Post/Author/DateTime	Post
industrygothica 05-21-06, 03:50 PM	If I wanted to put a single character up against a single monster and make it a balanced encounter, how would one determine an appropriate CR? Also, would a grimlock (for example), with 2 HD and a level adjustment of +2, for a total ECL of 4, be an appropriate encounter for a single 4th level character?
armeniantwins 05-21-06, 03:57 PM	As to the Grimlock, the answer is no. It would be an effective encounter for an average adventuring party of 4 characters. The general rule for multiple monsters is that 2 creatures= one of the creatures ECL+2. (This only works with identical monsters.) For a single monster, I would try an ECL of one, or maybye even two, digits lower. (For a forth level character, ECL 3 or ECL 2.)
industrygothica 05-21-06, 04:09 PM	As to the Grimlock, the answer is no. It would be an effective encounter for an average adventuring party of 4 characters. The general rule for multiple monsters is that 2 creatures= one of the creatures ECL+2. (This only works with identical monsters.) For a single monster, I would try an ECL of one, or maybye even two, digits lower. (For a forth level character, ECL 3 or ECL 2.) With a CR of 1, the grimlock would be an appropriate encounter for four 1st level characters, not four 4th level characters. I understand that every time you double the number of identical monsters, the challenge rating increases by two (except for CR 1 monsters, which the grimlock is), but not the effective character level (ECL).
StevenO 05-21-06, 08:14 PM	In theory a single character should be able to handle and encounter with an EL=Level - 4. An EL=Character Level would be challenging as that is a dire threat with a good chance the player dies. The reality is that a good encounter for a single character depends on the character. A wizard will often have a very hard time fighting a golem while a fighter of the same level will find the fight very winnable. Be award of the character/monsters benefits and limitation but generally a since character should be able to handle a monster with CR=Level-4. Higher CRs are possible but greatly increase the tension during the fight since one little mistake or run of bad luck will end it.
industrygothica 05-21-06, 08:31 PM	In theory a single character should be able to handle and encounter with an EL=Level - 4. An EL=Character Level would be challenging as that is a dire threat with a good chance the player dies. I was thinking along the same lines, except I was thinking an encounter 1/4 of the character level may be more appropriate. Since any given EL is designed for four characters, it seems logical that one quarter of that may be quitable for one character. What I'd like to do is put my PC's in an arena type setting so that they can go one-on-one with with whatever opponent they draw, I just want to make sure that whatever they're facing won't grossly overpower them (or under-power them).
Korhal_IV 05-21-06, 09:40 PM	Six PCs = CR (level+2) Four PCs = CR (level) Two PCs = CR (level-2) Ergo, one PC should equal CR (level-4). That's a CR 1/4th for a 1st level character or a CR 1 for a 4th level character. However, that's not quite accurate at several levels, particularly low levels. A CR 1 is a 1st level orc warrior, who will probably be plowed flat by any 4th level character. I suggest that you secretly tailor the encounters to the PCs for optimal results. :) If it's their only fight for the day, they'll be good to go.
industrygothica 05-22-06, 02:49 AM	I suggest that you secretly tailor the encounters to the PCs for optimal results. :) If it's their only fight for the day, they'll be good to go. I suppose that would work to start, but I was hoping to use brackets for an elimination tournament of some sort. Is there any sort of pubished arena with rules/statistics available?
okaynowa 05-22-06, 08:31 AM	Said Korhal IV:I suggest that you secretly tailor the encounters to the PCs for optimal results.That's about how I do it. I use the CR from the book as a starting point, but I scale creatures up or down according to how many players show up for the session. Typically, I give the creature(s) enough hit points to survive five rounds of the average damage the party can dish out. Adjusting the AC (through armor, buffs, better/worse Dex) also sets the pace for the encounter. The key element, though, is the opponent's damage output. I've put my party of 3rd level characters up against some nasty critters which, while narratively appropriate, could have taken some of them out in one swipe. I usually just lower the base damage die. If I still want the party to hurt, I may keep the damage high but lower the critter's BAB, so it hits less often. I've successfully used the latter tweak to put the fear in them. As for the brackets in your elimination tournament: do you know who you want the PCs to go up against, or do you want the outcome (up to that match) to be random?
industrygothica 05-22-06, 11:18 AM	As for the brackets in your elimination tournament: do you know who you want the PCs to go up against, or do you want the outcome (up to that match) to be random? I'd like everything to be random.
okaynowa 05-22-06, 12:13 PM	Said industrygothica:I'd like everything to be random.What I would do, then, is populate the brackets for the initial field of 64 (or 32, or 16, or whatever) with opponents who are all appropriate for the PCs, and give each competitor a simple 50/50 chance of making it to the next stage. This approach might take a bit of work-- since you don't know who's going to make it to the fight against the PCs, you'll have to have stats ready to go for any potential victor. The easiest way to stat potential victors is to use the descriptions right out of the Monster Manual. If the opponent needs to be stronger to provide an appropriate challenge for the party, add a template or class level (fighter is generally simplest) on the fly. If the opponent needs to be weaker, you can reduce the available number of limited use/day abilities, lower the HD/class levels, or penalize the ability scores. I believe the Character Optimization board has a few varieties of arena floating around-- you might look for a suitable venue there. All you really need, though, is a relatively flat area for the competitors surrounded by seating/standing room for the spectators. Check out any pictures of the old Greek amphitheaters or Roman coliseums-- they're pretty ideal in design.
industrygothica 05-25-06, 01:12 PM	What I would do, then, is populate the brackets for the initial field of 64 (or 32, or 16, or whatever) with opponents who are all appropriate for the PCs, and give each competitor a simple 50/50 chance of making it to the next stage. This approach might take a bit of work-- since you don't know who's going to make it to the fight against the PCs, you'll have to have stats ready to go for any potential victor. Actually, it just gives me something to do with all those character combinations I just had to stat up... Loads of characters, nothing to do with them - that's pretty much where the idea came from. I've pretty much got a _high_ magic arena setting put together; it's really just the rankings and balanced encounters I was having issues with. There was an issue of Dungeon with an arena and some stats in it that I was looking at the other day, and I might be able to encorporate a few of those ideas into mine, so we'll see. Thanks for your help. IG