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| WotC_Bart09-09-05, 07:55 PM | Hi folks, We've posted the second Design & Development column (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/dd/20050909a) -- the first from the designers. As part of the column, Dave Noonan asks: "Is there a monster from recent books (since 2000, say) that you think deserves traction? A monster that gained traction in your ongoing game and would probably be the "next githyanki" if everyone gave it a chance? Let us know. We've designed some monsters with the explicit intent of giving them traction, and we suspect that others are on the cusp of "traction-hood." No hints on which ones; we're curious whether you pick the same monsters. "So write in to: dndcolumn@wizards.com, and tell us what monster has traction at your gaming table, and why. We'll talk more about monsters in upcoming weeks, and we'll share your thoughts." If you'd like to share your thoughts and answers for this question, please feel free to use this thread! Thanks. |
| bob from the north09-10-05, 12:56 AM | I'm not sure you guys in development know this, but there was a plastic set of monsters you could buy in K-mart in the 1970's that was completely bizarre. They must have been Chinese, or Japanese. Because they were quite outside Western bestiaries. Our moms bought them for us -- or Santa brought them as stocking stuffers. But they were impossible to play with. Because, they didn't look like anything. Fortunately, they were the perfect size for attacking little lead figures. And three of them -- the rust monster,the bullete (aka John Belushi's "Land Shark"), and yes, THE OWL BEAR -- made the cut into AD&D. The owl bear "always already" had a minitaure,then. The new version just made the long-forgotten plastic Chinese ur-OB playable again. OB's aside, I'd like to talk Wraiths. These intriguing non-ghosts DON'T go etherial. Instead, they SORT OF just drift through material space, rather like projected images -- but also, a lot like x-rays. Wraiths are getting a lot stickier, since there's both a spell and a monster that can spawn them. Plus, both clerics and undead-hunting rangers (especially with the Nemesis feat) specifically are geared to defeat them. So, there's at least an oppositional relationship. And a wicked scary picture in the DM, where Jozan gets painted by them. That's enough for a start. What wraiths lack is a cosmogony. They're not really covered in any known text. Maybe the forthcoming "Heroes of Horror" faces this. It's too soon to know. Thing is, they're SO unique, and yet so familiar (think: Golden Compass). And, Tolkein loved them. Umm, Nazgul, Nazgul, Nazgul. This could be a landmark beast for you guys. Most needed: a novel and a module about them. Not, which include them. ABOUT them. That's when wraiths take immaterial form. |
| Tyhm09-10-05, 03:27 AM | I find the Justicator (especially when coupled with various Inevitables - gotta love a scalable servile construct race you can kill without remorse and there'll always be more) can make an interesting recurring villain, especially when opposing typically chaotic PCs. One of the great cliches of all time is the lovable rogue foiling the bungling police (see Lupin the Third) - when there's a great interplanar bureau of these Police being sent after the players in droves just as they're becoming well known, there's a foil to the lovable rogues. Whether or not there's a sinister plot behind them doesn't matter so much as that they keep coming week after week - if only there was a game mechanic for them (like with the Hoary Hunter) that made them truly Recurring, they'd be perfect. (My recurring chief's only survived due to obscene luck against Prismatic Spray sending him to the wrong plane...and plane shift planting him miles off course. Probably a good thing he lacks a Teleport to bring him back into the fight before his Inevitable backup flee) |
| Sucros09-10-05, 04:23 AM | Topiary. Guardians. Every adventurer in my group fears any plant shaped like an animal, for fear that it may attack them. Even at higher levels, PCs regard the guardians with unease. |
| Sucros09-10-05, 04:55 AM | Added thought: The Kobold has gained serious traction. In 2e, they were an encounter for low level characters if you wanted to go easy on them, or use a lot of creatures. They were also jokeish. Since they have become balanced, they've become a common nonstandard race for a PC to play, especially those with a love for the underdog, or a keen sense of comedy. The Coatl, generally not used because of its alignment, has likewise gained traction due to their integral role in the Silver Flame religion in Eberron. With a concrete place, they've moved from "mysterious creature that gives small hint" to "great creature of ancient history that has well defined goals" with well defined goals, they can then step on the PCs toes. I know that neither of these creatures are anywhere close to being new, but when I read "traction" I immediately thought of them. |
| Lamoron09-10-05, 07:37 AM | My vote goes to Kobolds as well... they are short, useless and cowardly, they have a diety who advocates strongly for "running the heck away" from anything remotely stronger than you unless you outnumber it grossly. Kobolds have been a favorite of every single gaming group I have ever played in, and my current group is planning to actually play a campaign, where the players start of as standard kobolds. (We were inspired by a Dragon Magazine article called "Ecology of the Kobold", talk about traction-bait). |
| Archade09-10-05, 12:13 PM | I agree that kobolds have gained traction. With classes and feats laid upon them, they are crafty *and* dangerous. A high level series of critters with traction are the Demon and Devil Princes -- who played in high school and fought Orcus? Asmodeus? Many of them are original creations from AD&D that have gained traction with little support -- no cover art, no miniatures, no ties to the campaign, but they are very interesting personalities that evoke a DM's imagination and a PC's healthy sense of fear. After Planescape, and going into 3E, they have more traction than ever ... |
| Light Dragon09-10-05, 01:33 PM | Kobolds certainly are a favorite of every group that I've played with, though I have to say that we don't make much use of them. Used sparingly, they're amusing and amazing, when overused- they're just that- another monster to be laughed at and hacked to bits. My groups have always enjoyed a variety of monsters. In essence the goals of our games were to fight characters with personality. Therefore, this usually means humans or humanoids hwo have devious agendas. But one game certainly stuck out in my players' minds. Exiting the underdark, beaten up, missing several magic items and wanting to get back to city to rest and recouperate- a party of six wandered out to the sunlight only to be assaulted by a screeching Roc. This encounter, meant to only take 15 minutes, became a struggle for survival, as through an accident, the Bard was grabbed by the Roc, and the Cleric fled into the cave only to fall 25 feet down a trap constructed by goblins. Thereby incapacitating the group's only heelers, the group- now only a Ranger, a Fighter, a Paladin, and a Sorceror were faced with the problem of hitting a Roc without striking their friend. The Bard eventually cast sanctuary on himself, and the 7th-level adventurers took out the roc after about an hour and a half of extreme roleplay. --- As for the most interesting new monster- my friends really enjoy the psionic beasts, though I still don't really understand the mechanics. I enjoy the mechanics of vampires and mindflayers, but they're really old-hat. And the drow is overplayed... I tend to create monsters myself when I feel bored and flying and aquatic creatures are both not as numerous as humanoid monsters and they're harder to make- so my advice would be to focus on new flying or aquatic creatures. There don't seem to be enough of them in D&D. Recently I noticed a trend toward incorporating Saughin and Drowned Dead into Dungeon Magazine adventures, and I think that's a step in the right direction. I would also like to see more focus on 'bizarre' monsters like will-o-the-wisps and beholders- creatures that don't have an 'orcish-frame' or creatures that don't think like humans- eg: Mindflayers. This gives them a great 'feel' to play with. |
| RSB09-10-05, 06:44 PM | Redcaps! They look mean, insane even, they carry a big scythe. They are small and sneaky, the perfect monster to throw in any random spot to cause trouble. Scalable too! Throw them in any ol dark alley even up into epic lvls, and if you have a good manaic laugh, all the better. My players all fear my redcaps. whenever they hear a manaic laugh, they all start making spot checks~ To a lesser extent, talking giant praying mantis sneaking up on my players' camp while they are sleeping, whispering for the person on watch to go to sleep is another both memorable and recurring character my players enjoy...running away from. That guy has never seen combat once! :| |
| KalamarDM09-10-05, 09:09 PM | Traction for my current 3.5 group is definitely swarms and mobs. My players were horrified to discover that a group of creatures that would normally be a momentary diversion with great cleave is now a serious threat to their existance. Swarms of very small creatures/animals are the most intimidating because they inflict automatic damage (ignoring those massive ACs) and are themselves immune to weapon damage; a fighter's worst nightmare. But I think mobs from DMG2 have scared the players the most. After very nearly getting spanked by less than 50 dominated domestic servants, the pcs will never look down on a group of commoners again! Just like those KotDT strips, if a pc mistreats a single beggar, all it takes is for the beggar to gather 50 friends and suddenly the pcs are running and screaming like kindergarten girls. THE SCARIEST PART IS THE PCS KNOW THIS CAN HAPPEN ANY TIME THEY ARE IN A CITY OR OTHER POPULATION CENTER SO THEY CAN NEVER TRULY RELAX. :invasion: Traction for 3.0 was definitely shadows because they were my players first and most frequent experience with touch attacks (again ignores those high ACs) and ability damage (ignores all those hit points). Common thread: RULE BREAKING MONSTERS SCARE YOUR PLAYERS BECAUSE THEY CANNOT PREDICT WHAT WILL HAPPEN IN A BATTLE! :gah: |
| Deflare09-11-05, 01:07 AM | I'll also throw my lot in with the kobolds. IMHO, the things are awfully underpowered; 5 minutes with a pen, a notebook, and the MM gained me a kobold that I wouldn't mind playing as a PC. Actually, it gave me two, for different parts of my campaign world. Now I just need to integrate warring bands of kobolds in the mountains between the deserts to the north and the fertile fields of the south... Dinosaurs as a whole should gain some traction. I mean, some on- they're bleeding DINOSAURS! They'd be excellent for jungle adventures- think of what it'd be like to face a pack of Deinonychuses in the jungle (of course, they should be Medium creatures, not Large, ibut whatever). Gibbering Mouther. The picture alone is justification- that thing is freaky! Play the right music in the background and include some sensible sentences ('Help me! I'm inside it- help me! Oh, please don't attack it, you'll kill me! NO!'), and you're guaranteed to have some freaked out players. Heh, I don't know about you guys, but with my friends, a Homunculus would be an excellent foe. This is for personal reasons: In my Magic deck, I like to use the various Homunculuses, which were generally greeted with, "Argh- it's the friggin' Sneaky Homunculus!" Throwing this into an adventure with them would likely elicit some eye twitches, should I get a game started with them. Someday... Maybe... Phasms. Take one look at their picture- the first thing out of my mouth was, literally, "The heck?" Furthermore, the things are intelligent, telepathic, and not evil. They could make for one strange encounter. All of the following are from the MM3: Drowned. Erk. These things are freaky, tough, and all too common. They could also have some good backstory- say, a once-thriving trade route was the site of a vicious and bloody pirate attack that led to all involved eventually falling into the sea; now the dead sailors have become Drowned, and are haunting the area, causing ships to take a different route and cutting off the lifeblood of a nearby trading port. Odopi. Blargh- essentially urchins that have hands and arms instead of spines. An encounter with one of these would be a memorable experience for the PCs. Plus, all those claws will increase their traction greatly- no skidding for these guys! Susurrus. These guys would be an interesting encounter. Especially good for players that use light spells instead of torches or lanterns. They simply look strange, and while the players may never fight or even talk to them, having one or two walk by as the players are exploring would be memorable, to say the least. Woodling creatures. Yes, it's a template, but a cool one. Perhaps the head of some local druids is a woodling; you then have an NPC that, without affecting its role in society much, is nonetheless interesting and possessing of unique powers. |
| Twonky09-11-05, 07:33 AM | The Astral Stalker from MM3 is very cool, and is, in my opinion, the best new monster in the book. The concept of a race of hunters who regard all others as potential prey has always been great, and Astral Stalkers, with their strong abilities are perfect for the role. The Shifter from Eberron Campaign Setting is also a race that will find a place in many players' hearts. A great thing about them is that there are a lot of varieties, each one interesting. I also like Shredstorm (MM3), Vashutant (MM3) and Thri-kreen (sp?) (MM2, XPH) (although they are not so new). |
| Seeker9509-11-05, 08:49 AM | Myconids. They can be in just about any environment, but without the flesh / traction of additional support, they seem to be more of an afterthought. Daemons. The not-a-devil-not-a-demon netherplanars are a great alternative to the norm, but need a bit more detail to give them better traction. |
| Elzaban the Ethereal09-11-05, 09:11 AM | I have to go with Thri-Kreen. Since they've been generalized from their place in Dark Sun, I've seen a lot more of them, and everyone I play with loves them. What's not cool about a race of super-jumping, psionic, four-armed, mantis warriors? Plus, they're tough enough to be a threat at low levels, and then they can easily be augmented with Psychic Warrior and whatnot to boost their power as the levels go on. Very tractionful creatures. And kobolds just go without saying. Saying that you don't like or use kobolds is like kicking a puppy. One armed with a shovel, some piano wire, and an army of similar puppies. |
| acid_nanny09-11-05, 12:40 PM | It may seem strange but in our games faeries have gained traction. small, fast, difficult to see with poison arrows and you can always whack a few druid levels on to them for evilness |
| Dragonsong197309-11-05, 02:31 PM | In our group the Maug from Fiend Folio has gained some traction. As with drow and thri-kreens also finding serious traction in our game the advantages of levels in classes adds to the appeal. From CR 2 base Maugs to the CR 20+Thulkir's(sp) that rule the race allows for scalability. With good ability scores all the way around there are very few classes the Maug is truly unsuited for. This class flexibilty plus being a very powerful ECL 5 with the construct traits makes it a very good option for a say, ECL 8+, campaign or set of advetnures. The matter of being an exception to the norm is a great appeal for some players. It is true that the PC's are exceptional in some way or another the Maug allows for another option to play the frankenstein/Tin man/ Pinocchio type "stranger in a strange land". |
| Ridureyu09-11-05, 02:38 PM | Ettercaps need more traction. They're like spiders, but monkeys... spider monkeys!!!!! |
| gribble09-11-05, 02:56 PM | Here's one a little out of left-field: Nerra. I can't recall which book they're from, but I think possibly the 3e Fiend Folio? A lot of players are getting exposure to them because they feature pretty heavily in the new RPGA "Mark of Heroes" Eberron campaign. That, and the fact they have some interesting special abilities (such as disguise self and reflective spell resistance) that have made my group's encounters with them very memorable! They also seem to scale pretty well, with at least 2 or 3 different (and increasingly powerful) types. |
| Lathlander09-11-05, 03:08 PM | The runehound is a great monster out of MM3. It's only a CR 2 or 3 creature but it has lots of special abilities. Like Reach for a medium size creature, good damage, DR, Fast healing, Blindsight, and a ranged acid attack. I love to hate it already. |
| Sucros09-11-05, 05:13 PM | Totally forgot about warforged. Of the four new eberron races, they are by far the most striking. They're the first thing eberron detractors thing of: "those roboty guys". For the first time since the Thri-Kreen there's a playable race that has a truly alien mindset that the players can get into. |
| zoroaster10009-11-05, 09:00 PM | I think of the new monsters created for 3e the ones that come to mind as having potential for traction are the ethergaunts and the kaorti. The main limitation is that their flavor does not fit with all typical campaigns, only those emphasizing horror/alien/sci-fi type fantasy, but they have some of the ingredients that made gythyanki and drow so successful, a "cool" factor and a lot of back history and information on their society or "flavor" suggestions. |
| MerricB09-12-05, 01:56 AM | Salt Mummy and Sand Golem have gained quite a bit in my recent sessions. I was leading up to playing Gary Gygax's Necropolis and I decided to add a bit of Sandstorm into the picture. I've just kept using them since then. Whenever it becomes time to expand a little on the adventure, those two creatures come up, and my players have had some memorable combats with them. The Salt Mummy is really just a mummy - but the dessicating touch and its appearance help it markedly. The Sand Golem is just tough. The suffocating sand has already claimed one PC's life (he was reincarnated from human to dwarf!), and it is just hard to damage. Each time the PCs have been looking at new ways to defeat them, and the conditions have changed each time so they're always interesting. Time to use them both again... Cheers! |
| hogi09-12-05, 03:29 AM | Greates memory of any monster we had would had been the first edition su-monsters. Wish they bring them back for 3e. |
| Elzaban the Ethereal09-12-05, 05:06 AM | Greates memory of any monster we had would had been the first edition su-monsters. Wish they bring them back for 3e. 3.0 Psionics Handbook web enhancement (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20010330a) with su-monsters. They'd need some updating to 3.5, but they're around. |
| CC Shade09-12-05, 11:44 AM | By book, I think the following are gaining traction: Fiend Folio: blackstone gigant, chronotyryn, crawling head, ethergaunts, kaorti, maug, nerra, shadar-kai, ulgurstasta, grafts, symbionts, swarm subtype MM II: avolakia, hellfire wyrm, neogi (mainly due to Lords of Madness), nimblewright MM III: death giant, drowned, living spells, ragewalker Epic-Level Handbook: atropal, xixecal, paragon template Other: deathless type (BoED), kaiju template (Dragon Magazine #289), mercane (MoTP) |
| Tyhm09-12-05, 06:53 PM | It helps that the Mercane are also in Epic - double the sources, an entire plane everyone's heard about and greedily yearns to visit, instant traction. Definitely nimblewrights. It's only unexpected the first time, but dex based fighters are rare in a smashy-smashy system, and taking the most smashy-smashy of all Types (Iron Golem verses Giant? Giants can have subtlety...) and dropping Finesse on them, beautiful. Definitely Definitely Paragon! Ye tapdancing monkeys, there's nothing so beautiful as the look on a 15th level fighter's face when his weapons prove ineffective against the 1-HD Kobold. I just wish there were more variants on the Paragon - seems odd they all have the exact same 3 SPs. (hint hint) House rule in my game is Paragons get any 3 Spell Like Abilities I feel like giving them. Of appropriate level of course, but it keeps the players on their toes. Disguise Self, True Seeing, and Spell Immunity make a fun combination. Sometimes a Heal or Ventriloquism or Globe of Invulnerability or Freedom of Movement, as the situation demands. Has to be flavor based though, can't really give a paragon iron golem Freedom of Movement just because the monk's a grappler. The Paragon Banelar, though... |
| feartheinvinceblehamster09-12-05, 07:16 PM | though it hasn't shown up yet, i'm creating an entire world who is practically owned by a advanced 90 HD corpse gatherer. and i'm writing a story about them in language arts. man do i love corpse gatherers. and hydra's are probably gonna gain some traction. and gelatinous cubes, i love those things! it's a cube! now we shall call it mr. icebreaker, give him an ice breath weapon, and have hillary duff absorbed inside him shreiking about liquid and ice not going together :) |
| Doopliss09-12-05, 09:04 PM | Call me insane, but I'd like to see....Assassin Vines. They just really stuck with me as something ordinary, yet not.(those hand-shaped leaves are creeepy) |
| TheRedRobedWizard09-12-05, 10:37 PM | Well, the Kobold would be the obvious answer; just look at the vocal outcry of the Meepo supporters when he was beaten. *sigh* Anyway, for a less obvious answer, I'm going to have to say that the Half-Dragon gets almost as much use as any other monster, both as a PC and NPC race. Lots of traction there; I mean, sure they were around in Council of Wyrms... Then again, most players nowadays have never played such things, might as well be a new monster. tl;dr - Half-Dragon for the win. -TRRW |
| MindWandererB09-13-05, 08:50 PM | Creatures that have the potential for traction: Half-bloods. Half-fiends, Half-celestials, and Half-dragons have firmly earned, and, I think, been awarded the title. They appear all over the place and are easy to fit into any campaign. That being said, they're perhaps a bit too easy... since they're templates and not actual creatures, they have no society or modus operandi, and are almost always encountered as individuals (usually as leaders of pure strains of their templated form) rather than groups. Choker: They look humanoid, but mostly they're just annoying as heck if played properly. Small, so they fit anywhere (perhaps even as a familiar or such). Devourer: Not overwhelmingly powerful, but intelligent and sadistic. Great as a single antagonist, but can you imagine them in numbers? Looks good, too. Inevitables: Some backstory could make these guys great. They come in multiple types, theoretically one for every transgression. I like the idea of a Tiny Inevitable of shoplifting. Shocker Lizards: They're cute, make good familiars, and scale by number as well as size. A mere four of these weigh in at EL 6, by the book, but can create an 8d8 blast (Reflex DC 14 half). Or a roomful of 12 of them at EL 9: 24d8 (Reflex DC 22 half)- Eww! Vargouille: Like the Penaggalan of yore, the idea of a flying head that tries to kiss you and turn you into one of its own is fantastic. I'd love to see variants (Vargouille-kin) that are more scalable and smarter, perhaps with detachable bodies or body-slaves. Yuan-Ti: The new Drow. Evil, smart, magical, xenophobic, with spell-like abilities and spell resistance, plus they have several racial variants scaling into the near-Epic. And some can pass as humans. I know they're not part of the "new generation" of D&D, but they still have a part to play, especially with the new Anathema and grafts. Abeil: All they need is an adventure or a novel and they can do anything. The Formians should have been more like these guys. Bogun: My players love these; the party druid just wishes they scaled like familiars or animal companions. They'd just as soon never fight another one, though- the tiny little buggers are annoying. Clockwork Horror: These guys are pre-scaled, familiar-sized, fit anywhere, destroy everything to make more of themselves... they're ready-made for a module. Might get sued by the people who make Stargate SG-1, though. Desmodu & Nycter: Such thorough writeups on their society, for Monster Manual entries. Surely more can be done with them. Shadar-Kai: Ditto. Gem Dragons: You know, you should either give them full coverage with the metallics and chromatics or write them out of the game. This "partial credit" thing just doesn't work well. Elemental Weirds: These work extraordinarily well in my game as semi-helpful NPCs and mysterious antagonists. Their intelligence, divination abilities, elemental nature, and limited scalability allow them to fill many roles. And their "usually" alignment status instead of the "always" usually associated with elementals has been a godsend. Neogi: We need to see more of these outside the Spelljammer context. As slavers, we should see them all over the place, and we don't. Their stat block doesn't say much for them, but they have great personality. Deomodands and Rilmani: If you made more of them, they'd work nicely to complement the other types of outsiders. Kaorti: These could be the new Githyanki, and a great way of making the Farplane concept make it into the canon cosmology. Nerra: I personally dislike the Plane of Mirrors, but these could also make it as new Githyanki. Living Spells: Talk about scalable. No creature without class levels is as versatile. Creatures that did, or could have had traction and blew it: Displacer beast: The new art turned the "panther-with-tentacles" into a starving, ugly, demon-thing. No one even wants to look at it anymore, let alone play with it. Gold Dragon: Also ruined by the new art. The most powerful good monster in the game, and it looks like a freaking catfish-eel. Go back to how it looked in 2E. The old Hairfoot halflings: people liked these, especially after LotR. Now they're Kender wannabes. At my table, we gave the Lightfoot lifestyle to the new Gnomes (calling them Wagon Gnomes instead of Rock Gnomes), although Lightfoots are retained in addition to the Hairfoots. Fey: I don't even think I have to say it. You guys know. Formians, Modrons and, to a lesser extent, Slaadi: I have many issues. 1) They're pointless. Celestials and Fiends influence the world, plot against each other, favor mortals and create magic items. Formians and Slaadi don't do any of these things, and can thus be ignored in most games. Good clerics pray for help from celestials and quests against fiends; what chaotic cleric prays for help from slaadi and quests against formians? 2) They're not that bright. They may have good Int scores, but in a game, they're usually just mindless attackers. 3) They're usually bad guys. A chaotic good character should be more likely to ally themselves with a slaad than with an archon. 4) they make no sense. Formians have no preference for "law" as it's treated in D&D, Slaadi aren't particularly chaotic (and, indeed, all look about the same with a rigid hierarchy, which is quite lawful), and Modrons are incapable of moral reasoning and should therefore have no alignment. 5) Celestials and fields have cool unique leaders (archdevils, etc.). Formians, especially, should have real Leaders, in keeping with their hierarchical mindset, and Slaadi, being creatures of chaos, should have many unique individuals among them, both strong and weak. [FYI: At my table, we use different creatures of Law and Chaos: the regimented but intelligent Abidons, each type of which has a metallic body ideally suited to fulfil its assigned role in existence, including fostering harmony and stability, as well as rigidity, in the world, and the constantly shapechanging Proteans (for which I used the Hagumemnon Protean as the upper end of power), which involve themselves in the world out of whimsy or purpose, fomenting anarchy and upheaval and combating stangnancy and complacency. I find these new creatures mesh much better with the celestials and fiends as anchors of the cosmos.] |
| Morka09-14-05, 11:22 AM | After the Lord of the Ring trilogy, which shows some Ent in action, I could see their cousin Treant gaining some traction. I would like to discuss about a point that was introduce in the article. It seems that a good way to gain traction in a monster is to define them as a racial enemy of an already popular monster. But it looks too artificial when a new monster pup up and is suddenly the racial enemy of an existing race. I'm talking about the Dracotaur, which seems to be the racial enemy of the centaur. Horsemen have existed for eons, while dracotaurs seems to just arrive, that doesn't work. The article said it worked for the drows (against elves) and the githyankis (against Mind Flayers). But we should remember that the conflicts between those races began eons ago. OTOH, I guess if you take an existing monster with few to no traction gaining traction if a new monster happen to be opposed to them. For example, if we create a sympathic forest-dwelling creature (perhaps a fey?) with a racial grudge against ettercap, I guess both of them would get some traction. |
| Old D&D Guy10-14-05, 01:42 PM | Since intoducing the abyssal ghoul my players are terrified of them. Their great wisdom drain ability and rear claw rakes aside, its definately the sneak attack that terrifies them. Even high level characters can be shredded if they don't use tactics to eliminate flanking. Nothing makes PCs form a square like a pack of abyssal ghouls. |
| ephealy11-17-05, 02:19 AM | Varrangoin (Fiend Folio): Anyone wanting to tussle with a fiend should run into these bad boys. They've got lots of the things you mentioned. (1) They are three known variants - the vanilla "Lesser" Varrangoin, and the two spicy ones, the Arcanist and Rager. (2) They are tied to another monster - fiends. (3) They are "mechanically interesting," in that they attack from the air. Also, while the PCs might think they're dealing with a low-powered fiendish minion, the Varrangoin are actually magical beasts. I for one WANT a Varrangoin mini. If there is one already, PLEASE LET ME KNOW ! ! ! Shadar-Kai (Fiend Folio): These guys are just soooo cool. Grey-skinned fey (not elves), tied to the Plane of Shadow (which is just BEGGING to be explored in more detail). Love the tatoos and piercings! Love the racial items to deal with the way cool Shadow Curse. They can work great as PCs (I am running a whole campaign with Shadar-Kai PCs based on Decker's Shadow Glade (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/re/20030714x). They use the spiked chain - did I read the words "mechanically interesting" somewhere? I hate to say this, though, the recent Ecology of the Shadar-Kai in DRAGON Magazine #337 (http://paizo.com/dragon/products/issues/2005/337) was disappointing. It gave marginal new cultural information, but that's really it. Nothing new was included that went very far beyond what was in the Fiend Folio or the above-mentioned Shadow Glade series. |
| Rake11-18-05, 12:54 PM | Kobolds, of course, but also (in my games, anyway): Chokers, fey, and hags. Ye GODS my players hate fairies and hags, by now. Using a sprite's voice-throwing-and-illusion magic, I convinced my party's rogue that his masterwork short sword had gained a voice, and therefore must have sprung to life as an intelligent item, when it entered what was apparently a 'magical forest' with him. The 'talking' sword convinced him that it had to be buried up to it's hilt in a pile of loose earth and leaves to fully awaken it's powers. Several formerly invisible fairies swooped down and carried the sword off, giggling all the while, of course, as soon as the sword was unattended. I also used a fairy (a petal, I think it was called) with a sleep-inducing power to fantastic effect once. My player, a 2'nd level cleric, encountered the fey in a tranquil little garden. The fairy asked if he wanted to play a game. Annoyed and wary, he said no. The fairy then decided that my player was under-rested. Even with a high Wis and base save, he managed to fail his save vs. sleep and the fairy promptly took and hid all of his things. His backpack went in a tree, his longsword was buried in the ground, his spell component pouch was fed, whole, to a small constrictor snake... etc. It was very entertaining watching him struggle to find and reclaim every item. He reaaaaly hated that encounter, and came very close to breaking with his alignment and finding and slaying the fey. Also, my PCs encountered and did some work for a green hag once, and the hag rewarded them with seemingly fantastic items which were, of course, severely cursed. This one they really should've seen coming. To this day my brother (who got a helm of alignment reversal), lives by the credo "never accept gifts from hags". One of the BBEGs from one of my early Eberron games was a dusk hag from Droaam with a LOT of choker minions. Chokers + grappling + aid another = good times (for me). Someone mentioned the nimblewright also, and though I haven't gotten around to using one yet, I agree - those babies are very cool. |
| Rake11-18-05, 01:01 PM | By the way, does constantly abusing the Hydra for polymorphing and animate undead-ing give it traction? :rolleyes: |
| Lord Doombringer11-18-05, 03:28 PM | Quaraphons have gained traction with my small home-group. The first encounter in the first adventure that I ran with my two members was a quaraphon. Not ony was it a difficult battle that required them to use tactics, but it lead to one of the funniest quote sections that we've had: "The quaraphon lets out an enormous unearthly bellow that makes your ears feel like they could bleed. Roll Fortitude." *Rolls* "Dammit, a 2!" "Crud, a 12..." "Okay, [sorcerer], you are deaf for *rolls* 1 round. [fighter], you are deaf for *rolls* 4 rounds! "WHAT? 4 ROUNDS?" "Yes. Now, guys, I want you to rollplay this as best as you can." "Okay. I CAN'T HERE ANYTHING!" "WHAT!?" "WHAT?!" "WHAT?!" "WHAT?!" "WHAT?" and so on... http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/mmiii_gallery/83036.jpg Quaraphon by Dave Allsop |
| Dr. Awkward12-09-05, 11:37 PM | Spellweavers: They're weird, enigmatic, have some really obnoxious abilities, and they've already shown up in one of the Dungeon magazine adventure paths. I like them. The recent Ecology article in Dragon was also pretty good. They make great "behind the scenes" puppetmasters, since they're not actually evil but they keep their many fingers in the affairs of the world as they search for whatever it is they're looking for. Nimblewrights: These always show up in my campaigns, and they make great "right-hand men" for the BBEG. They're combat monsters, and they're immune to a ton of spells, and sneak attacks too! That means they give the whole party a run for its money and have the chance to be a really nasty recurring villain, or althernatively, an important plot device. They can be the mcguffin and an NPC at the same time. Yugoloths: So much potential. Why haven't these guys been given "the treatment" yet? They haven't had any love since the Planescape days, and are now languishing in obscurity. We seriously need The Book of Fiends, with a big fat section on the 'loths. |
| Epicfetus01-10-06, 12:48 AM | I think the fact that many people have different styles of play has an affect on the traction of a given creature. What's cool to some is cheesy to others. Finding the rare creatures everyone can agree on is the real test. Some people like to play exotic races, and say things like "I'm a human in real life, why play one in a game?" These folk want the exotic, Thri-Kreens, Warforged, and Half-Dragons (or half-anything that isn't humanoid but has traction) is what these guys like. Of course, these races often come off as cheesy to others who reply "but you're not a mage or a knight in real life either, and the closer to reality the easier the suspension of disbelief" these people like humans as player races, and the more human-like non-humans, and prefere monsters that are rare and have well thought out reasons for existance or ecologies (undead, Dragons-but not half-dragons-, humanoid races with extensive backgrouds, constructs-all good, either because they fit in in ways that make sense or are the product of magic). On a simmilar, though different, axis- kick in the door vs. deep immersion role play has it's effects. Kick in the door guys like monsters that provide a good threat, while the deep immersion guys would rather see the same amount of development in half the number of monsters...more background the better. This relates a bit to the above, but can be different, although you can tell which style(s) go well together. Also, sometimes what the creature looks like has an effect...not just the art, but also what it's supposed to look like. The Owlbear sounds and looks better than the Peryton...the parts of the OB fit together better. Many of the newer 3.0/3.5 monsters just didn't look good to me...maybe it's suspension of disbelief? Whatever it is, they didn't look well thought out or put together, where others do. As for ones people mentioned here...Kobolds are well known because they're a typical threat for 1st-level parties, so everyone knows them. They're also a great monster to use for the occasional higher-level threat...because no one takes them seriously until they find themselves in a pit, full of greensblood-oil tipped bolts, wondering what in the 9 hells just happened. Nimblewrights are just cool...swashbuckling constructs, rapiers and speed mixed with machinary. I agree with the "dropping finesse on a smashy-smashy" comment above, it's different, but at the same time, not too different...it sounds like a tractable good idea on the part of a wizard bored with the same-old same-old, witnessed a rapier duel and went "huh, if I used haste and two of those thin-little blades...eureka!" While most gamers arn;'t total Drama Queens or Munchkins, you need to appeal to both to get a truely tractable creature. Drow are over-done and a bit too powered...but they have a good backstory, and a reason for it, hence they have traction (munchkins like the power, dq's like the fact that they have a good, if even tragic, backstory). So, if you want traction, i'd say test-art (to see if it looks "right", like it could exist...even abbarations need to make sense, even if only in contrast with itself [parts to whole, basic symmetry arguments, etc]), and suspension of disbelief..give it reasons for all of it's powers...make it believable. If it's easier to include it in a way that makes sense, it'll get more use. |
| Darkmeer01-10-06, 09:21 PM | So, I'm late as usual. My gaming group hates dark ones. A lot. Dark ones + Kobold Alliance = Lotsa traps in the dark. Outside of that: Maugs. These things rock. I'm a big PS fan. For a creature of their type, they have a very low ECL (5 IIRC), which makes them interesting to add to mid range parties. Hammerer & Crusher automatons. These things, when converted to 3.5 are rough to deal with. They are great in use as defenders and enemies for the wealthy to use against the PCs. I'm not a big Eberron fan, but Shifters, Changelings, and Warforged all look cool. I've almost picked up Magic of Eberron for a certain wizard prestige class that uses Warforged parts (can't remember the name). Classics with traction: Mind Flayer. I've had more eyes bug out at the sight of a mind flayer than I have with a beholder. The PC's reaction is more than worth it. Kobolds. As stated above. Love to hate kobolds. Osyluth/Bone Devil: These are some of the most frequently summoned devils in my games. Fomorian Giant: One of these took out half of the party once. Lotsa pain here, and very tough to smash to bits. /d |
| Grand Theft Otto01-11-06, 10:53 AM | I'm not sure you guys in development know this, but there was a plastic set of monsters you could buy in K-mart in the 1970's that was completely bizarre. They must have been Chinese, or Japanese. Because they were quite outside Western bestiaries. Our moms bought them for us -- or Santa brought them as stocking stuffers. But they were impossible to play with. Because, they didn't look like anything. Fortunately, they were the perfect size for attacking little lead figures. And three of them -- the rust monster,the bullete (aka John Belushi's "Land Shark"), and yes, THE OWL BEAR -- made the cut into AD&D. Finding evidence of these has been driving me mad lol. I remember getting the rust monster in particular... I think it was supposed to be like some manner of retarded looking ankylosaur, but it was a rust monster all right. |
| Grand Theft Otto01-11-06, 11:14 AM | In my current campaign, aberrations of any kind have gained some traction. I'm running an Oathbound campaign, set at the end of all worlds. Aberrations represent a fundamental wrongness with the universe as the threads of creation are unraveling. Things from out of space and time are beginning to slip into the player's world. in my game, even non-evil ones hasten decay, cause metal to corrode faster, food to spoil etc, and in numbers, their thought patterns can cause madness to spring up in communities. Lords of Madness is currently my favorite 3.5 book. In my variant of OB, a group of creatures imprisoned their creator diety (the only true god) in the world of the Forge, usurped its power, and became minor gods themselves. Flash forward thousands of years... the energy required to maintain the god's prison is being used up, the godlings do not wish to relinquish their power. So, the souls of their dead worshippers are being consumed to fuel this... not exactly a renewable resource. For many races, no new souls are entering the world... children are being stillborn, or as empty vessels for posession. As the campaign goes on, the players will discover this, and most likely turn on their gods in order to free the creator diety to bring life back to the universe... Needless to say, celestials will be appearing more as foes than as friends. |
| Raymond_Luxury_Yacht01-11-06, 07:19 PM | Flumphs. Give us Flumphs, damnit! |