Binders in Eb [Archive] - Wizards Community

Binders in Eb [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
korrick
10-15-07, 02:46 AM I wanted to find a good place for binders (as in pact magic) in Eb. I thought that the religious sect of house Lyrandar might include Binders. As the elves have a form of ancestor worship, the half elves can have a variation on that theme. They are willing to venerate those that are not so "glorious" or for that matter, deathless.

I rewrote the back stories for each vestige, using either giants, elves or humans. And, I'm having Binders based out of the Lyrandar lands in Valenar (remember, "ancestor worship").

Anyway, has the setting absorbed this class in some other way that I'm not aware of, or, does anyone have other ideas?
Alex_
10-15-07, 08:03 PM I think the concept of Pact Magic works very well with worhippers of the Dragon Below, Daelkyr, and other things trapped in Khyber. Usually, such beings are locked underground by the seals placed by the Gatekeeper Druids and others. Pact magic is just making another seal that bypasses that one, so you can draw on a vile being's power.
Edymnion
10-15-07, 08:31 PM I would actually attribute pact magic to the goblinoid empire.
You could use the names and everything pretty much as is, and play it up as being incredibly old. As in, it was an old art when the goblinoid empire was at it's height, and its virtually forgotten today. Only a very select few secret sects keep the ancient ways alive.

On a related note, I make Truenaming into Dragon Magic (as in, what the Dragons taught the Giants). Thats also my explination for the Mourning, that someone basically unnamed Cyre.

Basically, I try to make the Tome of Magic systems into very old systems. The PHB stuff is the way things are now for the vast majority of the setting, but if you know where to look, you can still find bits and pieces of the old ways still hanging on.
Yadot
10-16-07, 04:52 PM I do the same thing as Edymnion with Truename magic, but in my campaign Pact Magic is a relic from Ancient Sarlona before the Inspired set up shop. Dantilion, Paimon, etc. come from one of the lost kingdoms there.
Rechan
10-17-07, 02:38 AM I could see some of the pacts being Elven ancestors, sure, but there are a lot of other options.

Vestiges may be what's left of truly epic individuals who passed on beyond Dolurrh and their spirit or energy or being are so strong that they still exist. They are legendary figures, not quite Gods but heroes of their time, and the collective belief and reputation and power they held has left them clinging to existence.

Pacts could be a way to access Living Dreams in Dal Quor. Dal Quor is so distant from the Material that it is the equivalent of the Vestiges' locations. The Quori have managed to find a way through (possession), but dreams within Dal Quor given form can't pierce the fold. But the dreams of dragons or psionicists or whatever may have gained sentience, lived, and now want to contact the world beyond.

Clerics of Eberron get magic from Faith, right? You believe ins oemthing strong enough, you can get magic from it. But if enough people believe in the same thing, that power should be a two-way street - their belief CREATES things. Gives that Idea a true form. And those true forms may be Vestiges. So Binders may be tapping into the personification or true nature of an Idea.
Arz
10-24-07, 12:05 PM I would actually attribute pact magic to the goblinoid empire.
You could use the names and everything pretty much as is, and play it up as being incredibly old. As in, it was an old art when the goblinoid empire was at it's height, and its virtually forgotten today. Only a very select few secret sects keep the ancient ways alive.

On a related note, I make Truenaming into Dragon Magic (as in, what the Dragons taught the Giants). Thats also my explination for the Mourning, that someone basically unnamed Cyre.

Basically, I try to make the Tome of Magic systems into very old systems. The PHB stuff is the way things are now for the vast majority of the setting, but if you know where to look, you can still find bits and pieces of the old ways still hanging on.

Damn.

All I can say when I see thoughts matching my own on the boards. I attributed Pact magic to goblinoids for the reasons that firstly they don't believe in gods but are practical enough to cut deals. Truenaming I also attributed to them because it is so similar to the bardic tradition.

Additionaly this tied into my divergence from the main on elemental binding. I thought it made more sense that the gnomes stole it from Dhakaan. When later sources came out going in a different direction I split hairs. Adventures led my players to believe that giant magic was on a different scale; able to manipulate, create, and destroy planes. Toying with planar denizens would have been beneath them and too small scale for them.

Shadow obviously fits the houses of shadow but I didn't dwell on it since I was assembling class blurbs for a Darguun central campaign. Its all getting refreshed as friends are starting to give hints that I should DM soon.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
korrick 10-15-07, 02:46 AM	I wanted to find a good place for binders (as in pact magic) in Eb. I thought that the religious sect of house Lyrandar might include Binders. As the elves have a form of ancestor worship, the half elves can have a variation on that theme. They are willing to venerate those that are not so "glorious" or for that matter, deathless. I rewrote the back stories for each vestige, using either giants, elves or humans. And, I'm having Binders based out of the Lyrandar lands in Valenar (remember, "ancestor worship"). Anyway, has the setting absorbed this class in some other way that I'm not aware of, or, does anyone have other ideas?
Alex_ 10-15-07, 08:03 PM	I think the concept of Pact Magic works very well with worhippers of the Dragon Below, Daelkyr, and other things trapped in Khyber. Usually, such beings are locked underground by the seals placed by the Gatekeeper Druids and others. Pact magic is just making another seal that bypasses that one, so you can draw on a vile being's power.
Edymnion 10-15-07, 08:31 PM	I would actually attribute pact magic to the goblinoid empire. You could use the names and everything pretty much as is, and play it up as being incredibly old. As in, it was an old art when the goblinoid empire was at it's height, and its virtually forgotten today. Only a very select few secret sects keep the ancient ways alive. On a related note, I make Truenaming into Dragon Magic (as in, what the Dragons taught the Giants). Thats also my explination for the Mourning, that someone basically unnamed Cyre. Basically, I try to make the Tome of Magic systems into very old systems. The PHB stuff is the way things are now for the vast majority of the setting, but if you know where to look, you can still find bits and pieces of the old ways still hanging on.
Yadot 10-16-07, 04:52 PM	I do the same thing as Edymnion with Truename magic, but in my campaign Pact Magic is a relic from Ancient Sarlona before the Inspired set up shop. Dantilion, Paimon, etc. come from one of the lost kingdoms there.
Rechan 10-17-07, 02:38 AM	I could see some of the pacts being Elven ancestors, sure, but there are a lot of other options. Vestiges may be what's left of truly epic individuals who passed on beyond Dolurrh and their spirit or energy or being are so strong that they still exist. They are legendary figures, not quite Gods but heroes of their time, and the collective belief and reputation and power they held has left them clinging to existence. Pacts could be a way to access Living Dreams in Dal Quor. Dal Quor is so distant from the Material that it is the equivalent of the Vestiges' locations. The Quori have managed to find a way through (possession), but dreams within Dal Quor given form can't pierce the fold. But the dreams of dragons or psionicists or whatever may have gained sentience, lived, and now want to contact the world beyond. Clerics of Eberron get magic from Faith, right? You believe ins oemthing strong enough, you can get magic from it. But if enough people believe in the same thing, that power should be a two-way street - their belief CREATES things. Gives that Idea a true form. And those true forms may be Vestiges. So Binders may be tapping into the personification or true nature of an Idea.
Arz 10-24-07, 12:05 PM	I would actually attribute pact magic to the goblinoid empire. You could use the names and everything pretty much as is, and play it up as being incredibly old. As in, it was an old art when the goblinoid empire was at it's height, and its virtually forgotten today. Only a very select few secret sects keep the ancient ways alive. On a related note, I make Truenaming into Dragon Magic (as in, what the Dragons taught the Giants). Thats also my explination for the Mourning, that someone basically unnamed Cyre. Basically, I try to make the Tome of Magic systems into very old systems. The PHB stuff is the way things are now for the vast majority of the setting, but if you know where to look, you can still find bits and pieces of the old ways still hanging on. Damn. All I can say when I see thoughts matching my own on the boards. I attributed Pact magic to goblinoids for the reasons that firstly they don't believe in gods but are practical enough to cut deals. Truenaming I also attributed to them because it is so similar to the bardic tradition. Additionaly this tied into my divergence from the main on elemental binding. I thought it made more sense that the gnomes stole it from Dhakaan. When later sources came out going in a different direction I split hairs. Adventures led my players to believe that giant magic was on a different scale; able to manipulate, create, and destroy planes. Toying with planar denizens would have been beneath them and too small scale for them. Shadow obviously fits the houses of shadow but I didn't dwell on it since I was assembling class blurbs for a Darguun central campaign. Its all getting refreshed as friends are starting to give hints that I should DM soon.