Basketball? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Basketball? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Sudnji_cas
03-17-07, 06:46 PM What would be rules for playing basketball in D&D? I'm guessing that jump check DC 30 is normal for slam dunk. For catching a ball in flight AoO is required. And for passing a ball a ranged touch attack against your fellow player where his AC is substracted by his DEX modifier. Any other suggestions?

EDIT: DC 15 for slam dunk is better as Edymnion pointed out.
Edymnion
03-17-07, 07:01 PM I'm guessing that jump check DC 30 is normal for slam dunk.Thats way too high. That means you have to be level 7 before you are even potentially capable of doing it, and would have to be nearly level 20 before you could do it reliably without magical enhancements. And when was the last time you saw any competant basketball player try to make a slam dunk and just totally screw it up? Even at level 15 with max ranks, you'd still miss the check 60% of the time.

Nah, if you wanted to go that route, it would be more like DC 15-17.
Sudnji_cas
03-17-07, 07:11 PM Thats way too high. That means you have to be level 7 before you are even potentially capable of doing it, and would have to be nearly level 20 before you could do it reliably without magical enhancements. And when was the last time you saw any competant basketball player try to make a slam dunk and just totally screw it up? Even at level 15 with max ranks, you'd still miss the check 60% of the time.

Nah, if you wanted to go that route, it would be more like DC 15-17.

Thaaaank you. Any more suggestions?
Seeker95
03-18-07, 08:10 AM Catching a ball in a pass would not be an AoO. Stealing a ball would. Treat it as a disarm attempt (held ball) or a grab (stealing a pass).

Passing would be like a splash attack attempting to hit a specific square.

Catching a regular pass would probably be a simple dex check.

Hitting a basket is a ranged attack roll against a DC of maybe 15. I could even see making it DC 20, looking at the shot ratio of the teams in the NCAA tournament this year. Then make free throws DC 15.

Blocked shots are also an AoO. Since this seems to happen rarely, I would make it a higher DC... perhaps 25, requiring a readied action.

Fouls happen any time you attempt to block or steal and miss by more than 4 (miss by 5 or more) since they seem to happen so often.

Driving the lane is a charge (or a bull rush?), and to avoid the charging call, you have to be successful by more than 5. (This needs some work)

That's a start.
captainswift
03-18-07, 02:46 PM Y'know, as important as college sports are to my campaign, you'd think I'd have rules governing this sort of thing. And yet I do not.

I do have extensive rules about what sorts of spells the cheerleaders can legally cast during plays, however.
Edymnion
03-18-07, 03:39 PM See, this is when you actually put down the dice, go outside, and play the game for real to determine who wins. :D
Aricomus
03-18-07, 08:53 PM What about new skills? Off the top of my head I'd say Perform (basketball) and Profession (Pro-Athlete)
deanruel
03-19-07, 03:09 AM I find sports to be very very hard to accurately represent through DnD rules. but I mostly posted to share my belief that DC 30 was a very reasonable dunking DC, and at LEAST it should be 25. Consider this

Level 3 Expert (or warrior, depending on what you think B-ball players are)
5 Jump Ranks +6
5 Tumble Ranks +2
FEAT 1: Skill Focus: Jump +3
FEAT 2: Leap of the Heavens +5
FEAT 3: Acrobatic +2
FEAT 4: Run +4
Strength 16 +3
TOTAL: +25

I think this is a reasonable build for a character who focuses on the game, and It isn't even uber uber optimized. You could find all sorts of ways to bump that into the 30's without a ton of trouble. Now I'm not saying this will be common I'm just saying most people can't slam dunk unless they've gotten a lot of practice. So it's not innacurate to make someone wait until about 5th level until they can do it
Escef
03-19-07, 04:32 AM Level 3 Expert (or warrior, depending on what you think B-ball players are)
5 Jump Ranks +6
5 Tumble Ranks +2
FEAT 1: Skill Focus: Jump +3
FEAT 2: Leap of the Heavens +5
FEAT 3: Acrobatic +2
FEAT 4: Run +4
Strength 16 +3
TOTAL: +25

Where are you getting 4 feats from? One for first level, one for third, and one for human makes 3. Also, max skill ranks at level 3 would be 6, not 5. (Though you have the proper modifier for six ranks...?)
Seeker95
03-19-07, 08:24 AM I agree that a dunk DC of 30 is reasonable.

Not everyone can dunk. It is higher than 10.
Not all high school players can dunk. It is higher than 15.
Not all college players can dunk. It is higher than 20.
Not all pros can dunk. It is higher than 25.

That so many pros can dunk is more a testament to the skill of the pros, not the ease of a dunk.
Seghan
03-19-07, 09:05 AM See, this is when you actually put down the dice, go outside, and play the game for real to determine who wins. :D

Bingo. I think I saw that in UA somewhere.
swallowyersoul
03-19-07, 10:33 PM the dunk is easy to figure out.

a net is 10 feet off the ground. an average medium character can reach up about 7 feet. that means you have to be three feet above the ground to dunk.

DC 12 jump check. a 1st level commoner can nail that just less than half the time. a 3rd level barbarian could do it three quarters of the time. a 20th level fighter could do it 100% of the time using a struggling goblin for the ball.

sinking the ball would be another story (melee touch attack perhaps?).

now, an impressive slam dunk with air time.... that's another story.

lots of the athletics rules are a little unreasonable given real people and real time. check out the hustle rules: maintaining a 6 minute mile pace for an hour. raise your hand if you can run 10 miles at a 6 minute mile while wearing plate mail....

remember, they're supposed to be heroic

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Sudnji_cas 03-17-07, 06:46 PM	What would be rules for playing basketball in D&D? I'm guessing that jump check DC 30 is normal for slam dunk. For catching a ball in flight AoO is required. And for passing a ball a ranged touch attack against your fellow player where his AC is substracted by his DEX modifier. Any other suggestions? EDIT: DC 15 for slam dunk is better as Edymnion pointed out.
Edymnion 03-17-07, 07:01 PM	I'm guessing that jump check DC 30 is normal for slam dunk.Thats way too high. That means you have to be level 7 before you are even potentially capable of doing it, and would have to be nearly level 20 before you could do it reliably without magical enhancements. And when was the last time you saw any competant basketball player try to make a slam dunk and just totally screw it up? Even at level 15 with max ranks, you'd still miss the check 60% of the time. Nah, if you wanted to go that route, it would be more like DC 15-17.
Sudnji_cas 03-17-07, 07:11 PM	Thats way too high. That means you have to be level 7 before you are even potentially capable of doing it, and would have to be nearly level 20 before you could do it reliably without magical enhancements. And when was the last time you saw any competant basketball player try to make a slam dunk and just totally screw it up? Even at level 15 with max ranks, you'd still miss the check 60% of the time. Nah, if you wanted to go that route, it would be more like DC 15-17. Thaaaank you. Any more suggestions?
Seeker95 03-18-07, 08:10 AM	Catching a ball in a pass would not be an AoO. Stealing a ball would. Treat it as a disarm attempt (held ball) or a grab (stealing a pass). Passing would be like a splash attack attempting to hit a specific square. Catching a regular pass would probably be a simple dex check. Hitting a basket is a ranged attack roll against a DC of maybe 15. I could even see making it DC 20, looking at the shot ratio of the teams in the NCAA tournament this year. Then make free throws DC 15. Blocked shots are also an AoO. Since this seems to happen rarely, I would make it a higher DC... perhaps 25, requiring a readied action. Fouls happen any time you attempt to block or steal and miss by more than 4 (miss by 5 or more) since they seem to happen so often. Driving the lane is a charge (or a bull rush?), and to avoid the charging call, you have to be successful by more than 5. (This needs some work) That's a start.
captainswift 03-18-07, 02:46 PM	Y'know, as important as college sports are to my campaign, you'd think I'd have rules governing this sort of thing. And yet I do not. I do have extensive rules about what sorts of spells the cheerleaders can legally cast during plays, however.
Edymnion 03-18-07, 03:39 PM	See, this is when you actually put down the dice, go outside, and play the game for real to determine who wins. :D
Aricomus 03-18-07, 08:53 PM	What about new skills? Off the top of my head I'd say Perform (basketball) and Profession (Pro-Athlete)
deanruel 03-19-07, 03:09 AM	I find sports to be very very hard to accurately represent through DnD rules. but I mostly posted to share my belief that DC 30 was a very reasonable dunking DC, and at LEAST it should be 25. Consider this Level 3 Expert (or warrior, depending on what you think B-ball players are) 5 Jump Ranks +6 5 Tumble Ranks +2 FEAT 1: Skill Focus: Jump +3 FEAT 2: Leap of the Heavens +5 FEAT 3: Acrobatic +2 FEAT 4: Run +4 Strength 16 +3 TOTAL: +25 I think this is a reasonable build for a character who focuses on the game, and It isn't even uber uber optimized. You could find all sorts of ways to bump that into the 30's without a ton of trouble. Now I'm not saying this will be common I'm just saying most people can't slam dunk unless they've gotten a lot of practice. So it's not innacurate to make someone wait until about 5th level until they can do it
Escef 03-19-07, 04:32 AM	Level 3 Expert (or warrior, depending on what you think B-ball players are) 5 Jump Ranks +6 5 Tumble Ranks +2 FEAT 1: Skill Focus: Jump +3 FEAT 2: Leap of the Heavens +5 FEAT 3: Acrobatic +2 FEAT 4: Run +4 Strength 16 +3 TOTAL: +25 Where are you getting 4 feats from? One for first level, one for third, and one for human makes 3. Also, max skill ranks at level 3 would be 6, not 5. (Though you have the proper modifier for six ranks...?)
Seeker95 03-19-07, 08:24 AM	I agree that a dunk DC of 30 is reasonable. Not everyone can dunk. It is higher than 10. Not all high school players can dunk. It is higher than 15. Not all college players can dunk. It is higher than 20. Not all pros can dunk. It is higher than 25. That so many pros can dunk is more a testament to the skill of the pros, not the ease of a dunk.
Seghan 03-19-07, 09:05 AM	See, this is when you actually put down the dice, go outside, and play the game for real to determine who wins. :D Bingo. I think I saw that in UA somewhere.
swallowyersoul 03-19-07, 10:33 PM	the dunk is easy to figure out. a net is 10 feet off the ground. an average medium character can reach up about 7 feet. that means you have to be three feet above the ground to dunk. DC 12 jump check. a 1st level commoner can nail that just less than half the time. a 3rd level barbarian could do it three quarters of the time. a 20th level fighter could do it 100% of the time using a struggling goblin for the ball. sinking the ball would be another story (melee touch attack perhaps?). now, an impressive slam dunk with air time.... that's another story. lots of the athletics rules are a little unreasonable given real people and real time. check out the hustle rules: maintaining a 6 minute mile pace for an hour. raise your hand if you can run 10 miles at a 6 minute mile while wearing plate mail.... remember, they're supposed to be heroic