy, and Melee Hurters (effectively) are defined by their defensive capabilities. It is therefore quite possible to have an enemy that is both a Nutcracker and a Soft Target, for example. In fact, I would say that every enemy needs both a defensive category and an offensive category. Furthermore, some monsters fall into more than one offensive category, or even more than one defensive category. Shocker Lizards are some of my favorite Mobster/Nutcrackers, for instance, and Rogue Strategy enemies are sure to be Soft Targets. That being said, some categories interact better than others. Mobsters are more fun to DM as Hard than Soft Targets, since there's fewer HPs to track. Masterminds are more fun as Soft Targets, giving players a feeling of "whittling away" at them. I think we should go for a combination of characteristics that isn't usually seen. Here are my candidates: Mobster/Melee Hurter: It's not a big deal to bust out the ranged weapons and spells against a single monster. It's a lot harder to deal with them en masse. One way of doing this combination is with "exploding" enemies. Mobster/Spoiler: What makes big crowds of enemies harder to deal with? SR and energy resistance, that's what. Mobster/Mastermind: Think Voltron. Wait, bad example. Well, you get the idea. Perhaps "Legion" from the Castlevania games is a better example. This would be a good way of scaling them up so they can deal with flight/invisibility/etc. Mobster/Nutcracker: This is a great way of making mobsters that represent a decent threat at multiple levels. Melee Hurter/Soft Target: It's just begging to be melee'd. Until you actually try it. Wizard Strategy/Mastermind: Nukers usually shine against large numbers, especially minions. A high-DR, low-SR boss forces the warriors and the nukers to switch roles. So here's what I would vote for, if I could enter this in the radio buttons: a Mobster/Nutcracker/Melee Hurter that can combine multiple monsters into one big Mastermind/Soft Target. You're right. I say we could keep the two winning categories. The first one as the main category, and the second to add flavor to the monster. For example, the orcs are described as Mobsters. But an high level orc barbarian would become a good Soft Target or Melee Hurter.
skullhead 11-03-05, 02:35 AM	I voted for aberration initially, and mobster for this round. I agree with many of the previous posters. A "mobster" type aberration would be a good change of pace for this creature type.
Graven Thendor 11-03-05, 01:58 PM	After reading the comments that have been made, my chioce is for spoiler. Although giving it a second niche would be an interesting concept, as the niches descibed are not mutually exlusive( as pointed out by MindWanderB). In my campaigns, I often find that I have to insert spoilers to either put a character/player back in line when they begin to get too powerful or uppity, or to give a character/player a reason to contiue to play- keep their interest in the game. One can only use so many displacer beasts to "eat" magic items, before the players cacth on to a) the beasts powers and weaknesses and b) your diabolical plot to rid them of thier most valuable possesion ( you know the that the character could'nt possibly survive without!) As far as the mobster idea, mmm? Does the monster type (abberition, humaniod, etc.) really impact low level caracters? There are plenty of mobsters out there, and they are easy to create/modify if you really need a change of pace.
Irian 11-04-05, 01:45 AM	Yikes. It had to be expected, but whey are people so $§%#! ? Mastermind won?! I am extremely disappointed and I fear future results. How about the Boards do their own 'craft the creature' - using always the second choice of the official poll, so that we get at least something useful out of this? Edit: Oh, and let me predict the results of the next vote: CR 15+ wins with a landslide (but only because epic is not an option) :rolleyes:
Tyhm 11-04-05, 02:22 AM	That's, um, impressive. On my end, the poll's still going. :-P Yeah, I'm all for the underdog competition. Less about popularity, more about design. We had some good ideas on the old thread, but that's been so thoroughly mummified I can't get the energy to actually develop any of the ideas to fruition.
Irian 11-04-05, 07:46 AM	That's, um, impressive. On my end, the poll's still going. :-P It's strange, the article doesn't show up on the main page, but the rss feed provided a link to the new design article: Why We Aren’t Funny (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/dd/20051104a&dcmp=ILC-RSSDND)
Xyl 11-04-05, 10:01 AM	An aberration mastermind. How original. Yes, there's a definite shortage of those. :rolleyes: Oh well. There's a good spread of aberration masterminds at higher CRs, but I don't think there's a good "mastermind" monster at CR 3-5. So I'm going to pick that, and if you want one for higher levels you can always throw on some class levels. Who knows, the result might even be playable as a PC.
Tyhm 11-04-05, 10:21 AM	Hear hear. A flawed vote by the numbers anyway, as the thinking man's vote is split (Hmm, Spoiler? Nutcracker? Melee Hurter? Mobster? Class/Strategies? Wait, that's all of the above!) while the automaton's vote is clear (MINDFLAIRS ROOL!) So we'll try and dig it out I suppose, but barring that, umm, do we even wanna keep Abberation for our side project, or go back to the 10/14 thread? (Then again, on reading the content of the preceding page, is it possible Lord Decker of the Crossword Puzzles is having a little fun at our expense? 10/14, 10/28, 11/3...)
Irian 11-04-05, 10:54 AM	I'd vote for keeping Aberration because there was a good point raised about the uniqueness of a mobster aberration. But should we throw in a secondary catgeory as suggested on page one?
Graven Thendor 11-04-05, 12:06 PM	Some poeple just want to stick with what they are cofortable with. Hey Tyhm,how do I find those older threads? I'm new to this whole message board thing. Thanks. I agree with Irian, let's stick with the Aberration Mobster and add a spoiler as well. Or maybe we could craft a society of Aberrations that have different types of niches. Just to cover all the bases, even the dreaded mastermind.
Tyhm 11-04-05, 12:27 PM	http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=518448 <- the old thread, or to view Other Threads In General there's that big directory listing at the top of the page. A society of abberations...hmm, possibly a neutral one? Isolationist farplane-warped humanoids, shunned by surfacedwellers but not necessarily disgusting so much as unique, make excellent thralls...should Spoiler go towards DR or SR though? Flayers have the SR, so something that resembles and works with them but has DR seems like the better choice...
Xyl 11-04-05, 01:28 PM	The unusual alphabetizing in the XPH appears to be in the suggested names for half-giants (bet that had them rolling in the aisles). Any idea on the table in the DMG?
Graven Thendor 11-04-05, 01:39 PM	Thanks for the link. Great stuff! As for which one you should post first? Intelligent ooze gets my vote, but it needs to be immune to fire and acid attacks. As my players will use these two methods of ranged attacks on anything that even looks like it could be oozy, moldy, fungal, etc.. This has cuased me to give up on these types. :schemes: An Evil Fey would be interesting, but does'nt that condradict the whole nature base of Fey? :confused: As for the society of mobster Aberrations, It could be divided into a caste system where each caste has a different niche function-one caste could be the warrior drones that represent the Hard Target, Another caste would be for the Spioler (DR), another for Spoiler (SR), etc... :pile: I realize it means essentally creating several monsters. Or maybe a template type system. :invasion:
MindWandererB 11-04-05, 02:29 PM	I'm all in agreement with the "underdog" vote. However, that would make it a mobster dragon, not a mobster aberration. And I'm guessing that it'll be CR 3-5, since I agree that CR 15+ will win this time. I wish there weren't so many people who just click on something and leave- judging by the message boards, fey and mobster looked like the winners. If we like the aberration mobster so much, I vote we create a weaker version of the CR 15+ monster that'll win the poll. Also- has anyone picked out the 3E jokes that Dave Noonan pointed out- the table numbering in the DMG and the alphabetization in the XPH? I'll keep my eyes peeled for them, but that's so minor I may never notice even now that I'm aware of them.
Lord Doombringer 11-04-05, 03:16 PM	I voted mastermind at first, but I found it too common and switched my vote to something else (what was it...?). Anyways, I'm just going to say that I hope this creature is damn unique if it's going to be yet another abberant mastermind... BTW, does this monster go to the website afterwards, or is it going to be in the MMIV or something?
Graven Thendor 11-04-05, 03:58 PM	Ok- I'm a little behind in the abbreviation department, what is the XPH? It is too bad that the 3.0-3.5 designers lost their humor. It is an important part of most games. I actually designed an adventure based on humor. Back to the creature creation. CR 3-5 sounds good. But I think all those that are just voting and running will probably go with CR 15.
BrianCritchley 11-04-05, 04:07 PM	ya know, the problem with an abberation mastermind is.. they are so friken common, this critter won't have any tracktion. it'll get lost among the mind flayers etc
Rocketboy13 11-04-05, 04:20 PM	You know, I was having a conversation just a week or so ago about how Wizards should release a Heroes of Humor book (in the line of Heroes of Battle and Heroes of Horror) in April 2006, for April Fool's Day. We even started to debate what they could put into it, a chapter on munchkining, :evillaugh funny weapons (like the pie launching crossbow, or rubber chicken nunchuks), :rimshot: and feats that require successful perform (comedy) checks :blink:, monsters that have not been seen in 3.0+ bceasue they make no sense (A giant hand that fires different spells from it's colorfully painted nails, or a giant rubber chiken, or a template for giant anything because once you change scale, everything is funny, eg big boobs = Nice, giant boobs = better, dolly parton = funny boobs) :rimshot: And an expansion on how to apply humor to a D&D game, something originally covered in the DMG. :rofl: What do you think? :confused:
Tyhm 11-05-05, 12:04 AM	XPH is Expanded Psionics Handbook The DMG joke is the random NPC traits - one is No Sense of Humour, and it's right where the numbers stop meshing properly (I can't remember if it was You can't roll it, or The Next One can't be rolled, or they missed a number, something like that) Evil Fey are entirely in keeping with Fey - The Unseelie Court, the old Faerie tales where they kill babies and all that. So let's get cracking. I hear requests for fireproof oozes - that like the Crystal Troll in MM3, the vulnerable to sonic sense? (Somehow I recall a slime that grows when burned...) Still an interest in playable oozes, pretty warlock fey, etc?
Irian 11-05-05, 05:20 AM	If we like the aberration mobster so much, I vote we create a weaker version of the CR 15+ monster that'll win the poll. Actually, I think that's probably the best way to do it, because otherwise it could be difficult to follow through later steps in the 'craft the creature' process (like for example the vote on artwork)...
nathaniel mason 11-05-05, 06:53 AM	can any oneplease email me the basic rules cause im new to d&d and im realy keen on learning but i dont know were to start. can anyone help me??? email- nathanielmason@hotmail.com
Graven Thendor 11-05-05, 11:29 AM	I looked in the DMG 3.0 and could'nt find a table for NPC Traits. I than checked to see if they still had the Wand of Wonder, and nearly panicked....whew! they just changed it to the Rod of Wonder. So at least there is that, the rod is always good for some luaghs, although they did remove its gender changing ablities. A stream of 600 butterflies appearing in the middle of a life and death situation will always cuase laughter, as will getting your skin color changed to purple, blue or green :D I haven't allowed psionics in my campaigns for years. The rules always seemed too cumbersome for effecient play- o0(much like the 3.0 combat system)0o.
sabrewolf 11-05-05, 04:21 PM	Yikes. It had to be expected, but whey are people so $§%#! ? Mastermind won?! I am extremely disappointed and I fear future results. :nonono: . . . :raincloud . . . :weep: How about the Boards do their own 'craft the creature' - using always the second choice of the official poll, so that we get at least something useful out of this? It is an idea.. at least for us that didnt voted for yet another mastermind.. ;) Or mayhaps mix the seccond 2 or 3 for a more unique idea.. or a true aberration.. Edit: Oh, and let me predict the results of the next vote: CR 15+ wins with a landslide (but only because epic is not an option) :rolleyes: ..Well, i hope not. At least iīm considering the funny choice: a mastermind of CR 3.. adn voting for it. :P
Tyhm 11-05-05, 06:51 PM	*shrugs* We all know the statblock, let's post 'em as we make 'em. Big talk from someone who hasn't even touched his projects, sure, but that's no reason for anyone else to hesitate, I'd like to see some of your Abberation Low-CR Mobsters. Old statblock, I should think; the new one's nice, but we're not used to it yet. Are we? Oh, and I dunno about the 3.0 DMG, but the 3.5 on p128, Random NPC Trait #100 is No Sense of Humor (See #26). There is no #26. I don't have a 3.0 handy, but I seem to recall the table being in there too, same general area as Adept and NPC Wizard Levels 1-20. Assuming it wasn't a typo in the article.
arscott 11-06-05, 03:46 PM	I've heard the Deja Vu power appears twice in the XPH. And unless it appears twice in a row (which I doubt, as that would be to obvious), it'll be out of alphabetical order.
Prak, the Mad 11-06-05, 06:09 PM	so we now have an aberration mastermind.... aren't most aberrations viewed as materminds? or is that just me... let's see... Aboleth Athach beholder carrion crawler choker chuul cloaker delver destrachan drider etheral filcher ettercap gauth ghaur gibbering mouther grick mimic mind flayer naga otyugh phasm rust monster skum umber hulk will-o'-wisp ok, so I guess we're a little low on aberration masterminds, just taking MM1 into account, I voted for CR 3-5(or whatever the lowest range was) though I was tempted to go for the high end... I'm thinking a Master mind that has an affinity for low CR mobsters and sends wave upon wave of them at low level pcs.
Light Dragon 11-07-05, 03:03 PM	An aberration mastermind. How original. Yes, there's a definite shortage of those. :rolleyes: Oh well. There's a good spread of aberration masterminds at higher CRs, but I don't think there's a good "mastermind" monster at CR 3-5. So I'm going to pick that, and if you want one for higher levels you can always throw on some class levels. Who knows, the result might even be playable as a PC. I seconded that. I'd like to see them craft a good challenge at that CR with a frightening creature. The results would be interesting- to say the least.
MindWandererB 11-07-05, 03:50 PM	The 3.0 DMG has the 100 Traits chart on page 150. While #100 is still "no sense of humor" and there is no #26, there is no "see #26." So they certainly knew when they printed the 3.5 DMG that there was no #26. What's so funny about there being no #26? Were they trying to say that nitpicky people who email WotC complaining that they only got 99 traits have no sense of humor? Tyhm: It was the brown mold that grows when exposed to heat.
Tyhm 11-07-05, 05:09 PM	Ah, thank you.
Morka 11-08-05, 02:01 PM	I'm also voting for the Aberration Mastermind of CR 3-5. Also, Aberration is a catch-all name for anything that seems too odd to be a magical beast, monstrous humanoid, or anything else. Otherwise, I see few ressamblance between a Will-O'Wisp, an Athach, an Elan (XPH) and a Mindflayer. A glowing sphere? A giant with 3 arms? An human with a new mind? An humanoid with many tentacles on the face, sucking up brains? Where's the link? So even if we have the type of the monster, we don't know yet what he is looking like...
MindWandererB 11-10-05, 03:25 PM	I think that's partially the point. Design & Development put together monsters in two ways. One way, the old way, is to come up with a cool idea and then turn it into a stat block. That's all very well and good, but there's another way, and that's what's being demonstrated to us in this series. Coming up with a need first, as far as creature type, CR, and role in the game, and then coming up with a cool idea to meet that need, can often be a better way as far as D&D as a game goes. Is this a good way of building a monster with traction? Maybe, maybe not. It's probably harder this way than the old way. The advantage is that we can use this method to fill niches in the game that aren't being met. Now, whether or not this project will succeed at that remains to be seen- a high-CR aberration mastermind sure doesn't fill any unfilled niches- but it's the process that's being showcased here. It also gives us the opportunity to discuss this stuff. With any luck, WotC will skim through this thread and realize that we, the players, want more Seelie and Unseelie fey, more mobster aberrations, and more low-CR, scalable masterminds. And just maybe some of these needs will be met in the MMIV. So, to address Morka's comment: deciding what it looks like will be among the last things we do. I don't know how the development process works, so I don't know what steps we'll go through first, but coming up with things like a physical description, a name, and an alignment (probably) will come towards the end.
Honstrof 11-11-05, 02:33 AM	I stopped voting when fey didn't win.
Morka 11-11-05, 10:28 AM	My take on a low-level, mobster aberration. I don't know if such a monster has already been created... Please bear with me, it's the first time I create a monster. Blue Balls Medium Aberration Hit Dice: 3d8+6 (19 hp) Initiative: +2 Speed: 40 Ft, Swim 20 Ft Armor Class: 15 (+2 Dex, +3 natural), touch 12, flat-footed 13 Base Attack/Grapple: +2/+5 Attack: Stamp +5 melee (1d8+3) Full Attack: Stamp +5 melee (1d8+3) Space/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft. Special Attacks: Acidic Fluids Special Qualities: Darkvision 60 ft., resistance to acid 10, Damage Reduction 5/piercing or slashing Saves: Fort +2, Ref +12, Will +2 Abilities: Str 17, Dex 15, Con 15, Int 1, Wis 8, Cha 12 Skills: Jump +16*, Listen +2, Spot +1, Swim +11* Feats: Dodge, Mobility, Improved Overrun(B) Environment: Temperate plains Organization: Solitary, pair, or gang (3-5), swarm (6-15) or mob (12-60) Challenge Rating: 2 Treasure: None Alignment: Usually chaotic neutral Advancement: 4-8 HD (Medium); 9-16 (Large); 17-28 (Huge) Level Adjustment: - About the size and weight of a large dog, blue balls are spheres bouncing at great speed in the plains. Their flexible skins allow them to swim at good speed. Blue balls do not speak any language, but they seem to communicate together by empathy. COMBAT A blue ball attacks by bouncing and jumping on their opponents. Blue Balls usually migrate in mobs. When they encounter some living creatures, the front line usually try to overrun them and continue their way, letting the followers trample the prone victims. If affected by ranged attacks, the attacked blue ball move toward the attacker, and is usually followed by the other blue balls surrounding it. Acidic Fluid (Ex): A blue ball internal organs is a mass of acidic fluid. Any successful attack made with a piercing or slashing weapon generate a cone shaped, 15' radius acidic jet, centered on the attacker and dealing 1d6 damage. A successful reflex save DC 14 halves the damages. The DC is Constitution based, and include a +1 racial bonus. Damage Reduction (Ex): The blue balls thick and flexible skin is especially resistant against bludgeoning attacks. Skills: Blue balls have a +12 racial bonus on all jump checks. A blue ball has a +8 racial bonus on any Swim check to perform some special action or avoid a hazard. It can always choose to take 10 on a Swim check, even if distracted or endangered. It can use the run action while swimming, provided it swims in a straight line.
Morka 11-11-05, 10:42 AM	So, to address Morka's comment: deciding what it looks like will be among the last things we do. I don't know how the development process works, so I don't know what steps we'll go through first, but coming up with things like a physical description, a name, and an alignment (probably) will come towards the end. What I meant is we are still at the starting point. Should we have voted a fey, everyone would guess that the final result is some pretty humanoid creature, probably weak in melee but adept with magic. Should we have voted a dragon, everyone would guess that the final result would be some kind of reptile with thick scales, a good bite and claws, and perhaps some magical powers. And so on...
Tyhm 11-11-05, 06:18 PM	What I meant is we are still at the starting point. Should we have voted a fey, everyone would guess that the final result is some pretty humanoid creature, probably weak in melee but adept with magic. Should we have voted a dragon, everyone would guess that the final result would be some kind of reptile with thick scales, a good bite and claws, and perhaps some magical powers. And so on... Thus we are perhaps still at odds with the methodology of this development; we say "We need something to fill the niche of simplified pretty fey casters so my girlfriend/sister/daughter/cousin/ladyfriend can play with us" (as I doubt any amongst us will say DnD does not lack of female gamers), and the poll says "Another mastermind abberation it is!" It could surprise me. The mastermind abberation could turn out to be an unearthily beautiful caster, reminiscent of Eberron's psionic races. Who knows?
MindWandererB 11-11-05, 06:29 PM	Morka: I really disagree. Most of the more recent fey have been pretty demented critters (redcap, spriggan, and wendigo come to mind). And lot of the recent dragons have been small and magic-less. I could really go for Tyhm's idea. The whole "alien mindset" makes little sense as a type-defining feature to me, but if that counts, I say go for it. As far as I'm concerned, it just has to be a race of all women. That would make it an alien mindset to me. But seriously, some kind of creature that thinks of itself as a "higher being" (especially if the CD 15+ category wins) and has goals that mortals simply can't understand, would be pretty cool.
Irian 11-11-05, 10:24 PM	*sigh* (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/dd/20051111a&dcmp=ILC-RSSDND) 15+: 27.3% 9-11: 24.4% 12-14: 18.1% 6-8: 16.1% 3-5: 14.1% Just as I feared... :rolleyes: Next guess: 'Underground' wins :(