Child PCs? [Archive] - Wizards Community - Pages Merged by Solauren

Child PCs? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Shingro
10-01-06, 10:51 AM So how would people go about creating a child charecter of any given race? As far as I can tell there aren't any rules for anything before the 'average' 20+

the primary reason this seems at least vaugely importent is the size difference, of course by logic a child would be weaker then an adult. Of course in the campaign in question PCs are infused with special power, (so it might not have to be exceptionally shafted stats)

anyway I'm trying to figure out a good comprimise that won't severely punish a player for an *age choice* you know? ;) any thoughts?

incedently, the exact thing under discussion is a child Elan Psion
cog_and_taz
10-01-06, 10:53 AM Especially if he's an elan, make him weaker(less str/con), give the guy a cha boost(aww, he's so cute!), and some extra power points.
Vestigial_Thumb
10-01-06, 10:57 AM Young Adult/Juvenile: -1 to all ability scores.
Young Child: -4 to Str and Con, -2 to all other ability scores.
Children are bad at everything they do when compared to adults.

Penalties are not cumulative.

And Elans are made, not born, so a child Elan would probably be impossible.
Bowlich
10-01-06, 11:57 AM I'm suprised that WotC hasn't bothered to put out rules for child characters on a faq, or something since it seems that this issue comes up every all the time.

My current campaign has a player playing a 12 year old kid. I ruled that the kid has -4 str, con, -2 int, wis (kid's aren't strong, tend to get ill easily, and haven't had enough life-experiance to gain as much useful skills as an adult.), +2 dex and +2 cha (kid's are smaller, better and squeezing into things and manipulating smaller instruments, and kid's tend to be very good at getting their way).
frasmage
10-01-06, 02:06 PM In some ways, it would almost make sense to give them an int boost - it seems like teens know far more about technology,etc. (try explaining a computer to a grandparent )

then again they would also have a massive wis penalty ;)
bhu
10-01-06, 03:33 PM Kids learn new tech easier because your brain gets hard wired as you get older, making it more difficult to learn new things. If you want to learn soemthing complex such as a new language or a particularly difficult physical sport (many martial arts), the younger you start the better.

Also keep in mind how easily manipulated children are. Their Willpower Saves would suck. Not to mention in all likelihood their first response at seeing something like a Cloaker would be to crap themselves and run screaming.
Vestigial_Thumb
10-01-06, 03:39 PM and kid's tend to be very good at getting their way
Riiiiiight.

Kid: "I want a Blue Megaman"
Mother: "You can't have a Blue Megaman."
Kid: "IwantIwantIwantIwantIwant!"
Mother: "Easy there, little Johnny. You're making a scene."

as opposed to

Abnormal Kid: "I want a Blue Megaman."
Mother: "You can't have a Blue Megaman."
Abnormal Kid: "Let's cut a deal..."
Tarvok
10-01-06, 05:09 PM I'm suprised that WotC hasn't bothered to put out rules for child characters on a faq, or something since it seems that this issue comes up every all the time.

Actually, aren't there rules for this somewhere in the DMG? I *know* there are rules for it in d20 Modern.
frasmage
10-01-06, 05:25 PM I remember seeing rules for it somewhere....

can't find it on the srd, dunno where it was
Smischmal
10-01-06, 05:30 PM There are rules for this in the Star Wars Roleplaying Game
Children (up to 11 years old) get-3 to Strength and Constitution, -1 to mental scores and Dexterity, and are 1 size smaller
Young adults (up to 15 years old) get -1 to all scores
Ages are for humans, you would have to figure out ages for other races
cat_god
10-01-06, 08:08 PM And the Quintessential Sorceror.
dokesa
10-01-06, 08:29 PM There was a similar thread a couple weeks ago. Here's what I do:

category scores size age (human)
infant 1 tiny 0 years
toddler 1d3 small 1 year
child 1d6 small 4 years
juvenile 2d6 medium 9 years
adult 3d6 medium 15 years
minimum of 3 intelligence for all age categories.
supernerd222
10-01-06, 08:45 PM An infant wouldn't have 3 intelligence.
Giant Turtle
10-02-06, 03:18 AM An infant wouldn't have 3 intelligence.
I can see your point, but I wouldn't say its a 1.
An infant is defined as: (nound) 1. A child in the earliest period of life, especially before he or she can walk. 2. Law. A person under the legal age of majority; a minor.
I'm assuming we aren't talking about the legal meaning, so I will go with definition 1. I have a 3 year old nephew I live with, so I know the whole infant thing, and I swear to you that a child, even shortly after birth, is smarter then a Camel (Int 1). Sure, the camel knows how to survive in the desert, but he's built that way. Overall, infant has atleast a 2 (a dog). I can understand an infant being as smart as your average dog.
Personally, since the youngest you can adventure as a human is 16 (PHB, Page 109, Table 6-4), then I am assuming you don't receive penalties at this age. I would say that from 8-12 yours of age, -4 Strength, -4 Con, -2 Int, -2 Wis, -2 Cha sounds about right. Children by no means have low dex scores. For those of you saying "Kids often get their way" or "Aww, how cute" for bumping up Charisma, thats not how it works. Charisma represents diplomacy for getting what you want. As far as "How cute" then sure, thats charisma, but I have never found an 8 year old to be very good at lying, diplomacy, or intimadating. Besides, the whole "cute" thing is bull, look around yourself and tell me that you never see a fat kid or an ugly kid. Thats why there is almost NO humanoid race that gets a bonus to charisma. (Drow being the ONLY exception I know of, which is supposed to represent generations of ruthless practice in force of personality).
zae
10-02-06, 08:46 AM They have rules for children. It's in the Players Handbook, at the end of the "Races" section.

Here's the gist of what they get:

+2 Dexterity, –2 Strength.
Small size
20' speed
+2 racial bonus on Climb, Jump, and Move Silently checks.
+1 racial bonus on all saving throws.
+2 morale bonus on saving throws against fear: This bonus stacks with the +1 bonus on saving throws in general.
+1 racial bonus on attack rolls with thrown weapons and slings.
+2 racial bonus on Listen checks.
Automatic Languages: Common and Halfling. Bonus Languages: Dwarven, Elven, Gnome, Goblin, and Orc.
Favored Class: Rogue
Grand Theft Otto
10-02-06, 10:16 AM They have rules for children. It's in the Players Handbook, at the end of the "Races" section.

Here's the gist of what they get:

+2 Dexterity, –2 Strength.
Small size
20' speed
+2 racial bonus on Climb, Jump, and Move Silently checks.
+1 racial bonus on all saving throws.
+2 morale bonus on saving throws against fear: This bonus stacks with the +1 bonus on saving throws in general.
+1 racial bonus on attack rolls with thrown weapons and slings.
+2 racial bonus on Listen checks.
Automatic Languages: Common and Halfling. Bonus Languages: Dwarven, Elven, Gnome, Goblin, and Orc.
Favored Class: Rogue

:rolleyes:

Halflings arent children. Halflings are friggin supermen compared to a human that's been shrunk (-4 to str), and several times stronger than a small human that hasnt gone through puberty.

Here's my suggestion for making a kid character. Most probably wont like them, since people who want to play them want some kind of retarded anime-esque kid that rides around on a skateboard, shooting lightning and making adults look stupid, but here you go.

Toddler (1/4 starting age or less, 4 or less for a human)
You cant realistically play a 4 year old. If somehow you get put into the body of a 4 year old, you get -4 to con, -6 to dex, and -8 to strength, -4 circumstance penalty on all charisma related checks. Size small.

Toddlers are rediclously weak and uncoordinated, and their health is nowhere near an adult (which is why disease kills children more than adults). Even if someone accepts a talking baby, its hard to take them seriously. You arent going to follow them in battle, you arent going to be scared if they tell you they're gonna rip your throat out, and you arent likely to tell them the latest happenings down at the thieves guild. Sorry for those who think babies are cute, thats not charisma.

Young child (1/2 starting age, roughly 8 for a human)
-2 to Dex and Con, -4 to Int, Wis and Cha, -6 to Strength, size small, suffers non-proficiency penalty with anything except light weapons.

You suck slightly less than a toddler, but you cant really heft a heavy weapon, even a small one (and that's assuming you've been trained). Ever seen a 6 year old at T-Ball almost swing around with the weight of the bat? Same thing applies here.

Pre-teen (1/2 to 4/5, starting age 9-13 for humans)
-3 to Strength, -2 Intelligence and Charisma, size small, powerful build.

Adulthood comes early in most midieval societies, which is what D&D is based on. The difference between a 14 year old barbarian and a 15 year old arent incredibly great. The powerful build trait represents that they are likely in the upper range of their size category (similar to how goliaths bridge the gap between medium and large).

You'll note there are no +'s to stats. Contrary to popular belief on these boards, children are not more physically coordinated than adults. Go watch a bunch of 8 year olds play any sport, and you'll quickly dismiss the notion of some sort of super thief. Cute? Maybe, but as touched on, children arent great leaders. They arent terribly convincing. They stammer and stutter near adults when flustered. They lack strong sense of selves, and tend to follow orders. So no silly uber sorcerer either.
dokesa
10-02-06, 10:57 AM An infant wouldn't have 3 intelligence.It's probably a two, and I would have made it a one to be consistent with the other scores, but I wanted them to be sentient. This is actually a good argument for why intelligence scores don't translate to IQ. The average baby would have an IQ of 100, and a person's IQ doesn't change as he advances into older age categories.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Shingro 10-01-06, 10:51 AM	So how would people go about creating a child charecter of any given race? As far as I can tell there aren't any rules for anything before the 'average' 20+ the primary reason this seems at least vaugely importent is the size difference, of course by logic a child would be weaker then an adult. Of course in the campaign in question PCs are infused with special power, (so it might not have to be exceptionally shafted stats) anyway I'm trying to figure out a good comprimise that won't severely punish a player for an age choice you know? ;) any thoughts? incedently, the exact thing under discussion is a child Elan Psion
cog_and_taz 10-01-06, 10:53 AM	Especially if he's an elan, make him weaker(less str/con), give the guy a cha boost(aww, he's so cute!), and some extra power points.
Vestigial_Thumb 10-01-06, 10:57 AM	Young Adult/Juvenile: -1 to all ability scores. Young Child: -4 to Str and Con, -2 to all other ability scores. Children are bad at everything they do when compared to adults. Penalties are not cumulative. And Elans are made, not born, so a child Elan would probably be impossible.
Bowlich 10-01-06, 11:57 AM	I'm suprised that WotC hasn't bothered to put out rules for child characters on a faq, or something since it seems that this issue comes up every all the time. My current campaign has a player playing a 12 year old kid. I ruled that the kid has -4 str, con, -2 int, wis (kid's aren't strong, tend to get ill easily, and haven't had enough life-experiance to gain as much useful skills as an adult.), +2 dex and +2 cha (kid's are smaller, better and squeezing into things and manipulating smaller instruments, and kid's tend to be very good at getting their way).
frasmage 10-01-06, 02:06 PM	In some ways, it would almost make sense to give them an int boost - it seems like teens know far more about technology,etc. (try explaining a computer to a grandparent ) then again they would also have a massive wis penalty ;)
bhu 10-01-06, 03:33 PM	Kids learn new tech easier because your brain gets hard wired as you get older, making it more difficult to learn new things. If you want to learn soemthing complex such as a new language or a particularly difficult physical sport (many martial arts), the younger you start the better. Also keep in mind how easily manipulated children are. Their Willpower Saves would suck. Not to mention in all likelihood their first response at seeing something like a Cloaker would be to crap themselves and run screaming.
Vestigial_Thumb 10-01-06, 03:39 PM	and kid's tend to be very good at getting their way Riiiiiight. Kid: "I want a Blue Megaman" Mother: "You can't have a Blue Megaman." Kid: "IwantIwantIwantIwantIwant!" Mother: "Easy there, little Johnny. You're making a scene." as opposed to Abnormal Kid: "I want a Blue Megaman." Mother: "You can't have a Blue Megaman." Abnormal Kid: "Let's cut a deal..."
Tarvok 10-01-06, 05:09 PM	I'm suprised that WotC hasn't bothered to put out rules for child characters on a faq, or something since it seems that this issue comes up every all the time. Actually, aren't there rules for this somewhere in the DMG? I know there are rules for it in d20 Modern.
frasmage 10-01-06, 05:25 PM	I remember seeing rules for it somewhere.... can't find it on the srd, dunno where it was
Smischmal 10-01-06, 05:30 PM	There are rules for this in the Star Wars Roleplaying Game Children (up to 11 years old) get-3 to Strength and Constitution, -1 to mental scores and Dexterity, and are 1 size smaller Young adults (up to 15 years old) get -1 to all scores Ages are for humans, you would have to figure out ages for other races
cat_god 10-01-06, 08:08 PM	And the Quintessential Sorceror.
dokesa 10-01-06, 08:29 PM	There was a similar thread a couple weeks ago. Here's what I do: category scores size age (human) infant 1 tiny 0 years toddler 1d3 small 1 year child 1d6 small 4 years juvenile 2d6 medium 9 years adult 3d6 medium 15 years minimum of 3 intelligence for all age categories.
supernerd222 10-01-06, 08:45 PM	An infant wouldn't have 3 intelligence.
Giant Turtle 10-02-06, 03:18 AM	An infant wouldn't have 3 intelligence. I can see your point, but I wouldn't say its a 1. An infant is defined as: (nound) 1. A child in the earliest period of life, especially before he or she can walk. 2. Law. A person under the legal age of majority; a minor. I'm assuming we aren't talking about the legal meaning, so I will go with definition 1. I have a 3 year old nephew I live with, so I know the whole infant thing, and I swear to you that a child, even shortly after birth, is smarter then a Camel (Int 1). Sure, the camel knows how to survive in the desert, but he's built that way. Overall, infant has atleast a 2 (a dog). I can understand an infant being as smart as your average dog. Personally, since the youngest you can adventure as a human is 16 (PHB, Page 109, Table 6-4), then I am assuming you don't receive penalties at this age. I would say that from 8-12 yours of age, -4 Strength, -4 Con, -2 Int, -2 Wis, -2 Cha sounds about right. Children by no means have low dex scores. For those of you saying "Kids often get their way" or "Aww, how cute" for bumping up Charisma, thats not how it works. Charisma represents diplomacy for getting what you want. As far as "How cute" then sure, thats charisma, but I have never found an 8 year old to be very good at lying, diplomacy, or intimadating. Besides, the whole "cute" thing is bull, look around yourself and tell me that you never see a fat kid or an ugly kid. Thats why there is almost NO humanoid race that gets a bonus to charisma. (Drow being the ONLY exception I know of, which is supposed to represent generations of ruthless practice in force of personality).
zae 10-02-06, 08:46 AM	They have rules for children. It's in the Players Handbook, at the end of the "Races" section. Here's the gist of what they get: +2 Dexterity, –2 Strength. Small size 20' speed +2 racial bonus on Climb, Jump, and Move Silently checks. +1 racial bonus on all saving throws. +2 morale bonus on saving throws against fear: This bonus stacks with the +1 bonus on saving throws in general. +1 racial bonus on attack rolls with thrown weapons and slings. +2 racial bonus on Listen checks. Automatic Languages: Common and Halfling. Bonus Languages: Dwarven, Elven, Gnome, Goblin, and Orc. Favored Class: Rogue
Grand Theft Otto 10-02-06, 10:16 AM	They have rules for children. It's in the Players Handbook, at the end of the "Races" section. Here's the gist of what they get: +2 Dexterity, –2 Strength. Small size 20' speed +2 racial bonus on Climb, Jump, and Move Silently checks. +1 racial bonus on all saving throws. +2 morale bonus on saving throws against fear: This bonus stacks with the +1 bonus on saving throws in general. +1 racial bonus on attack rolls with thrown weapons and slings. +2 racial bonus on Listen checks. Automatic Languages: Common and Halfling. Bonus Languages: Dwarven, Elven, Gnome, Goblin, and Orc. Favored Class: Rogue :rolleyes: Halflings arent children. Halflings are friggin supermen compared to a human that's been shrunk (-4 to str), and several times stronger than a small human that hasnt gone through puberty. Here's my suggestion for making a kid character. Most probably wont like them, since people who want to play them want some kind of retarded anime-esque kid that rides around on a skateboard, shooting lightning and making adults look stupid, but here you go. Toddler (1/4 starting age or less, 4 or less for a human) You cant realistically play a 4 year old. If somehow you get put into the body of a 4 year old, you get -4 to con, -6 to dex, and -8 to strength, -4 circumstance penalty on all charisma related checks. Size small. Toddlers are rediclously weak and uncoordinated, and their health is nowhere near an adult (which is why disease kills children more than adults). Even if someone accepts a talking baby, its hard to take them seriously. You arent going to follow them in battle, you arent going to be scared if they tell you they're gonna rip your throat out, and you arent likely to tell them the latest happenings down at the thieves guild. Sorry for those who think babies are cute, thats not charisma. Young child (1/2 starting age, roughly 8 for a human) -2 to Dex and Con, -4 to Int, Wis and Cha, -6 to Strength, size small, suffers non-proficiency penalty with anything except light weapons. You suck slightly less than a toddler, but you cant really heft a heavy weapon, even a small one (and that's assuming you've been trained). Ever seen a 6 year old at T-Ball almost swing around with the weight of the bat? Same thing applies here. Pre-teen (1/2 to 4/5, starting age 9-13 for humans) -3 to Strength, -2 Intelligence and Charisma, size small, powerful build. Adulthood comes early in most midieval societies, which is what D&D is based on. The difference between a 14 year old barbarian and a 15 year old arent incredibly great. The powerful build trait represents that they are likely in the upper range of their size category (similar to how goliaths bridge the gap between medium and large). You'll note there are no +'s to stats. Contrary to popular belief on these boards, children are not more physically coordinated than adults. Go watch a bunch of 8 year olds play any sport, and you'll quickly dismiss the notion of some sort of super thief. Cute? Maybe, but as touched on, children arent great leaders. They arent terribly convincing. They stammer and stutter near adults when flustered. They lack strong sense of selves, and tend to follow orders. So no silly uber sorcerer either.
dokesa 10-02-06, 10:57 AM	An infant wouldn't have 3 intelligence.It's probably a two, and I would have made it a one to be consistent with the other scores, but I wanted them to be sentient. This is actually a good argument for why intelligence scores don't translate to IQ. The average baby would have an IQ of 100, and a person's IQ doesn't change as he advances into older age categories.