Post/Author/DateTime	Post
eehamburg 02-15-08, 02:29 PM	Throughout various fantasy works, there has been ideas that have been thrown around of super-humans. Whether it be genetic engineering or some other method. We have seen this in Star Trek with Khan and his bunch. We have seen this in Andromeda with the Nietzscheans. It is a common theme. So... this got me thinking. What if ... during the Last War, Vadalis was doing experiments to create super-men of that nature? What if they had decided to start making Magebred Humans (the same way that the clones were made in Star Wars for example)? Does anyone have any ideas about this? How would this be received? What stats would you give? What plots would unravel? Any thoughts on this idea? Please share. again ... just a thought.
naturax 02-15-08, 03:38 PM	Personally, I'd link these experiments to the Cult of the Dragon Below.
eehamburg 02-15-08, 04:24 PM	Personally, I'd link these experiments to the Cult of the Dragon Below. Ok... that works too .. so ... what would be the reason? What's the story?
naturax 02-15-08, 04:51 PM	Ok... that works too .. so ... what would be the reason? What's the story? Someone in House Vadalis gets the idea that a particular race, humans in this case, are imperfect and they want to create the perfect human. This is maddness: they are either already mad and are willing to use secrets from the Daelkyr in order to further their research, or they start their research and stumble across Daelkyr secrets and it drives them mad. The influence from the Daelkyr is necessary to speed up the process, you see. Magebreeding techniques as currently used on animals, you could say, take many generations to take effect, and that might work fine for pigs or whatever when they reach maturity in a couple of years, but for humans it just takes too long. Now the question is how do you want the players to get involved, that will drive how things go from here.
AlHazred 02-15-08, 05:18 PM	One of the nobles running Galifar could have asked House Vadalis to participate in what is essentially the "super-soldier" scenario. For best effect, say this took place just before the Last War started. House Vadalis, always at the fringes due to the reluctance of most communities to allow dangerous monsters so close to settled areas, uses a remote facility. Their research requires them to use people as breeding stock, so slaves are acquired for this purpose. These slaves are bred over generations (probably five of them could be generated during the Last War) to refine the results. Hmmm... 1) Which Galifar noble makes the most sense? For true "noir" reaction, it should be one with a sterling reputation, untarnishable. 2) Which remote area? If we place it in the Eldeen Reaches, we have it currently outside of Five Nations jurisdiction; maybe it's located on a manifest zone to Kythri or Mabar, as those occur in the Reaches. Other locations are also viable: the Shadow Marches (possible Dragon Below influence?), Q'barra (taint from Haka’torvhak?), or even the Frostfell. 3) What kind of slaves? Humans from Sarlona (former refugees), near-humans from Xen'drik or the nearer islands (thus introducing or justifying some of the Races of... or Magic of Incarnum races), or maybe even from another plane (justifying any particular Outsider race your GM is fond of, like the Diaboli from Dragon magazine)?
MJMurtha 02-15-08, 05:27 PM	Hi All, Wasn't there something suggested somewhere that the Dreaming Dark might make use of Vadalis to bred new Chosen for another version of the Inspired?
justicar347 02-17-08, 03:24 PM	I think this is a pretty good idea. Its a great way to add a dark side to one of the less vissible Dragonmarked houses. Something to keep in mind is that Vadalis's mark gives them power over animals, not magical beasts, humans, and dragons. I would set this up as some rogue scion of the house wanting to create supper soldiers. The Eldeen Reaches is a great place for this kind of activity and it is already the House's base of operations. I wouldn't go for the Cults of the Dragon Bellow, though you might throw in Dalkyr fleshwarping techniques for experimental purposes. Yes, it is mentioned somewhere, though I dont know where off the top of my head, that the Dreaming Dark might use Vadalis to create new inspired bodies. That would be a great throw in. The Rogue Vadalis scion thinks he is trying to create a weapon better than the warforged for when the Last War starts again, but it is actually the Dreaming Dark manipulating him.
Ehtiar 02-19-08, 11:18 AM	Well for one thought.. House Vadalis is set up with a fair few properties within the Eldeen Reaches.. which means access to manifest zone of Thelanis.. and the slewed time effect from going there... Who's to say they wouldn't take advantage of that if they were trying to create a "Magebred Human"? Also , think of the PrC from Dragonmarked for Vadalis, the Vadalis Beastkeeper, at 10th level they get portions of the Magebred template added to the player... due to "constant exposure to the arcane essence of magebred animals and magical beasts" . Which could give a starting point on how to apply to "improve" humans.
eehamburg 02-20-08, 12:37 PM	Well for one thought.. House Vadalis is set up with a fair few properties within the Eldeen Reaches.. which means access to manifest zone of Thelanis.. and the slewed time effect from going there... Who's to say they wouldn't take advantage of that if they were trying to create a "Magebred Human"? Also , think of the PrC from Dragonmarked for Vadalis, the Vadalis Beastkeeper, at 10th level they get portions of the Magebred template added to the player... due to "constant exposure to the arcane essence of magebred animals and magical beasts" . Which could give a starting point on how to apply to "improve" humans. The experimenters become the experimentees. I like it.
LunarWolfPrime 02-21-08, 09:19 AM	Well for one thought.. House Vadalis is set up with a fair few properties within the Eldeen Reaches.. which means access to manifest zone of Thelanis.. and the slewed time effect from going there... Who's to say they wouldn't take advantage of that if they were trying to create a "Magebred Human"? Also , think of the PrC from Dragonmarked for Vadalis, the Vadalis Beastkeeper, at 10th level they get portions of the Magebred template added to the player... due to "constant exposure to the arcane essence of magebred animals and magical beasts" . Which could give a starting point on how to apply to "improve" humans. I was just thinking about that, but hey here is a thought, they could use shifters as guine pigs, being part beast an all, besides they are all over the place in the eldenreach and the house of vadialis is proadbly one of the few houses that they would trust. Perfect cover, untell a reachrunner finds out goes back to the village gets the weretouched masters, reachrunners, rangers, scouts, moonspeakers, druids, brabarian, and my be a tiger claw warblade or 2 and hunt your but down, ah nothing like running for your life with your experiment from a village full of hunters, trackers, angry beast and ambush masters to get the blood flowing or your to make :censored: yourself! Have a good day folks
Ehtiar 03-01-08, 06:14 PM	Well I was also half getting a transposed image delivered via Star Wars.. :D Think of the Clone Troopers being created... and House Vadalis using the time differential from Thelanis to help "accelerate" growth every time a new "test batch" is going through...
Rekko 03-03-08, 09:37 AM	Clone War... :) I like it! You could also have a feel of Blade Runner. If you look closely at the magebred animal template, animal are bred with a purpose (swift, tracking or thick-skinned). What would be the purpose of magebred humanoid/humans? Obviously soldiers, but intellectuals could also be wanted. The magebred humans could be boosted in Martial, Arcane and Divine (to go with 4th ed. power sources)? Or, Martial, Stealth, Caster? Anyhow, here's something to start with for the Magebred human template. "Magebred human" is an inherited template that can be applied to any living human (reffered to hereafter as the base creature). A magebred human uses all the base creature's statistics and special abilities except as noted here. Size and Type: Size remains unchanged. Type changes to Outsider(native, Augmented Human). (not entirely sure about that) Armor Class: The base creature's natural armor bonus increases by +1 Special Qualities: A magebred human is easier to train and to order than a normal human. Excellent learner: A magebred human can select 4 skills that will always be class skills to him. Moreover, a magebred human gains +1 skill point per level (+4 skill points at 1st level). A magebred human also gains one of the fallowing additional special qualities. Martial: +1 to melee or ranged weapon damage Stealth: Speed increases by 10ft. Caster: 1 bonus spell at spell level 0, 1st, 2nd. Psionic: +1 power points per character level whether they choose a psionic class or not. (and it would be frightful to consider them the empty vessels of Khorvaire) Abilities: +2 to any two ability. Level Adjustment: +1
Nived 03-04-08, 04:01 AM	I'd take it another way. I wouldn't have it connected to the Dreaming Dark or the Dragon Below. Though I can see both avenues as valid, particularly the 'Chosen'/Empty Vessel parallel to an artificially bred 'superhuman'. I however think it would be more interesting, and ultimately more tragic if it was all done with the best of intentions. House Vadalis is a house of breeders. That's their profession, and Dragonmarked mentions how important family genealogy is to them as a family. In such an environment I don't feel that the idea of turning the family into a carefully bred family of superhumans would be that far off. That Vadalis would be stronger, faster, better than anyone by right of their selective courtships, and a little magic. I'd say that this has been going on a long time, it takes a few generations to breed the right stock. However the first true magebred scions weren't born until about twenty years ago. The problem is, that they're not exactly human, they're magebred humans. A subrace, thus they can't get true Dragonmarks. Every one of these magebred children of the family have failed their test of Siberys or worse, the test produced Aberrant Marks. Here's the tradegy, these are the sons and daughters or prominent respected Vadalis members. Their pregnancies and what not were effected by magic (or however magebreeding 'works' in your game), but really these are still their kids, but they're a failure. I imagine the Vadalis would try to cover up the whole business, a mixture of shame and guilt over the whole thing. Vadalis tries to hide their shame, arranging these magebred scions to be shunted off to Blackbriar (see Stormreach), or some other equally remote house enclave. The problem is these kids are starting to reach adulthood, maybe they've figured out what was done to them. Maybe some just want to leave and make their own way in the world and have been told they can't. Maybe House Tarkanan has found out about them and have set about 'liberating them'. Maybe their Aberrant Marks really do open them up to the influence of Xorat or Kyber... One way or another these Magebred kids turn or are turned against the family, and though considered 'failures' Vadalis did succeed in making them better, faster, and stronger, and now they've turned violent. The idea of this hook would be House V brought it on themselves really. Drop the PCs in the middle, have fun with the moral and ethical questions it'll raise.
eehamburg 03-04-08, 12:25 PM	Now ... that is an original idea ... that can be manipulated quite well ... and imagine what would happen if knowledge of these mutants got released ... furthermore, imagine the abilities of these mutants ...would they be like the Xmen? the Morlocks? or something else?
Nived 03-05-08, 01:32 AM	I'd keep it to the normal aberrant dmark powers but definatly use lesser and greater aberrant marks from Dragonmarked, and other powers like Mark of Madness for instance. The frightening thing isn't just that they're stronger, faster, tougher, but their aberrant marks are fighteningly powerful. If you haven't yet used improved aberrant marks in your game its an excellent time to add them. It would certainly freak out Vadalis and they'd want to keep secret that they've basically created a way to breed powerful Aberrant Marks, heck with the way true marks feel about aberrants some in the house might have even called for these kids to be put down. Still like I said in my previous posts these are the sons and daughters, instead they're more or less exiled. Eventually somethings got to give. As for how they look. I wouldn't have them like Morlocks. Magebred animals are described as 'fine specimins of their kind' Similarly I'd imagine magebred Vadalis would look like incredibly healthy humans. Their skin will be tougher, the'll be built like body builders, but they're not freaks, beyond their aberrant marks. The scenario is a pot waiting to explode. What if the other Dragonmark houses discover these powerful Aberrants, what about House Tarkanan?Even when they go bad some in the house are sure not to want their children, blasted mutations that they are, killed. It's not an easy problem to solve. In my scenario these kids would have been raised to be the next leaders of their house, from an early age, if not from birth, it would have been clear that the magebred part worked. They would have been stonger, tougher etc of other kids, the House would have thought they succeeded. These kids would have had the best education in the world, they were all exceptional, each one likely havning PC class levels instead of NPC class levels... then everything went wrong, they developed aberrant marks instead of true and their world colapsed and they were spirited away to the back of beyond, shunned, out of sight out of mind. More or less prisoners, probably not even told why they had developed these marks instead of the true ones of their house, because its unlikely they don't know what aberrant marks are. Once they discover that they're the way they are because of what their grandparents and parents had done, I'd imagine they'd be slightly angry at the hand they've been dealt.
Rekko 03-05-08, 07:08 AM	If you bring a green Syberis shard next to them, do they loose their abilities and become vulnerable? :P Rekko
eehamburg 03-07-08, 04:08 PM	If you bring a green Syberis shard next to them, do they loose their abilities and become vulnerable? :P Rekko No ... but if you bring a ring next to and chant an oath, you become part of the Green Shard Corps, defenders of the realm. It ring gives the ability to do almost anything except against yellow objects. LOL
Nived 03-08-08, 01:31 AM	The Dark Lanterns already have that schtick, didn't you know that the organization is actually lead by a group of Blues?
eehamburg 03-08-08, 10:28 PM	The Dark Lanterns already have that schtick, didn't you know that the organization is actually lead by a group of Blues? :rofl: