Post/Author/DateTime	Post
zgrose 04-05-04, 03:06 PM	Looking for a little clarification on damage reduction. My zombie knights have 5/slashing + 2/- (from armor using UA rules). My player's PC has a morningstar (bludgeoning) enchanted with Magic Weapon (gives +1 attack/damage) which I rules also makes the weapon a magic weapon, just as the spell implies. Does the magic-ness of the morningstar trump both the slashing and - DR types or has this changed in the 3.0 -> 3.5 transition?
symons 04-05-04, 03:13 PM	my understanding is that. The magic weapon would not help with that comb. of DR. Also only the highest DR would work. Then do not stack.
ieattrollsforbreakfast 04-05-04, 03:22 PM	The DR 2/- is not overcome by anything apart from things that normally bypass DR altogether, such as a spell. The magic morning star cannot overcome the DR 5/slashing, it is irrelevant whether or not it is magical, it MUST be a slashing weapon. Also, by the way I understand it multiple damage reductions (of different types) are applied seperately, so do effectively stack, but for example a creature with DR 3/slashing that then gains another 5/slashing from somewhere would only get 5/slashing. For example, using the 5/slashing 2/- combo above, the morningstar would have 5 damage reduced, and then another 2. A sword would only be reduced by 2 damage.
zgrose 04-05-04, 03:27 PM	Originally posted by symons my understanding is that. The magic weapon would not help with that comb. of DR. Also only the highest DR would work. Then do not stack. Oops, you are right. They don't stack (DMG pg 292 para 4). So they dropped the old damage reduction rankings, eh? The old example was that a +1 weapon would also do full damage to the 15/silver werewolf even though it wasn't silver. I guess since they dropped damage reduction numbers across the board they balanced that loss with more specific weapon requirements.
zgrose 04-05-04, 03:29 PM	Originally posted by ieattrollsforbreakfast Also, by the way I understand it multiple damage reductions (of different types) are applied seperately, so do effectively stack, but for example a creature with DR 3/slashing that then gains another 5/slashing from somewhere would only get 5/slashing. For example, using the 5/slashing 2/- combo above, the morningstar would have 5 damage reduced, and then another 2. A sword would only be reduced by 2 damage. [/B] That is what I would've thought too, but the DMG is pretty clear on that part (see reference in last post).
ieattrollsforbreakfast 04-05-04, 03:30 PM	Originally posted by zgrose Oops, you are right. They don't stack (DMG pg 292 para 4). Sorry about above, I must have missed that paragraph.
Seeker95 04-05-04, 03:53 PM	The best way to bypass damage reduction is to hit harder and more often. :devil: Aside from that, you can always try to use the appropriate material / magic / type.
zgrose 04-05-04, 03:59 PM	Originally posted by Seeker95 The best way to bypass damage reduction is to hit harder and more often. Aside from that, you can always try to use the appropriate material / magic / type. My PCs are limited to in weapon choices by the campaign setting so they have less flexibility in this regard than they would in a vanilla DnD setting. The morningstar wielding character regularly does over 10 points of damage with his power attack so -5 damage shouldn't be too bad. I've also almost used up all my planned zombie encounters so he should be hitting harder. Now the bodak (main Bad Guy) will be another story. Guess I should drop some hints that they may need some cold iron weapons in the near future. :D
Seeker95 04-06-04, 12:13 AM	Originally posted by zgrose Now the bodak (main Bad Guy) will be another story. Guess I should drop some hints that they may need some cold iron weapons in the near future. :D You could pull a video-game trick. Place a few corpses in the area -- past attempts at vanquish that failed -- where the former inhabitants of the bodies were carrying the right weapons (non-magical, but proper material) that they just didn't quite get to use effectively. That way, the weapons are available, if the party thought to examine them closely, or made the connection when they did examine them.
Escef 04-06-04, 01:37 PM	Probably past your party's capabilities right now, but damage reduction is a supernatural (Su) ability, and thus negated by Anti-Magic Shell.
zgrose 04-06-04, 02:10 PM	Originally posted by Escef Probably past your party's capabilities right now, but damage reduction is a supernatural (Su) ability, and thus negated by Anti-Magic Shell. Oh. Good to know. They are currently level 3 but I could create an environment where such a shell exists and they could lure the Bad Guy to it. So many good ideas. :)
Goreg Skullcrusher 04-06-04, 03:33 PM	The DR 2/- is not overcome by anything apart from things that normally bypass DR altogether, such as a spell. The magic morning star cannot overcome the DR 5/slashing, it is irrelevant whether or not it is magical, it MUST be a slashing weapon. Also, by the way I understand it multiple damage reductions (of different types) are applied seperately, so do effectively stack, but for example a creature with DR 3/slashing that then gains another 5/slashing from somewhere would only get 5/slashing. For example, using the 5/slashing 2/- combo above, the morningstar would have 5 damage reduced, and then another 2. A sword would only be reduced by 2 damage. Almost. Against a monster with DR 5/slashing and DR 2/- only the most prevalent one is used, in this case, the DR 5/slashing. If that is bypassed, the DR 2/- kicks in. A magical morningstar would have 5 of its damage reduced, not 7.
Escef 04-07-04, 12:04 AM	Something I overlooked, you might want to rule that DR granted by armor isn't supernatural. And to be honest, I'd let skeletons and zombies keep their damage reduction as well, as it's based on the construction of their bodies more than any magical/mystical properties.
zgrose 04-07-04, 02:27 AM	Originally posted by Escef Something I overlooked, you might want to rule that DR granted by armor isn't supernatural. And to be honest, I'd let skeletons and zombies keep their damage reduction as well, as it's based on the construction of their bodies more than any magical/mystical properties. MM does say Damage Reduction can be Su or Ex. I would be inclined to go with the Ex(traordinary) version as well. Neither DMG or MM give much guidance as to whether a particular case of DR is Su or Ex (at least in the most obvious places).
Escef 04-07-04, 12:16 PM	Yeah, I'd say lycanthropic and outsider DRs are Supernateral. Golems I'd be torn on. You can make arguements either way for those.
Goreg Skullcrusher 04-07-04, 02:02 PM	Yeah, tough call on the Golems. Iron and Adamantine versions I can be convinced of (Ex), but other ones like Clay are really toss ups.
Escef 04-07-04, 03:12 PM	Actually, I just bust open the latest issue of Dragon and this very question is discussed in sage advice. It seems the only DR types that are considered supernatural are the types that a weapon can be only if enchanted. So damage reduction slashing, peircing, bludgeoning, silver, adamantine, and cold iron are extraordinary, while magic, lawful, chaotic, evil, and good are supernatural. An area of anti-magic only suppresses the supernatural components of DR, so something with DR 10/good and silver would be reduced to DR 10/silver.