Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Sy_Cottic 02-06-04, 09:20 PM	I just recently picked up this book. From what I see so far I’m pleasantly surprised. I do have one question (well 1 right now anyways). How does one become an “Exalted” character? Is it basically the same as a “normal” class, but with access to the new feats in the book? Or is it more of a prestige class? I want to present some of this to my DM, but I don’t want to give him the wrong impression. Thanks. :angel:
Ogre4Hire 02-06-04, 09:24 PM	Just take a feat with the Exalted descriptor. You are now officially and Exalted Character and are subject to all the restrictions. Oh, yeah, and you have to be good aligned, but you already knew that.
Sy_Cottic 02-06-04, 09:28 PM	Alright....seems almost too simple to be true. :D Thanks!
Mousse 02-06-04, 09:29 PM	I just recently picked up this book. From what I see so far I’m pleasantly surprised. I do have one question (well 1 right now anyways). How does one become an “Exalted” character? Is it basically the same as a “normal” class, but with access to the new feats in the book? Or is it more of a prestige class? I want to present some of this to my DM, but I don’t want to give him the wrong impression. You're first guess is the right one. Exalted is simply a modifier to a normal class that allows you take the Exalted Feats and PrCs in the book. As far as becoming Exalted, that choice is up to your DM. Basically, Exalted characters are paragons of good in the universe. Exalted is somewhat akin to being a Paladin's state, except even (I know its not a word :rolleyes: ) Good-er. For example, my current character managed to achieve Exalted status last session, after being ressurected by the God/dess of dreams. Of course, she had been good to begin with, and before she was resurrected, she swore herself to the God/dess's cause and a quest to perserve the world and bring ultimate happiness. So, yeah. Exalted is a distinction. It means you are uber-good. You can get some real neat things (Power AND/OR Flavor wise). Your DM must okay the fact that you will be Exalted. You must maintain your Exalted Status at ALL TIMES. Yup, that's Exalted in a nut-shell.
MattMart 02-07-04, 10:39 AM	Exhaulted feats are gifts....they are better than regular feats....you can play them in different ways depending on how the dm wants them to be done... 1) Any Good person can get them 2) Any person who swares to a good god can use them 3) Anyone who performs a service in the name of thier diety can use them 4) Anyone who has communed with a celestial being aligned with thier diety can use them 5) Anyone who has aided / saved / performed a great service to the celestial being can take them 6) Anyone who has stood before an avatar of thier diety can take them 7) Anyone who has directly communed with thier diety can take one 8) Anyone who has been singled out and specially blessed by thier diety can take one different degrees.... its up to the DM to decide.... I like #8... it adds alot of flavor... :)
Quathmoir Dlaeh Issarhai 02-07-04, 07:30 PM	Originally posted by Sy_Cottic seems almost too simple to be true. That's the point with BoED!:D
Count Arioch the 28th 02-09-04, 03:52 AM	In my game, I take a hard-line stance with exalted (And vile) material. Vile and exalted feats are gifts from the gods themselves. As in, you are given them through your deeds, and they can be taken away if you anger the deity.
DungeonlessMaster 02-09-04, 01:36 PM	I take a different stance than most of the other posts. In my games any good character is exalted. That is what having good as part of your alignment means. Evil characters are vile. They act really really evil. Any character who does not think his character can live up to the standard presented in the book of exalted deeds or any character who does not feel there character is despicale enough to be evil according to the book of vile darkness is NEUTRAL! Using this d&d alignments seem to mean a lot more. Being good really means you are good, and neutral characters don't seem so random.
Mercurius 02-09-04, 05:17 PM	Originally posted by DungeonlessMaster I take a different stance than most of the other posts. In my games any good character is exalted. That is what having good as part of your alignment means. Evil characters are vile. They act really really evil. Any character who does not think his character can live up to the standard presented in the book of exalted deeds or any character who does not feel there character is despicale enough to be evil according to the book of vile darkness is NEUTRAL! Using this d&d alignments seem to mean a lot more. Being good really means you are good, and neutral characters don't seem so random. That's kind of an interesting idea. However, I've had several good aligned characters that don't exactly qualify for exalted feats, so I'd be personally against doing it that way, myself.
Count Arioch the 28th 02-09-04, 05:45 PM	That idea isn't very realistic, but it certainly would make an entertaining game, I think.
DungeonlessMaster 02-09-04, 05:57 PM	How can your good characters not qualify? The only requirement for the feats is that they be good. The way I see exalted/vile feats is that they are tied to alignment. Characters are gaining powers beyond those considered "normal" or even "learnable" in exchange for their status. If they switch status they lose the feats. I.E. A paladin that takes nimbus of light would lose such if he became a black guard. He gets no replacement. I think that the authors intent in the book of exalted deeds and the book of vile darkness was to further explore the operation of the d&d alignment system. Good alignments and Evil alignments really are just that. Orc society would be a terrible place becuase it would be rife with the sort of activities listed as evil in the book of vile darkness. On the other hand having your soul live eternally with a bunch of celestials would be pretty nice again becuase they act according to the more clear standard set forth in the book of exalted deeds. Mostly what I like is that if you assume that good IS exalted and evi is VILE then neutral seems to have a place. Neutral characters probably consider themselves good. They find it easier to work with good characters than with evil ones. They are not ambivilient, just more pragmatic. Lawful neutral characters torture prisoners if it will save lives. Chaotic neutral characters are not insane but instead rugged individualist. They are the ultimate libritarians. Neutality means something playable using this standard, because everybody cares about something.
strenoth 02-09-04, 06:46 PM	no.. a simply good character could be good with a flaw or two that keeps them from quite being exalted. Like in a story I am writing with a friend, we have one hero who qualifies as being good, but wiht a combination of reluctance to accept the responsibility of a leadership role that it's his duty to take up, a short temper, and a tendancy to hide form his promblems in a tankard of ale. These character flaws keep him from being exalted, despite the fact that he is willing to risk his life for the sake of others with no desire for reward. in DnD, the basics of being good is the willingness to risk/sacrifice for the sake of others with out expecting a reward. A neutral person would at least insist on payment of some sort, unless that person being helped was a friend or relative or something. and an evil person would not risk their lives for the sake of others at all, though if the reward is big enough, well, most evil people are greedy to a certain extent. Oh, and Evil People would ignore the needs of their 'friends' and family unless they got something out of it. An Exalted person does not have to be flawless, but they have to be soem what close. An Exalted person can drink alchol, but can not allow himself to become regularly inebrated because that would hamper hsi ability to help others. An exalted person can not be a lech, though it's fine if he has the occasional casual relationship. Basically, an Exalted character can not have the deeper flaws a simply good person is allowed to have. they have to be stronger. of course, this can build up arrogance, and to much arrogance and pride will also cause an exalted person to loose their status. So the ability to maintain a certain level of genuine humbleness is a must as well. no, good does not equal Exalted. Exalted is a higher standard fo good.
DungeonlessMaster 02-10-04, 11:33 AM	Quite simply no. The problem is to many people assume that your alignment has to generate a persons personality. A character who drinks can be exalted. It would be a bad idea for him to take the abstinance feat, but any exalted character he could. The exalted feats represent characters who draw power from an aspect of THEIR goodness. A good character can brood, and drink and even get wasted. The differance is that a character who is good knows that what they are doing is not helping them. Consider Athos, he drowns his own sins alchohol but is still a good character, and still would qualify for other sorts of exalted feats. A good character does not have to share his feelings. Consider Angel, he is defiantly now good but he understands that his life is dangerous (as is he) and so prevents people from getting close. As he is what amounts to a warrior of god (the powers that be) he is defiantly exalted, yet he is still fallen and dark. A good character can get angry and have a temper. The exalted feats that prevent these acts should not be taken by characters who suffer from these flaws. Consider the characer you discribe. What if he had a nimbus of light. It would act as a constant reminder of the duty his is shurking that he KNOWS he should be fullfiling. An exalted character can feel very inadequite. A constant simbol of what you should be doing could way very heavly on the heart of a person who likes doing good. I call this RAND syndrome. All the elements we have discussed thus far are personality elements. Your personality is in no way dictated by your alignment. You can play a LG character who never ever says thank you to anybody, gets mad whenever anybody else wont let him die in battle but as long as he adheres to a MORAL standard of justice none of that matters. Other personality elements that should not affect your alignment are temper, loathing, insanity (Don Quhote is not CN but is definatly insane), bad habits (including smoking, drinking, hygene, swearing), courteousness (you can be good and rude at the same time, and anything else that does not impact how you go about making MORAL choices. Exalted should not be made "gooder good" and here is why. If you take that path you break the d&d alignment system. Consider a line that goes from -1 to 1. With the alignments filled in as shown -1---------0--------1 Evil Neutral good Alright, this is similar to the "axes" they talk about in the phb. Consider that however there is no "middle" ground. The acceptable values are -1,0, 1. Not .5 or -.3. Now where do you stick exalted characters? At say 2? Then what is the point in being good? Exalted people represent what is really good. people who are back at position 1 are not really good at all only "nice." On the other hand if you have to be flawless to be good and you can play a good character who can be pragmatic about is goodness by not being exalted then what is the value of being neutral? A single act, or even a small number of acts of altruism do make make a person good. Remeber the line in the book of exlated deeds where it says that simply avoiding evil acts does not make a person good? (Chapter 1, first page). Read the introduction and back cover of the book of exalted deeds. The entire intent of the book is to define the line between NEUTRAL and good. Yes a neutral character probably demands a reward for fighting the dragon. On the other hand a neutral character might not becuase he understands that a dragon could destroy the city he comes from (to which he might have an attachment) or with a slighly differnt personality he might decide that it would be imposssible for HIM to function without a town/city/place of habitation near by and go slay the dragon becuase he does not have all the skills neccessary to live in isolation. His reward as he sees it is the continuation of his current lifestyle. The point of both exalted deeds and vile darkenss is to show that most pcs are probably more neutral than they might expect. The other point is that being nuetral does not have to mean apathetic. In fact it basically means pragmatic. Neutral characters are driven by solutions, not by values.
Loren Pechtel 02-10-04, 04:55 PM	Originally posted by DungeonlessMaster A good character can brood, and drink and even get wasted. The differance is that a character who is good knows that what they are doing is not helping them. I don't think an exhalted character should get wasted. Too much risk of doing a non-good act under the influence.
MattMart 02-10-04, 06:23 PM	It says specifically that exhaulted feats can only be taken by those who are "of good alignment and the highest moral standards" and "only as a gift from powerful agents of good"
Eco-Mono 02-11-04, 10:17 AM	DungeonlessMaster, the way I see it is that the system rounds numbers. Some people are at .3, .8, -.1, and places like that... it's just that the alignment system "rounds" their alignments in order to describe them in game terms. Thus, while Good qualifies anything from .51 to 1, Exalted is a much smaller window within Good (.9 to 1 or something like that). Is this coherent?
Pagan priest 02-11-04, 05:23 PM	Originally posted by Loren Pechtel I don't think an exhalted character should get wasted. Too much risk of doing a non-good act under the influence. Kind of depends on what the character is under the influence of. Some things, like alcohol, only reduce inhibitions. There is no true personality change, it is just that the normal filter is removed. A person who would lose exalted status for things done while drunk should probably not have been exalted in the first place. Other drugs can incite evil behavior, like PCP might induce inappropriately agressive behavior.
MattMart 02-12-04, 08:38 AM	I would hardly concider being a drunkard or drinking at all to be "of highest moral standards"...thats what it takes to be exhaulted..."of highest moral standards'
Pagan priest 02-15-04, 12:26 AM	Intoxication is morally neutral, as a general rule. It is very possible that someone might do things immoral while under the influence, merely being under the influence is is not in and of iteself, immoral. Now of course, if a person has some sort of problem, eg, alway a mean drunk, doesn't know when to stop, intoxication interfering with required activities, then intoxicants should be completely avoided. There are certain cultures that consider intoxication, under the right circumstances as highly moral. For example, the Cult of Dionysus, or the Native American Peyote ritual. Certain South American Indian tribes use a powerful hallucinagen as part of the shamaic rituals. It is all a question of context. A paladin celebrating a major victory by taking part in a great feast and having several ales over the course of the evening is no less exalted for it. On the other hand, if that paladin were to spend every afternoon in the local tavern having several ales, leaving his wife home to worry about the mortgage and ignoring the goblin raids on the edge of town... well, that is a paladin with a problem.