What do Karrnathi undead believe in? [Archive] - Wizards Community

What do Karrnathi undead believe in? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
JulesCARV
11-11-07, 07:12 PM I was wondering -- the Karrnathi undead are supposed to serve that Karrnathi nation, but what does that mean in more concrete terms?

Does that mean that they're basically "good soldiers" who will obey their superior officers and do what they're told, and if, for instance, there's a war between royalists and rebel lords, Karrnathi undead might fight on both sides, depending on which unit they're in at the time, with each undead obeying whoever he regards as his superior officer and considering others to be betraying Karrnath?

Or does it mean they're dedicated to upholding Karrnath's laws and state, so they're unswervingly loyal to the Karrnathi throne? Although if they found out that the true legitimate heir to Karrnath's throne were actually in a prison cell, that might complicate matters, and they might try to fight for their king and liberate him from his usurping grandpa. Or perhaps not.

Or are they nationalistic in some more abstract sense -- believing not so much in obeying their king or superior officer, but in serving the Karrnathi nation as a whole, which is usually, but not always, aligned with the interests of the Karrnathi army, state, and throne?

Also, what religious beliefs are common among Karrnathi skeletons and zombies? Do many of them care about religion? If so, do they now worship the Sovereign Host in light of the split between the Karrnathi state and the Blood of Vol? Do they have their own weird undead-apologist sect of Sovereign Host worship? Or do they stick to the BoV? Or do they not care about religion at all?
Alex_
11-11-07, 07:37 PM I was wondering -- the Karrnathi undead are supposed to serve that Karrnathi nation, but what does that mean in more concrete terms?

Does that mean that they're basically "good soldiers" who will obey their superior officers and do what they're told, and if, for instance, there's a war between royalists and rebel lords, Karrnathi undead might fight on both sides, depending on which unit they're in at the time, with each undead obeying whoever he regards as his superior officer and considering others to be betraying Karrnath?

Or does it mean they're dedicated to upholding Karrnath's laws and state, so they're unswervingly loyal to the Karrnathi throne? Although if they found out that the true legitimate heir to Karrnath's throne were actually in a prison cell, that might complicate matters, and they might try to fight for their king and liberate him from his usurping grandpa. Or perhaps not.

Or are they nationalistic in some more abstract sense -- believing not so much in obeying their king or superior officer, but in serving the Karrnathi nation as a whole, which is usually, but not always, aligned with the interests of the Karrnathi army, state, and throne?

Also, what religious beliefs are common among Karrnathi skeletons and zombies? Do many of them care about religion? If so, do they now worship the Sovereign Host in light of the split between the Karrnathi state and the Blood of Vol? Do they have their own weird undead-apologist sect of Sovereign Host worship? Or do they stick to the BoV? Or do they not care about religion at all?

Well they only have a Charisma of 1, so however capable they are of using strategy and reason, they don't seem to have too much personality or "spark" about them.

I tend to think of them as just really smart Zombies and Skeletons. Usually these Undead are fairly stupid, follow only simple commands, and ignore obvious threats and never change in response. Karrnathi Zombies and Skeletons learn and use concepts like flanking, tactical withdrawals, and suppressive fire when and where appropriate. When not doing that, they sit around, waiting patiently for their next order(s).

I don't fancy them the type to think about the nature of their mission, the complexities of politics, or how they actually fit into the whole picture. They do what they do (fight) and do it well.

If they did concern themselves with it, they'd have plenty of time to do so and debate amongst themselves while sitting in "storage" for the past couple of years.
The_Devourer
11-12-07, 03:39 PM Well, the average Karrnathi undead I don't think would really care, it would just be a mindless automaton that is really good for battle. But if you really wanted to put an interesting twist on it, it might make for an interesting story if one Karrn undead acheives full sentience and personality (perhaps the personality carries over from their old life?).
Revvecor
11-12-07, 03:57 PM I am not sure if this thread (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=873370) will help you, but it does discuss weather or not the Karrnathi undead can have class levels.
Hellcow
11-12-07, 07:27 PM In my opinion, Karrnathi undead, while sentient, are in no way human. Personally, whenever I use them I try to play up the fact that you DON'T know how they think or what drives them. Are they truly the devoted servants of Karrnath that the priests claim? Or is there something darker moving them?

In general, however, I do play to the fact that Karrnathi undead share the same skills and cannot advance to give them something of an insect mentality. They do their jobs efficiently and rarely show emotion. They communicate with one another in ways that aren't always obvious to the living creatures around them. Again, I try to play up the eerie aspects of the sentient undead... the fact that we can't truly know what they are thinking.

Refering to the other thread, yes, the example given of a Karrnathi undead with class levels is an aberration, as Karrnathi undead normally cannot advance; this is one of the few edges that the warforged have on the Karrnathi undead, that they are more adaptable and can learn. However, there's no reason to assume that there aren't special Karrnathi undead that have greater capabilities than the multitude; I've used unique Karrnathi undead in my campaign in the past. The bulk of them have uniform skills and abilities and don't cling to their memories of the past, but a particular NPC can bend any of those rules if it serves the needs of a story.

All of this is, of course, just my opinion - it's certainly an interesting question that could be answered many different ways.
Nerdicus
11-13-07, 07:56 PM In my present campaign I have a Karnathi army group that went rogue in the end of hte last war. It has something to do with the mourning, and their already being dead. Anyways, they all are fully sentient and their leader is full out evil. The group just met with three of the undead pirates who were left behind to guard a supply depot the pirates use in the Cyre river.
Edymnion
11-19-07, 01:28 PM I've actually had a character idea in mind for a while now, but haven't found the right kind of game to put him him.

My general take on karnnathi undead (the actual karnnathi skeletons and zombies, as in the specific creatures of that name) is that they are mindless without actually being mindless. They can react and improvise like a sentient creature, but they don't have independant thought outside of that area. You can get one to adapt to your battle tactics, but you can't persuade one to stop attacking if thats what it's orders are.

The character I want to play is a Karnnathi Zombie that walks out of the Mournland mists with full sentience and partial memory of his past life. Driving force for the character would be to finish remembering who he was, and either learning to cope with being undead, or find a way to return to life.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
JulesCARV 11-11-07, 07:12 PM	I was wondering -- the Karrnathi undead are supposed to serve that Karrnathi nation, but what does that mean in more concrete terms? Does that mean that they're basically "good soldiers" who will obey their superior officers and do what they're told, and if, for instance, there's a war between royalists and rebel lords, Karrnathi undead might fight on both sides, depending on which unit they're in at the time, with each undead obeying whoever he regards as his superior officer and considering others to be betraying Karrnath? Or does it mean they're dedicated to upholding Karrnath's laws and state, so they're unswervingly loyal to the Karrnathi throne? Although if they found out that the true legitimate heir to Karrnath's throne were actually in a prison cell, that might complicate matters, and they might try to fight for their king and liberate him from his usurping grandpa. Or perhaps not. Or are they nationalistic in some more abstract sense -- believing not so much in obeying their king or superior officer, but in serving the Karrnathi nation as a whole, which is usually, but not always, aligned with the interests of the Karrnathi army, state, and throne? Also, what religious beliefs are common among Karrnathi skeletons and zombies? Do many of them care about religion? If so, do they now worship the Sovereign Host in light of the split between the Karrnathi state and the Blood of Vol? Do they have their own weird undead-apologist sect of Sovereign Host worship? Or do they stick to the BoV? Or do they not care about religion at all?
Alex_ 11-11-07, 07:37 PM	I was wondering -- the Karrnathi undead are supposed to serve that Karrnathi nation, but what does that mean in more concrete terms? Does that mean that they're basically "good soldiers" who will obey their superior officers and do what they're told, and if, for instance, there's a war between royalists and rebel lords, Karrnathi undead might fight on both sides, depending on which unit they're in at the time, with each undead obeying whoever he regards as his superior officer and considering others to be betraying Karrnath? Or does it mean they're dedicated to upholding Karrnath's laws and state, so they're unswervingly loyal to the Karrnathi throne? Although if they found out that the true legitimate heir to Karrnath's throne were actually in a prison cell, that might complicate matters, and they might try to fight for their king and liberate him from his usurping grandpa. Or perhaps not. Or are they nationalistic in some more abstract sense -- believing not so much in obeying their king or superior officer, but in serving the Karrnathi nation as a whole, which is usually, but not always, aligned with the interests of the Karrnathi army, state, and throne? Also, what religious beliefs are common among Karrnathi skeletons and zombies? Do many of them care about religion? If so, do they now worship the Sovereign Host in light of the split between the Karrnathi state and the Blood of Vol? Do they have their own weird undead-apologist sect of Sovereign Host worship? Or do they stick to the BoV? Or do they not care about religion at all? Well they only have a Charisma of 1, so however capable they are of using strategy and reason, they don't seem to have too much personality or "spark" about them. I tend to think of them as just really smart Zombies and Skeletons. Usually these Undead are fairly stupid, follow only simple commands, and ignore obvious threats and never change in response. Karrnathi Zombies and Skeletons learn and use concepts like flanking, tactical withdrawals, and suppressive fire when and where appropriate. When not doing that, they sit around, waiting patiently for their next order(s). I don't fancy them the type to think about the nature of their mission, the complexities of politics, or how they actually fit into the whole picture. They do what they do (fight) and do it well. If they did concern themselves with it, they'd have plenty of time to do so and debate amongst themselves while sitting in "storage" for the past couple of years.
The_Devourer 11-12-07, 03:39 PM	Well, the average Karrnathi undead I don't think would really care, it would just be a mindless automaton that is really good for battle. But if you really wanted to put an interesting twist on it, it might make for an interesting story if one Karrn undead acheives full sentience and personality (perhaps the personality carries over from their old life?).
Revvecor 11-12-07, 03:57 PM	I am not sure if this thread (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=873370) will help you, but it does discuss weather or not the Karrnathi undead can have class levels.
Hellcow 11-12-07, 07:27 PM	In my opinion, Karrnathi undead, while sentient, are in no way human. Personally, whenever I use them I try to play up the fact that you DON'T know how they think or what drives them. Are they truly the devoted servants of Karrnath that the priests claim? Or is there something darker moving them? In general, however, I do play to the fact that Karrnathi undead share the same skills and cannot advance to give them something of an insect mentality. They do their jobs efficiently and rarely show emotion. They communicate with one another in ways that aren't always obvious to the living creatures around them. Again, I try to play up the eerie aspects of the sentient undead... the fact that we can't truly know what they are thinking. Refering to the other thread, yes, the example given of a Karrnathi undead with class levels is an aberration, as Karrnathi undead normally cannot advance; this is one of the few edges that the warforged have on the Karrnathi undead, that they are more adaptable and can learn. However, there's no reason to assume that there aren't special Karrnathi undead that have greater capabilities than the multitude; I've used unique Karrnathi undead in my campaign in the past. The bulk of them have uniform skills and abilities and don't cling to their memories of the past, but a particular NPC can bend any of those rules if it serves the needs of a story. All of this is, of course, just my opinion - it's certainly an interesting question that could be answered many different ways.
Nerdicus 11-13-07, 07:56 PM	In my present campaign I have a Karnathi army group that went rogue in the end of hte last war. It has something to do with the mourning, and their already being dead. Anyways, they all are fully sentient and their leader is full out evil. The group just met with three of the undead pirates who were left behind to guard a supply depot the pirates use in the Cyre river.
Edymnion 11-19-07, 01:28 PM	I've actually had a character idea in mind for a while now, but haven't found the right kind of game to put him him. My general take on karnnathi undead (the actual karnnathi skeletons and zombies, as in the specific creatures of that name) is that they are mindless without actually being mindless. They can react and improvise like a sentient creature, but they don't have independant thought outside of that area. You can get one to adapt to your battle tactics, but you can't persuade one to stop attacking if thats what it's orders are. The character I want to play is a Karnnathi Zombie that walks out of the Mournland mists with full sentience and partial memory of his past life. Driving force for the character would be to finish remembering who he was, and either learning to cope with being undead, or find a way to return to life.