~Subraces in Eberron? [Archive] - Wizards Community

~Subraces in Eberron? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
rice830
04-29-07, 10:48 PM ~There are subraces in Eberron, correct?
Vharuck
04-29-07, 11:16 PM If you want them. However, subraces seem to be frowned upon by most players of Eberron. The idea is, that if you want a strong elf, put your highest score in strength.

However, your game is your game. But there are few officially mentioned subraces in Eberron (drow being the closest I can think of).
The Ubbergeek
04-29-07, 11:37 PM The problem that somes fail to see is that a subrace is not (shoudln't not be, at least) merely a variation with a min-max idea in mind, but, well, a distinct, flavorfull and fluffyficious entity in itself, like Drow toward Elves. More than a different set of stats.
Arcane Guyver
04-30-07, 12:21 AM Quite a few subraces live in Eberron, but they aren't commonly encountered.

Aquatic elves and whisper gnomes supposedly exist somewhere...the former might be extinct, the latter a rumor.
The aventi, duergar, and skulks live in Sarlona.
Drow and half-drow exist in Xen'drik.
Svirfneblin and underfolk live in Khyber.

The Player's Guide to Eberron shows other subraces existing, though I'm loath to use them.
Marcus Majarra
04-30-07, 12:23 AM Most of the subraces you'll find in Eberron are those found in the Monster Manual, as well as those introduced in the various core sourcebooks (Races and Terrain series come to mind). The emphasis on subraces, however, is barely existent at all.
Captain_Kobold
04-30-07, 10:05 AM While the creator has stated that apart from the Elf/Drow split, he does not like subraces in Eberron, the books do include some details on how they are found.

I imagine most subraces not addressed would exist in an area separated from the main body of the race. Isolated communities in Xen'drik, or the Frostfell and suchlike are possibles.

What sort of thing did you have in mind? Part of it might depend on the circumstances.
For example you could have a small civilisation of Aventi and/or aquatic elves in the seas somewhere. Only just making contact with mainland Khorvaire now that their Sahuagin enemies are getting new resources from trading with the Xen'drik expeditions.

If, however, you are trying to get away with a Wood Elf-statted Valenar, your DM should commence to beat you down with your own books.
Nived
04-30-07, 11:54 AM As had been said one of the ideas of the creator of Eberron, and one that has either attracted, or been picked up by many Eberron fans that post here is that you don't need subraces.

Khorvaire elves, Valenar elves, and Arenal elves are all standard Player's Handbook elves. Doesn't matter that their cultures are different or that Valenar are a warrior race of elves, they're the same race.

That being said, "Everything that is in D&D can have a place in Eberrron" being the mantra that it is you can include subraces, and yes they do get mentioned in such places as the Player's Guide to Eberron. Generally there should be a good solid reason they exist, "Because they're elves that live in the mountains instead of the forrests" is simply not good enough, because Eberron is cosmopolitian. There are Dwarves that live in the Eldeen Reaches (not many) and Elves that live in the Mror Holds (again not many), and elves that live in the desert (the highest concentration on Khorvaire) and they don't get different stats.

So when allowing players to choose subraces a DM should ask the following questions.
"How does it fit in Eberron?"

"What caused this subrace? Planar interferance? Magic of ages past?" It should never EVER be as simple as they live somewhere else.

"Is there any benifit beyond a free +2 to the character's stat of choice?" If there's no reason beyond wanting a higher Str, or Int just say no, you don't get to play a hippity dippity super elf, you play an elf.
Edymnion
04-30-07, 06:35 PM ~There are subraces in Eberron, correct?New to the Eberron boards, and not just trolling I hope?
I'll just put my two bits in this way:

I have *NEVER* seen any character, in the entire time I have played this game that used a subrace that could not have been played EXACTLY the same with the default race. And all too often people using subraces do so entirely for mechanical reasons, or to use them as a roleplaying crutch so they can just play a stereotyped cliche of the race instead of an actual character.

Other than instances where mechanical changes are absolutely required to make the race viable (such as aquatic elves), then there is no reason to have differant mechanics for what is essentially nothing more than a cultural differance.
Antioch
04-30-07, 08:33 PM Anything in D&D has a place in Eberron. Its really up to you if you are DMing, or your DM if you wish to use subraces in your game.
retillin
04-30-07, 09:31 PM Remember one thing about subraces, they can not get regular Dragonmarks. You can still the the aberrant, but that's it. So they are not part of any of the large houses that are so central to Eberron.

That said, some races can fit out there. Whisper gnomes for example. They drop a line out there that they "were created by the Trust to be spies". So that could work. But nothing is set up just because it lives in the plains instead of a forest.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
rice830 04-29-07, 10:48 PM	~There are subraces in Eberron, correct?
Vharuck 04-29-07, 11:16 PM	If you want them. However, subraces seem to be frowned upon by most players of Eberron. The idea is, that if you want a strong elf, put your highest score in strength. However, your game is your game. But there are few officially mentioned subraces in Eberron (drow being the closest I can think of).
The Ubbergeek 04-29-07, 11:37 PM	The problem that somes fail to see is that a subrace is not (shoudln't not be, at least) merely a variation with a min-max idea in mind, but, well, a distinct, flavorfull and fluffyficious entity in itself, like Drow toward Elves. More than a different set of stats.
Arcane Guyver 04-30-07, 12:21 AM	Quite a few subraces live in Eberron, but they aren't commonly encountered. Aquatic elves and whisper gnomes supposedly exist somewhere...the former might be extinct, the latter a rumor. The aventi, duergar, and skulks live in Sarlona. Drow and half-drow exist in Xen'drik. Svirfneblin and underfolk live in Khyber. The Player's Guide to Eberron shows other subraces existing, though I'm loath to use them.
Marcus Majarra 04-30-07, 12:23 AM	Most of the subraces you'll find in Eberron are those found in the Monster Manual, as well as those introduced in the various core sourcebooks (Races and Terrain series come to mind). The emphasis on subraces, however, is barely existent at all.
Captain_Kobold 04-30-07, 10:05 AM	While the creator has stated that apart from the Elf/Drow split, he does not like subraces in Eberron, the books do include some details on how they are found. I imagine most subraces not addressed would exist in an area separated from the main body of the race. Isolated communities in Xen'drik, or the Frostfell and suchlike are possibles. What sort of thing did you have in mind? Part of it might depend on the circumstances. For example you could have a small civilisation of Aventi and/or aquatic elves in the seas somewhere. Only just making contact with mainland Khorvaire now that their Sahuagin enemies are getting new resources from trading with the Xen'drik expeditions. If, however, you are trying to get away with a Wood Elf-statted Valenar, your DM should commence to beat you down with your own books.
Nived 04-30-07, 11:54 AM	As had been said one of the ideas of the creator of Eberron, and one that has either attracted, or been picked up by many Eberron fans that post here is that you don't need subraces. Khorvaire elves, Valenar elves, and Arenal elves are all standard Player's Handbook elves. Doesn't matter that their cultures are different or that Valenar are a warrior race of elves, they're the same race. That being said, "Everything that is in D&D can have a place in Eberrron" being the mantra that it is you can include subraces, and yes they do get mentioned in such places as the Player's Guide to Eberron. Generally there should be a good solid reason they exist, "Because they're elves that live in the mountains instead of the forrests" is simply not good enough, because Eberron is cosmopolitian. There are Dwarves that live in the Eldeen Reaches (not many) and Elves that live in the Mror Holds (again not many), and elves that live in the desert (the highest concentration on Khorvaire) and they don't get different stats. So when allowing players to choose subraces a DM should ask the following questions. "How does it fit in Eberron?" "What caused this subrace? Planar interferance? Magic of ages past?" It should never EVER be as simple as they live somewhere else. "Is there any benifit beyond a free +2 to the character's stat of choice?" If there's no reason beyond wanting a higher Str, or Int just say no, you don't get to play a hippity dippity super elf, you play an elf.
Edymnion 04-30-07, 06:35 PM	~There are subraces in Eberron, correct?New to the Eberron boards, and not just trolling I hope? I'll just put my two bits in this way: I have NEVER seen any character, in the entire time I have played this game that used a subrace that could not have been played EXACTLY the same with the default race. And all too often people using subraces do so entirely for mechanical reasons, or to use them as a roleplaying crutch so they can just play a stereotyped cliche of the race instead of an actual character. Other than instances where mechanical changes are absolutely required to make the race viable (such as aquatic elves), then there is no reason to have differant mechanics for what is essentially nothing more than a cultural differance.
Antioch 04-30-07, 08:33 PM	Anything in D&D has a place in Eberron. Its really up to you if you are DMing, or your DM if you wish to use subraces in your game.
retillin 04-30-07, 09:31 PM	Remember one thing about subraces, they can not get regular Dragonmarks. You can still the the aberrant, but that's it. So they are not part of any of the large houses that are so central to Eberron. That said, some races can fit out there. Whisper gnomes for example. They drop a line out there that they "were created by the Trust to be spies". So that could work. But nothing is set up just because it lives in the plains instead of a forest.