Cannith Artisan PrC (please comment!) [Archive] - Wizards Community

Cannith Artisan PrC (please comment!) [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Subtle Knife
03-08-07, 08:53 PM Cannith Artisan

While every Dragonmarked House produces its’ share of Artificers, none surpass House Cannith, both in numbers and skill. Not all artificers trained by House Cannith are as skilled as the Cannith Artisan; they are the prodigies of this field, those who learn to utilize and improve on their Dragonmark abilities. The Cannith Artisan represents the forefront of mystical experimentation and construction, able to emulate a variety of magical effects and create a breadth of different magical items.

Hit Die: d4

Requirements
To qualify to become a Cannith Artisan, a character must fulfill all of the following criteria.
Skills: Knowledge (Arcana) 8 ranks, Spellcraft 8 ranks, Use Magic Device 8 ranks
Feats: Least Dragonmark, Cannith Forgecraft
Infusions: Infuser caster level 5th

Class Skills
The Cannith Artisan's class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Appraise (Int), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Disable Device (Int), Knowledge (All, taken separately) (Int), Search (Int), Spellcraft (Int) and Use Magic Device (Cha).
Skill Points per Level: 4 + Int modifier.

Class Features
All of the following are class features of the Cannith Artisan.
Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Cannith Artisans gain no proficiency in any weapon or armor.

Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special Infusions
1st +0 +0 +0 +2 Heir’s Mark, Craft Reserve, Item creation
2nd +1 +0 +0 +3 Improved Least Dragonmark +1 level of existing infuser class
3rd +2 +1 +1 +3 Bonus Item Creation Feat +1 level of existing infuser class
4th +3 +1 +1 +4 Lesser Dragonmark +1 level of existing infuser class
5th +3 +1 +1 +4 Improved Lesser Dragonmark +1 level of existing infuser class
6th +4 +2 +2 +5 Skilled Crafter +1 level of existing infuser class
7th +5 +2 +2 +5 Bonus Item Creation Feat +1 level of existing infuser class
8th +6 +2 +2 +6 Greater Dragonmark +1 level of existing infuser class
9th +6 +3 +3 +6 Improved Greater Dragonmark +1 level of existing infuser class
10th +7 +3 +3 +7 Master Crafter +1 level of existing infuser class

Infusions: At second level and every level thereafter, a Cannith Artisan gains new infusions per day and infusions known as if he had also gained a level in the artificer class. He does not, however, gain any other benefit a character of that class would have gained.

Item Creation (Ex): For purposes of meeting item prerequisites, a house artificer adds his levels in this class to his levels in the artificer class.

Craft Reserve (Ex): When a Cannith Artisan gains a new class level, he also gains a new craft reserve as if he had also raised a level of the artificer class. To determine the amount of craft reserve the Cannith Artisan receives, add levels of Cannith Artisan to levels of artificer and consult the artificer craft reserve table.

Heir’s Mark: Odd-numbered levels in the Cannith Artisan prestige class count as levels in the dragonmark heir prestige class when determining the caster level for the spell-like abilities of your dragonmark. You can have a maximum of five effective levels in dragonmark heir for the purpose of determining the caster level of your dragonmark.

Improved Least Dragonmark: At 2nd level, the Cannith Artisan gains an additional daily use of his Least Dragonmark.

Bonus Item Creation Feat: At 3rd and 7th level, a Cannith Artisan gains a bonus item creation feat that he qualifies for.

Lesser Dragonmark: At 4th level a Cannith Artisan manifests the lesser dragonmark of his house. He gains the Lesser Dragonmark feat as a bonus feat without having to meet the prerequisites for it. If the Cannith Artisan already has the Lesser Dragonmark feat, he may instead use the powers of his lesser mark one additional time per day.

Improved Lesser Dragonmark: At 5th level, the Cannith Artisan gains an additional daily use of his Lesser Dragonmark.

Skilled Crafter - At 6th level, the Cannith Artisan is able to craft items more rapidly than others; he can craft up to 2000gp/day, rather than the standard 1000gp/day.

Greater Dragonmark: At 8th level a Cannith Artisan manifests the greater dragonmark of his house. He gains the Greater Dragonmark feat as a bonus feat without having to meet the prerequisites for it. If the Cannith Artisan already has the Greater Dragonmark feat, he may instead use the powers of his greater mark one additional time per day.

Improved Greater Dragonmark: At 9th level, the Cannith Artisan gains an additional daily use of his Greater Dragonmark

Master Crafter - At 10th level, the Cannith Artisan truly reaches the pinnacle of crafting; the magical effects created by items crafted by this individual have a +1 bonus to Caster Level and the DC of saving throws, if appropriate.
jonci
03-09-07, 03:24 AM For the most part, I think it is balanced in the fact that it takes 10 levels of this to equal 5 in just taking dragonmarked heir, just to preserve your Artificer levels.

However, I think the bonus dragonmark feats throw it off. They are already getting the Least, Lesser, Greater Dragonmark feats and improved versions, plus the item creation feats.

My suggestions, remove those bonus feats and keep the space empty. You shouldn't always gain something especially with the advantages this PrC would give. Also I think you should shift up the feats like this:

1st Heir’s Mark, Craft Reserve, Item creation
2nd Improved Least Dragonmark
3rd -
4th Lesser Dragonmark, Bonus Item Creation Feat
5th -
6th Improved Lesser Dragonmark
7th -
8th Greater Dragonmark, Bonus Item Creation Feat
9th -
10th Improved Greater Dragonmark

By the way, what is Heir's mark?
Kid SixXx
03-09-07, 06:52 AM I like this PrC quite a bit, but there's still the issue that nearly every PrC that is remotely artificer friendly seems to involve House Cannith. :weep:
Ayrmeth
03-09-07, 08:06 AM Looks good, but why the D4 hit dice? Also how about something that means they can craft magic items faster (there's a PrC somewhere that lets you do 2000gp/ day).
Subtle Knife
03-09-07, 02:19 PM Kid SixXx - Save-vs-DM has a pretty good non-house-specific artificer PrC (The House Artificer) that you might want to peek at! I just wanted something a bit different that that archetype!

Ayrmeth - I picked a d4 HD to balance out the bonus feats given.

Jonci - Personally, I prefer the staggered approach to allocating new abilities to prestige classes (and to base classes for that matter). It seems that the good people at Wizards are beginning to think thusly as well, with the new articles on "Dead Levels". Oh, and Heirs' Mark is a common class feature from Dragonmarked that allows the character to add his class level (up to five levels total) to the caster levels of his dragonmarked spell-like abilities, as if he/she had gained levels in Dragonmarked Heir. I'll add the full description shortly (small oversight on my part). PS – your last name isn’t McGinley, is it?

All this being said, perhaps the bonus Dargonmarked Feats are a bit much. I have had a few other ideas (below) that might be worthwhile; I might even be willing to replace some of the “Improved <X> Dragonmark” abilities with some of these, considering that you average artificer is not likely going to use Fabricate or Minor Creation more than a couple of times daily.... Alternately, we could replace some of the “Improved <X> Dragonmark” abilities with alternate Dragonmark feats! Let me know which of these abilities you think might be worthy!

I have also been considering changing the name to something more original – perhaps the Cannith Craftsman, or the Cannith Artisan? Give me ideas, folks!

SK

Crafter’s Eye - At X level, the Cannith Artificer is able to use his unique insight into magical matrices to better determine the nature of magical items he finds. He gains Identify as a spell-like ability, useable 3/day, with the standard casting time but no material component requirement.

Construct Competence – At X level, the Cannith Artificer has developed a special knowledge of Constructs; you gain a bonus on Knowledge (Arcana) equal to one-half your class level, and treat Constructs as a Favored Enemy (+2 bonus on Bluff, Listen, Sense Motive, Spot, and Survival checks when using these skills against creatures of this type).

Crafter Feat – At X level, the Cannith Artificer gains his choice of one of the following feats – Extraordinary Artisan, Legendary Artisan, or Exceptional Artisan.

Skilled Crafter - At X level, the Cannith Artificer is able to craft items more rapidly than others; he can craft up to 2000gp/day, rather than the standard 1000gp/day.

Master Crafter - At X level, the Cannith Artificer truly reaches the pinnacle of crafting; the magical effects created by items crafted by this individual have a +1 bonus to Caster Level and the DC of saving throws, if appropriate.

Mystic Loophole – At X level, you have learned enough of the magic generated by items that you can occasionally manipulate those effects to your benefit. You may expend one Action Point to effectively shield yourself (and anything you carry) from any magical effect created by a magic item (but not those created by spells or spell-like abilities).

Crafters’ Aura – At X level, you have learned how to deceive magical items with respect to special requirements for their use (ie racial, class, or alignment requirements). At any given time, the Cannith Artificer can automatically bypass a single special requirement, which can be changed at will as an immediate action. Bypassing further special requirements requires an appropriate Use Magical Device check.
Subtle Knife
03-10-07, 09:55 PM Basically, I'm not certain which of the above abilities are appropriate at what point in the PrC progression. Any thoughts?

SK
Subtle Knife
03-12-07, 04:28 PM I've made some solid edits to the development of the PrC. Any comments?
SK
jonci
03-12-07, 07:26 PM With the new changes, I like it. I'd stick with the Improved mark feats. If someone really wants the dragonmark feats from Dragonmarked book, they have their HD progression feats to use especially since an Artificer usually has enough bonus feats to cover any item creation stuff they want.
And no, that isn't my last name. But if you know another Jonci in the world, you are special. It is a rare name.
Ayrmeth
03-13-07, 02:22 PM Fair comment on the HD dude, was just wonderin' :D

I like the new and improved class, it's very :cool: but considering savevsDM's PrC guide I can't think of a reason why (unless my character couldn't meet the prerequisites) I wouldn't take it... Although I can't think of anything that could be dropped without spoiling the class...

All in though, if a player in my game asked to use the class I'd let them :) but with the proviso that it could be subject to play-testing review.

Good stuff mate :cool:
Subtle Knife
03-16-07, 03:12 PM Thank you muchly for the input!
SK

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Subtle Knife 03-08-07, 08:53 PM	Cannith Artisan While every Dragonmarked House produces its’ share of Artificers, none surpass House Cannith, both in numbers and skill. Not all artificers trained by House Cannith are as skilled as the Cannith Artisan; they are the prodigies of this field, those who learn to utilize and improve on their Dragonmark abilities. The Cannith Artisan represents the forefront of mystical experimentation and construction, able to emulate a variety of magical effects and create a breadth of different magical items. Hit Die: d4 Requirements To qualify to become a Cannith Artisan, a character must fulfill all of the following criteria. Skills: Knowledge (Arcana) 8 ranks, Spellcraft 8 ranks, Use Magic Device 8 ranks Feats: Least Dragonmark, Cannith Forgecraft Infusions: Infuser caster level 5th Class Skills The Cannith Artisan's class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Appraise (Int), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Disable Device (Int), Knowledge (All, taken separately) (Int), Search (Int), Spellcraft (Int) and Use Magic Device (Cha). Skill Points per Level: 4 + Int modifier. Class Features All of the following are class features of the Cannith Artisan. Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Cannith Artisans gain no proficiency in any weapon or armor. Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special Infusions 1st +0 +0 +0 +2 Heir’s Mark, Craft Reserve, Item creation 2nd +1 +0 +0 +3 Improved Least Dragonmark +1 level of existing infuser class 3rd +2 +1 +1 +3 Bonus Item Creation Feat +1 level of existing infuser class 4th +3 +1 +1 +4 Lesser Dragonmark +1 level of existing infuser class 5th +3 +1 +1 +4 Improved Lesser Dragonmark +1 level of existing infuser class 6th +4 +2 +2 +5 Skilled Crafter +1 level of existing infuser class 7th +5 +2 +2 +5 Bonus Item Creation Feat +1 level of existing infuser class 8th +6 +2 +2 +6 Greater Dragonmark +1 level of existing infuser class 9th +6 +3 +3 +6 Improved Greater Dragonmark +1 level of existing infuser class 10th +7 +3 +3 +7 Master Crafter +1 level of existing infuser class Infusions: At second level and every level thereafter, a Cannith Artisan gains new infusions per day and infusions known as if he had also gained a level in the artificer class. He does not, however, gain any other benefit a character of that class would have gained. Item Creation (Ex): For purposes of meeting item prerequisites, a house artificer adds his levels in this class to his levels in the artificer class. Craft Reserve (Ex): When a Cannith Artisan gains a new class level, he also gains a new craft reserve as if he had also raised a level of the artificer class. To determine the amount of craft reserve the Cannith Artisan receives, add levels of Cannith Artisan to levels of artificer and consult the artificer craft reserve table. Heir’s Mark: Odd-numbered levels in the Cannith Artisan prestige class count as levels in the dragonmark heir prestige class when determining the caster level for the spell-like abilities of your dragonmark. You can have a maximum of five effective levels in dragonmark heir for the purpose of determining the caster level of your dragonmark. Improved Least Dragonmark: At 2nd level, the Cannith Artisan gains an additional daily use of his Least Dragonmark. Bonus Item Creation Feat: At 3rd and 7th level, a Cannith Artisan gains a bonus item creation feat that he qualifies for. Lesser Dragonmark: At 4th level a Cannith Artisan manifests the lesser dragonmark of his house. He gains the Lesser Dragonmark feat as a bonus feat without having to meet the prerequisites for it. If the Cannith Artisan already has the Lesser Dragonmark feat, he may instead use the powers of his lesser mark one additional time per day. Improved Lesser Dragonmark: At 5th level, the Cannith Artisan gains an additional daily use of his Lesser Dragonmark. Skilled Crafter - At 6th level, the Cannith Artisan is able to craft items more rapidly than others; he can craft up to 2000gp/day, rather than the standard 1000gp/day. Greater Dragonmark: At 8th level a Cannith Artisan manifests the greater dragonmark of his house. He gains the Greater Dragonmark feat as a bonus feat without having to meet the prerequisites for it. If the Cannith Artisan already has the Greater Dragonmark feat, he may instead use the powers of his greater mark one additional time per day. Improved Greater Dragonmark: At 9th level, the Cannith Artisan gains an additional daily use of his Greater Dragonmark Master Crafter - At 10th level, the Cannith Artisan truly reaches the pinnacle of crafting; the magical effects created by items crafted by this individual have a +1 bonus to Caster Level and the DC of saving throws, if appropriate.
jonci 03-09-07, 03:24 AM	For the most part, I think it is balanced in the fact that it takes 10 levels of this to equal 5 in just taking dragonmarked heir, just to preserve your Artificer levels. However, I think the bonus dragonmark feats throw it off. They are already getting the Least, Lesser, Greater Dragonmark feats and improved versions, plus the item creation feats. My suggestions, remove those bonus feats and keep the space empty. You shouldn't always gain something especially with the advantages this PrC would give. Also I think you should shift up the feats like this: 1st Heir’s Mark, Craft Reserve, Item creation 2nd Improved Least Dragonmark 3rd - 4th Lesser Dragonmark, Bonus Item Creation Feat 5th - 6th Improved Lesser Dragonmark 7th - 8th Greater Dragonmark, Bonus Item Creation Feat 9th - 10th Improved Greater Dragonmark By the way, what is Heir's mark?
Kid SixXx 03-09-07, 06:52 AM	I like this PrC quite a bit, but there's still the issue that nearly every PrC that is remotely artificer friendly seems to involve House Cannith. :weep:
Ayrmeth 03-09-07, 08:06 AM	Looks good, but why the D4 hit dice? Also how about something that means they can craft magic items faster (there's a PrC somewhere that lets you do 2000gp/ day).
Subtle Knife 03-09-07, 02:19 PM	Kid SixXx - Save-vs-DM has a pretty good non-house-specific artificer PrC (The House Artificer) that you might want to peek at! I just wanted something a bit different that that archetype! Ayrmeth - I picked a d4 HD to balance out the bonus feats given. Jonci - Personally, I prefer the staggered approach to allocating new abilities to prestige classes (and to base classes for that matter). It seems that the good people at Wizards are beginning to think thusly as well, with the new articles on "Dead Levels". Oh, and Heirs' Mark is a common class feature from Dragonmarked that allows the character to add his class level (up to five levels total) to the caster levels of his dragonmarked spell-like abilities, as if he/she had gained levels in Dragonmarked Heir. I'll add the full description shortly (small oversight on my part). PS – your last name isn’t McGinley, is it? All this being said, perhaps the bonus Dargonmarked Feats are a bit much. I have had a few other ideas (below) that might be worthwhile; I might even be willing to replace some of the “Improved <X> Dragonmark” abilities with some of these, considering that you average artificer is not likely going to use Fabricate or Minor Creation more than a couple of times daily.... Alternately, we could replace some of the “Improved <X> Dragonmark” abilities with alternate Dragonmark feats! Let me know which of these abilities you think might be worthy! I have also been considering changing the name to something more original – perhaps the Cannith Craftsman, or the Cannith Artisan? Give me ideas, folks! SK Crafter’s Eye - At X level, the Cannith Artificer is able to use his unique insight into magical matrices to better determine the nature of magical items he finds. He gains Identify as a spell-like ability, useable 3/day, with the standard casting time but no material component requirement. Construct Competence – At X level, the Cannith Artificer has developed a special knowledge of Constructs; you gain a bonus on Knowledge (Arcana) equal to one-half your class level, and treat Constructs as a Favored Enemy (+2 bonus on Bluff, Listen, Sense Motive, Spot, and Survival checks when using these skills against creatures of this type). Crafter Feat – At X level, the Cannith Artificer gains his choice of one of the following feats – Extraordinary Artisan, Legendary Artisan, or Exceptional Artisan. Skilled Crafter - At X level, the Cannith Artificer is able to craft items more rapidly than others; he can craft up to 2000gp/day, rather than the standard 1000gp/day. Master Crafter - At X level, the Cannith Artificer truly reaches the pinnacle of crafting; the magical effects created by items crafted by this individual have a +1 bonus to Caster Level and the DC of saving throws, if appropriate. Mystic Loophole – At X level, you have learned enough of the magic generated by items that you can occasionally manipulate those effects to your benefit. You may expend one Action Point to effectively shield yourself (and anything you carry) from any magical effect created by a magic item (but not those created by spells or spell-like abilities). Crafters’ Aura – At X level, you have learned how to deceive magical items with respect to special requirements for their use (ie racial, class, or alignment requirements). At any given time, the Cannith Artificer can automatically bypass a single special requirement, which can be changed at will as an immediate action. Bypassing further special requirements requires an appropriate Use Magical Device check.
Subtle Knife 03-10-07, 09:55 PM	Basically, I'm not certain which of the above abilities are appropriate at what point in the PrC progression. Any thoughts? SK
Subtle Knife 03-12-07, 04:28 PM	I've made some solid edits to the development of the PrC. Any comments? SK
jonci 03-12-07, 07:26 PM	With the new changes, I like it. I'd stick with the Improved mark feats. If someone really wants the dragonmark feats from Dragonmarked book, they have their HD progression feats to use especially since an Artificer usually has enough bonus feats to cover any item creation stuff they want. And no, that isn't my last name. But if you know another Jonci in the world, you are special. It is a rare name.
Ayrmeth 03-13-07, 02:22 PM	Fair comment on the HD dude, was just wonderin' :D I like the new and improved class, it's very :cool: but considering savevsDM's PrC guide I can't think of a reason why (unless my character couldn't meet the prerequisites) I wouldn't take it... Although I can't think of anything that could be dropped without spoiling the class... All in though, if a player in my game asked to use the class I'd let them :) but with the proviso that it could be subject to play-testing review. Good stuff mate :cool:
Subtle Knife 03-16-07, 03:12 PM	Thank you muchly for the input! SK