Anything I should be wary of for... [Archive] - Wizards Community

Anything I should be wary of for... [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
fatal error
06-26-05, 12:54 PM Anything I should be way of for GURPS? I just switched from D&D to gurps for a little change, so far I really like it. The combat system allows a much larger variety of tactics and attack types, rather than D&D where all you do is power attack, or just try to chain trip for AoOs, no variety, because everything is either just better than attacking or just worse. No worries of racial balance, and you can actually build in personality to your character through disadvantages. And the magic system isn't entirely about combat magic, though I don't have the magic sourcebook yet, so I guess I'll have to wait to see.

Anyway, for those of you who played GURPS and have gone back to D&D. What made you want to go back to D&D?
woozygremlin
06-26-05, 01:29 PM The main problem many player and GMs have with GURPS is the Generic part. It can also be hard to find players since it is less popular than D&D (why do you think they include those players wanted fliers in the back of the book?).

The character creation system is complex and time consuming which makes it hard to prepare games on short notice (although I highly recommend the official character generator program, you can download partial copy from the Steve Jackson Games website, 3rd ed.).

GURPS is also not very effective for cinematic games and the lack of good quality fluff means there aren't as many ready made story hooks. The main reason I switched back to D&D though is the same reason you decided to try GURPS: Variety.

There are a lot of great games out there of which D&D and GURPS are only two. Temporary book trades with other DMs is a great way to sample them.
weasel fierce
06-26-05, 05:20 PM GURPS is one of the best systems out there, IMO. The points system, in particular, makes things easy to work with.

Be prepared to do a lot of work, if you're the DM.

Also, be prepared to use a lot of common sense in regards to what you allow. However, the system will handle just about anything and everything you throw at it.

As for "going back", I dont see why it has to be one or the other. They each do separate things.
Giant Turtle
06-26-05, 06:45 PM I've played a lot of different games, Exalted, Vampire, Werewolf, Changeling, Mage, Palladium, GURPS, Star Wars, Dungeons and Dragons (Duh), Iron Kingdoms, Earthdawn, and probably some more I can't remember. My main reason for switching is to try something else, yeah, I love D&D, but I can't play it non-stop, I need some other stuff! GURPS is probably one of my least favorite game systems because I am a fantasy buff and its sooo easy to die. Its very realistic as far as damage goes. Yes, a bullet kills you, very easily. Other than that, its one sided towards Psions and Casters (Especially since one person can be both) Seeing how broad the spell list is and what you can do with it. Immune to ranged attacks, DR 5, PD 5 (Okay, PD 5 isn't great, but PD rocks), flying, teleporting, switching bodies, permanent dominate. It only takes a 500 point character to be able to cast almost every spell and only fail on a 17 or 18. The warrior type only gets to swing at stuff, and easily miss. Master Swordsman with 50 point in his sword skill, goes to hit a mage, mage dodges on a 15 because he has haste, improved haste, and a dexterity of 20 because of magic and then responds with a permant mind-wipe, there goes his fighting skills. Yeah, little one sided in my opinion.
fatal error
06-26-05, 07:06 PM It would seem you had a bad experiance, turtle. But 500 points is 5 times a 'standard' campaign starting point, and the 'master swordsmen' could have all out attacked since he'll get no defense against a spell, and did a feint, which he would have easily beat the mage by tons on, then attacked and did quite a bit of damage with a higher strength from a 500 point game... But I digress, the magic system could be overpowered, its just refreshing not to see 3/4 of the spells be for combat.
Arrowhen
06-26-05, 08:22 PM My main problem with GURPS is the one second combat round; I prefer my combat a bit more abstract, granting situational modifiers based on my player's descriptions of their actions rather than having concrete rules for every little maneuver. However, for campaigns where combat is gritty, deadly, and hopefully rare, GURPS does offer a character generation system unmatched in its flexibility.

This flexibility, though, changes the focus of the game as compared to D&D. D&D is all about character advancement; you start off weak and steadily grow more powerful as you advance through the levels. GURPS is more focused on creating a character at a certain level of ability and adventuring at that level for a long time. Sure, you get character points to increase your abilities, but you only get a few at a time. You're constantly having to decide, "Do I want to increase skill X by a few points, or do I want to save up for cool but expensive ability Y?" There's nothing WRONG with that, but it's substantially different from the "Cool, I just levelled up!" aspect of D&D.

Where GURPS really shines is in one-shot adventures or limited scope campaigns in odd settings. GURPS Atomic Horror is, in my opinion, one of the best roleplaying suppliments ever: a sourcebook for running adventures based on 1950 science fiction B-movies. It's a great premise for a night or a month of roleplaying fun, but the subject matter is far less suitable for long-term campaigns. In GURPS, a short term campaign can be very satisfying; in D&D, it can be disappointing to start a short campaign with a 3rd level character and end it at 4th level. "Yeah," you'd think, "that was fun, but my wizard never even got a chance to learn fireball."

Different systems, different sets of expectations. Like weasel fierce said, it doesn't have to be either or. Game systems are tools; use the appropriate tool for the job at hand.
Stardrake
06-26-05, 10:46 PM As a long time GURPS 3e player (and starting a 4e campaign to go with my 3.5 D&D campaign) my take is this: What GURPS does best is human to "human-plus" type of games and characters. So it's good for "realistic" level games and lower powered "pulp adventurer" type games. It tends to break apart at higher levels--especially superhero games. (This may have been fixed somewhat with 4e--but I'm still skeptical)

If you like the idea of one character taking out adversaries by the dozen witout more than a paper cut, GURPS may not be for you. Combat is both intricate and deadly in GURPS--just about the opposite of the abstact, cinematic D&D system. Each lends itself to a different type of game--both are valid to them as likes.

(And N.B.--I did find it interesting that someone said that GURPS lacks "fluff". With literally dozens of GURPS worldbooks out there, most of which are 80-90% fluff, there is much fluff to be had. You just pick what specific fluff you want, instead of having it in the basic rulebooks.)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
fatal error 06-26-05, 12:54 PM	Anything I should be way of for GURPS? I just switched from D&D to gurps for a little change, so far I really like it. The combat system allows a much larger variety of tactics and attack types, rather than D&D where all you do is power attack, or just try to chain trip for AoOs, no variety, because everything is either just better than attacking or just worse. No worries of racial balance, and you can actually build in personality to your character through disadvantages. And the magic system isn't entirely about combat magic, though I don't have the magic sourcebook yet, so I guess I'll have to wait to see. Anyway, for those of you who played GURPS and have gone back to D&D. What made you want to go back to D&D?
woozygremlin 06-26-05, 01:29 PM	The main problem many player and GMs have with GURPS is the Generic part. It can also be hard to find players since it is less popular than D&D (why do you think they include those players wanted fliers in the back of the book?). The character creation system is complex and time consuming which makes it hard to prepare games on short notice (although I highly recommend the official character generator program, you can download partial copy from the Steve Jackson Games website, 3rd ed.). GURPS is also not very effective for cinematic games and the lack of good quality fluff means there aren't as many ready made story hooks. The main reason I switched back to D&D though is the same reason you decided to try GURPS: Variety. There are a lot of great games out there of which D&D and GURPS are only two. Temporary book trades with other DMs is a great way to sample them.
weasel fierce 06-26-05, 05:20 PM	GURPS is one of the best systems out there, IMO. The points system, in particular, makes things easy to work with. Be prepared to do a lot of work, if you're the DM. Also, be prepared to use a lot of common sense in regards to what you allow. However, the system will handle just about anything and everything you throw at it. As for "going back", I dont see why it has to be one or the other. They each do separate things.
Giant Turtle 06-26-05, 06:45 PM	I've played a lot of different games, Exalted, Vampire, Werewolf, Changeling, Mage, Palladium, GURPS, Star Wars, Dungeons and Dragons (Duh), Iron Kingdoms, Earthdawn, and probably some more I can't remember. My main reason for switching is to try something else, yeah, I love D&D, but I can't play it non-stop, I need some other stuff! GURPS is probably one of my least favorite game systems because I am a fantasy buff and its sooo easy to die. Its very realistic as far as damage goes. Yes, a bullet kills you, very easily. Other than that, its one sided towards Psions and Casters (Especially since one person can be both) Seeing how broad the spell list is and what you can do with it. Immune to ranged attacks, DR 5, PD 5 (Okay, PD 5 isn't great, but PD rocks), flying, teleporting, switching bodies, permanent dominate. It only takes a 500 point character to be able to cast almost every spell and only fail on a 17 or 18. The warrior type only gets to swing at stuff, and easily miss. Master Swordsman with 50 point in his sword skill, goes to hit a mage, mage dodges on a 15 because he has haste, improved haste, and a dexterity of 20 because of magic and then responds with a permant mind-wipe, there goes his fighting skills. Yeah, little one sided in my opinion.
fatal error 06-26-05, 07:06 PM	It would seem you had a bad experiance, turtle. But 500 points is 5 times a 'standard' campaign starting point, and the 'master swordsmen' could have all out attacked since he'll get no defense against a spell, and did a feint, which he would have easily beat the mage by tons on, then attacked and did quite a bit of damage with a higher strength from a 500 point game... But I digress, the magic system could be overpowered, its just refreshing not to see 3/4 of the spells be for combat.
Arrowhen 06-26-05, 08:22 PM	My main problem with GURPS is the one second combat round; I prefer my combat a bit more abstract, granting situational modifiers based on my player's descriptions of their actions rather than having concrete rules for every little maneuver. However, for campaigns where combat is gritty, deadly, and hopefully rare, GURPS does offer a character generation system unmatched in its flexibility. This flexibility, though, changes the focus of the game as compared to D&D. D&D is all about character advancement; you start off weak and steadily grow more powerful as you advance through the levels. GURPS is more focused on creating a character at a certain level of ability and adventuring at that level for a long time. Sure, you get character points to increase your abilities, but you only get a few at a time. You're constantly having to decide, "Do I want to increase skill X by a few points, or do I want to save up for cool but expensive ability Y?" There's nothing WRONG with that, but it's substantially different from the "Cool, I just levelled up!" aspect of D&D. Where GURPS really shines is in one-shot adventures or limited scope campaigns in odd settings. GURPS Atomic Horror is, in my opinion, one of the best roleplaying suppliments ever: a sourcebook for running adventures based on 1950 science fiction B-movies. It's a great premise for a night or a month of roleplaying fun, but the subject matter is far less suitable for long-term campaigns. In GURPS, a short term campaign can be very satisfying; in D&D, it can be disappointing to start a short campaign with a 3rd level character and end it at 4th level. "Yeah," you'd think, "that was fun, but my wizard never even got a chance to learn fireball." Different systems, different sets of expectations. Like weasel fierce said, it doesn't have to be either or. Game systems are tools; use the appropriate tool for the job at hand.
Stardrake 06-26-05, 10:46 PM	As a long time GURPS 3e player (and starting a 4e campaign to go with my 3.5 D&D campaign) my take is this: What GURPS does best is human to "human-plus" type of games and characters. So it's good for "realistic" level games and lower powered "pulp adventurer" type games. It tends to break apart at higher levels--especially superhero games. (This may have been fixed somewhat with 4e--but I'm still skeptical) If you like the idea of one character taking out adversaries by the dozen witout more than a paper cut, GURPS may not be for you. Combat is both intricate and deadly in GURPS--just about the opposite of the abstact, cinematic D&D system. Each lends itself to a different type of game--both are valid to them as likes. (And N.B.--I did find it interesting that someone said that GURPS lacks "fluff". With literally dozens of GURPS worldbooks out there, most of which are 80-90% fluff, there is much fluff to be had. You just pick what specific fluff you want, instead of having it in the basic rulebooks.)