Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Manyfist 11-29-06, 12:02 AM	Lets say you're going to stat out a Child, not a super intelligent child, just your normal child before Character level. Would you use the D20 Modern version or just say 1HD, Feat...etc? D20 Modern: -3 Str, -1 Dex, -3 Con, -1 Int, -1 Wis, -1 Cha. Children have 1d4 hp, no feats, skills, action points, or occupations. They have +0 bab and base mod to saves. Children have a normal speed of 20ft.
Tenebrous_Sage 11-29-06, 01:56 AM	There really aren't rule for stating out children, but I think it would be safe to give them one humanoid HD that would be replace by their first class level at about the time they reach maturity. They really shouldn't have a feat and all skills should be cross-class skills. Penalties to their attributes would make sense as well.
Seeker95 11-29-06, 09:44 AM	Children? I would apply -1 for every two years before the age of 18. All stats. Average human is 11 across the board. Age 18: 11s Age 16: 10s Age 14: 9s Age 12: 8s Age 10: 7s Age 8: 6s Age 6: 5s Age 4: 4s Age 2: 3s Before you object, because you know "a really smart kid" or a "really strong kid" -- that kid is not the norm. Normal kids are weak, slow, clumsy, dumb, susceptible to pain, unwise and very uncharismatic. Every kid seems to excel in some area, raising the score for that stat above the norm. And as that kid ages, that stat continues to increase. The strongest kid in your high school is still nowhere near as strong as he will be by the end of college. And that college graduate doesn't peak in strength until about age 30. A runner isn't at his fastest until about age 30, no matter how wonderfully fast s/he outpaced the others on the high school track team. The smartest genius kid in the world still demonstrates even greater intelligence as s/he gets older.
Sulaco 11-29-06, 01:00 PM	Human Child 0-Level Commoner Small Vermin Hit Dice: 1d4 (2 hp) Initiative: +0 Speed: 15 ft. (3 squares) Armor Class: 11 (+1 size) Base Attack: +0 Space/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft Special Attacks: — Special Qualities: Wuss (when suffering any damage, even non-lethal, the child begins to cry uncontrolably) Saves: Fort +2, Ref +0, Will –1 Abilities: Str 9, Dex 10, Con 10, Int 10, Wis 9, Cha 8 Skills: — Feats: — Organization: Solitary or playgroup (2d6) Challenge Rating: 0 Treasure: Candy Alignment: Always Chaotic Advancement: By character class Level Adjustment: +0
Grand Theft Otto 11-29-06, 01:04 PM	Lets say you're going to stat out a Child, not a super intelligent child, just your normal child before Character level. Would you use the D20 Modern version or just say 1HD, Feat...etc? D20 Modern: [/sblock] -3 Str, -1 Dex, -3 Con, -1 Int, -1 Wis, -1 Cha. Children have 1d4 hp, no feats, skills, action points, or occupations. They have +0 bab and base mod to saves. Children have a normal speed of 20ft.[/sblock] That kid is a friggin superman. Children are significantly worse than adults in every possible way, and the -1 just doesnt reflect that.
Lorianne 11-29-06, 02:20 PM	The Game of Thrones D20 book has rules about playing children of various ages... I don't have the book, but you could try to take a look at that.
SephDragoon 11-29-06, 05:59 PM	Except you are saying that a 3 year old is less intelligent than your average animal, yet, during those early years, children learn far faster than at any other time in their life. Also, dexterity isn't just a measure of speed. If it was, then not everyone would be going at 30ft per round... You are already representing their change in speed with their small size 20ft per round. Also, yes, the strength should be a huge drop, but some of the others, I don't think so. Con should be about half that rate (con effects fortitude saves as well, and while small children are more vulnerable to disease, a 14-16 year old will on average resist sickness FAR better than a 30 year old (their immune system is actually stronger at that age). Next, charisma shouldn't ever take more than a -2... and that is only for very young children (aka, immature), because how often did you see a baby causing everyone to run away in disgust? Babies are cute, and no doubt, more charismatic in their own way than most adults. Wisdom... oh yeah, that should be going at the same rate as strength... kids aren't too wise, no doubt. So... my idea would be closer to children get huge penalties on strength and wisdom, small penalties to dexterity and charisma, and a moderate (but still pretty low) penalty to constitution and intelligence. Even with that, it is horribly horribly off for the various stages of life. But that is a bit closer. Besides, there are stats for children in D&D... I've had to use them before. I can't remember the book they are in though.
Seeker95 11-29-06, 08:19 PM	Except you are saying that a 3 year old is less intelligent than your average animalWho is making a 3-year old less intelligent than the average animal? I have seen no posts in this thread suggest that children have an intelligence of less than 3. The average animal is a 1. Some very intelligent animals are a 2. The lowest intelligence stat offered on this thread is 3 for a two-year old.
Bowmore 11-29-06, 08:39 PM	Special Qualities: Wuss (when suffering any damage, even non-lethal, the child begins to cry uncontrolably) Alignment: Always Chaotic Frighteningly accurate!
High Octane 11-29-06, 08:51 PM	Now that you have them statted, you can kill them! "How can you shoot innocent women and children?" "Easy. Just don't lead your shots as much!" Cookie for the reference recognition.
Cincinnati 11-29-06, 08:56 PM	Human Child 0-Level Commoner Small Vermin Awesome.
KurenaiYami 11-29-06, 09:02 PM	Human Child 0-Level Commoner Small Vermin Hit Dice: 1d4 (2 hp) Initiative: +0 Speed: 15 ft. (3 squares) Armor Class: 11 (+1 size) Base Attack: +0 Space/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft Special Attacks: — Special Qualities: Wuss (when suffering any damage, even non-lethal, the child begins to cry uncontrolably) Saves: Fort +2, Ref +0, Will –1 Abilities: Str 9, Dex 10, Con 10, Int 10, Wis 9, Cha 8 Skills: — Feats: — Organization: Solitary or playgroup (2d6) Challenge Rating: 0 Treasure: Candy Alignment: Always Chaotic Advancement: By character class Level Adjustment: +0 I would sig this so fast if I had the space.
Sarella Starshine 11-29-06, 09:11 PM	my only beef with sulaco's stats is the cha...my wee one has way more cha than a mere 8. In fact, cha scores should decrease as one ages as a wee baby is very charasmatic compared to an old geezer. :P then again it maybe she has the SA charm (at will) with either a horendous save DC or i just voluntary fail it. :D
Zicka 11-29-06, 09:24 PM	well, Id say this all depends on the age for example... A 12 year old would most certinly be +2 dex because children are more flexible and agile, -4 strength, -2 con, and +2 cha.. why the +2 cha? simple.... children are cute. I am one. :invasion:
Seeker95 11-29-06, 09:33 PM	A 12 year old would most certinly be +2 dex because children are more flexible and agileTheir reaction times suck, and they are clumsy as hell. Although they can bend like Gumby, they are not more dextrous... just more flexible.
Zicka 11-29-06, 09:36 PM	Well... maybe you are just clumsy in general but I am 12 and I know that I have faster reflexes than you probobly do.
SephDragoon 11-29-06, 09:44 PM	But perhaps not the +2 charisma... as you don't seem to know how to be very diplomatic or convincing. :P
Zicka 11-29-06, 09:53 PM	hey thats not nice I won state at middle school 4n6 you know... n00b
KurenaiYami 11-29-06, 09:53 PM	Well... maybe you are just clumsy in general but I am 12 and I know that I have faster reflexes than you probobly do. ...no you don't.
Zicka 11-29-06, 09:55 PM	one yes two... I can do a mathmatical proof that states I am always right There is a 66% chance that god exists
Artector 11-29-06, 09:56 PM	Well... maybe you are just clumsy in general but I am 12 and I know that I have faster reflexes than you probobly do. Just wait till you hit puberty.... Honest to god, why is there a need to stat out COMBAT stats for a child?
jeffepp 11-29-06, 09:58 PM	How about a couple of points of DR for the flexibility, if not a dex buff. The old (or is that young) rubber bones thing.
KurenaiYami 11-29-06, 09:59 PM	one yes two... I can do a mathmatical proof that states I am always right There is a 66% chance that god exists One: You should work on sentence structure and grammar. It makes the posts easier to read. Two: Science tells us you can't prove you are always right.* Three: The God thing is neither provable or improvable, but religious topics are taboo on the boards, so we probably shouldn't get into a discussion about that. *Strike that, science can, but you yourself can't, as it requires repeatability in multiple people testing you on whether or not you are always right. To contribute to the topic, I like the d20 Modern way of doing it stated in the OP, though I really don't find it necessary to give stats to them that often. I just assume if somebody tries to kill them, they die.
Cherubaddon 11-29-06, 10:29 PM	Honest to god, why is there a need to stat out COMBAT stats for a child? As High Octane said...to have an excuse to kill them. :devil: Who doesn't hate kids? Loud and annoying... :coolcthul Well, he doesn't. Actually he loves them. As does Pun-Pun. They just taste great with syrup. Sorry for the randomness, but I just had to express my evil tendencies. I just assume if somebody tries to kill them, they die. Yes, but once they have stats, they become monsters, and once they are monsters, you are justified to kill them :devil:. Not true. I love kids. (...with syrup :evillaugh)
SephDragoon 11-29-06, 11:22 PM	hey thats not nice I won state at middle school 4n6 you know... n00b And you've now proven my point... If you had more wisdom, you'ld never say noob... its just silly. *pats head condescendingly* You'll eventually overcome your stat penalties with age... And actually, we needed the stats because we were supposed to go into a dream sequence something or another, and we would be level 1 children versions of ourselves. We made the save though, so :P.
Obsidianjaerc 11-29-06, 11:28 PM	I personally use the stats as presented in GRRM's A Game of Thrones d20. I think they do a very good job of representing children in a fantasy setting.
Lorianne 11-30-06, 08:19 AM	I personally use the stats as presented in GRRM's A Game of Thrones d20. I think they do a very good job of representing children in a fantasy setting. Yeah, just like I said... but I was being ignored :weep: Anyway, it's worth mentioning a few times, maybe someone will read it eventually :P
Seeker95 11-30-06, 09:40 AM	but I was being ignoredDid you say something? :P
Sulaco 11-30-06, 09:53 AM	my only beef with sulaco's stats is the cha...my wee one has way more cha than a mere 8. In fact, cha scores should decrease as one ages as a wee baby is very charasmatic compared to an old geezer. :P then again it maybe she has the SA charm (at will) with either a horendous save DC or i just voluntary fail it. :D Their CHA isn't higher, they just have an innate ability that is kinda like a cross Charm Person spell combined with Feeblemind. There are two children who live below me (aged 7 and 3) and one who lives next door (also 7) and after observing them for more than 5 years now I can assure you that an 8 CHA is generous in the extreme. Children are not like animals, they are animals. The primary job of a parent is to teach that animal how to be a human being.
Grand Theft Otto 11-30-06, 11:05 AM	my only beef with sulaco's stats is the cha...my wee one has way more cha than a mere 8. In fact, cha scores should decrease as one ages as a wee baby is very charasmatic compared to an old geezer. :P then again it maybe she has the SA charm (at will) with either a horendous save DC or i just voluntary fail it. :D Children are cute. They arent charismatic. They suck at lying, they arent intimidating, and they arent very good at brokering deals.
Grand Theft Otto 11-30-06, 11:06 AM	Well... maybe you are just clumsy in general but I am 12 and I know that I have faster reflexes than you probobly do. No you arent. You'll be faster, more coordinated, and more dextrous at 20 thanm at 12. You're about to enter puberty, have fun tripping over your own feet for a few years.
Sarella Starshine 11-30-06, 12:07 PM	Children are cute. They arent charismatic. They suck at lying, they arent intimidating, and they arent very good at brokering deals. i beg to differ at the brokering deal part. My child knows all she needs to is cry and mommy comes running, or that if she giggles mommy will smile, so if she wants mommy, she cries, if she wants smiles, she giggles. babies are master manipulators. they know how to get what they want with minimal effort on thier end to achive it. of course, i do tend to blow my sense motive checks and voluntarily fail will saves because i want to have my child happy, giggling, and grinning. and, she is a very happy baby and worships mommy and daddy so we must be doing something right :)
Sulaco 11-30-06, 12:10 PM	i beg to differ at the brokering deal part. My child knows all she needs to is cry and mommy comes running, or that if she giggles mommy will smile, so if she wants mommy, she cries, if she wants smiles, she giggles. babies are master manipulators. they know how to get what they want with minimal effort on thier end to achive it. Listen sister, just cos you can't make a WILL save doesn't make the kid Captain Charisma. ;)
Findail 11-30-06, 12:29 PM	Obviously the word "child" covers a broad range of development. An age-based set of penalties like that suggested by Seeker95 might be appropriate, but probably needs some tweaking. Strength, in particular, should vary a LOT with age: dexterity, not much until quite young (an older child, approaching his/her teens, is quite agile and has good coordination). As for skills: it seems a little strange to go from "no skills" to "quadruple skill points at 1st level" in one year. Children, especially in the traditional quasi-medieval D&D world, would work for their parents or be apprenticed at quite a young age. I think some sort of gradual increase of the multiplier in late childhood would be appropriate, working up to that x4.
Manyfist 11-30-06, 02:21 PM	Honest to god, why is there a need to stat out COMBAT stats for a child? Because I was thinking of running a Venerable Half red dragon Dragonwrought Kobold Beguiler (House rule on LA buy off, and LA on Half Dragon) in the Redhand of Doom setting (Eberron) were I use my "puppets" aka Humanoid children as "Sheilds" to protect him from physical/magical harm. I'd would gather orphans from the villages and basically have Dominate person/Charm to help me. Since they're wills are weak I don't have to worry about them breaking free. NE Venerable Half Red Dragon Dragonwrought Kobold Beguiler ftw :P
SephDragoon 11-30-06, 03:28 PM	NE Venerable Half Red Dragon Dragonwrought Kobold Beguiler ftw :P Some people should die for their characters... Hell, I was teased for making a half vampire, and then I see this ****!
Grand Theft Otto 11-30-06, 03:33 PM	Because I was thinking of running a Venerable Half red dragon Dragonwrought Kobold Beguiler (House rule on LA buy off, and LA on Half Dragon) in the Redhand of Doom setting (Eberron) were I use my "puppets" aka Humanoid children as "Sheilds" to protect him from physical/magical harm. I'd would gather orphans from the villages and basically have Dominate person/Charm to help me. Since they're wills are weak I don't have to worry about them breaking free. NE Venerable Half Red Dragon Dragonwrought Kobold Beguiler ftw :P Dogs are cheaper, tougher, and easier to care for. Unless the kids have levels of devoted defender, equip each of them with a 50,000gp ring of shield other (what great return on a 4 hp creature!), or train them in UMD and hand out scrolls of shield other, they cant protect you from much. Theres the belt of the dread emperor in the BOVD, but its pricey, and again, the kids have crap for HP (plus you look like a moron wandering around with a mess of rug rats tied to your waist). God forbid someone with whirlwind and great cleave gets close, because you've just supplied them with their very own bag of rats. Some enemies might be reulctant to shoot a lightning bolt through one of them to get to you, but I doubt the bad guys in Red Hand of Doom would care if they zapped some human brat. If memory serves, they are bad enough dudes to save the president from ninjas, then eat him. Charm person wouldnt make them run into combat with you unless you wasted time making opposed charisma checks with each of them each round to prevent them from running off screaming at the hint of danger. You'd need Dominate, which is pretty much wasted on something so sucky as a 1st level commoner child. Unless your guy is into being chaotic stupid evil for its own sake, the kids are a waste of time.
Sulaco 11-30-06, 03:38 PM	NE Venerable Half Red Dragon Dragonwrought Kobold Beguiler ftw :P Only if "FTW" stands for "f*** that waste-of-space." When did half-races and templates replace the core as the de facto standard for D&D characters? :nonono:
SephDragoon 11-30-06, 03:43 PM	Plain Ole Human FTW! That's what I'm playing now... no LA, no broken houserule to get rid of it, I get a bonus feat, more skills, and hey, guess what? All of his power is in his classes. Besides, I'd love for him to come up against your character... just so I could kill it >_<. Which btw... low saves also means, ones gust of wind, and not only are all of the children down (without killing them hopefully) but you could be as well. So... gust of wind, charge in and wail on you :P.
ArcTan 11-30-06, 03:46 PM	That kid is a friggin superman. Children are significantly worse than adults in every possible way, and the -1 just doesnt reflect that. You forgot the part where the kid has no skills, no feats, no BAB, no saves, and no class abilities. The kid is really not capable of doing *anything* -- sure, he may have 13 Int, but that Int is giving him *nothing* except the ability to roll a very few skills with a +1 *total modifier* because he has *no ranks* in *any skills*. People give raw stat scores more importance than they should -- the total number of levels you have, your *experience*, is what represents growing up and being a competent adult. BAB matters a lot more for your attack rating than your Str score, your total skill points and max skill ranks for a skill matter a lot more for skill checks than your Int score, your total HD matter a lot more for your HP than your Con score, etc. A kid with a high Int, Wis and Cha, by these rules, may show certain insights into a few skills (whoopee, he can make untrained Knowledge checks to know common knowledge at a DC of 10, he can sometimes make simple Bluffs and Sense simple Motives at DCs of 15, etc.), and a kid who's particularly strong may even, possibly, kind of, be able to hit something. But these stats don't mean anything at all until that kid loses his 1d4 Child HD and trades it in for his first Hero class level -- the Int has no skill points per level to modify, the Str has a +0 BAB to apply to (and *no weapon proficiencies* to work with), etc.
ArcTan 11-30-06, 03:50 PM	How about a couple of points of DR for the flexibility, if not a dex buff. The old (or is that young) rubber bones thing. This just means if they break their leg it'll heal faster and with less chance of permanent bone damage. It doesn't make them any less vulnerable to dying of having their bones broken. I.e. maybe a change to natural HP regen rates, but no way is there an actual decrease in damage taken to HP, especially if it's "notional" HP -- how far away are you from being killed -- we're talking about. The ability for bones to heal better over long periods of time has nothing to do with how vulnerable you are to breaking your bones in the first place and how much breaking your bones hurts, cripples you and threatens your immediate health.
High Octane 11-30-06, 03:51 PM	Children are cute. They arent charismatic. They suck at lying, But the hamster WANTED to try out the fan as his new hamster wheel! they arent intimidating, and they arent very good at brokering deals. If you don't buy me a Nintendo Wii, I WON'T LOVE YOU ANYMORE!!
Grand Theft Otto 11-30-06, 06:21 PM	But the hamster WANTED to try out the fan as his new hamster wheel! If you don't buy me a Nintendo Wii, I WON'T LOVE YOU ANYMORE!! Which works how well on someone not related to the child?
KurenaiYami 11-30-06, 07:24 PM	But the hamster WANTED to try out the fan as his new hamster wheel! If you don't buy me a Nintendo Wii, I WON'T LOVE YOU ANYMORE!! Then you make sure the child doesn't get dessert*, and it learns not to try and blackmail and lie to daddy anymore. *(That's just for those of you with actual children. I was raised on the "backhand method," but aparently that is frowned upon. Sissies.)
High Octane 11-30-06, 08:07 PM	Then you make sure the child doesn't get dessert*, and it learns not to try and blackmail and lie to daddy anymore. *(That's just for those of you with actual children. I was raised on the "backhand method," but aparently that is frowned upon. Sissies.) Dont hit your kids with your fist. Makes them fear you as a person. You use an object that symbolizes what they should fear, that way they can still trust you when you dont have it. So use a bat. Its the right thing to do. Aluminum works best.
Manyfist 11-30-06, 11:11 PM	Only if "FTW" stands for "f*** that waste-of-space." When did half-races and templates replace the core as the de facto standard for D&D characters? :nonono: Because why be 1000000^n Human, Dwarf, ELF...etc. When you can be something unique? I'd probly switch to something else besides Beguiler, and probly scrap the children idea yet I'll probly will go into Mindbender in order to get a few puppets. @SephDragoon: Yet will you have wings and a breath attack? Or have a Dragontype? I play monsterous races than the plain old Human, Dwarf, Elf... *Yawn*. Edit: I've decided to make him the Ultimate villian in Red Hand of Doom. After you face the Aspect of Tiamat you'll face this powerhouse. Since I'm the DM and my players are going to be optimized why not hit them hard. :)
SephDragoon 12-01-06, 04:55 AM	@SephDragoon: Yet will you have wings and a breath attack? Or have a Dragontype? I play monsterous races than the plain old Human, Dwarf, Elf... *Yawn*. No, I won't. It is about my sword, the spells I can channel through it, and the target. He's also been more fun than 80% of the monster characters I've rolled up. Hell, this is one of few Humans I've ever rolled up. In any case... it was the children thing that made me want to kill him. Such a cowardly act, that hell, I'd want to take him out just for the satisfaction.
Manyfist 12-01-06, 09:41 AM	No, I won't. It is about my sword, the spells I can channel through it, and the target. He's also been more fun than 80% of the monster characters I've rolled up. Hell, this is one of few Humans I've ever rolled up. In any case... it was the children thing that made me want to kill him. Such a cowardly act, that hell, I'd want to take him out just for the satisfaction. You must not have good monster races. I had fun with my changeling I use to freak out my party members by at random times turning into a female shifter. Edit: I took out the Children and going to make him a Warlock or Sorcerer for a BBEG
Sulaco 12-01-06, 09:48 AM	Because why be 1000000^n Human, Dwarf, ELF...etc. When you can be something unique? Huh, and here I thought playing a character of a completely other mythological species in an imaginary fanatsy world was unique. Personally, I'd rather play a "plain ol' dwarf" than a "unique" characetr like one of the horde of dual-scimitar wielding good drow rangers or half-dragons. How you play the PC makes it unique, not shovelling a bunch of templates onto it.
Cherubaddon 12-01-06, 01:17 PM	Agree. All power to the human wizards!
Rhydur Meith 12-01-06, 07:36 PM	my only beef with sulaco's stats is the cha...my wee one has way more cha than a mere 8. In fact, cha scores should decrease as one ages as a wee baby is very charasmatic compared to an old geezer. :P then again it maybe she has the SA charm (at will) with either a horendous save DC or i just voluntary fail it. :D Actually, as a not only a parent of now teens, but also a professional who's worked with children a long time, I'd say chrisma should get a +4 bonus as infants, and decrease -1 each year after one. Genetically, most humans are programmed to respond to infants (otherwise we wouldn't likely put up with the demands of taking care of one). Then it should stay flat until 13, when it should again decrease every year until about 18; towards adults only (and increase towards younger children). After 18 or so it could be a normal stat. Teens (and I love them, really I do) are typically poor at relating well to adults, but are very attractive to younger kids. I think there is also a genetic thing at work here, as I think it helps parents seperate from their adolscents and let them go forge their own way. Adolscents thinks adults, espcially parents, are dull, boring and don't know much. Adults find teens to often be obnoxious and arrogant. (Broad generaliztions, I know, but true enough, even it is cliched!) Sorry if I've dampaned your enthusiam for parenting! :)
Manyfist 12-02-06, 12:58 AM	Huh, and here I thought playing a character of a completely other mythological species in an imaginary fanatsy world was unique. Personally, I'd rather play a "plain ol' dwarf" than a "unique" characetr like one of the horde of dual-scimitar wielding good drow rangers or half-dragons. How you play the PC makes it unique, not shovelling a bunch of templates onto it. Hmm. Drizzit made people want to play Drow, Half Dragons aren't common. Why play the standards when you can have the exotic? Spice your human/dwarf up its still standard. Spice up a Half-Dragon or Kobold, or anyother "Monsterous" race then you got a good character. (Venerable=Age)(Half-Dragon = Template) (Kobold= Race) (Dragonwrought = Feat). So the Shovelling a bunch of templates thing doesn't cut it as a comeback. Drow are "Common" now thanks to Drizzit, and why would I want to play a Human when I want to escape reality, not put reality in to another. Stock races get tedeious, I personally like Warforged and Goblinoids, for both are out the norm.
pedro2112 12-02-06, 12:26 PM	Now that you have them statted, you can kill them! "How can you shoot innocent women and children?" "Easy. Just don't lead your shots as much!" Cookie for the reference recognition. Full Metal Jacket
High Octane 12-02-06, 12:32 PM	Full Metal Jacket :cookie:
SephDragoon 12-02-06, 02:45 PM	Hmm. Drizzit made people want to play Drow, Half Dragons aren't common. Why play the standards when you can have the exotic? Spice your human/dwarf up its still standard. Spice up a Half-Dragon or Kobold, or anyother "Monsterous" race then you got a good character. (Venerable=Age)(Half-Dragon = Template) (Kobold= Race) (Dragonwrought = Feat). So the Shovelling a bunch of templates thing doesn't cut it as a comeback. Drow are "Common" now thanks to Drizzit, and why would I want to play a Human when I want to escape reality, not put reality in to another. Stock races get tedeious, I personally like Warforged and Goblinoids, for both are out the norm. DRIZZT, not DRIZZIT! My god... >_< Anyways, the thing is, I think you aren't really thinking enough for your BBEG. Making him simply a powerful character by templates and crap, you are doing a disservice to your players. Now... creating someone truely unique, like going with good classes and a good build would do better. I mean heck, I'm killing black dragons with my human. Plain ole human! And he was only level 9 at the time... P.S. Old aged black dragons too...
Elzaban the Ethereal 12-02-06, 03:30 PM	I'm frankly amazed that no one's mentioned the best monster in Cityscape - Throng of Children. At a nice EL 5 encounter, you can have your party fighting swarm-mob of 50 to 100 children. It's fun for the whole family! For bonus fun, apply Fiendish template to the children. Prevent that fireball from toasting them while they smite good.
Cherubaddon 12-02-06, 05:02 PM	I'm frankly amazed that no one's mentioned the best monster in Cityscape - Throng of Children. At a nice EL 5 encounter, you can have your party fighting swarm-mob of 50 to 100 children. It's fun for the whole family! For bonus fun, apply Fiendish template to the children. Prevent that fireball from toasting them while they smite good. :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :heehee So full of good ideas! :heehee :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Raymond_Luxury_Yacht 12-02-06, 05:26 PM	I'm frankly amazed that no one's mentioned the best monster in Cityscape - Throng of Children. At a nice EL 5 encounter, you can have your party fighting swarm-mob of 50 to 100 children. It's fun for the whole family! For bonus fun, apply Fiendish template to the children. Prevent that fireball from toasting them while they smite good. Well, there goes my boycott of WotC products.
Manyfist 12-02-06, 06:09 PM	DRIZZT, not DRIZZIT! My god... >_< Anyways, the thing is, I think you aren't really thinking enough for your BBEG. Making him simply a powerful character by templates and crap, you are doing a disservice to your players. Now... creating someone truely unique, like going with good classes and a good build would do better. I mean heck, I'm killing black dragons with my human. Plain ole human! And he was only level 9 at the time... P.S. Old aged black dragons too... Solo? Does the Dragon have Sorcerer Levels to amp up its already natural spell casting? I know my players strengths, I have several Houserules allowing them to survive a bit longer (Not worth mentioning). This BBEG will be a test on how much they can stand.