Post/Author/DateTime	Post
the_bringer 03-03-06, 03:29 PM	so a friend has a ninja with +4d6 sudden strike, and the arguments is about how to calculate the damage.. is it +4d6 to each hit (ie: 4 hits/attack = +4d6(x4) therfore +16d6) or +4d6 for the round? help needed urgently...
Vaelan 03-03-06, 03:33 PM	Each hit. This has been confirmed by both the text of the abilities and the Rules of the Game article on Sneak Attacks.
the_bringer 03-03-06, 03:37 PM	but would it not be considered a volley attack as he is rolling 6 times in one attack? after doing some reading i found an article on the sight saying that for volley attacks only the first is considered a sneak attack...
Norath 03-03-06, 04:31 PM	how is he attacking? details my friend, details.
Zherog 03-03-06, 05:47 PM	but would it not be considered a volley attack as he is rolling 6 times in one attack? after doing some reading i found an article on the sight saying that for volley attacks only the first is considered a sneak attack... We don't know if it's a volley attack or not - you never told us what weapon was being used. Sneak Attack (and related abilities like skirmish or sudden strike) can be had on any attack you make that meet the criteria. So, if I have a rogue who gets 3 attacks a round, plus one off-hand weapon attack, and that rogue flanks the target, he can make 4 sneak attacks in a round. You are indeed correct that a volley of attacks (Manyshot, for example) only applies sneak attack once.
Tempest Stormwind 03-03-06, 06:09 PM	You are indeed correct that a volley of attacks (Manyshot, for example) only applies sneak attack once. Actually, the rules are foggy on this area. It doesn't add up on Manyshot because Manyshot explicitly says it does not (see precision-based damage). Other volleys (i.e. the Manticore's tail spikes) are silent on the issue. And then there are feats like Greater Manyshot (see your SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/psionicFeats.htm#greaterManyshot) in the psionics section -- it was in the XPH, although it is a [General] feat with nothing to do with psionics), which are essentially volley attacks but allow precision damage to hit on every arrow. Personally, I say that if it doesn't say it does, then it only works on the first hit of a volley. For clarification for the OP, this explicitly means volley attacks, instead of the normal attacks a character gets, or increases thereof (say, Rapid Shot or Two-Weapon Fighting). Those, as normal, still deal full precision damage in every single attack that qualifies. For the OP, I use "precision damage" as a catchall for Sneak Attack, Sudden Strike, and Skirmish. They each apply so long as you mee the conditions for them applying: Sneak Attack: Target is denied Dexterity bonus to AC OR you are Flanking target. Sudden Strike: Target is denied Dexterity bonus to AC. Skirmish: You have moved at least 10' in this round. If an enemy is in a position to be hit with more than one, he's hit with more than one. Example: A rogue 1 / ninja 1 has Sneak Attack 1d6 and Sudden Strike 1d6. If he flanks a target, he deals +1d6 damage on ALL his attacks from Sneak Attack (and since he chose the Two-Weapon Fighting feat and uses two weapons, this is two attacks a round, for a total of 2d6 damage). If he attacks a target who is denied his Dexterity bonus to AC against his attacks (say, he's attacking while Invisible), then both Sudden Strike and Sneak Attack kick in, dealing +2d6 damage on each attack (total +4d6 since he has two weapons). Does that make sense?
Mentar 03-03-06, 06:59 PM	Remember that when attacking while hidden or under normal invisibility, the opponent is denied dexterity for only the first attack (which breaks the hide/invisible). Thus a flanking rogue 1/ninja 1 with two weapon fighting, who is hidden/invisible would get +2d6 on the first attack and only +1D6 on the off hand attack. Greater invisibility does not go away when you attack, so that would allow multiple sneak attacks/sudden strikes. Even using ranged weapons/rapid shot you only get the sneak attack/sudden strike on the first shot, unless something else is denies the target his dex bonus. This is why tanglefoot bags are good investments for ranged rogues.