Post/Author/DateTime	Post
fflam 07-18-07, 05:55 PM	So I have an unusual problem: I have a character that just died (-10 dead). There is a cleric spell from one of the supplementary books (the name of which escapes me at the moment... revive, restore, something) that a cleric can use *within one round* to basically restore the dead character to -1 stable. The problem is, the character is under the influence of an active Shroud of Undead spell. The Shroud of Undead spell states that, for all *spell effects*, the character under the Shroud is treated as undead. This would render the revive spell unusable. The $64,000 question: do vested spells dissipate upon the death of a character, or is the Shroud spell still there the following round, thereby not allowing the revive spell to work? It's a real head-scratcher for me; I haven't found anything online that discusses death and spell dissipation...?
Khael 07-18-07, 06:08 PM	The shroud remains - You can dismiss some of your own spells as a standard action, but a spell is not stopped, unless dispelled, its duration runs out, or its dismissed etc. Some things will bypass, but the spell is not stopped short of special effects. Which is why animated undead stay animated if you kill the necromancer.# Sorry, but it does look like the character is dead, unless someone earlier in the initiative line casts dispel first.
fflam 07-18-07, 06:14 PM	Hmmm...bummer. I'm afraid I have to agree with you, I was just hoping I might be wrong. Thanks for the response, even if it wasn't the one I was hoping for!
Cavienn 07-18-07, 06:31 PM	This is actually something I've wondered about before too. I don't know what the exact description of Shroud of Undead does, but if a spell targets a creature, and that creature dies, mightn't his corpse be now considered an object, not a creature, and so the spell effect would end since he is no longer an eligible target?
Seeker95 07-18-07, 06:54 PM	"He's dead, Jim." :weep: :angelhide :raincloud :surrender :b:
Khael 07-18-07, 07:05 PM	This is actually something I've wondered about before too. I don't know what the exact description of Shroud of Undead does, but if a spell targets a creature, and that creature dies, mightn't his corpse be now considered an object, not a creature, and so the spell effect would end since he is no longer an eligible target? All the raised dead PCs in the world pray not, for this reason: Raise Dead Conjuration (Healing) Level: Clr 5 Components: V, S, M, DF Casting Time: 1 minute Range: Touch Target: Dead creature touched Duration: Instantaneous Saving Throw: None; see text Spell Resistance: Yes (harmless) If he counts as an object, not a creature... Exactly.
Millennium 07-18-07, 07:08 PM	If a spell's target ceases to be legal then it fizzles, so the real question is whether or not this spell can target a corpse. If shroud of undeath can't target a corpse, then your spell should work as normal; shroud of undeath stopped working when the character died. If it can target a corpse, then you're hosed. I'm not familiar with the spell, so I can't comment on this. There is some dispute about whether or not the spell's effect comes back if its target becomes legal again before the spell's duration expires. There are varying interpretations of that rule. But the spell definitely doesn't have any effect on something it can't target.
Cavienn 07-18-07, 07:09 PM	Target: Dead creature touched ... If he counts as an object, not a creature... Exactly. Touché.
Seeker95 07-18-07, 08:48 PM	If a spell's target ceases to be legal then it fizzles.Not true. "Target" is defined at the time of casting. If you cease to be a vaild target *after* it has been cast, the effects may be ineffective (enlarge person, then you polymorph), but the spell itself does not fizzle.
Morwen 07-18-07, 10:39 PM	The problem is, the character is under the influence of an active Shroud of Undead spell. The Shroud of Undead spell states that, for all *spell effects*, the character under the Shroud is treated as undead. This would render the revive spell unusable. Except Shroud of Undeath does not say that. It says you are treated as an undead creature "for all spells and effects that specifically affect undead creatures". Since Revivify does not specifically affect undead creatures, it will work fine. Your character lives :)
fearless_slayer 07-18-07, 10:57 PM	So I have an unusual problem: I have a character that just died (-10 dead). There is a cleric spell from one of the supplementary books (the name of which escapes me at the moment... revive, restore, something) that a cleric can use *within one round* to basically restore the dead character to -1 stable. The problem is, the character is under the influence of an active Shroud of Undead spell. The Shroud of Undead spell states that, for all *spell effects*, the character under the Shroud is treated as undead. This would render the revive spell unusable. The $64,000 question: do vested spells dissipate upon the death of a character, or is the Shroud spell still there the following round, thereby not allowing the revive spell to work? It's a real head-scratcher for me; I haven't found anything online that discusses death and spell dissipation...? that spell is called Revivify [edit] the above poster is correct; the spell will work fine since the only thing that the shroud undeath is used for, is for spells that only work on undead