Creating a deaf character [Archive] - Wizards Community

Creating a deaf character [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
CommonAnomaly
04-25-08, 10:57 PM I am currently hashing out a character using 3.0 system (although by dm discretion we are using a 3.5 monster manual, which is pertinent to my cause)

I am creating a deaf half celestial human wizard that plans to prestige as a fire elemental savant. The way i understand it, a deaf character is immune to sonic damage, giving this character resistance to acid, cold, and electricity 10, immunity to sonic and an eventual immunity to fire, tehe.

What I am wondering is, does selecting to be deaf give a character any other bonuses. The DMG says a deafened character can overcome the penalty to initiative and the arcane spell failure, but to what extent.
ciaran
04-25-08, 11:02 PM I'd rule that with a 1st level feat those two are completely overcome.

Additionally, your ability to use diplomacy, gather info, etc is almost obliterated. Drow sign language maybe? ;)
Seeker95
04-26-08, 07:41 AM You would not be immune to all sonic damage. Only sonic damage that was harmless to objects.

And while you may be looking for bonuses, I'd say you should probably consider the penalties.
No Listen.
Penalties to Sense Motive.
Penalties to Spot.
Penalty on Aid Another.

I would also impose a permanent circumstance penalty to:
Reflex Saves
Armor Class

If you want to play a gimped character, go for it. But take the penalties that being gimped provide.
ciaran
04-26-08, 10:35 AM I wouldn't agree will all of your penalties if we were going under the assumption that the PC had adapted to living without hearing.

Also I might add that while immunity to sonic effects would have to be case-by-case for the dm until it was nailed down, immunity to language dependant effects would be certain.

There would be alot of effects unknown until you play with this guy.
Seeker95
04-26-08, 12:02 PM I wouldn't agree will all of your penalties if we were going under the assumption that the PC had adapted to living without hearing.In my opinion, "adaptation" changes prohibitions into penalties.

Rather than your simply not being able to sense motive in an opponent trying to convince your girlfriend that he is delivering a message from the King, you would have a penalty to sense motive because you are attempting to do so based solely on body language, without being able to use the verbal intonation, pace and inflection.

Rather than having no chance of preparing yourself against the coming onslaught of thousands of bats about to sweep through the tunnel you are walking along, you will be able to roll a "listen" check at a penalty, because you sense the beating wings of thousands of bats change the flow of air in the tunnel as they push it ahead of them.
ciaran
04-26-08, 08:16 PM I can say from personal, real-life experience that some people highly attuned to body language (not so much me), can learn more from movement of hands, mouth and eyes - for example - than they could from words and inflection - the hearing aspect. I understand that they are all pieces of the whole, however, and that your argument is certainly true in the real world.

I'm just saying that its possible for anyone who grew up being deaf to grow accustomed to this and overcome it to an extent, as you described. I suggested a feat to go above and beyond. It is a fantasy game after all.
ciaran
04-26-08, 08:17 PM double post. sorry!
Edymnion
04-26-08, 10:24 PM Yes, but you're overlooking something.
Those people are not good at what they do because they are deaf, they are good at that because they have worked their fricken' asses off to make up for their handicap. Any hearing person that puts the same level of dedicated training into those things could achieve the same levels of results.

Just because you're deaf does not mean you automatically become good at reading body language, it means you work harder at it because you have no choice.

IE, you start with a normal deaf character, you take all of the penalties and drawbacks that includes, and then you start spending feats and skillpoints to try and get back to even with a hearing character that hasn't spent anything yet.

Of course, then you have to find an explanation as to why the character is deaf in a world where a simple second level spell can restore his hearing in a matter of seconds.
Fonitrus
04-27-08, 09:47 AM Is this character going to solo the adventure?

I ask this because unless the party has picked up sign language skill of some sort then they wont be able to communicate effectively.
How would this play out in a tactical situation.
Unless the person can see the person talking he would have hard time telling that the person just told him to peel of his enemy and go back and give help to the wizzard in the back that just got jumped by a rogue.

I would also penalize on Move Silently checks (im sure there is a pun here that I did not intend) :)
People that are not hearing impaired can modify their audible levels by simple feedback they receive from the ears so they can slowly decrease the current volume they produce.
The deaf person would not know when he is walking loud or when the leaves/grass under him is making noise, and he wont be able to decrease the motions. Of course he can try (some harsh penalties here should be imposed maybe -10 on move silently checks??)

Of course the hearing impaired have improved vision and taste/feel. The brain enhances the remaining sensory organs when one fails. I have played paintball with a vision impaired person and he was able to pin point players' exact location even when he was hiding behind a barrel, then quick jump + tripple tap and down they went.

You would be lucky if the GM doesnt read these boards :) and let you get away without ingame mechanics penalties or at the very least roleplaying/social handicaps.

I see all these immunities and resistances to the elements you intend to have and I have to ask, any reason for this in your campaign?
Seeker95
04-27-08, 04:26 PM I can say from personal, real-life experience that some people highly attuned to body language (not so much me), can learn more from movement of hands, mouth and eyes - for example - than they could from words and inflection - the hearing aspect.Those are people who have placed lots of skill ranks into "sense motive"... sufficient ranks to be better at sensing motive -- even with the circumstance penalty I would apply -- than the average person and even better than most people who casually place ranks in such a skill.

The deaf character is gimped, not helpless. The gimps should continue to apply. But the gimps eventually become more nuisance than hindrance. Placing ranks into the appropriate skills can overcome the hindrances that early levels encounter. But doing so comes at an opportunity cost. The deaf character placing skill ranks in sense motive and spot can never be as good at sensing motive and spotting the not-yet-noticed than a non-deaf character with the same stats and the same classes and the same race and the same level placing the same ranks into the same skills. It's just that, after a while, that -2 circumstance penalty is no longer that big of a deal to the deaf character.
VulcanStormwrath
04-27-08, 05:51 PM You'd be immune to Command, Greater Command, Dictum/Holy Word/Blasphemy/Word of Chaos, and Wail of the Banshee. That alone may be worth it.

Take Drow Hand sign, and teach it to the party, (each spening a skill point)

Overall the benefits may very well balance the penalties with the right feat selection.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
CommonAnomaly 04-25-08, 10:57 PM	I am currently hashing out a character using 3.0 system (although by dm discretion we are using a 3.5 monster manual, which is pertinent to my cause) I am creating a deaf half celestial human wizard that plans to prestige as a fire elemental savant. The way i understand it, a deaf character is immune to sonic damage, giving this character resistance to acid, cold, and electricity 10, immunity to sonic and an eventual immunity to fire, tehe. What I am wondering is, does selecting to be deaf give a character any other bonuses. The DMG says a deafened character can overcome the penalty to initiative and the arcane spell failure, but to what extent.
ciaran 04-25-08, 11:02 PM	I'd rule that with a 1st level feat those two are completely overcome. Additionally, your ability to use diplomacy, gather info, etc is almost obliterated. Drow sign language maybe? ;)
Seeker95 04-26-08, 07:41 AM	You would not be immune to all sonic damage. Only sonic damage that was harmless to objects. And while you may be looking for bonuses, I'd say you should probably consider the penalties. No Listen. Penalties to Sense Motive. Penalties to Spot. Penalty on Aid Another. I would also impose a permanent circumstance penalty to: Reflex Saves Armor Class If you want to play a gimped character, go for it. But take the penalties that being gimped provide.
ciaran 04-26-08, 10:35 AM	I wouldn't agree will all of your penalties if we were going under the assumption that the PC had adapted to living without hearing. Also I might add that while immunity to sonic effects would have to be case-by-case for the dm until it was nailed down, immunity to language dependant effects would be certain. There would be alot of effects unknown until you play with this guy.
Seeker95 04-26-08, 12:02 PM	I wouldn't agree will all of your penalties if we were going under the assumption that the PC had adapted to living without hearing.In my opinion, "adaptation" changes prohibitions into penalties. Rather than your simply not being able to sense motive in an opponent trying to convince your girlfriend that he is delivering a message from the King, you would have a penalty to sense motive because you are attempting to do so based solely on body language, without being able to use the verbal intonation, pace and inflection. Rather than having no chance of preparing yourself against the coming onslaught of thousands of bats about to sweep through the tunnel you are walking along, you will be able to roll a "listen" check at a penalty, because you sense the beating wings of thousands of bats change the flow of air in the tunnel as they push it ahead of them.
ciaran 04-26-08, 08:16 PM	I can say from personal, real-life experience that some people highly attuned to body language (not so much me), can learn more from movement of hands, mouth and eyes - for example - than they could from words and inflection - the hearing aspect. I understand that they are all pieces of the whole, however, and that your argument is certainly true in the real world. I'm just saying that its possible for anyone who grew up being deaf to grow accustomed to this and overcome it to an extent, as you described. I suggested a feat to go above and beyond. It is a fantasy game after all.
ciaran 04-26-08, 08:17 PM	double post. sorry!
Edymnion 04-26-08, 10:24 PM	Yes, but you're overlooking something. Those people are not good at what they do because they are deaf, they are good at that because they have worked their fricken' asses off to make up for their handicap. Any hearing person that puts the same level of dedicated training into those things could achieve the same levels of results. Just because you're deaf does not mean you automatically become good at reading body language, it means you work harder at it because you have no choice. IE, you start with a normal deaf character, you take all of the penalties and drawbacks that includes, and then you start spending feats and skillpoints to try and get back to even with a hearing character that hasn't spent anything yet. Of course, then you have to find an explanation as to why the character is deaf in a world where a simple second level spell can restore his hearing in a matter of seconds.
Fonitrus 04-27-08, 09:47 AM	Is this character going to solo the adventure? I ask this because unless the party has picked up sign language skill of some sort then they wont be able to communicate effectively. How would this play out in a tactical situation. Unless the person can see the person talking he would have hard time telling that the person just told him to peel of his enemy and go back and give help to the wizzard in the back that just got jumped by a rogue. I would also penalize on Move Silently checks (im sure there is a pun here that I did not intend) :) People that are not hearing impaired can modify their audible levels by simple feedback they receive from the ears so they can slowly decrease the current volume they produce. The deaf person would not know when he is walking loud or when the leaves/grass under him is making noise, and he wont be able to decrease the motions. Of course he can try (some harsh penalties here should be imposed maybe -10 on move silently checks??) Of course the hearing impaired have improved vision and taste/feel. The brain enhances the remaining sensory organs when one fails. I have played paintball with a vision impaired person and he was able to pin point players' exact location even when he was hiding behind a barrel, then quick jump + tripple tap and down they went. You would be lucky if the GM doesnt read these boards :) and let you get away without ingame mechanics penalties or at the very least roleplaying/social handicaps. I see all these immunities and resistances to the elements you intend to have and I have to ask, any reason for this in your campaign?
Seeker95 04-27-08, 04:26 PM	I can say from personal, real-life experience that some people highly attuned to body language (not so much me), can learn more from movement of hands, mouth and eyes - for example - than they could from words and inflection - the hearing aspect.Those are people who have placed lots of skill ranks into "sense motive"... sufficient ranks to be better at sensing motive -- even with the circumstance penalty I would apply -- than the average person and even better than most people who casually place ranks in such a skill. The deaf character is gimped, not helpless. The gimps should continue to apply. But the gimps eventually become more nuisance than hindrance. Placing ranks into the appropriate skills can overcome the hindrances that early levels encounter. But doing so comes at an opportunity cost. The deaf character placing skill ranks in sense motive and spot can never be as good at sensing motive and spotting the not-yet-noticed than a non-deaf character with the same stats and the same classes and the same race and the same level placing the same ranks into the same skills. It's just that, after a while, that -2 circumstance penalty is no longer that big of a deal to the deaf character.
VulcanStormwrath 04-27-08, 05:51 PM	You'd be immune to Command, Greater Command, Dictum/Holy Word/Blasphemy/Word of Chaos, and Wail of the Banshee. That alone may be worth it. Take Drow Hand sign, and teach it to the party, (each spening a skill point) Overall the benefits may very well balance the penalties with the right feat selection.