Artificer and Metamagic rods [Archive] - Wizards Community

Artificer and Metamagic rods [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
cbradshaw007
03-07-07, 11:59 AM Two questions:

1. Can an Artificer use a Metamagic Rod with the metamagic item infusion?

2. The DMG doesn't list the pre-reqs for metamagic rod creation, anyone know what they are?
DarkWarriorKarg
03-07-07, 01:14 PM 1. No, but may use them when casting actual infusions.
2. Having the metamagic feat.
Dragom
03-07-07, 08:54 PM Isn't there a thing saying one can't use Metamagic feats on Infusions?

Though an Artificer with a rod of extend could craft scrolls of extended Mage Armour without the Metamagic: Extend Feat.

I think your stuck handing them over to the party Caster when you find or make them.

And I think the DC for crafting such a rod is the same as emulating a cantrip modified by said feat. (Much as a cruel or embittered DM won't let you take metamagic feats you can't use)

DC 23 Empower
DC 21 Enlarge
DC 21 Extend
DC 25 Maximize
DC 27 Quicken
DC 21 Silent
DC 21 Still
DC 25 Widen

Anyway that's what I'd do.
Subtle Knife
03-09-07, 12:01 PM Isn't there a thing saying one can't use Metamagic feats on Infusions?

Though an Artificer with a rod of extend could craft scrolls of extended Mage Armour without the Metamagic: Extend Feat.

I think your stuck handing them over to the party Caster when you find or make them.

And I think the DC for crafting such a rod is the same as emulating a cantrip modified by said feat. (Much as a cruel or embittered DM won't let you take metamagic feats you can't use)

DC 23 Empower
DC 21 Enlarge
DC 21 Extend
DC 25 Maximize
DC 27 Quicken
DC 21 Silent
DC 21 Still
DC 25 Widen

Anyway that's what I'd do.

I have never seen anything that states you cannot use metamagic feats on infusions. Please reference this.

SK
Dragom
03-09-07, 06:35 PM Either I'm hallucinating or they changed that sometime in the past two years without bothering to tell me.
Elderich
03-09-07, 06:49 PM Two questions:

1. Can an Artificer use a Metamagic Rod with the metamagic item infusion?

2. The DMG doesn't list the pre-reqs for metamagic rod creation, anyone know what they are?1 What are you asking? Do you want to cast a MM rod enhanced version of MMII (say persistant MMII)? or are you trying to use the MMRod as the FEAT to apply to the item infused with MMI?

You may not use the MMRod as the FEAT to apply to the item infused with MMI. You have to have the feat.
Subtle Knife
03-09-07, 06:50 PM I'm not saying you are wrong. I'm saying I've never seen that particularly rule and was under the assumption that they could be used (making Metamagic Feats useful for more than items). If you have a source you can reference, I will believe you; if not, then I won't...

SK
Subtle Knife
03-09-07, 07:01 PM To Dragom, I quote:
"Like a spellcaster, an artificer can apply item creation feats and metamagic feats to his infusions. Like a sorceror, an artificer can apply a metamagic feat to an infusion spontaneously, by doing this requires extra time." - ECS p31, top of the page, second column, second paragraph down.

Looking at the official errata for the book, there is no retraction of this statement. Please be certain of what you are talking about before you say it - it is frustrating for us and embarrassing for you.

SK
Dragom
03-09-07, 07:20 PM I remember there being a retraction in the ECS errata. It is no longer there.

Rule wise my ability to retain information is very good so I rarely re-reference information except to point things out. This may be the first time I was not only unable to find a reference but found a contradictory reference in it's place.

Indeed I remember the Bovine himself presenting the dire news to the boards shortly after I bought the ECS. He was not in favor of the change.

That being the case It would make less sense to force a UMD roll to craft a Metamagic Rod.

PS: I'm almost certain Persistant Spell is a Forgotten Realms feat.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
cbradshaw007 03-07-07, 11:59 AM	Two questions: 1. Can an Artificer use a Metamagic Rod with the metamagic item infusion? 2. The DMG doesn't list the pre-reqs for metamagic rod creation, anyone know what they are?
DarkWarriorKarg 03-07-07, 01:14 PM	1. No, but may use them when casting actual infusions. 2. Having the metamagic feat.
Dragom 03-07-07, 08:54 PM	Isn't there a thing saying one can't use Metamagic feats on Infusions? Though an Artificer with a rod of extend could craft scrolls of extended Mage Armour without the Metamagic: Extend Feat. I think your stuck handing them over to the party Caster when you find or make them. And I think the DC for crafting such a rod is the same as emulating a cantrip modified by said feat. (Much as a cruel or embittered DM won't let you take metamagic feats you can't use) DC 23 Empower DC 21 Enlarge DC 21 Extend DC 25 Maximize DC 27 Quicken DC 21 Silent DC 21 Still DC 25 Widen Anyway that's what I'd do.
Subtle Knife 03-09-07, 12:01 PM	Isn't there a thing saying one can't use Metamagic feats on Infusions? Though an Artificer with a rod of extend could craft scrolls of extended Mage Armour without the Metamagic: Extend Feat. I think your stuck handing them over to the party Caster when you find or make them. And I think the DC for crafting such a rod is the same as emulating a cantrip modified by said feat. (Much as a cruel or embittered DM won't let you take metamagic feats you can't use) DC 23 Empower DC 21 Enlarge DC 21 Extend DC 25 Maximize DC 27 Quicken DC 21 Silent DC 21 Still DC 25 Widen Anyway that's what I'd do. I have never seen anything that states you cannot use metamagic feats on infusions. Please reference this. SK
Dragom 03-09-07, 06:35 PM	Either I'm hallucinating or they changed that sometime in the past two years without bothering to tell me.
Elderich 03-09-07, 06:49 PM	Two questions: 1. Can an Artificer use a Metamagic Rod with the metamagic item infusion? 2. The DMG doesn't list the pre-reqs for metamagic rod creation, anyone know what they are?1 What are you asking? Do you want to cast a MM rod enhanced version of MMII (say persistant MMII)? or are you trying to use the MMRod as the FEAT to apply to the item infused with MMI? You may not use the MMRod as the FEAT to apply to the item infused with MMI. You have to have the feat.
Subtle Knife 03-09-07, 06:50 PM	I'm not saying you are wrong. I'm saying I've never seen that particularly rule and was under the assumption that they could be used (making Metamagic Feats useful for more than items). If you have a source you can reference, I will believe you; if not, then I won't... SK
Subtle Knife 03-09-07, 07:01 PM	To Dragom, I quote: "Like a spellcaster, an artificer can apply item creation feats and metamagic feats to his infusions. Like a sorceror, an artificer can apply a metamagic feat to an infusion spontaneously, by doing this requires extra time." - ECS p31, top of the page, second column, second paragraph down. Looking at the official errata for the book, there is no retraction of this statement. Please be certain of what you are talking about before you say it - it is frustrating for us and embarrassing for you. SK
Dragom 03-09-07, 07:20 PM	I remember there being a retraction in the ECS errata. It is no longer there. Rule wise my ability to retain information is very good so I rarely re-reference information except to point things out. This may be the first time I was not only unable to find a reference but found a contradictory reference in it's place. Indeed I remember the Bovine himself presenting the dire news to the boards shortly after I bought the ECS. He was not in favor of the change. That being the case It would make less sense to force a UMD roll to craft a Metamagic Rod. PS: I'm almost certain Persistant Spell is a Forgotten Realms feat.