Post/Author/DateTime	Post
The_Devourer 11-15-07, 02:05 PM	I was thinking of a really cool set of enemies to use here in Eberron. Flipping through my books, I came across the idea of the Valenar being ninjas (Complete Adventurer) in place of rogues. Instead of attributing their powers to Ki, attribute the powers to ancient ancestors. Like the ghost step becomes the Step of Ellis-Thran. What do you guys think?
Alex_ 11-15-07, 02:27 PM	Sounds like a great application of the class. Unless you tell your PCs otherwise, chances are that they'll assume they're Rangers or Rogues with levels in some spell-casting class, or spell-like ability. Either way, you have some supernatural skirmishers.
eehamburg 11-15-07, 03:03 PM	It sounds like an awesome idea. What are your ideas for their background and integration into the society? What roles do they fit? How do the other Valenar perceive them? Are they known to anyone? What is your 'fluff'?
SquirrelMortis 11-17-07, 09:40 AM	This is an excellent idea! Everyone's always tried to integrate ninjas into either the Shadow Houses or the Dhakaani. The Valenar work much better! Thanks for giving me an idea for my next campaign... :D
Alex_ 11-17-07, 10:56 AM	This is an excellent idea! Everyone's always tried to integrate ninjas into either the Shadow Houses or the Dhakaani. The Valenar work much better! Well the Dhakaani are agnostic ancestor worshipers, have sprinklings of Chinese and Japanese flavor, and the Sharrat'Khesh clan- renowned for producing Monk/Rogues, who engage in espionage and assassination on behalf of warring factions. Also, the favored class of all Dhakaani Goblinoids is Rogue. You just can't get better justification for the Ninja class than that.
The_Devourer 11-19-07, 10:49 AM	Well, it would really depend on the flavor of the campaign. If the PC's are allied with the Valenar and their associated Ninja, then the Ninja could work as a group of assassins, spies, scouts, or anything similar to that. If they are enemies to the elves (as they likely will be in this case), they can be that unseen horror in the dark. Striking quickly, silently, and maybe backed up by a few rangers themselves. While the rangers would make great assassins for the Valenar and NOT require the evil alignment, Ninjas would work just as well for a different approach. Rangers for actual combative assassins and Ninjas with their powers (ancestor or otherwise) being the hit and run style. They could rely on disguises, poisons, or other classes before the crap hits the fan and battle is required. Depending on campaign, good scout type characters who have proven themselves in battle alongside the elves might be offered a chance to discipline themselves to mimic ancient ancestors (the Ninja class itself), although that sounds more like a prestige class to me though. What do you guys think? One problem I have though- The biggest downside I see to the Ninja is the fact that they don't get evasion (an essential to a speed character) until 12th level. Is there a variant anybody knows of where the Ninja gets it earlier (or maybe they just thought of it themselves, as long as it is balanced). I can understand taking a level or 2 of rogue to get it early (and that would make sneak attacks + sudden strike really painful). Hopefully soon, my and few friends are going to run a 2-player campaign with cycling DM's in Eberron. To make up for the lack of man power, we are planning on running gestalt characters. I thought Valenar Ninja/Fighter. What do you guys think?
TheKeyofE 11-20-07, 07:01 PM	This is an excellent idea! Everyone's always tried to integrate ninjas into either the Shadow Houses or the Dhakaani. The Valenar work much better! Thanks for giving me an idea for my next campaign... :D I'm currently playing a Thuranni ninja/swordsage. Very effective combination, better than straight ninja. It just fits naturally for a member of a Shadow House. Depending on campaign, good scout type characters who have proven themselves in battle alongside the elves might be offered a chance to discipline themselves to mimic ancient ancestors (the Ninja class itself), although that sounds more like a prestige class to me though. What do you guys think? Ghost Faced Killer from CAd?
The_Devourer 11-21-07, 12:57 PM	Ghost Faced Killer might work. That would be one scary assassin though (yeah, I know. Bad pun). But the flavor fits, so I guess I can't really argue that. My group doesn't use Tome of Battle, since no one else has it but me nor do they have the time to learn the system for it. While I know this is a possibly off-topic thing, I need help with the Gestalt combo. We've got either a Fighter/Paladin or a Fighter/Rogue as the other half of the team. I was thinking Cleric/Warlock. What do you guys think? We use all of the completes but Champion and scoundrel, and most of the Eberron books that we have. Warlock lets me blast and provide offensive firepower, and Cleric allows me to concentrate on healing. What do you guys think? Is there a better combo for this?
korcheck 11-21-07, 01:09 PM	I have to say that considering the middle eastern theme that these elves have that the idea of a clan or tradition of ninja isn't that far fetched considering the word assassin actually comes from the middle east and the european mispronounciation (sp?) of it.