Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Grummush_Rogue 03-01-07, 09:29 PM	Why shouldn't a Channgling be able to manifest a mark? it is half human, and dopplegangers are a pretty linked to destiny. just because they dont always have the same skin means what? i mean, the mark would always stick to the skin, even with a new shape maybe the mark stays on. inconvinent, be thats iner workings Wizards should have worked out. why cant this be?!
Ricohard_Draconis 03-01-07, 09:32 PM	because its not just blood that matters with dragonmarks its magic a mystical connection to the true power of the prophecy. (also the dragonmarks are designed to make the core races more attractive against the new races)
Metamagick 03-01-07, 10:11 PM	Giving a changeling a dragon wouldnt upset the balance of the game. My DM allows changelings to have them but they can make the mark "go away" but when they do it cant use the magic. He also says you have to have a REALLY REALLY REALLY good backstory on why you have it. :)
Bluebrush 03-01-07, 10:14 PM	Giving a changeling a dragon wouldnt upset the balance of the game. My DM allows changelings to have them but they can make the mark "go away" but when they do it cant use the magic.It came up on the AKB thread that the power of your mark comes from within, not the external symbol. Meaning if you get the limb with your mark hacked off you can still use your powers. I'm not sure if it's canon though. He also says you have to have a REALLY REALLY REALLY good backstory on why you have it. :)Oh that's easy. Died, reincarnated, exoriated.
Metamagick 03-02-07, 12:30 PM	It came up on the AKB thread that the power of your mark comes from within, not the external symbol. Meaning if you get the limb with your mark hacked off you can still use your powers. I'm not sure if it's canon though. Oh that's easy. Died, reincarnated, exoriated. True, but he says that if you change your shape and hide your dragonmark it blocks it (Like your "new skin" is a shield). He is a english teacher who teaches AP Creative Writting, so one must have a really REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY good story. No stories about an elf scion who got drunked had got pregnant with a changeling :-P
Cifer 03-02-07, 01:21 PM	it is half human You just answered your own question. There is exactly one mark that exists on humans and one specific kind of demihumans (plus a rather strange being named Vol, but we don't know about her mark or whether dragons are a specific exception from the draconic prophecy). Humans can't get the mark of storm although Lyrandar consists of demi-humans. Half-elves don't get the mark of shadow although Phiarlan consists of elves. and dopplegangers are a pretty linked to destiny So are dragons, giants, daelkyr and quori. And this means...?
Metamagick 03-02-07, 02:10 PM	So are dragons, giants, daelkyr and quori. And this means...? I think when Cifer means "destiny" he means Races of Destiny that contains races that are linked to humans in some way or another.
TenEyedMan 03-02-07, 02:48 PM	(also the dragonmarks are designed to make the core races more attractive against the new races) Seconded. If you want to change stuff around in your campaign, that's the purview of your group, but I'm sure that this is Keith's and WOTC's reasoning. Whether you and your friends care about that reasoning is a separate matter.
Vharuck 03-02-07, 04:13 PM	Dragonmarks are magical phenomenon that, after centuries, even the dragons have not been able to discern the workings or possible meanings. No offense, but I think we can safely say that any twisted logic we want to use to get what we want doesn't always fly.
Loki5654 03-02-07, 04:52 PM	Why shouldn't a Channgling be able to manifest a mark? Because Changelings cannot meet the prerequisites for the feats. Its that simple. No need to use fluff. Its a crunch question with a crunch answer. For example: One of the prereq's for the Least Mark of Making is "Race: Human". Look at the character sheet. If the entry under "race" says anything except "Human" you cannot take the feat! Someone else can give the Racial Emulation argument now.
Zombomaniac 03-02-07, 06:49 PM	double post
Zombomaniac 03-02-07, 06:57 PM	Because Changelings cannot meet the prerequisites for the feats. Its that simple. No need to use fluff. Its a crunch question with a crunch answer. For example: One of the prereq's for the Least Mark of Making is "Race: Human". Look at the character sheet. If the entry under "race" says anything except "Human" you cannot take the feat! Someone else can give the Racial Emulation argument now. Obviously we aren't talking about rules here Loki, we are talking about plot, opinions, and house rules. So why don't we move onto a intelegent answer instead of "The rules say NO!":) @everyone else One way we could look at it (and this isn't a very deep answer) is that the Changlings simply weren't choosen as one of the "blessed races." There aren't really any real plot reasons why another race couldn't have a Mark. Heck it could create a amazing story. Marks start appearing on races that they never appeared on before. This would send all the Houses and the Chamber into a frenzy to understand how and why this is happening. On a one Changling basis the reasons could be a lot more specific. Like this Changling's bloodline has had constant exposure to Dragon Mark breeding, powers, etc and they have delt with a lot of Sibrys shards. Over time the Marks started showing up.
Loki5654 03-02-07, 07:27 PM	Obviously we aren't talking about rules here Loki, we are talking about plot, opinions, and house rules. So why don't we move onto a intelegent answer instead of "The rules say NO!":) 'Scuse me for employing Occam's Razor. Sheesh. The OP never explicitly stated they only wanted fluff answers. If you want to journey off into the far realms of House Rules, then anything is possible and nothing has to have a reason. If you are going to ignore the firm base of (as you put it, not me) "The rules say NO!" then all bets are off. You might as well tell him that "Changelings can't have Dragonmarks because faeries fart to much. Their farts pollute the atmosphere and prevent changeling evolution. Kill more faeries and you can have a d'mark." You may think your answers are more "intelegent" (sic) (intelligent, inelegant?), but without being based on the RAW, then they mean the same as "'Cuz we said so. Nyeah."
Metamagick 03-02-07, 07:52 PM	Obviously we aren't talking about rules here Loki, we are talking about plot, opinions, and house rules. So why don't we move onto a intelegent answer instead of "The rules say NO!":) @everyone else One way we could look at it (and this isn't a very deep answer) is that the Changlings simply weren't choosen as one of the "blessed races." There aren't really any real plot reasons why another race couldn't have a Mark. Heck it could create a amazing story. Marks start appearing on races that they never appeared on before. This would send all the Houses and the Chamber into a frenzy to understand how and why this is happening. On a one Changling basis the reasons could be a lot more specific. Like this Changling's bloodline has had constant exposure to Dragon Mark breeding, powers, etc and they have delt with a lot of Sibrys shards. Over time the Marks started showing up. You talk about the "blessed" race. Changelings are the ultimate adapters and "blenders". I think that changeling's bodies are so "mutable" that they can take on Dragonmarks. And because we dont know alot about the Dragon Prophecy *sp* it might make sense. Just me though!
Zombomaniac 03-02-07, 08:20 PM	'Scuse me for employing Occam's Razor. Sheesh. Loki this is the 4th or 5th time I have seen you post and every time you shoot down what others say for no good reason. So excuse me for not liking your style, but this thread isn't designed for us to flame each other so lets stay on topic. The OP never explicitly stated they only wanted fluff answers. But it did say they wanted ways on how they could or couldn't use Marks and I am pretty sure that if they are smart enough to think about the whole "new skin" thing and how it would be inconvenient for spies to have identifying marks then they are smart enough to read the requirements for the feat. "Changelings can't have Dragonmarks because faeries fart too much. Maybe I could tell him that, but Good House Rules normally make sence. So I am pretty sure that "faeries fart to much" doesn't make the cut. You make think your answers are more "intelegent" <snip> If we are going to be friendly enough to correct each other I will have to say that "You make think..." is improper grammar. You want to say "You may think..." Also it isn't "faeries fart to much" it's "faeries fart too much." Now if you don’t want to think of answers as intelligent vs. not intelligent then perhaps we should look at answers as constructive vs. not constructive. Have your answers contributed to the advancement of the topic? No.
Zombomaniac 03-02-07, 08:21 PM	You talk about the "blessed" race. Changelings are the ultimate adapters and "blenders". I think that changeling's bodies are so "mutable" that they can take on Dragonmarks. And because we dont know alot about the Dragon Prophecy *sp* it might make sense. Just me though! Actually “blessed race” is something I got from the book Marked for Death. A young Elf girl asked why Shifters don’t have Marks. A Pali of the Flame said it was because they weren’t of the “blessed races.” Personally I wish there was a published way for other races to get a Mark. It wouldn’t be an easy thing to do of course, but I would love to see that.
johnkretzer 03-02-07, 11:11 PM	because its not just blood that matters with dragonmarks its magic a mystical connection to the true power of the prophecy. (also the dragonmarks are designed to make the core races more attractive against the new races) If they is a true power of the 'prophecy'. Sorry it is just a proveable as any other religion in Eberron. Yet people talk like it is gospel.... To the OP: The same reason Shifters and Kalashtar can't get them....though they are part human. Maybe even the warforged too. These races are too young and new to the world. Atleast that is what I tell my players when asked :) Though I agree it is to give the orginal races a new thing in response to these young upstarts.
Loki5654 03-03-07, 02:42 AM	Loki this is the 4th or 5th time I have seen you post and every time you shoot down what others say for no good reason. So excuse me for not liking your style, but this thread isn't designed for us to flame each other so lets stay on topic. If you think I am flaming someone, report me. Answering someone's question with firm rules isn't flaming, no matter how much you don't like the answer. If you don't like my answer (or the way I phrase it), feel free to dispute it using the only common frame of reference we have: the Rules As Written. Another option would be to ignore me. But it did say they wanted ways on how they could or couldn't use Marks and I am pretty sure that if they are smart enough to think about the whole "new skin" thing and how it would be inconvenient for spies to have identifying marks then they are smart enough to read the requirements for the feat. You shouldn't make assumptions about what someone is or isn't smart enough to do. As I've said before, the only common frame of reference we have is the RAW. Once we step away from that, we venture into the nebulous world of house rules. Anyone can house rule anything they want. I gave the answer supported by the rules. That's all. Maybe I could tell him that, but Good House Rules normally make sence. So I am pretty sure that "faeries fart to much" doesn't make the cut. Yes, I was using an absurd example to prove my point. House rules don't need to make sense. What makes sense to one person might not make sense to anyone else. That is why house rules are pointless to discuss. If we are going to be friendly enough to correct each other I will have to say that "You make think..." is improper grammar. You want to say "You may think..." Also it isn't "faeries fart to much" it's "faeries fart too much." Yes, touche. I mentioned the word because I was honestly confused as to whether you meant intelligent or inelegant. Now, would you like to continue our discussion, or would you rather pick apart grammar? Now if you don’t want to think of answers as intelligent vs. not intelligent then perhaps we should look at answers as constructive vs. not constructive. Have your answers contributed to the advancement of the topic? No. That's your opinion. I, personally, find it highly constructive and contributive to cut through needless discussions of fluff and house rules with a clear point based on the rules. The OP was asking why Changelings don't manifest D'marks. There are only two answers: 1) The rules clearly state you can't. or 2) Anyone can change the RAW by making a house rule. The justification of the house rule is irrelevant as long as your DM OKs it. The fluff reasons Changelings don't have D'marks are unclear at best. Yes, it could have something to do with the Prophecy (unsubstantiated). It could also have something to do with the length of time the race has existed. It could also be a joint plot devised by the Dreaming Dark and the Lords of Dust to disrupt the race's natural evolution for sinister reasons. Could be the phases of the moons. Could be sunspots. Could be faerie farts. I could go on and on. Fortunately, there is only one answer to the question that is 100% accurate: the rules say no.
Gevuri 03-03-07, 03:44 AM	OK, so, here is my HO; I'm personally biased toward the idea that the changeling race cannot manifest dragonmark's. Why? Well, I suppose a few reasons. One of the main reasons being that the Campaign Setting kinda sorta says so by NOT detailing a changeling d'mark. Oh. And the CS is riddled with the idea of the number 12, and a possible 13 (see entries on the moons and obviously the Dragonmarks) However, I agree that one should be able to do this very thing which I believe to be a bad idea. Because of the Rules As Written. If I'm not mistaken, somewhere there is the rule (quite possibly not really explicit) that the DM my change the rules as seen fit. So technically, by RAW, yes, you could have a changeling manifest a d'mark, because, as a DM (if you are? ... I forget if you mentioned that or not) the rules say that you may change them. But should you? Its definitely possible. But, so is the fact that fearie gas can do bad things to the environment and all subsequent life existing within the environment mentioned above.
Metamagick 03-03-07, 11:07 AM	People are saying that Shifters and Kalashtars cant manifest dragonmarks because they are so new the world. Yes they are but changelings have mutable DNA; they are the ulitmate shape shifters. I say yes to changelings having dragonmarks. :::Metamagick:::
Zombomaniac 03-03-07, 12:54 PM	People are saying that Shifters and Kalashtars cant manifest dragonmarks because they are so new the world. Yes they are but changelings have mutable DNA; they are the ulitmate shape shifters. I say yes to changelings having dragonmarks. :::Metamagick::: As far as Kalashtars in SoS it says that Sarlona (if I remeber right) is more or less a blind spot in the Draconic Prophesy. No one on Sarlona has a Mark. If they weren't born on Sarlona they could but anyone born on Sarlona will never have a Mark. Also the Chamber basicly refuses to talk about Sarlona. If the Kalashtar(s) wheren't born on Sarlona then all bets are off as for why they can or can't have a Mark. Though you would have to consider that mabye the races of Sarlona are also mild blind spots.
Witchcraft 03-04-07, 12:19 PM	People are saying that changelings can/cant develope *sp?* dragonmarks. But how many families would allow such a union? That is tainting the blood. I would think MAYBE the Shadow Marked houses would like it because it would give them better spies but still...... Changelings should beable to have Aberrant Dragonmarks . I also think AD need to be given a better denotation. Witcho Crafto
Cifer 03-04-07, 02:12 PM	Yes they are but changelings have mutable DNA Do they? That's funny - I've never read the word in any of my books. Care to enlighten me where it says that? And would you also please point out why humans and elves, two seperate races, can have offspring capable of reproducing? Bringing science into D&D, a world which is most probably not even based on our laws of nature, is generally a bad way to prove anything.
Shady314 03-04-07, 04:42 PM	People are saying that Shifters and Kalashtars cant manifest dragonmarks because they are so new the world. They are? That''s pretty dumb since Shifters have been around for a long time as SoS just showed. Shifters and changelings and kalashtar don't have dragonmarks because they only appear on the races/families that have dragonmarks. Thus the feat requirements that changelings can't fulfill. Yes they are but changelings have mutable DNA; Assuming that is true. What does that have to do with dragonmarks? Unless you're saying a Changeling could make himself the perfect copy of a DM character and thus take the DM feat? That's a possible argument but they don't have such great/fine control of their shapechange. MAYBE if you take racial emulation but if you ever shapechange into something that doesn't meet the requirements for the feat you'll lose it. they are the ulitmate shape shifters. :confused: :rolleyes: :rofl: Because they get a +10 to disguise? The ultimate shapeshifters are dopperlgangers. Changelings are weak bastardized doppelgangers. Of course I still have to ask what shapeshifting has to do with dragonmarks? Doppelgangers ARE the ultimate shapeshifters and THEY can't have dragonmarks so why would changelings? I say yes to changelings having dragonmarks. Well that's great but do you have a single good reason why? The ECS makes it clear only the specific race each dragonmark manifests on can manifest that mark. Changelings are not one of those races. Thus they do not even qualify for aberrant marks. This is why there are rules on how a changeling can fake having one. If you want to change it then were just talking a dumb houserule and why talk any further?
Kinger 03-04-07, 04:43 PM	Do they? That's funny - I've never read the word in any of my books. Care to enlighten me where it says that? And would you also please point out why humans and elves, two seperate races, can have offspring capable of reproducing? Bringing science into D&D, a world which is most probably not even based on our laws of nature, is generally a bad way to prove anything. I'm going to have to agree with that. There's really no mention that I'm aware of of Changelings actually being anything other than Changelings. A Changeling disguised as an Aasimar (note the word "disguise") is still a Changeling: a Humanoid, not an Outsider. My point, for clarity's sake, is this: Changelings are Changelings, regardless of what they look like, and Changelings do not manifest dragonmarks. The reason for this, game-mechanics-wise, has been stated many times above (ie: don't meet the prereq's). Fluff-wise? That's never been nailed down. That's been left up to the DM, as far as I know.
Magicianguy131 03-04-07, 05:36 PM	They are? That''s pretty dumb since Shifters have been around for a long time as SoS just showed. Shifters and changelings and kalashtar don't have dragonmarks because they only appear on the races/families that have dragonmarks. Thus the feat requirements that changelings can't fulfill. Assuming that is true. What does that have to do with dragonmarks? Unless you're saying a Changeling could make himself the perfect copy of a DM character and thus take the DM feat? That's a possible argument but they don't have such great/fine control of their shapechange. MAYBE if you take racial emulation but if you ever shapechange into something that doesn't meet the requirements for the feat you'll lose it. :confused: :rolleyes: :rofl: Because they get a +10 to disguise? The ultimate shapeshifters are dopperlgangers. Changelings are weak bastardized doppelgangers. Of course I still have to ask what shapeshifting has to do with dragonmarks? Doppelgangers ARE the ultimate shapeshifters and THEY can't have dragonmarks so why would changelings? Well that's great but do you have a single good reason why? The ECS makes it clear only the specific race each dragonmark manifests on can manifest that mark. Changelings are not one of those races. Thus they do not even qualify for aberrant marks. This is why there are rules on how a changeling can fake having one. If you want to change it then were just talking a dumb houserule and why talk any further? Geez people are being mean on this board! I kinda understand what Meta is trying to say. Changelings have DNA that can bend and shape (because their white hair gene can become a black hair gene). Which translates to: Taking DNA from a Dragonmarked Father and the mutable DNA of a changeling mother=a changeling who can control weather. He isnt saying that changelings, who have no ties to any dragonmarked house, can develope one. The changeling has to have be tied to the dragonmarked house by blood someway or another. Also, saying that the ECS clearly says no (because of the feat) isnt a very good reason againist because peopel change feats all the time. The books are guidelines and the DM and the players can shape and change it as they want..kinda like a changelings. Allowing Changelings to have dragonmarks wouldnt unbalance the game at all. It might even make a good plot. A changeling gives birth to a child who has a Mark of the Storm. They would trace it back to a heir of the Mark of Storm falling in love with a changeling. Now the House is after the baby!!!!! :_:Magicianguy131:_:
Kinger 03-04-07, 06:56 PM	Changelings have DNA that can bend and shape (because their white hair gene can become a black hair gene). Which translates to: Taking DNA from a Dragonmarked Father and the mutable DNA of a changeling mother=a changeling who can control weather. He isnt saying that changelings, who have no ties to any dragonmarked house, can develope one. The changeling has to have be tied to the dragonmarked house by blood someway or another. Sorry, sorry, no, gotta stop there. Changelings have DNA that can bend and shape? Where exactly are you getting this information? I challenge you to find, ANYWHERE, a reference specifically to this "DNA" any where in the WotC documentation regarding Changelings. Find it anywhere in D&D, even. Are you saying a Wizard that casts Polymorph gets Frog DNA and loses his elf DNA? A wildshaped Druid gets Dire Boar DNA instead of Shifter DNA? They actually BECOME those creatures with regards to physical statistics like ability scores, movement, traits, etc. A Doppelganger does the same. A Changeling? He just makes himself LOOK different. That's it. Those claws won't work, those eyes won't see in the dark, and he won't get that bonus to swim for having a Lizardfolk's webbed fingers. It is, for all intents and purposes, a cosmetic change. Nothing more. Going back to DNA, there's little evidence shown in D&D that "genetics" and "DNA" and all that stuff actually even WORKS like it does in reality. Case in point: Half-Dragons. Dragon (reptilian?) gets freaky with a Horse (mammalian) and produces some noble, scaled, equine, fire-breathing thingy. In reality, different species of lizard can't even inter-breed, let alone crossing to another kingdom of animal. DNA just doesn't work that way. Also, saying that the ECS clearly says no (because of the feat) isnt a very good reason againist because peopel change feats all the time. The books are guidelines and the DM and the players can shape and change it as they want..kinda like a changelings. The original post asked for a reason why Changelings cannot manifest dragonmarks. The only answer out there that matters is because they do not fulfill the prereq's. Question answered. All other answers (Not in the Prophecy, not chosen by the gods, they didn't grind enough Rat Swarms in the Cogs, whatever) are fluff justifications for that rule. You want to change that rule? Please do! Far be it from me to say you can and can't do what you want with your game. Allowing Changelings to have dragonmarks wouldnt unbalance the game at all. It might even make a good plot. A changeling gives birth to a child who has a Mark of the Storm. They would trace it back to a heir of the Mark of Storm falling in love with a changeling. Now the House is after the baby!!!!!:_:Magicianguy131:_: It wouldn't unbalance the game, mechanically, at all, I agree. Neither would allowing a Changeling to access ANY of the dragonmarks. Nor would it be unbalanced to allow Goblins to access all the dragonmarks, either. But if you were to allow Changelings to have dragonmarks, even just the Human ones, all the published documentation regarding Dragonmarks, the Houses, etc. would need changing. Then you should answer the question of why Half-Orcs can't get the Mark of Making, but they can the Mark of Finding, or why Half-Elves can't get the Mark of Handling or Shadow, but they can the Mark of Storm. You could change those too. Then there would be more questions, and more inconsistencies to remedy. If you're willing to remedy those inconsistencies, go for it, and enjoy your game. Otherwise, maybe reconsider. And please, simply disagreeing with you does not make a person mean. Neither does explaining the reasoning behind their disagreement. Admitedly, refering to your idea as a "dumb houserule" (as has been done, unfortunately) might cross the line.
Sivis 03-04-07, 09:47 PM	Why are we arguing about something that we have no control of! If Witchcraft wants changelings to have Dragonmarks she can, if Kinger doesnt then thats his/her choice. I think if a changeling developes a dragonmark of making because her father has one is intresting. It might make a twist in the game. Dungeons and Dragons is a game and the if we abide by the RAW everyone would do the same things. House rules make the game ones own, and if you think it is a "dumb rule" then thats fine. But if that DM and his group likes it then what is that do you to stop their fun? DnD is about having fun, not seeing whose right. Lets just love each other and our house rules! ^^Sivis^^
Zombomaniac 03-04-07, 11:34 PM	My response to the last few post? We all ready now why Changlings can't get the Mark as far as RAW is conserned! RAW has already been mentioned by serveral people. Please read all the posts before you start posting. So now that we all know that everyone knows that can we venture into other reasons why they can't or can? Now I warn you in advance these reasons wont be RAW reasons, they will be fluff reasons. So please can we move on?
Shady314 03-05-07, 04:04 AM	My response to the last few post? We all ready now why Changlings can't get the Mark as far as RAW is conserned! RAW has already been mentioned by serveral people. Please read all the posts before you start posting. So now that we all know that everyone knows that can we venture into other reasons why they can't or can? Now I warn you in advance these reasons wont be RAW reasons, they will be fluff reasons. So please can we move on? That's fantastic. Of course I think most people were talking to Gruumsh and I was talking to Meta. Since you are neither of those people you can stop telling me what they do or do not already know. What's funny is the RAW is the Fluff reason. All we know is the Dragons consider the marks to play a part in prophecy and seem to be tied to Eberron shards. Changelings meet both those requirements if they live on Khorvaire. And for some strange reason left up to the DM certain marks only appear on certain families of certain races thus excluding anyone not a member of that group from taking the DM. Now since you've apparently decided to hijack the thread from Gruumsh and embark on a discussion of whatever craziness we can conjure up to justify changelings getting or not getting a mark I'll say my crazy personal reason would be that... no one knows why but changelings can't have a DM. I as the all seeing DM don't even know why. I don't need to come up with concrete answers for every single thing in Eberron. Some things just work the way they work. Why does a fireball spell do what it does? or magic in general? I don't know for sure and I wouldn't even want to think up a reason either. I'll take the mystery.
Paranoia833 03-05-07, 12:25 PM	I'm repeating much of what's gone before but yes, fluff wise, Changelings can't take a dragonmark just because. Why? No one knows, but their closeness to humanity likely has nothing to do with it given that neither Dragonmarks nor D&D as a whole obey rules consistent with our real-world understanding of genetics. Dragonmarks are not a genetic phenominon but rather an act of magic. Of course since the 'laws' of dragonmarks are currently beyond human understanding and don't always follow the rules set for them in earlier supplements (further development of Aberrant marks has specifically contradicted the rules posted in the ECS, though that was very obviously forshadowed) so there's nothing to stop a DM from saying that, in the interests of story, a changeling cannot one day just suddenly manifest a mark. Personally, I think a changeling with a dragonmark could make for a potentially interesting game. Of course, said changeling would likely be the only changeling with a dragonmark, and thus the Twelve would probably be very interested in said changeling to the point of trying to kidnap him/her for a life of being a glorified guinea pig. Fun times.
sooperspook 03-05-07, 11:17 PM	As a DM I don't think there is much justification as to why a changeling would get a dragonmark. Only very specific people from very specific family lines get dragonmarks. Not every human has the chance to get the Mark of Making. Only those who have familial ties (no matter how distant) to House Cannith can get that mark. The only mark that could even remotely be considered , afaik, is an Aberrant mark. Even then I would have to say this particular changeling would be unique. Every house would be after him. So would the dragons. So would Vol probably. The reason , maybe exposure to the mournlands, extensive contact with high areas of magic or the will of the gods. Who knows?
heavygearkiller2005 03-06-07, 08:32 PM	to help to stop this disbute think about this. rule zero
Arcane_Mark 03-26-07, 11:35 PM	My DM allows changelings to have dragonmarks. Of cource, they have to be related to the dmarked house. The House of Phi. has a good amount of them, Medani has some a few, and the Orien has a fair amount. We had a mish were we had to kill a Vadalis's women who was going to give birth to a changeling (we were evil). Sivis and Cannith have NO changelings. The house watches very careful on who the changelings marry and "breed" with. They dont want the entire over being taken over by changelings. Of cource these are just "rumors" in Eberron, most changelings in a dmakred house take on a "passer" type and are forbidden to change shape, unless in an emergency. Of course, in the elven houses/Medani allow them to change shape if they are on duty. The changelings HAVE to have Racial Emulation as a feat to get a dmark. My DM likes to roleplay and he thinks it would make a good "inner struggle". Example (An orien girl talking to her mom): Mommy, the world says that only humans can have the Mark of Passage. But my left arm has one! But I am a changeling; Jok doesnt even have one and he is my older HUMAN brother. I can teleport just like the rest of our family but the world says that changelings cant. I am so confused. Why mom, why? Well...I just dont know, Sama. The history say you cant but you can. Just remember, you can never leave the form you have chosen. The world must never know that not just humans can have the power to teleport. I know. Sama will go through life struggling to find her place in her house. Only the house elders know of her has a changeling and everyone else sees her a human......but she will always feel distant and different from her familiy.
Solar-powered_Warforged 03-27-07, 02:18 AM	It would be greatly appreciated by the percentile of people who know what they are talking about and have a firm understanding of genetics, if you would go back and reread your high school biology textbooks before you twist DNA and/or the theory of evolution into something it isn't. People like Darwin and Mendel spent their lives researching and gathering information on such subjects and it is an insult to their memories and numerous achievements when you go and spout BS you thought up on a sugar high about dragons, magic, d'marks and d'shards and DNA that isn't even supported by the RAW or even fluff at large. Leave genetics out of this one please will ya'? Aureon knows that it's taken enough beatings at the hands of those blindly trying to prove their points. Sidenote: A changeling's DNA is not mutable; they undergo a cosmetic change through the use of an innate supernatural ability. A change in DNA would not result in a change in apperance, only in that of the changeling's offspring.
bad_phil 03-27-07, 03:48 PM	Every few months we get a post about a uncore race and the dragonmarked thing. It's an old question with no definitive answer, your D&D party should decide (house rules) but personnaly i see no reason for theses races to have dragonmarks. If you think it's funnier, do it. If you think it's unfair for other races, don't do it.(As i do, if changelings can have a dragonmark, than all races would have that possibility, wich I don't like.) But, I just imagined a changeling with such a powerful shapeshift ability, that he could emulate the power of dragonmarks as he shape shift, any of them. For example, he shap shift(cosmiticly speaking) into a half elf of Lyrandar and then can use the abilities of their mark. Yes, it's absolutly against the rules and I would never grant a player with such power, but as the DM I could use this character as a powerful ennemie(or spie) wich must be stopped by the players. See, if I feel like it, maybe I would, but not for players.
Vharuck 03-27-07, 04:06 PM	to help to stop this disbute think about this. rule zero That's sort of like telling all philosophy professors that they needn't teach nor continue that field because of the existence of relativism, eh?