Answer a N00B's Question... [Archive] - Wizards Community

Answer a N00B's Question... [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
*astonish*
12-10-04, 04:08 PM I just recently got into D&D about 4 days ago and i'm going to be starting my first campaign with a friend and his group this sunday. In this campaign characters start of as multiclass using the best stats and abilities etc. from both classes. Ex. My character is a rogue/wizard, he gets the rouges reflex and skills every lvl and the wizards will and feats everey lvl. When a charater lvls both class lvls are raised.

The question is will this characters be overpowered? (Don't want my first time playing to be ruined :weep:) Does anyone else do this?

Thx for replies ahead of time.
shakedown47
12-10-04, 04:13 PM That's not multicalss, it's something called gestalt. And actually, it's not really that. Here's what you do: Every time the character levels up, he gets all class abilities from each class. Pick the best Base attack bonus (don't stack them) and the best of each save (again, don't stack them) out of the two classes. No it's not overpowered, as long as everything else in the game has been adjusted accordingly.
Mind Rogue
12-10-04, 04:31 PM I assume that you are playing in your buddy's group rather than DMing it. But unless your DM tells you so and the campaign is specifically designed for it, you don't want to do anything that either you or shakedown just said. As shakedown just said, what you mentioned is simmilar to gestalts, but gestalts are designed for high-powered campaigns, usually with fewer than four players.

Each time your rogue/wizard levels up, he must choose which of his classes to level up in. If you choose to advance as a rogue, you get d6 + CON hp, 8 + INT skill points, a pretty good chance to increase your reflex save, and a whole array of rogue abilities, most notably sneak attack. If you advance as a wizard, you gain d4 + CON hp and 2 + INT skill points, decent Will saves and increased spellcasting prowess. Effectively, you take the BaB and saving throws of both classes and add them together, as well as the abilities of each class.

For instance, pretend you decide to start as a non-human rogue, add a level of wizard, then another one of rogue. You have a Con of 10 and an Int of 16. You start with 6 hp and 44 skill points, which are spent on rogue skills. Next level, you add d4 hp and 5 skill points spent on wizard skills, then d6 more hp and 13 skill points spent on rogue skills. At this point, you probably have 12 hp, 52 skill points, a BaB of +1, a Fort save of +0, Ref save of 3+Dex, Will of 2+Wis, sneak attack +1d6, trapfinding, evasion, scribe scroll, summon familiar, and the spells of a first level wizard. Next level, you choose to either add another level of rogue, bumping your fort and will saves up a notch, increases your BaB by 1, 13 skill points, gives you sneak attack +2d6, trapsense +1 and +1d6 hp, or you choose to increase your wizard level which gives you +1 will, +1 BaB, +1d4 hp, 5 skill points, and another first level wizard spell per day and another cantrip per day and two more spells in your spellbook.
*astonish*
12-10-04, 05:23 PM :D Thank you both, that really cleared things up! :D
salamander
12-10-04, 07:02 PM I really need to look up those gestalt rules someday... I always wondered what a character that actually wants to stick with one class would get to do in such a campaign. I don't want to be a sorcerer/rogue mix, I just want to be a sorcerer, ok? Or any other class for all I care, just as long as I don't have to divide my 'training' over two different fields of expertise.
Azual
12-10-04, 07:52 PM :D
i remeber my first character
yes.. a Sorcerer... he was so kool...
that before i bacame a DM and turned EVIL
:evillaugh
Morwen
12-10-04, 10:52 PM I really need to look up those gestalt rules someday... I always wondered what a character that actually wants to stick with one class would get to do in such a campaign. I don't want to be a sorcerer/rogue mix, I just want to be a sorcerer, ok? Or any other class for all I care, just as long as I don't have to divide my 'training' over two different fields of expertise.
Well, you get everything from both classes each level, so the extra class wouldn't matter one bit too you if you want to be mainly the other class. If you want to be a Sorcerer first-and-only, in a gestalt campaign, you should probably use Fighter as your second class, since you would get better HD, as well as bunches of feats you could use to enhance your Sorcerer class (you would choose fighter bonus feats like Improved Initiative, Weapon Focus (ray spells) etc).
IceFractal
12-11-04, 01:55 PM Actually, if you wanted to be as close to pure Sorcerer as possible you could go Sorcerer/Wizard (all arcane full-casters), Sorcerer/Bard (all spontaneous arcane casters), Sorcerer/Evangelist (all spontaneous full-casters), or Sorcerer/Warlock (all innate magic users).
salamander
12-11-04, 09:21 PM ... as close to pure X as possible ...Bottom line: as close as possible to a pure single-classed character is still an even mix between two classes, the best you can do is pick similar ones. Whoop-de-doo, as they say.
Korhal IV
12-12-04, 12:35 AM Actually, since gestalt characters are considered to be level +2 for determining CR, etc., a "pure" sorcerer could be 2 levels ahead and single-classed. :)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
astonish 12-10-04, 04:08 PM	I just recently got into D&D about 4 days ago and i'm going to be starting my first campaign with a friend and his group this sunday. In this campaign characters start of as multiclass using the best stats and abilities etc. from both classes. Ex. My character is a rogue/wizard, he gets the rouges reflex and skills every lvl and the wizards will and feats everey lvl. When a charater lvls both class lvls are raised. The question is will this characters be overpowered? (Don't want my first time playing to be ruined :weep:) Does anyone else do this? Thx for replies ahead of time.
shakedown47 12-10-04, 04:13 PM	That's not multicalss, it's something called gestalt. And actually, it's not really that. Here's what you do: Every time the character levels up, he gets all class abilities from each class. Pick the best Base attack bonus (don't stack them) and the best of each save (again, don't stack them) out of the two classes. No it's not overpowered, as long as everything else in the game has been adjusted accordingly.
Mind Rogue 12-10-04, 04:31 PM	I assume that you are playing in your buddy's group rather than DMing it. But unless your DM tells you so and the campaign is specifically designed for it, you don't want to do anything that either you or shakedown just said. As shakedown just said, what you mentioned is simmilar to gestalts, but gestalts are designed for high-powered campaigns, usually with fewer than four players. Each time your rogue/wizard levels up, he must choose which of his classes to level up in. If you choose to advance as a rogue, you get d6 + CON hp, 8 + INT skill points, a pretty good chance to increase your reflex save, and a whole array of rogue abilities, most notably sneak attack. If you advance as a wizard, you gain d4 + CON hp and 2 + INT skill points, decent Will saves and increased spellcasting prowess. Effectively, you take the BaB and saving throws of both classes and add them together, as well as the abilities of each class. For instance, pretend you decide to start as a non-human rogue, add a level of wizard, then another one of rogue. You have a Con of 10 and an Int of 16. You start with 6 hp and 44 skill points, which are spent on rogue skills. Next level, you add d4 hp and 5 skill points spent on wizard skills, then d6 more hp and 13 skill points spent on rogue skills. At this point, you probably have 12 hp, 52 skill points, a BaB of +1, a Fort save of +0, Ref save of 3+Dex, Will of 2+Wis, sneak attack +1d6, trapfinding, evasion, scribe scroll, summon familiar, and the spells of a first level wizard. Next level, you choose to either add another level of rogue, bumping your fort and will saves up a notch, increases your BaB by 1, 13 skill points, gives you sneak attack +2d6, trapsense +1 and +1d6 hp, or you choose to increase your wizard level which gives you +1 will, +1 BaB, +1d4 hp, 5 skill points, and another first level wizard spell per day and another cantrip per day and two more spells in your spellbook.
astonish 12-10-04, 05:23 PM	:D Thank you both, that really cleared things up! :D
salamander 12-10-04, 07:02 PM	I really need to look up those gestalt rules someday... I always wondered what a character that actually wants to stick with one class would get to do in such a campaign. I don't want to be a sorcerer/rogue mix, I just want to be a sorcerer, ok? Or any other class for all I care, just as long as I don't have to divide my 'training' over two different fields of expertise.
Azual 12-10-04, 07:52 PM	:D i remeber my first character yes.. a Sorcerer... he was so kool... that before i bacame a DM and turned EVIL :evillaugh
Morwen 12-10-04, 10:52 PM	I really need to look up those gestalt rules someday... I always wondered what a character that actually wants to stick with one class would get to do in such a campaign. I don't want to be a sorcerer/rogue mix, I just want to be a sorcerer, ok? Or any other class for all I care, just as long as I don't have to divide my 'training' over two different fields of expertise. Well, you get everything from both classes each level, so the extra class wouldn't matter one bit too you if you want to be mainly the other class. If you want to be a Sorcerer first-and-only, in a gestalt campaign, you should probably use Fighter as your second class, since you would get better HD, as well as bunches of feats you could use to enhance your Sorcerer class (you would choose fighter bonus feats like Improved Initiative, Weapon Focus (ray spells) etc).
IceFractal 12-11-04, 01:55 PM	Actually, if you wanted to be as close to pure Sorcerer as possible you could go Sorcerer/Wizard (all arcane full-casters), Sorcerer/Bard (all spontaneous arcane casters), Sorcerer/Evangelist (all spontaneous full-casters), or Sorcerer/Warlock (all innate magic users).
salamander 12-11-04, 09:21 PM	... as close to pure X as possible ...Bottom line: as close as possible to a pure single-classed character is still an even mix between two classes, the best you can do is pick similar ones. Whoop-de-doo, as they say.
Korhal IV 12-12-04, 12:35 AM	Actually, since gestalt characters are considered to be level +2 for determining CR, etc., a "pure" sorcerer could be 2 levels ahead and single-classed. :)