Any race any class. [Archive] - Wizards Community

Any race any class. [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
babysamurai
06-29-05, 11:00 AM While I love the fact that 3rd edition lifted the race/class restrictions, but obviously in some campaigns this seems a little odd.

For example; you've been running a Dragonlance campaign for 20 years and there were no Kender Wizards, when all of a sudden 3rd edition comes out and all these Kender Druid/Wizards start popping up out of the woodwork.

Same for Forgotten Realms; for years Dwarves could not be Wizards, but in the 3rd edition FR campaign book there's some female Dwarven Sorcerer all of a sudden.

I mean I can suspend my disbelief, this is fantasy after all, but new race/class combinations suddenly appearing after years of campaign continuity doesn't seem to jive with me.

Any thoughts?
rbrt_Spade
06-29-05, 11:15 AM well the majority of people i think hated the race/class rec.-personaly i think they add more fun to the game and lets people not have the common dwarf fighter-some of the class things were weird-humans cant multi class-only human paladins?-i like the new system-tsr went bad on this-the old AD&D i think sucks to 3.x
J Milburn
06-29-05, 11:20 AM Yes, playing the odd class combos is often fun. I disagree with race-class restrictions.

And i doubt that they jumped out of the wood work- they are not that common now anyways, by definition. I would be able to believe that I had just not come across them.
KoboldSlayer
06-29-05, 11:23 AM While I love the fact that 3rd edition lifted the race/class restrictions, but obviously in some campaigns this seems a little odd.

For example; you've been running a Dragonlance campaign for 20 years and there were no Kender Wizards, when all of a sudden 3rd edition comes out and all these Kender Druid/Wizards start popping up out of the woodwork.

Same for Forgotten Realms; for years Dwarves could not be Wizards, but in the 3rd edition FR campaign book there's some female Dwarven Sorcerer all of a sudden.

I mean I can suspend my disbelief, this is fantasy after all, but new race/class combinations suddenly appearing after years of campaign continuity doesn't seem to jive with me.

Any thoughts?

If you want to introduce this to a continuing campaign that had race/class restrictions before and now all of a sudden doesnt'...but you are still running the same storyline with the same characters...have something fundamentally change about the world. Better yet, make it part of the plot. Dwarves suddenly born with sorcerous powers, for example, might be a new blessing from the dwarven deities...or might be a sinister plot to mingle dragon blood with dwarves.
anarco_rata
06-29-05, 11:28 AM Now its all about roleplaying...in AD&D it always ****** me of that the dwarves couldn't be wizards, and always thought how would a race without amgic survive in a magicall world? besides, it was stupid that if you had a dwarv that has lived under the tutelage of a wizard, you couldnt be one too ("i am sorry Mroot, i can't teach you o be a wizard, you just CANT, beacuse you are a dwarve...go play with axes and rocks!")
If you want to introduce this to a continuing campaign that had race/class restrictions before and now all of a sudden doesnt'...but you are still running the same storyline with the same characters...have something fundamentally change about the world. Better yet, make it part of the plot. Dwarves suddenly born with sorcerous powers, for example, might be a new blessing from the dwarven deities...or might be a sinister plot to mingle dragon blood with dwarves.
In forgotten realms they take this aproach with the blessing of the thunder, saying that now blonde and magical gifted dwarves are borned because the race was at the border of extinction
babysamurai
06-29-05, 11:31 AM If you want to introduce this to a continuing campaign that had race/class restrictions before and now all of a sudden doesnt'...but you are still running the same storyline with the same characters...have something fundamentally change about the world. Better yet, make it part of the plot. Dwarves suddenly born with sorcerous powers, for example, might be a new blessing from the dwarven deities...or might be a sinister plot to mingle dragon blood with dwarves.

Thank you KoboldSlayer, these are the kind of responses I was looking for.

The other two posters didn't seem to read my original post, I agree with them that class/race restrictions suck (it's fun to play a Dwarf Monk), I was specifacally referring to campaign continuity (suddenly non-human Monks appearing in the Realms etc).
celtredleg
06-29-05, 03:30 PM No continuity problems for me. I have never imposed race/class restritions. Or level limits on races that 1st and 2nd ed had. Most DMs have played with did not impose those either.
ForgottenImmortal
06-29-05, 03:46 PM While dwarves dislike arcane magic it doesn't mean some don't use it. Dwarven sorc are more common than dwarven wizards because wizardry is taught and dwarven society doesn't teach wizardry. Dwarfs use more divine magic and are real big on clerics. Sorc will pick spells that make sense for a dwarf in a mine like stone shape, rock to mud, etc. They are said to be blessed by Mordin and have a good standing in dwarven society. A dwarf wizard would proably be taught by a non-dwarf and would proably never acheive as high of a standing as a cleric or sorc persay. Class race restriction are pertty stupid even for thing like PrCs if u can find someone to willing to teach you, you should be able to learn.
DDogwood
06-29-05, 05:27 PM There's not really any reason to allow ANY race to take ANY class - the PHB simply doesn't blatantly disallow it. The DMG has a section suggesting that some race/class combinations can be disallowed for campaign flavour.

It's essentially the same as disallowing certain races or classes from some settings. For example, in a Dragonlance campaign, you can't normally play a Halfling. Even though they are in the PHB, they are replaced by the Kender in this setting. Likewise, if the DM decides that there are no Kender Wizards, there simply aren't. The DM may or may not allow a Kender to become a wizard later on in the game.

For Forgotten Realms, it's interesting that a very popular character was a good Drow Ranger - not really in the normal rules, either.
Count Arioch the 28th
06-29-05, 06:27 PM I run a homebrew campaign, starting when 3E came out, so it wasn't a huge deal at all. In fact, in my world Wizard is the second most common class for dwarves past fighter, with Warmage a close third.
Ogre4Hire
06-29-05, 07:19 PM You know, I've been reading a lot of the older FR novels lately, and I've been surprised by the number of apparent Race/Class violations that popped up in them.
Scipion Emilien
06-29-05, 07:38 PM You know, I've been reading a lot of the older FR novels lately, and I've been surprised by the number of apparent Race/Class violations that popped up in them.

The exceptions are here because of the rule, in what a dwarven mage is exceptionnal if all dwarven cities have their mage learning corner and that it is acceptable by all?

In what a popular fantasy character of FR would have been popular if all drows were ranger?
DDogwood
06-30-05, 12:14 PM In what a popular fantasy character of FR would have been popular if all drows were ranger?

Judging from the posts you see on these boards, there are a lot of Good Drow Rangers :)
DragonDeadite
06-30-05, 01:00 PM I was running a campaign under 2nd Edition rules when 3.0 came out. Instead of changing around all the rules and the game mechanics (I waited for 3.5 really) in the middle of a campaign, I decided to warp time. Everything was warped forwerd by 100 years so now there were new classes and because of the warp the characters got changed around, so part of the story now was figuring out who caused them to change time and how their new powers actualy worked. It made it very fun for me to only thow hints as to what their characters could actualy do and then when they tried to do something they discovered it was easier/harder to do than they thought it would be. It was kind of an easy way out but it was much more fun than I thought it would be. Everything that they knew about the world was completely changed, nations were gone in some continents now existed that didn't before (Mainly one that the barbarians came from).

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
babysamurai 06-29-05, 11:00 AM	While I love the fact that 3rd edition lifted the race/class restrictions, but obviously in some campaigns this seems a little odd. For example; you've been running a Dragonlance campaign for 20 years and there were no Kender Wizards, when all of a sudden 3rd edition comes out and all these Kender Druid/Wizards start popping up out of the woodwork. Same for Forgotten Realms; for years Dwarves could not be Wizards, but in the 3rd edition FR campaign book there's some female Dwarven Sorcerer all of a sudden. I mean I can suspend my disbelief, this is fantasy after all, but new race/class combinations suddenly appearing after years of campaign continuity doesn't seem to jive with me. Any thoughts?
rbrt_Spade 06-29-05, 11:15 AM	well the majority of people i think hated the race/class rec.-personaly i think they add more fun to the game and lets people not have the common dwarf fighter-some of the class things were weird-humans cant multi class-only human paladins?-i like the new system-tsr went bad on this-the old AD&D i think sucks to 3.x
J Milburn 06-29-05, 11:20 AM	Yes, playing the odd class combos is often fun. I disagree with race-class restrictions. And i doubt that they jumped out of the wood work- they are not that common now anyways, by definition. I would be able to believe that I had just not come across them.
KoboldSlayer 06-29-05, 11:23 AM	While I love the fact that 3rd edition lifted the race/class restrictions, but obviously in some campaigns this seems a little odd. For example; you've been running a Dragonlance campaign for 20 years and there were no Kender Wizards, when all of a sudden 3rd edition comes out and all these Kender Druid/Wizards start popping up out of the woodwork. Same for Forgotten Realms; for years Dwarves could not be Wizards, but in the 3rd edition FR campaign book there's some female Dwarven Sorcerer all of a sudden. I mean I can suspend my disbelief, this is fantasy after all, but new race/class combinations suddenly appearing after years of campaign continuity doesn't seem to jive with me. Any thoughts? If you want to introduce this to a continuing campaign that had race/class restrictions before and now all of a sudden doesnt'...but you are still running the same storyline with the same characters...have something fundamentally change about the world. Better yet, make it part of the plot. Dwarves suddenly born with sorcerous powers, for example, might be a new blessing from the dwarven deities...or might be a sinister plot to mingle dragon blood with dwarves.
anarco_rata 06-29-05, 11:28 AM	Now its all about roleplaying...in AD&D it always ****** me of that the dwarves couldn't be wizards, and always thought how would a race without amgic survive in a magicall world? besides, it was stupid that if you had a dwarv that has lived under the tutelage of a wizard, you couldnt be one too ("i am sorry Mroot, i can't teach you o be a wizard, you just CANT, beacuse you are a dwarve...go play with axes and rocks!") If you want to introduce this to a continuing campaign that had race/class restrictions before and now all of a sudden doesnt'...but you are still running the same storyline with the same characters...have something fundamentally change about the world. Better yet, make it part of the plot. Dwarves suddenly born with sorcerous powers, for example, might be a new blessing from the dwarven deities...or might be a sinister plot to mingle dragon blood with dwarves. In forgotten realms they take this aproach with the blessing of the thunder, saying that now blonde and magical gifted dwarves are borned because the race was at the border of extinction
babysamurai 06-29-05, 11:31 AM	If you want to introduce this to a continuing campaign that had race/class restrictions before and now all of a sudden doesnt'...but you are still running the same storyline with the same characters...have something fundamentally change about the world. Better yet, make it part of the plot. Dwarves suddenly born with sorcerous powers, for example, might be a new blessing from the dwarven deities...or might be a sinister plot to mingle dragon blood with dwarves. Thank you KoboldSlayer, these are the kind of responses I was looking for. The other two posters didn't seem to read my original post, I agree with them that class/race restrictions suck (it's fun to play a Dwarf Monk), I was specifacally referring to campaign continuity (suddenly non-human Monks appearing in the Realms etc).
celtredleg 06-29-05, 03:30 PM	No continuity problems for me. I have never imposed race/class restritions. Or level limits on races that 1st and 2nd ed had. Most DMs have played with did not impose those either.
ForgottenImmortal 06-29-05, 03:46 PM	While dwarves dislike arcane magic it doesn't mean some don't use it. Dwarven sorc are more common than dwarven wizards because wizardry is taught and dwarven society doesn't teach wizardry. Dwarfs use more divine magic and are real big on clerics. Sorc will pick spells that make sense for a dwarf in a mine like stone shape, rock to mud, etc. They are said to be blessed by Mordin and have a good standing in dwarven society. A dwarf wizard would proably be taught by a non-dwarf and would proably never acheive as high of a standing as a cleric or sorc persay. Class race restriction are pertty stupid even for thing like PrCs if u can find someone to willing to teach you, you should be able to learn.
DDogwood 06-29-05, 05:27 PM	There's not really any reason to allow ANY race to take ANY class - the PHB simply doesn't blatantly disallow it. The DMG has a section suggesting that some race/class combinations can be disallowed for campaign flavour. It's essentially the same as disallowing certain races or classes from some settings. For example, in a Dragonlance campaign, you can't normally play a Halfling. Even though they are in the PHB, they are replaced by the Kender in this setting. Likewise, if the DM decides that there are no Kender Wizards, there simply aren't. The DM may or may not allow a Kender to become a wizard later on in the game. For Forgotten Realms, it's interesting that a very popular character was a good Drow Ranger - not really in the normal rules, either.
Count Arioch the 28th 06-29-05, 06:27 PM	I run a homebrew campaign, starting when 3E came out, so it wasn't a huge deal at all. In fact, in my world Wizard is the second most common class for dwarves past fighter, with Warmage a close third.
Ogre4Hire 06-29-05, 07:19 PM	You know, I've been reading a lot of the older FR novels lately, and I've been surprised by the number of apparent Race/Class violations that popped up in them.
Scipion Emilien 06-29-05, 07:38 PM	You know, I've been reading a lot of the older FR novels lately, and I've been surprised by the number of apparent Race/Class violations that popped up in them. The exceptions are here because of the rule, in what a dwarven mage is exceptionnal if all dwarven cities have their mage learning corner and that it is acceptable by all? In what a popular fantasy character of FR would have been popular if all drows were ranger?
DDogwood 06-30-05, 12:14 PM	In what a popular fantasy character of FR would have been popular if all drows were ranger? Judging from the posts you see on these boards, there are a lot of Good Drow Rangers :)
DragonDeadite 06-30-05, 01:00 PM	I was running a campaign under 2nd Edition rules when 3.0 came out. Instead of changing around all the rules and the game mechanics (I waited for 3.5 really) in the middle of a campaign, I decided to warp time. Everything was warped forwerd by 100 years so now there were new classes and because of the warp the characters got changed around, so part of the story now was figuring out who caused them to change time and how their new powers actualy worked. It made it very fun for me to only thow hints as to what their characters could actualy do and then when they tried to do something they discovered it was easier/harder to do than they thought it would be. It was kind of an easy way out but it was much more fun than I thought it would be. Everything that they knew about the world was completely changed, nations were gone in some continents now existed that didn't before (Mainly one that the barbarians came from).