Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Mighty Max 02-24-08, 09:25 PM	Hi I'm trying to work out a skill system where player would acquire ranks in a skill by succeeding at that particular skill(to raise your forgery, forge). If any of you guys has any input on this, feel free.
Fatalis_902 02-24-08, 09:32 PM	My advice? Be very careful with this. If you are too conservative with aquiring points, you risk the characters not having a good enough modifier for a ceratin skill when they need it, because they didn't have enough opportunities to use it in the last adventure, and now that it has come up again at a higher level, they are simply not ood enough, and can't complete the challenge. Conversely, if you are too liberal with handing out skill points, you risk the characters generating rediculous modifiers for their skills, and then you are unable to really challenge them anymore, skill-wise, at least. It sounds interesting, and once you get a system worked out, let me know how the play-test goes, but don't be surprised if this doesn't work the way you want.
CryoSilver 02-25-08, 12:48 AM	How about this: set a secondary DC for raising your rank. Each time the skill is used, if it succeeds and also beats the DC to be raised, the PC gains a rank. 1 rank: DC 15 2 ranks: DC 17 3 ranks: DC 19 Etc. Ex: Bob the Scout has 1 rank in Spot. He spots someone hiding (DC 20) by rolling an 18. Because he also beat the DC for gaining a second rank in Spot (DC 17) he now has 2 ranks in Spot. He needs to get a 19 in order to gain the third rank. Set limits on how many times per level skills can be raised, so you don't have players grinding skills to insane proportions at level 1 (eg: enforce the regular sp cap).
Chrono Nexus 02-25-08, 01:34 AM	I thought about this a long time ago (a couple of years)... I didn't want to confuse my players too much with it, so it isn't in my game. I would allow my players a pool of "gray ranks" in addition to normal ranks at every level. Gray ranks are floating ranks that can be (re)trained or placed between gaining levels. A character only retains gray ranks in a skill if he trains in that particular skill for an hour out of a given day. I would set the amount to Int mod+1 per level... This isn't perfect, and it does require a level of work many players wouldn't enjoy (tracking gray rank placement, making sure to train). I'd also add in a maximum to the number of gray ranks that can be placed in a single skill per day (let's say, 1).
Orenmir 02-25-08, 11:23 AM	I think giving away bonus skill points can be balanced. Don't be too generous; and, make the PC pay for the ranks - literally, in gold and XP. Think of it as extra training. It costs time and money, and is already calculated in the level-up system of attaining skill points. If you get to add more than what the system allows for, you need to pay for it.
Edymnion 02-25-08, 12:11 PM	I will typically give out free ranks in minor skills, such as Profession or Craft (Blacksmithing) if the player RPs it very well. For example, if a player has his character carry around an iron pot and makes stews out of trail rations for the party every night, I'll give him a free rank in Craft (Cooking) when he levels. I don't give those out in anything I would consider to be "useful" skills, but its a good way for characters to get some background/RP skills without having to detract from their survival skills.
Mad_Jack 02-25-08, 07:50 PM	Well, looks like my internet crashed my first post, so... I use the standard skill points, but I also give out the occasional extra free skill point... As Edymnion said, I'll give a character a few points in a less-than-useful skill if there's a character-backstory reason why they'd have them, or if they continually roleplay using that particular skill. Nobody's gonna become a master chef by boiling a few stolen potatoes while sitting around the campfire at night, but if by some bizarre chance a craft (cooking) roll suddenly becomes important to the story, I'll let them have that +1 or +2 to their roll... Also, I occasionally give out a free skill point to characters who make a particularly impressive roll in a certain skill. Although if you're not using the regular per-level skill points this probably wouldn't give characters sufficient points to be viable, what I do is... -If a character succeeds at a skill roll on which they could only hit the DC on a 20, i.e., natural 20 + ranks + Ab. mod. = exact DC... *and* -If they do it without the assistance of magic or taking 10/20... Then I give them a free rank in the skill with which they made the roll, assuming it's not already maxed out. I figure making that one-chance-in-hell shot has to be good for something, even if only raising their confidence in their skill. Since most characters' primary skills are either maxed out or pretty close to it, they won't often come across a skill roll where they'll need to roll their max to hit it, but they have a decent chance of getting an extra point or two in some of their cross-class skills, which isn't really unbalancing. If you're looking to completely rewrite the skill system, I'm not entirely sure how to do that, but you could probably come up with something like, for every X number of uses of that skill, your rank increases by 1. Possibly by half a rank if it's a cross-class skill.
Bacon and Eggs 02-26-08, 02:09 PM	I've been thinking about this one for a day or so... alas it's still on the first page... What I might do to keep everyone happy is the have the equivilent of a spell book for skills... except that the book it more like a manual... and it can be created and maintained by the person themselves. The mechanics would be something along the lines of the way theives tools work, granting a +2 circumstance bonus on things... you know, if it's a really good manual... perhaps have a +4 for those who really like to keep notes and practice. So have/or allow a character to create a Manual of Forgery +2. ...or you know... a Cookbook.
DiegoDraw 02-26-08, 02:20 PM	Sounds kind of like The Elder Scrolls series. Which is awesome. I love the games (Oblivion was a bit iffy, but we won't go into that), and I love the way you level, but I just don't know if it'd work well enough in a pen and paper game like D&D. The mechanics are so precise in Elder Scrolls. You gain X percentage of the next skill by succeeding in something in-game (or sometimes even just running around...a lot). The only problem is that D&D is not real-time. What if someone says, "I'm going to spend two weeks only cooking." Of course, in a real-time game, that would mean that person would have to repeatedly grind that skill for hours upon hours. In D&D, though, it's as simple as announcing that you're cooking for a really, really long time. The DC level trick could work, but then someone could just take a twenty on a roll, and consistently hit the DC necessary. Or, of course, if you couldn't take a twenty, you could just say, "I'm going to cook for a really, really long time," and roll over and over again. There's no prevention for grinding a particular skill for days and days in-game. I mean, hopefully, the players would be mature enough to roleplay correctly and know that their character wouldn't have the patience to sit there for weeks straight only cooking, but still, the mechanism would be broken. If you do happen to come up with a system that would work without breaking the game, it'd be great, and lots of fun as par the PC games I was talking about before, but I have my skepticism about it in D&D. ~D-Draw