Post/Author/DateTime	Post
OneWinged4ngel 08-25-06, 02:03 AM	((DELETED due to WotC's exploitations)) By posting or submitting any text, images, designs, video, sound, code, data, lists, or other materials or information (such User-submitted content, collectively, "User Content") to or through a Site, including without limitation on any User profile page, you hereby irrevocably grant to Wizards, its affiliates and sublicensees, a worldwide, perpetual, irrevocable, royalty-free, non-exclusive, and fully sub-licensable license, to use, reproduce, modify, adapt, publish, translate, create derivative works from, distribute, perform and display such User Content (in whole or in part) in any media and to incorporate the User Content into other works in any format or medium now known or later developed. The foregoing grants shall include the right to exploit any proprietary rights in such User Content, including but not limited to rights under copyright, trademark, service mark or patent laws under any relevant jurisdiction.
Splendide 08-25-06, 02:17 AM	When a problem comes along You must chip it Before the cream sits out too long You must chip it When something's going wrong You must chip it now chip it into shape shape it up get straight go forward move ahead try to detect it it's not too late to chip it chip it good When a good time turns around You must chip it You will never live it down Unless you chip it No one gets their way Until they chip it
OneWinged4ngel 08-25-06, 02:55 AM	O...k?
Straylight 08-25-06, 02:55 AM	Wow, Splendide, that was useless. Hm, let's see here: Hit Dice: Eh. I just let my players take max through 3rd level. I also give them the option of rolling normally at each level or taking average (they have to choose one method at 4th level and stick with it, though). Your solution worked for NWN, so I guess it works here, too. Skills: Suit yourself, it works okay. I disagree with the Balance + Tumble, though. I have extremely good balance, but any but the most basic acrobatics are beyond my ability. Beware your Rogues with this, though. They get to consolidate skills points more, which leads to further trapmonkey cheese. I like the new Open Lock use, but that sounds more like a -20 to me, putting it in-line with things like using Hide to Snipe. Clerics: ...are rediculous enough as it is. They don't need further buffing, trust me. Paper: Good rule, consider this yoinked. :D Printing Presses: Also a good rule. Altar of Res: Okay, so first you have to find an enclave that has an Altar. Then you have to see if they have a Greater or Siberys 'mark available to do it, then you have to convince that 'mark that it needs to be done, and then you have to go find 10,000 galifars worth of diamonds and a bottle of holy water. And that's "too cheap and accessible" to you? Wow. And I thought I ran a high-powered game. Zil Upbringing: Cute and fluffy, it works. You might try giving your players a choice, though: pick two of Sense Motive, Bluff, Gather Information, since all three are equally fluffy choices. Hobgoblins: Don't have my MM with me, but that looks okay. I generally allow Hobgoblins, Goblins and Bugbears as PCs anyway, since this is Eberron and all. I also ignore most +1 LAs, since they tend to be about on-par with Dwarves and 'Forged as it is. Social stigmas and the occasional lynch mob more than make up for their strength in the case of Hobgoblins. Half-Elves: Makes sense. I like it. Half-Orcs: Eh. I don't like the +2 Survival, but I suppose everything else makes sense. D'mark Heirs: I like this, consider it yoinked. Exorcists: Eh. Strange PrC anyway. The fix works.
OneWinged4ngel 08-29-06, 02:56 AM	(Blasted double posts)
OneWinged4ngel 08-29-06, 03:08 AM	Wow, Splendide, that was useless. Hm, let's see here: Hit Dice: Eh. I just let my players take max through 3rd level. I also give them the option of rolling normally at each level or taking average (they have to choose one method at 4th level and stick with it, though). Your solution worked for NWN, so I guess it works here, too. Skills: Suit yourself, it works okay. I disagree with the Balance + Tumble, though. I have extremely good balance, but any but the most basic acrobatics are beyond my ability. Beware your Rogues with this, though. They get to consolidate skills points more, which leads to further trapmonkey cheese. I'd considered this, as far as the Balance/Tumble. It's probably the most iffy thing on the list. However, consider this: Are you training in balance, or do you simply have a high dexterity? Disable Device and Open Lock combination is pretty much a no-brainer (which is why so many other d20 systems do it) and Use Rope never really seemed to deserve its own skill. As far as consolidation, Rogues still have lots of skills to go for, and a few extra aren't going to significantly overpower them. They're *supposed* to be able to handle the situations where skills come up with aplomb, and I have no problem with letting them. I'm not quite sure what you mean by "trapmonkey cheese." Aren't you supposed to be able to handle the traps as a rogue? I like the new Open Lock use, but that sounds more like a -20 to me, putting it in-line with things like using Hide to Snipe. I didn't quite think that scrubbing a simple lock should be a DC40 task suitable only for the greatest masters. The fact that lock DCs are high and that you can't take 20 if you're scrubbing makes a -10 quite high. Clerics: ...are rediculous enough as it is. They don't need further buffing, trust me. I realize clerics are quite powerful. However, I don't believe that giving a proficiency with bows is a significant enough to really boost their power level. It's mostly a flavor thing, since even many peasants are trained with the bow in areas that follow the Silver Flame. If someone wants to make a cleric archer build, they could take the War domain or be an elf, and accomplish the same thing. I honestly think it's not very significant, and I think that since clerics *ARE* martially trained, and that archery is often used as a form of meditation and so forth by the Silver Flame, that Silver Flame clerics should be proficient with bows. It's mostly a flavor thing. Alternatively, instead of giving a straight benefit, I could make a Silver Flame organizational feat (Something like some other sects have, such as some of the monk feats or the gatekeepers). Thoughts? Paper: Good rule, consider this yoinked. :D Printing Presses: Also a good rule. Altar of Res: Okay, so first you have to find an enclave that has an Altar. Then you have to see if they have a Greater or Siberys 'mark available to do it, then you have to convince that 'mark that it needs to be done, and then you have to go find 10,000 galifars worth of diamonds and a bottle of holy water. And that's "too cheap and accessible" to you? Wow. And I thought I ran a high-powered game. If you would take a moment to look at the sort of wealth that's thrown around, absolutely. Any member of the Aurum could easily afford to go out to some big enclave and find a member with the greater mark, fork over the money, and tip the guy. It doesn't take a high powered game to get your hands on 10,000 galifars. It's fully expected for people to buy things much more expensive than that at the auction house at Skyway. The thing is far, far cheaper than... say... an Aureon's Eye (which is well over 100,000 if I recall) and people are going to be willing to hold out a lot of money to come back to life. I'd fess up my life savings to get out of Dolurrh... how about you? In short, yes, I believe this is too cheap. Greater marks are NOT incredibly rare to the point where you can't find one within the bounds of a given one of the Five Nations, and a 10,000 gp item is NOT prohibitively expensive for the upper classes. Zil Upbringing: Cute and fluffy, it works. You might try giving your players a choice, though: pick two of Sense Motive, Bluff, Gather Information, since all three are equally fluffy choices. Good idea, I think I might change it to that... Hobgoblins: Don't have my MM with me, but that looks okay. I generally allow Hobgoblins, Goblins and Bugbears as PCs anyway, since this is Eberron and all. I also ignore most +1 LAs, since they tend to be about on-par with Dwarves and 'Forged as it is. Social stigmas and the occasional lynch mob more than make up for their strength in the case of Hobgoblins. Half-Elves: Makes sense. I like it. Half-Orcs: Eh. I don't like the +2 Survival, but I suppose everything else makes sense. I think that orcs have something like enhanced senses and instincts, especially considering the numerous suggestions people have made about giving orcs the Scent feat as a racial feature. I think this could contribute to Survival. If not for half-orcs, I believe it fits for orcs. D'mark Heirs: I like this, consider it yoinked. Exorcists: Eh. Strange PrC anyway. The fix works. Thanks for all the feedback!
Koesherbacon 08-29-06, 09:35 PM	Looks good. Nothing to add but approval.
Thanqol 08-29-06, 10:02 PM	Will refererance and yoink for my upcoming Droaam game.
ryanroyce 08-29-06, 11:09 PM	Hit Dice: I already have a similar rule, though I allow re-rolls for anything less than the true average (i.e., 6.5 for a d12, 5.5 for a d10, and so on). It's okay because I usually give my antagonists full HP anyway. Skills: Cool idea that I hadn't considered, but I like a lot. Eberron Specifics: Longbow Flamers: For my own game, I've been working on "regional templates", for lack of a better term, that give specific bonuses (and penalties, in some cases) based on region of origin. These bonuses typically take the form of weapon proficiencies (longbow for Thrane), bonus languages (Irian for Aerenal), skill bonuses (+2 Balance and Use Rope for Lhazzar), extra class skills (Knowledge Local for Sharn), or additional Favored Classes (Ranger for Valenar). Paper: I went about this problem from a different direction, namely by significantly increasing the "wage" of your average joe. Thus, the 1sp/day laborer earns 1gp/day instead. Printing: I've had a similar idea. My favorite is to use an Amanuesis-attuned dragonshard that can copy text into itself and "print" it later. Originally designed for newsprinting, it has since found extensive use in the espionage industry to precisely copy top secret documents without actually removing them. A great replacement for the "stop the spy with the microfilm!" noir plots, IMO. ;) I'd say more, but it's late and I need to be up early for work tomorrow. It seems some people like my house rules... to the point that one DM even adopted them in his game (to my surprise when I found out). This being the case... I've decided to post them up here. Enjoy! Edits: -Changed Zil Upbringing to allow a choice of three skills, adding Gather Information as a choice. -Changed Hobgoblins to have a choice between Constitution or Dexterity, instead of taking Constitution. -Added some of the reasoning behind adding listed variants. GENERAL -Hit dice are rolled for each level. However, characters may reroll hit dice that are lower than half the maximum for their die. E.g. Wizards reroll 1s, rogues rerolls 1s and 2s, rangers reroll 1s, 2s, and 3s, fighters reroll 1s, 2s, 3s, and 4s, and barbarians reroll 1s, 2s, 3s, 4s, and 5s. This way, no one gets screwed on hp, but no one really gets favored more by the odds. -Certain Skills are combined into one skill for the purpouse of taking ranks. This includes... Open Lock + Disable Device = Disable Device --(Disable Device can already, technically, disable locks, as they are a device. Jamming a lock's even given as an example action Open Lock is something of a legacy skill that no longer really fits, and many d20 system games have done away with the skill for a good reason. Way back, Rogues used to have a "Find/disable traps" skill and an "Open Lock" skill. Now, however, Find/Disable traps has been split into Search and Disable Device, and Disable Device has been expanded to include much more than traps (Really any mechanical or magical device). Open Lock just doesn't make sense anymore.) Use Rope + Sleight of Hand = Sleight of Hand --(No one wants to take ranks in Use Rope... really. Sleight of Hand isn't all too much more popular, and Sleight of Hand artists are typically able to use ropes effectively) Tumble + Balance = Tumble --(It never seemed to make sense that someone who could somersault over your head wouldn't have to master some good balance... or that someone training in balance wouldn't be mastering some sort of acrobatics) These changes should help open up skill selection for people. All these skills still gain bonuses from items and such as if they were seperate skills. You just get the ranks for them together. Rules for usage are all the same. -Open Lock gains the new ability to "scrub" a lock open as a standard action (as opposed to a Full Round Action), at a -10 to the roll. This is a real ability skilled lockpicks can use to open locks in about 1 second, but it takes a good deal of skill. -I use K's fix for Undead templates and Polymorph from the Tome of Necromancy and Tome of Fiends, respectively (These excellent articles are posted on the Classes boards) -Those Darn Floaty Shields that everyone knows and doesn't really love aren't going to be there in my game. The designers even came out and said in an article (on Wizards) that animated shields were a problem, and something they never should have done. The enchantment essentially negates the trade-off between the choice of a two-handed weapon or sword and board, as if the idea that two-handed weapons were superior isn't prevalent enough already without allowing people to have a shield floating around and both hands free for your greataxe. EBERRON SPECIFIC HOUSE RULES -Clerics of the Silver Flame gain proficiency with Bows, even without the War Domain. They receive Weapon Focus: Longbow as a result from the War Domain. -Paper in Eberron is more cheaply produced and readily available than in other D&D settings, and as such does not outstrip an average worker's salary in cost. Eberron has advanced enough to have efficient paper production. As a result, you can get 10 sheets of paper per 1cp, or 100 for 1sp. Higher quality paper costs 1cp per sheet. Subscriptions to newspapers typically cost only a couple gp per year, as detailed in Sharn: City of Towers. This change follows logically from that source, and the idea that newspapers can be available to an average citizen. -Printing Presses in Eberron are created through the efficient use of magic. A cantrip spell called Amanuesis (From Spell Compendium) which copies text combined with a simple magic item that prints to pages allows the creation of printing presses. There are two basic types of printing press-type items. One copies on a one-to-one basis, or directly produces text from imputted commands [an enchanted pen that writes on its own], called a Sivis Pen, the other transfers one text copy to multiple papers (large-scale printing press). The first type is relatively cheap and sees employ in sivis stations Khoirvare 'round, while the second is more specalized but extremely useful for it's given task. A Sivis Pen costs 500 galifars. A large-scale printing press costs 3000 galifars. -Altar of Resurrection is far too cheap and accessible, basically taking out the element of it being *rare* to revive in Eberron. It's just gone. FEATS: -Zilargo Upbringing Req: Zilargo Gnome, Level 1 Effect: Pick two skills from a choice of Gather Information, Sense Motive, and Bluff. These are class skills for you. In addition, you gain +2 in one of these skills (Your choice). Flavour: In the cutthroat political world of shady deals, favors and debts one needs to master the social skills needed to survive. RACES: HOBGOBLINS • +2 Constitution OR Dexterity. • Medium: As Medium creatures, hobgoblins have no special bonuses or penalties due to their size. • Hobgoblin base land speed is 30 feet. • Darkvision (Ex): Hobgoblins can see in the dark up to 60 feet. Darkvision is black and white only, but it is otherwise like normal sight, and hobgoblins can function just fine with no light at all. • +2 racial bonus on Move Silently checks. • +2 racial bonus on Knowledge and Profession checks that are related to war, tactics, and strategy. This includes things like Armorsmithing or Knowledge: History used for information about past battles. • Automatic Languages: Common and Goblin. Bonus Languages: Draconic, Dwarven, Elven, Giant, Gnoll, Gnome, Halfling and Orc. -Favored Class: (M) Fighter (F) Bard LA +0 Note: Effective? You bet. It's one of the upper LA +0s, but it's balanced when you look at the dwarf, shifter, or warforged, I believe. The lack of a penalty generally doesn't matter for balance, much like a dwarf's -2 cha: It's a dump stat from a mechanical point of view, and only really works towards shoehorning them out of say, playing a sorceror, while having no real effect on what they would optimally be suited for. -Half-Elves gain 1 bonus skill point per level, like humans. -Half-orcs get a +2 racial bonus to Survival and Intimidate, and +4 to saves to resist disease, and a +2 on morale checks and saving throws against fear. Orcs get the same. Also, half-orcs combine the cunning of humans with the strength of the orcs. They do not suffer a -2 penalty to intelligence. SPELLS All of my custom spells are allowed (Merill's Marvelous Masterpiece, Burning Talent, Wild Spark, and Achromic Touch) CLASSES -Dragonmark Heir I think that Dragonmarked Heirs should get a class skill based on their dragonmark, based on the bonuses they receive to skills, unless they already have those skills as class skills. Something like, as follows: Mark of Detection: Spot Mark of Finding: Search Mark of Handling: Handle Animal Mark of Healing: Heal Mark of Hospitality (Diplomacy is already a Dragonmarked Heir class skill. Hmm...): Knowledge (local) Mark of Making: Craft Mark of Passage: Survival Mark of Scribing: Decipher Script Mark of Sentinel (Sense Motive already a class skill): Listen Mark of Shadow (Gather Info too): Disguise Mark of Storm: Balance Mark of Warding: Search This house rule was gotten from somewhere on these boards, but I cannot recall who posted this dragonmarked heir variant. Props to whoever it was... and if I can find out I'll give credit where it's due. -Exorcist of the Silver Flame A Paladin Exorcist of the Silver Flame can't Exorcise anything... in fact, it seems to assume you have the Exorcism ability as a cleric, from the Exorcism domain. This makes paladin Exorcists very sad, since they're not actually Exorcists. I propose that Exorcist of the Silver Flame gain the Exorcism domain special ability at level 1, with the ability based on their character level. ___________ Any feedback would be appreciated :) More will be added as it comes up.
OneWinged4ngel 08-30-06, 04:35 AM	Hit Dice: I already have a similar rule, though I allow re-rolls for anything less than the true average (i.e., 6.5 for a d12, 5.5 for a d10, and so on). It's okay because I usually give my antagonists full HP anyway. Skills: Cool idea that I hadn't considered, but I like a lot. Eberron Specifics: Longbow Flamers: For my own game, I've been working on "regional templates", for lack of a better term, that give specific bonuses (and penalties, in some cases) based on region of origin. These bonuses typically take the form of weapon proficiencies (longbow for Thrane), bonus languages (Irian for Aerenal), skill bonuses (+2 Balance and Use Rope for Lhazzar), extra class skills (Knowledge Local for Sharn), or additional Favored Classes (Ranger for Valenar). Paper: I went about this problem from a different direction, namely by significantly increasing the "wage" of your average joe. Thus, the 1sp/day laborer earns 1gp/day instead. Printing: I've had a similar idea. My favorite is to use an Amanuesis-attuned dragonshard that can copy text into itself and "print" it later. Originally designed for newsprinting, it has since found extensive use in the espionage industry to precisely copy top secret documents without actually removing them. A great replacement for the "stop the spy with the microfilm!" noir plots, IMO. ;) I'd say more, but it's late and I need to be up early for work tomorrow. I've been thinking about some regional (or origin-related) feats or templates, myself, but I'm thinking I'll generally do this on a character-by-character basis. This is how the Cleric and Zil Upbringing things came up to begin with. I don't really care enough about favored classes, and multiclassing usually weakens you anyways so I think I may just take out the penalty for multiclassing altogether (and thus not bother with things like giving Valenar a favored class of Ranger) As for the printing, I've also raised wages a bit, but also paper would *still* be too expensive. Right now, a piece of paper already costs more than its weight in gold... and that's just silly for a society that has newspapers. If the newspaper is short, say only 15 pages, you're looking at 6gp an issue in costs for just paper... then the cost for journalists and all that... and yet you pay what, 10 gold a year for a Sharn Inquisitive subscription according to the Sharn sourcebook? It's just silly. (So is having a 10 pound iron pot cost half as much as half its weight in iron, thus making crafting the iron into something depreciate its value. *Sigh* the D&D economy is so screwed up...)
Straylight 08-30-06, 05:05 AM	I'd considered this, as far as the Balance/Tumble. It's probably the most iffy thing on the list. However, consider this: Are you training in balance, or do you simply have a high dexterity? But Tumble and Balance are both still Dex based skills, so by D&D logic if I've got a dex mod of +3 to one of them, I've got a dex mod of +3 to the other as well, so it doesn't matter if I have skills ranks or am relying purely on ability scores. Because both skills are tied to the same ability, a character who has ranks in neither skill will be equally good at both -which doesn't reflect real-world tendencies (which, despite all of its concessions to gameplay, D20 does try to do) which having Tumble and Balance as seperate skills reflects with more accuracy. Disable Device and Open Lock combination is pretty much a no-brainer (which is why so many other d20 systems do it) and Use Rope never really seemed to deserve its own skill. As far as consolidation, Rogues still have lots of skills to go for, and a few extra aren't going to significantly overpower them. They're *supposed* to be able to handle the situations where skills come up with aplomb, and I have no problem with letting them. I generally agree with the Disable Device/Open Lock combo, but I'd almost be tempted to drop the Open Lock skill completely and just roll that completely into Disable Device. On the note of Skill points, yes, Rogues are supposed to be highly skilled individuals, but unless the Rogue's got an Int of wtf, he's still going to have to make a few concessions with his skill selection. Letting the Rogue double up on too many skills is going to remove even that limitation, and I have a general dislike of Mary Sue-type characters, which is what the Rogue becomes if he can literally be good at everything. I didn't quite think that scrubbing a simple lock should be a DC40 task suitable only for the greatest masters. The fact that lock DCs are high and that you can't take 20 if you're scrubbing makes a -10 quite high. Fair enough, I hadn't looked too closely at lock DCs when I made my original post. The -10 to get an end result DC between 30 and 50 sounds perfectly adequate now that I've refreshed my memory of lock DCs. I realize clerics are quite powerful. However, I don't believe that giving a proficiency with bows is a significant enough to really boost their power level. Depends on the player, I guess. I know a couple who would mercilessly abuse the addition. If you can handle it, though, go for it. It's mostly a flavor thing, since even many peasants are trained with the bow in areas that follow the Silver Flame....and that training is represented by the Martial Weapon Proficiency: Longbow feat... If someone wants to make a cleric archer build, they could take the War domain......and use up one of their two domains... ...or be an elf......and lose a feat, a skill point per level, and two points of Con... I honestly think it's not very significant, and I think that since clerics *ARE* martially trained, and that archery is often used as a form of meditation and so forth by the Silver Flame, that Silver Flame clerics should be proficient with bows. It's mostly a flavor thing.And I disagree; I think it is very significant. The longbow is a combination of good damage, speed, crit and range that makes for an overall very effective weapon. Not all clerics are going to use a bow all the time, and not all of the ones who do are necessarily going to be any good at it -target shooting is one thing, combat archery is quite another. I think if a cleric has taken the time to honor his god by becomg proficient in that gods chosen weapon, he has either subsumed that weapon into the core of his faith (War domain), or has spent the time necessary to perfect the art on his own (Weapon Proficiency). Either way, the cleric isn't getting anything for free, which is as it should be. Clerics are martially trained, yes, but they aren't the Chruch's martial champions -that title belongs to the Paladins, who are proficient with the longbow and, as crusaders, are much more likely to be out on the front lines than the clerics and priests are, speaking from a fluff standpoint. Alternatively, instead of giving a straight benefit, I could make a Silver Flame organizational feat (Something like some other sects have, such as some of the monk feats or the gatekeepers). I like that idea, if only because most clergy of the Flame aren't going to be Clerics and Paladins at all -they're Adepts and Experts -but I can't think of any organization-specific feats that come with weapon proficiencies; that sort of thing is usually left to Prestige Classes. My basic thoughts on the matter are that Clerics (or anyone else for that matter) should get no special treatment when it comes to bonus weapon proficiencies -I'm not saying Core is balanced (we're discussing Clerics, for Soverign's sake...), but giving another useful bonus feat free to an already powerful class isn't going to help matters any. In short, yes, I believe this is too cheap. Greater marks are NOT incredibly rare to the point where you can't find one within the bounds of a given one of the Five Nations, and a 10,000 gp item is NOT prohibitively expensive for the upper classes. Perhaps you're right, but I thought we were speaking in context of adventuring parties, who do collect massive material wealth, yes, but rarely in the form of pure coin. By the time your average aventuring party has access to 10K in cash, they've probably just straight-up got access to the spell itself, whether through divine casting or Artificer assistance. There is also the questions of ability and willingness. Remember that the 'Mark has to expend one of his daily uses to power the altar, so if he's already blown all his uses/day, you're outta luck. The other factor, as I mentioned, is willingness. Yeah, Jorasco healers are depicted in the fluff as coin-operated, but I refuse to believe there isn't some sort of moral issue to deal with. Jorasco are, first and foremost, healers and helpers. It would seriously surprise me if they did not have an equivalent to the Hippocratic Oath, and let's face it, raising the dead is screwing with divinity no matter which way you slice it -even if a given healer has that ability, he may not want to use it in all but the most critical circumstances (Joe Adventurer drags his dead buddy in looking for REZ PLZ, he gets stiffed. Queen Aurala gets ganked the day before she signs a world-shaking treaty with Karrnath, she's back on her feet before lunch.) Play it however you like, but at least from a pure mechanical money standpoint, the party shouldn't have enough raw cash on them to pay for a res until about 13th level, at which point the cleric has access to the spell anyway (and the Artificer has had access since 11th). I think that orcs have something like enhanced senses and instincts, especially considering the numerous suggestions people have made about giving orcs the Scent feat as a racial feature. I think this could contribute to Survival. If not for half-orcs, I believe it fits for orcs. I suppose. Orcs straight from the MM don't have any special bonuses except for Darkvision and light sensetivity, and I don't really see a precedent for giving them a bunch of cool racials since they advance by character class anyway.
OneWinged4ngel 08-30-06, 05:32 AM	-I have rolled Open Lock completely into Disable Device already :P -Giving the Rogues Use Rope or Balance isn't going to completely narrow down that huge skill list. Use Rope, at least, was rarely taken to begin with. -I can wait a day to have the guy get another use of his mark tomorrow to cast Resurrection. My friend's not going to be any less ressurrectable or rich. I may bring back the altars in some (more reasonable) form, but for now they're just out. I would make it a pretty special thing, and by that I mean more special than burning a hunk of cash and a use of a dragonmark per day in a big city enclave. As far as messing with divinity, resurrection is stealing souls back from the Keeper. Perhaps there's an angry Marut around to make sure that people stay in Dolurrh, and that scares off the Jorascos. Perhaps it's something else. Regardless, I've not set up any such thing as it is. I hardly see a level 10+ player character as "Joe Adventurer" in Eberron, by the way. I also rather resent the comment that I must run an extremely high powered game because of this ruling. The only prohibitive factor would be cost, as it is now. I suppose the ruling for this would fall on whether you think rich nobles should have access to resurrection or not, or whether there is some extra force (like said marut) that give the Jorascos a reason not to be raising people outside of some emergency, like Queen Aurala tripping and piercing her neck on an upturned Sivis pen before signing the Treaty of Thronehold. -MM orcs and other monstrous races are designed as flat stat blocks, for the most part. -Clerics are knights of the church... the ECS says so. Also, it also says that it's common for peasants, adepts, or whatever to be proficient with bows... and I realize that this is represented by a feat, but no decently optimizing player character wants to spend a feat for proficiency.
Wolfwood2 08-30-06, 11:35 AM	I've made 'Disguise' a class skill for all Changelings, no matter what class they are. They might as well be able to use their one big racial ability without having to dip into rogue.
Koesherbacon 08-30-06, 03:02 PM	I've made 'Disguise' a class skill for all Changelings, no matter what class they are. They might as well be able to use their one big racial ability without having to dip into rogue. Totally agree with this point.
manneedshaircut 08-30-06, 05:18 PM	I diagree with the addition of the exocism ability to the Exorcist of the Silver Flame prestige class. I think that that takes an already extremely powerful clas for paladins and makes it that much better. Look at it this way: For a cleric to take this prestige class, he is voluntarily subsuming the usual stated purpose of the cleric (that is, to cast spells) and instead focusing on combat, usually, but not always, melee combat. Compared to Paladins who qualify for the EotSF, Clerics are weak in combat. They cannot use the best weapons and do not have a full BAB. And what do they get from the class? 4 lost spell levels, a bunch of abilities useful only in combat and the nice little bonus to Exorcism if they have it. For a Paladin taking the class, he is already in a great position: full BAB, full weapon proficiencies. And he gets one of the most useful lists of combat abilities I have ever seen. Without the need to algin his weapons permanently, and with the ability to do both fire and sacred damage, the Paladin can spend his money on getting more fun additions to his weapon, like vorpal or brilliant energy, when he would have been spending time and money adding abilities like Holy and forging weapons out of silver. Now the Paladin looks at the Cleric, and points and laughs. Except that, aha!, The cleric has this nice little ability that the Paladin doesn't get. It's not much, but it does help assuage the fact that the Paladin destroys the Cleric in combat, swinging his adamantine, silver, good, lawful +5 Brilliant Energy Keen Greatsword with +1d6 fire and +1d6 sacred damage, while the cleric attempts to defend with his similar morning star. A greatsword will outdamage a morning star anytime, and the paladin has more HP to boot. I also think that the fact that only clerics get the ability to actually exorcise demons is thematicaly appropriate. Paladins are front line soldiers, tending to fight corporeal manifestations of evil, while the Clerics are better equipped to deal with spiritual manifestations of evil. just my 2c
OneWinged4ngel 08-30-06, 10:55 PM	I diagree with the addition of the exocism ability to the Exorcist of the Silver Flame prestige class. I think that that takes an already extremely powerful clas for paladins and makes it that much better. Look at it this way: For a cleric to take this prestige class, he is voluntarily subsuming the usual stated purpose of the cleric (that is, to cast spells) and instead focusing on combat, usually, but not always, melee combat. Compared to Paladins who qualify for the EotSF, Clerics are weak in combat. They cannot use the best weapons and do not have a full BAB. And what do they get from the class? 4 lost spell levels, a bunch of abilities useful only in combat and the nice little bonus to Exorcism if they have it. For a Paladin taking the class, he is already in a great position: full BAB, full weapon proficiencies. And he gets one of the most useful lists of combat abilities I have ever seen. Without the need to algin his weapons permanently, and with the ability to do both fire and sacred damage, the Paladin can spend his money on getting more fun additions to his weapon, like vorpal or brilliant energy, when he would have been spending time and money adding abilities like Holy and forging weapons out of silver. Now the Paladin looks at the Cleric, and points and laughs. Except that, aha!, The cleric has this nice little ability that the Paladin doesn't get. It's not much, but it does help assuage the fact that the Paladin destroys the Cleric in combat, swinging his adamantine, silver, good, lawful +5 Brilliant Energy Keen Greatsword with +1d6 fire and +1d6 sacred damage, while the cleric attempts to defend with his similar morning star. A greatsword will outdamage a morning star anytime, and the paladin has more HP to boot. I also think that the fact that only clerics get the ability to actually exorcise demons is thematicaly appropriate. Paladins are front line soldiers, tending to fight corporeal manifestations of evil, while the Clerics are better equipped to deal with spiritual manifestations of evil. just my 2c So, you think that an 'exorcist' class should have no ability to actually exorcise anything? It's not as though the Exorcism ability is particularly powerful. Also, optimally a paladin going into Exorcist of the Silver Flame will be taking a level of Cleric anyways, as it IS better to be a cleric going into it. This is because you're getting a better spell progression. However, not everyone wants to go along with this when building an Exorcist. Furthermore... the cleric can still beat the paladin to a pulp in melee, and having a silver, good aligned, etc weapon with a +2d6 (average 7 damage) bonus is not going to change that. In fact, the benefit to the paladin is arguable; you get a lower HD and lose valuable caster levels for what is effectively the ability to bypass DR and add a few points of damage, which many don't have too much trouble with anyways. It *could* be more useful to get a few more casts of Rhino Charge or that spell that lets you reroll allies' saves or to gain a few more HP. I wouldn't call Exorcist of the Silver Flame an "extremely powerful class", though I would consider it a worthwhile one. Gaining full weapon proficiencies? You had that already... that's only a benefit for the cleric. Full BAB? Every other Paladin PrC has that... Forging weapons out of Silver? I can just carry around some Silversheen at a rather negligible cost by the point I care about having it. Good aligned weapon? I can get that with sooooo many things as a paladin why even try to list them all? Spells, smite feats... and why wouldn't I want a Holy Weapon anyways? I still get the benefit of a +2d6 damage bonus. When the cleric goes into Exorcist of the Silver Flame, he is gaining more combat abilities and he is gaining the ability to smite like a paladin, and he's still progressing in better casting, and he's not knocking down his HD. However, he is losing out in the single respect that he loses a few caster levels, which is worse for him because HIS CASTER LEVELS ARE BETTER. This doesn't change that a Cleric Exorcist will be smiting the place up just as well (or better if played right) than a paladin, and by decent levels the base damage difference between a morningstar and a greatsword isn't actually that huge, because you're relying more on bonuses and the like. I fail to see how that bonus 7 damage makes you "extremely powerful" when I can do over 100 a hit average with a level 7 paladin on a charging smite (PHB II) with barely any effort into optimizing (I take flavor feats, for godsakes), and just a +1 shocking greatsword. (This would be a character I'm playing right now). Exorcism isn't even much of a battle spell, and is more of a thematic role that the class is supposed to cover according to the flavor text that's right there! Also, an Exorcist of the Silver Flame isn't a normal paladin; she's an *EXORCIST* of the Silver Flame. Now why does she walk around with that honorary title and the accompanying role... if she can't actually exorcise things? It's hardly buffing a class to get something that a first level character can do *at will* at 6th level, and your idea of "extremely powerful" seems to be "actually gives benefits, with some offsets." Also... Clerics are in no way weak in combat, and I fail to see paladins destroying them and laughing. If you truly believe this, get anyone who knows how to play one into your group. They can pound a fighter flat. If you don't believe me, go onto the classes or charop boards. I'd also like to see how adding Exorcism is thematically out of place for an exorcist or how an at will level 1 ability is so terribly unbalancing... and if bypassing easy DRs (I still need to get things like Cold Iron) and getting 2d6 bonus damage are among the best combat abilities you've ever seen, look at more PrCs...
cancerousmango 08-30-06, 11:04 PM	Ugh, apparently I have to say something useful to post. Uh...house rules...well, I'm going to disallow certain metamagic combinations with artificers. There.
Azazyll 08-31-06, 12:15 AM	I'm a big fan of all these ideas, particularly the stuff about orcs and half orcs. They really need the flavor. I said so somewhere else before and then never got around to doing anything about it, so i'm glad someone else did. I agree with open lock and disable device, I also like the balance and tumble, not sure about the use rope and sleight of hand, but can certainly see your point from a game balance perspective. More radically, I've combined hide and move silently into sneak (a la Arcana Unearthed) and listen and spot into perception. I realize these are much more useful skills, but what do you think? maybe lower rogue skill points by two to make up for all the role-ins? I'd rather make longbows simple weapons in Thrane and crossbows martial. Maybe say the same for puritans in aundair, but that's the only other place I'd do it. Brelish and other flamers don't have the level of dedication in general, any of them who do should take a feat. I think the skill bonuses for the hobgoblins in craft and profession may be a little too vague, and perhaps a bit overgeneralized to all hobgoblins when in fact it would be better applied to only dhakanni hobgoblins. Maybe as part of a feat. I'd also give bugbears the Powerful Build ability. Racial hit dice in humanoid just aren't worth it otherwise, IMHO. Love the skills to Dragonmarked heir, was going to do something along those lines myself. I also liked the racial skill disguise to changelings idea. Makes sense. I've been toying with overhauling the common races in general, actually. Getting rid of bonuses against specific races especially, particularly for Eberron. Perhaps make up for it by overhauling their paragon classes (from Unearthed Arcana) or using racial classes, like Arcana unearthed. dwarves get a Small Build ability along the same lines as Powerful Build and remove the dodge bonus vs Giants. Dwarves would be the most unbalanced by all this, perhaps a -2 to dex (charisma is such a confused stat, and it just doesn't make sense for dwarves to have a -2 while ghouls get a +2). Elves lose the secret doors ability (very strange anyway, why just doors? maybe modify how they use the search rule), halve penalties for distance for perception tests (maybe replacing skill bonuses) and lose the con penalty (it doesn't seem right that they're so long lived when they're so frail, more prone to disease and poison). To balance humans, give them a lucky ability similar to halflings and more AP (or maybe even one extra action point a day, can only be used that day so they can't store them up). I think nonhumans should be more powerful than humans, but you could say that some humans (i.e. player characters) are just plain lucky, or favored by fate, or whatever, and that's what has given them the edge (that and breeding like rabbits, but with better hygene than goblins). Haven't really thought much about the little folk, excpet for giving a variety of spell-like ability arrays for gnomes, sort of a choose-your-lineage thing, particularly adding the wavecrest gnome idea from Stormwrack (speak with seagulls and know direction instead of ghost sound), since gnomes are such excellent sailors in eberron. Some of this may be extreme, but I like high powered games. Anyway, I really, really like this thread. Please post more stuff here!
OneWinged4ngel 08-31-06, 08:26 PM	You may have a point for the hobgoblin ability, and I do think it may be too vague... and that it might be more of a Dhakaani thing. I may pick a different ability... As for the other race overhauls, I'd have to look into it more (as well as get my hands on Arcana Unearthed and the like). I'm not really up for redoing all of the races at the moment, however. So far, I've simply addressed the ones that I thought needed it most immediately. I may yet turn my eye on bugbears, goblins, kobolds, and the like... but we'll see. If you want a complete race overhaul where you can play just about everything from level 1, I would suggest checking out Lotus Crane's rebalanced races, or perhaps K/Frank's LA fix. I can dig up these links on request... I'm still considering the idea of regional feats, though I think attributing bow proficiency to Thrane wouldn't be quite too accurate, as the Silver Flame is a major religion in much of Khorvaire. As for the spells that I reference in the "spells" section, here's a link that lists them all. They're basically extra-length prestidigitation effects you can use at will as a sorceror to give them that extra flair of natural magic accessibility... so they can have little flashy effects thrown in for RP without worrying about wasting those nice spells slots (Especially when cantrips get real useful when you take the new 'Versatile Spellcaster' feat from Races of the Dragon) Signature Cantrips (http://www.thetangledweb.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=1250) Working idea: Expanding Decipher Script! This skill is perfect for Cryptography: creating and deciphering codes. I'll have to work out the mechanics a bit. Anyways, it fits the skill pretty well (in my opinion), and Decipher Script is a rather underutilized skill. Codes and such can lead to another pulpy element, after all, and surely they would develop some for things like getting foolproof messages through sivis stations from spies or whatever. *shrug* Just added: Material Components are out! K explains the good reasons for this far better than I can in his noteworthy article, the Dungeonomicon (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?p=9483435). The relevant quote: Material Components: A Joke Gone Way Out of Hand Material components are a joke. I'm not saying that they are metaphorically a joke in that they don't act as a consistent or adequate limiting factor to spellcasting, I mean that they are actually a joke. Material components are supposed to be "ha ha" funny. The fact that even after having this brought to your attention, you still aren't laughing, indicates that this is a failed attempt at humor. Most material components are based on technological gags, when you cast scrying you are literally supposed to grab yourself a "specially treated" mirror, some wire, and some lemons – which is to say that you make a TV set to watch your target on and then power it with an archaic battery. When you cast see invisibility you literally blow talc all over the place – which of course reveals invisible foes. Casting lightning bolt requires you to generate a static charge with an amber rod and some fur, tongues requires that you build a little Tower of Babel, and of course fireball requires that you whip up some actual gunpowder. Get it? You're making the effects MacGuyver style and then claiming that it's "magic" after the fact. Are you laughing yet? Of course not, because that joke is incredibly lame and there's no way for it to hold your attention for several months of a continuous campaign.
OneWinged4ngel 09-02-06, 01:03 AM	I just came upon this thread (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=693261) and was enlightened to a little bit that certainly seems to be rather unintended. Just added: Psicrystals are like familiars in this respect, and cannot gain new abilities for rising in HD. ___ Also... a rough writeup for my Decipher Script expansion: (changes in bold) Decipher Script (Int; Trained Only) Check You can decipher writing in an unfamiliar language or a message written in an incomplete or archaic form. The base DC is 20 for the simplest messages, 25 for standard texts, and 30 or higher for intricate, exotic, or very old writing. If the check succeeds, you understand the general content of a piece of writing about one page long (or the equivalent). If the check fails, make a DC 5 Wisdom check to see if you avoid drawing a false conclusion about the text. (Success means that you do not draw a false conclusion; failure means that you do.) Decipher Script may also be used to crack codes. With an ample amount of sampling material (about 10 pages, or a good deal of repetition, etc), the DC to decipher a code is DC 20 for the simplest ciphers (like simple substitution ciphers), DC 25 for moderately complex codes, DC 30 for very complex ones, and DC 40 for the most truly uncrackable codes. The DC is raised by 5 for smaller samplings (about 1 page, or lack of any repetition, etc.). Both the Decipher Script check and (if necessary) the Wisdom check are made secretly, so that you can’t tell whether the conclusion you draw is true or false. See also: epic usages of Decipher Script. Action Deciphering the equivalent of a single page of script takes 1 minute (ten consecutive full-round actions). Deciphering a code takes 30 minutes, +30 minutes per 5 DC increase. Every 5 points by which you exceed the DC decreases the time taken to decipher the code by 10 minutes (to a minimum of ten minutes) Once a code is deciphered, applying the solution and ascertaining the rest of the text is often a simple matter. Also, Decipher Script can be treated as knowledge (Linguistics and Crytography). This knowledge of linguistics gives you insight into the meaning and nature of words, but doesn't allow you to actually speak another language. Synergy: 5 ranks in Speak Language gives a +2 bonus on Decipher Script checks Thoughts? Any feedback, criticism, opinions, or suggestions are most definitely welcome!
igotsmeakabob!! 09-02-06, 02:17 AM	Nice stuff... just wish that I had more than 1 campaign to play in.
OneWinged4ngel 09-02-06, 03:11 AM	Nice stuff... just wish that I had more than 1 campaign to play in. I'm actually still recruiting for an online Eberron chat game :rolleyes: :D Blatant self-promotion aside... *runs back to whatever he was doing before*
igotsmeakabob!! 09-02-06, 03:33 AM	Hmmm.. an online D&D game... well I've probably already done geekier things... how are you going to run it? just in a chat or in a program designed for online rpg stuff? Just asking, never did either but I've seen some cool programs used for that kind of stuff.
OneWinged4ngel 09-02-06, 03:39 AM	Ehh... this is hardly the place to discuss such things. PM me or, better yet, IM me and avoid clutterring the thread. I probably shouldn't have mentioned it in this post (that's what the classifieds are for) ^_^;;
OneWinged4ngel 09-05-06, 11:16 PM	Back on the real topic: Added a few new edits. Anyone have any ideas or house rules of their own they'd like to share? What does everyone think of the Decipher Script change? Should I add it? :confused:
Werebat 09-06-06, 08:40 PM	Lots of useful stuff here, thanks a lot for the post! I may consider using much of it in my upcoming Eberron campaign. One alternate fix I've seen for Hobgoblins that I like is to keep them as they are in the book (+1 LA and all) and give them a bonus fighter feat at 1st level (regardless of class). Simple, elegant, and fits flavorwise. - Ron ^*^
OneWinged4ngel 09-07-06, 12:43 AM	Lots of useful stuff here, thanks a lot for the post! I may consider using much of it in my upcoming Eberron campaign. One alternate fix I've seen for Hobgoblins that I like is to keep them as they are in the book (+1 LA and all) and give them a bonus fighter feat at 1st level (regardless of class). Simple, elegant, and fits flavorwise. - Ron ^*^ I still don't think that works well. The main reason is that the LA system just doesn't work. For one, LA will almost *always* screw you over for a great variety of classes (particularly casters). Then you've got crazy things like having PCs getting killed off by mookkillers like cloudkill (though that's not usually a problem with low LAs). Further, it contributes even more to shoehorning into a melee role (which is something all LAs generally do, since melee progressions are generally more linear in power growth as opposed to geometric, and often take more advantage of most LA traits) LA +0 is typically much more playable. LAs are always sort of bumpy, and if they're not nescessary (and they're not for hobgoblins) then there's no reason to keep them there. LAs are a poor system, but I've not decided on any sort of variants or anything to use yet (and it's not come up in my game yet, so it's not really a big thing on the board) However, I think there may a problem with my Hobgoblin fix, as someone suggested... and that would be the +2 to war-related things. It seems a bit vague, and may not apply so aptly to all hobgoblins. Any suggestions on what I could do as a replacement? Racial weapon proficiencies? A different skill? Or perhaps just the same thing with a bit more clarifiaction? What do you all think? I'm eager to hear some ideas.
makeshiftwings 09-07-06, 06:31 PM	Paper: I went about this problem from a different direction, namely by significantly increasing the "wage" of your average joe. Thus, the 1sp/day laborer earns 1gp/day instead. I did the same thing. The standard D&D economic model makes it so that after your very first level 1 adventure, the PC's are basically filthy rich in comparison to everyone else, with your average joe saying stupdi things like "WOW! A whole gold piece! Thanks mister!" This doesn't fit with my idea of Eberron's grittiness, or its wide magic. Default rules say the lowest level magical sword is worth about a hundred thousand loaves of bread. That seems ridiculous in Eberron... I think the setting seems more realistic with things normalized a bit... the price of bread goes up to at least 1sp, and the wage of normal workers goes up by a lot.
OneWinged4ngel 09-07-06, 08:26 PM	I did the same thing. The standard D&D economic model makes it so that after your very first level 1 adventure, the PC's are basically filthy rich in comparison to everyone else, with your average joe saying stupdi things like "WOW! A whole gold piece! Thanks mister!" This doesn't fit with my idea of Eberron's grittiness, or its wide magic. Default rules say the lowest level magical sword is worth about a hundred thousand loaves of bread. That seems ridiculous in Eberron... I think the setting seems more realistic with things normalized a bit... the price of bread goes up to at least 1sp, and the wage of normal workers goes up by a lot. I completely agree with raising the wage of normal workers, and have already done so in my game (as mentioned before) However, for the economy to really work you'd have to take it a bit further, since lots of things are just really out of proportion. Some are just outright absurd! For example, 10 pounds of iron costs 10sp (1sp a pound) yet a 10 pound iron pot is 5sp. Apparently, someone decided to go take his ten sp worth of stuff and put some work and effort into making it be worth half that much. But then again, by the crafting rules he spent 2.5 sp or something on creating it. There's just hundreds of silly little things like this. However, fixing up the screwy economy would take... a LOT of work :( I'm holding out to see if I can grab some stuff from K's Tome of Gears (especially eager to see what he does with the crafting system)
Werebat 09-07-06, 08:52 PM	I still don't think that works well. The main reason is that the LA system just doesn't work. For one, LA will almost *always* screw you over for a great variety of classes (particularly casters). Then you've got crazy things like having PCs getting killed off by mookkillers like cloudkill (though that's not usually a problem with low LAs). Further, it contributes even more to shoehorning into a melee role (which is something all LAs generally do, since melee progressions are generally more linear in power growth as opposed to geometric, and often take more advantage of most LA traits) LA +0 is typically much more playable. LAs are always sort of bumpy, and if they're not nescessary (and they're not for hobgoblins) then there's no reason to keep them there. LAs are a poor system, but I've not decided on any sort of variants or anything to use yet (and it's not come up in my game yet, so it's not really a big thing on the board) However, I think there may a problem with my Hobgoblin fix, as someone suggested... and that would be the +2 to war-related things. It seems a bit vague, and may not apply so aptly to all hobgoblins. Any suggestions on what I could do as a replacement? Racial weapon proficiencies? A different skill? Or perhaps just the same thing with a bit more clarifiaction? What do you all think? I'm eager to hear some ideas. Umm... A bonus fighter feat? :^) Locally, we use the option from Unearthed Arcana that lets you buy off LA, so a +1 LA isn't such a big deal in our games. I agree that Hobgobs don't seem like they really need it though... In fact in 3.0 they were LA +0. I like the bonus fighter feat thing, though. I'd drop their stat mods to make room for it if it came to that. - Ron ^*^
OneWinged4ngel 09-07-06, 09:01 PM	Umm... A bonus fighter feat? :^) Locally, we use the option from Unearthed Arcana that lets you buy off LA, so a +1 LA isn't such a big deal in our games. I agree that Hobgobs don't seem like they really need it though... In fact in 3.0 they were LA +0. I like the bonus fighter feat thing, though. I'd drop their stat mods to make room for it if it came to that. - Ron ^*^ I like how hobgoblins, as I have them right now, can be effective in any class, like humans. The fighter bonus feat seems to shoehorn them towards a melee role... and I like to avoid that if possible. Thanks for the idea, though :) Besides, +2 Con, some skills, Darkvision, and a feat would be pretty good... probably solidly better than a human unless you want a non-combat feat. Remember, limitations to certain types of abilities (like saying you can only get caster feats with a bonus feat, for example, or giving a +spell DC instead of +2 int) isn't really a balancing factor... it just means the class will be powerful in one role and less powerful in another, making it a tool to boost a class from a mechanical viewpoint. The guy who wants the combat feats anyways doesn't mind the limitation; it's what he wanted anyways.
Werebat 09-08-06, 05:52 AM	I like how hobgoblins, as I have them right now, can be effective in any class, like humans. The fighter bonus feat seems to shoehorn them towards a melee role... and I like to avoid that if possible. Thanks for the idea, though :) Besides, +2 Con, some skills, Darkvision, and a feat would be pretty good... probably solidly better than a human unless you want a non-combat feat. Remember, limitations to certain types of abilities (like saying you can only get caster feats with a bonus feat, for example, or giving a +spell DC instead of +2 int) isn't really a balancing factor... it just means the class will be powerful in one role and less powerful in another, making it a tool to boost a class from a mechanical viewpoint. The guy who wants the combat feats anyways doesn't mind the limitation; it's what he wanted anyways. Suit yourself. I think Hobgobs are SUPPOSED to be nudged toward being fighters, racially and culturally -- remember this is a culture of conquest and martial law. One combat feat doesn't necessarily force the Hobgobs hand, either -- even a wizard can use it to take Dodge, Weapon Focus: Ray, or something similarly useful. Solidly better than a human at being a fighter, maybe, but then again so are dwarves. That's the point. It's their preferred class. Actually I think +2 Con, a couple skill bonuses, Darkvision, and a fighter feat might make a decent +0 LA Hobgoblin. Maybe with a stat penalty to balance things out. Force the fighter feat to be Weapon Focus if you want to cut down on versatility. Remember, compared to the human they still have less skill points and less versatility in feat selection, which certainly counts for something. - Ron ^*^
OneWinged4ngel 09-08-06, 04:07 PM	Suit yourself. I think Hobgobs are SUPPOSED to be nudged toward being fighters, racially and culturally -- remember this is a culture of conquest and martial law. One combat feat doesn't necessarily force the Hobgobs hand, either -- even a wizard can use it to take Dodge, Weapon Focus: Ray, or something similarly useful. Solidly better than a human at being a fighter, maybe, but then again so are dwarves. That's the point. It's their preferred class. Actually I think +2 Con, a couple skill bonuses, Darkvision, and a fighter feat might make a decent +0 LA Hobgoblin. Maybe with a stat penalty to balance things out. Force the fighter feat to be Weapon Focus if you want to cut down on versatility. Remember, compared to the human they still have less skill points and less versatility in feat selection, which certainly counts for something. - Ron ^*^ Dwarves are better at lots of stuff... except anything that relies on Cha (like sorcerors). They make perfect wizards, too, for example. Dwarves are just darned good, mechanically. They don't really have fighter-specific bonuses. By the same note, elves don't get things that make them excellent wizards, like bonuses to the save DCs of their spells or anything. In fact, you might say dwarves have an advantage over them in the respect that dwarves get a +4 con leg up on them, and are thus less likely to go down in a hit with the flimsy hit die, and that the dex may not make up for that. On the flip side, elves get to sleep less, can search better, and get a handy dandy little weapon proficiency. Anyways, aside from the stat adjustments and sizes, all the core races seem to have abilities that can apply to all classes. Stat adjustments can turn races towards certain classes (like half-orc getting -2 int and cha and +2 strength turning them away from spellcasters), while size can discourage fighting classes (small weapon size and lack of mobility) I will still consider possibly giving something like a combat bonus representing the warlike culture of the hobgoblins, however.
OneWinged4ngel 09-10-06, 08:33 PM	Urban Tracking, Research, and Investigate seem to me to represent expanded uses of skills that lots of people already utilized anyways when such situations came up, and that the designers of Eberron wanted to add such things. However, adding such things as 'variants' would prevent them from being able to make classes based on the assumption that you could use your skills for these purpouses (like the Master Inquistive), and that Wizards never changes core... ever. Anyways, I've just taken these feats out altogether and made them expanded, complex uses of Gather Information, Knowledge, and Search. They all already seem to be things that would be covered by such skills (a scholar with great knowledge probably knows how to study and find out more, a person who can gather information socially could probably use it to determine where someone's going, and so forth.) Just added this.
Mort_Q 09-17-06, 01:49 PM	Thoughts? Any feedback, criticism, opinions, or suggestions are most definitely welcome! I like. Have you read/seen the extended skills & ability checks rules in Iron Heroes (http://www.montecook.com/cgi-bin/page.cgi?iron-lore) (am I allowed to mention that here?)? If you haven't, I think you'd find some stuff worth Yoinking.
OneWinged4ngel 09-17-06, 03:26 PM	I like. Have you read/seen the extended skills & ability checks rules in Iron Heroes (http://www.montecook.com/cgi-bin/page.cgi?iron-lore) (am I allowed to mention that here?)? If you haven't, I think you'd find some stuff worth Yoinking. I've not seen Iron Heroes, no. I might just take a look at it, however...
Neofish 09-17-06, 04:04 PM	Generally I like it, especially the half-orc and the half-elf. If I might add, I use weapon group feats in my campaigns, not only for the added boost of weapon focus, but also to add abit more flavor to the player's weapon choices. Anyway, my point it, for a Silver Flame Cleric you could just make a weapon group feat like so. Templar Training [General] your study of the silver flame faith also includes the training with the basic weapons of your religion. Prerequisites: Cleric level 1st. Must Whorship the Silver Flame. Benefit: You are profiecient with the Longbow, Composite Longbow and the Longsword. Anyway, hope this helps.
OneWinged4ngel 09-17-06, 04:12 PM	Generally I like it, especially the half-orc and the half-elf. If I might add, I use weapon group feats in my campaigns, not only for the added boost of weapon focus, but also to add abit more flavor to the player's weapon choices. Anyway, my point it, for a Silver Flame Cleric you could just make a weapon group feat like so. Templar Training [General] your study of the silver flame faith also includes the training with the basic weapons of your religion. Prerequisites: Cleric level 1st. Must Whorship the Silver Flame. Benefit: You are profiecient with the Longbow, Composite Longbow and the Longsword. Anyway, hope this helps. See, the thing is that the proficiency there doesn't help you out, and is pretty much a rather useless choice for a cleric to take. He can already get it by just taking the War domain (and getting the free bonus feat, weapon focus, with the bow as well). Also, why longsword? I was thinking of something more like making Zen Archery a Silver Flame thing, and combining that feat with a proficiency with bows. However, just giving them the proficiency doesn't really change balance much at all, so I see no problem with just doing that at this point. The War domain already gives you proficiency AND the weapon focus feat. You're not taking away from it... and considering you can just do this you've really got no reason to take martial weapon proficiency if you actually care about the bow in any way mechanically. If I made a feat, though, it'd be more like: Meditative Archery [General] Prerequisite: Worshipper of the Silver Flame Benefit: You gain proficiency with bows (if you do not already have them) and can use Wis instead of Dex for ranged attack rolls involving bows. This is actually sort of useful, while not retaining all the benefits of Zen Archery since it only works for bows instead of, say, your divine metamagiced extended Slay Living attacks. It still seems like a poor solution rather than just handing them the proficiency though. It's something small enough that it's mostly just flavor. Elves aren't substantially boosted by getting a racial proficiency, for example... why should anything else be? Why should I require them to take a feat instead of just getting the proficiency added on as a result of being a Cleric of the Silver Flame? Call it a substitution level or something.
Neofish 09-17-06, 04:31 PM	See, the thing is that the proficiency there doesn't help you out, and is pretty much a rather useless choice for a cleric to take. He can already get it by just taking the War domain (and getting the free bonus feat, weapon focus, with the bow as well). Also, why longsword? Well, considering that a Silver Flame Cleric doesnt have access to the War domain I thought it would be pretty useful. A longsword just seem to be a nice staple weapon for a knight/templar that would focus more on archery than melee. I was thinking of something more like making Zen Archery a Silver Flame thing, and combining that feat with a proficiency with bows. However, just giving them the proficiency doesn't really change balance much at all, so I see no problem with just doing that at this point. It's all you dude, just offering a suggestion. The War domain already gives you proficiency AND the weapon focus feat. You're not taking away from it... and considering you can just do this you've really got no reason to take martial weapon proficiency if you actually care about the bow in any way mechanically. Silver Flame= No War domain. If I made a feat, though, it'd be more like: Meditative Archery [General] Prerequisite: Worshipper of the Silver Flame Benefit: You gain proficiency with bows (if you do not already have them) and can use Wis instead of Dex for ranged attack rolls involving bows. This is actually sort of useful, while not retaining all the benefits of Zen Archery since it only works for bows instead of, say, your divine metamagiced extended Slay Living attacks. It still seems like a poor solution rather than just handing them the proficiency though. It's something small enough that it's mostly just flavor. Elves aren't substantially boosted by getting a racial proficiency, for example... why should anything else be? That's kinda blending multiple feats into one, isn't it? Proficiency with bows allows for a single character to gain 3 different weapon Proficiencies for the cleric (shortbow, longbow, greatbow, not to mention the composite counterparts) 2 of those are exotic, in addition, your trade a Cleric's throw away stat for their primary stat, very powerful as it will allow him to concentrate on a single stat for boosting his spellcasting and ranged attack power. My feat was just a limited focus, flavor feat a cleric would pick up at first level (weapon group variant from UA) that would add and diversify a whorshipper of the Silver Flame. And yes, Elven weapon proficiencies do help out, they give elven wizards and rogues and clerics access to weapons they otherwise wouldn't normally have, increase their situational diversity. Why should I require them to take a feat instead of just getting the proficiency added on as a result of being a Cleric of the Silver Flame? Call it a substitution level or something. Like I said, I use the UA weapon group variant, in which a first level character picks a certain number of weapon group feats such as the one I presented. Anyway, hope this helps.
OneWinged4ngel 09-17-06, 04:34 PM	Well, considering that a Silver Flame Cleric doesnt have access to the War domain I thought it would be pretty useful. A longsword just seem to be a nice staple weapon for a knight/templar that would focus more on archery than melee. It's all you dude, just offering a suggestion. Silver Flame= No War domain. :embarrass Wow, you're right. They don't normally get the War domain. I can't believe I overlooked something like that! In actuality, members of a certain sect get access to the War domain according to a supplement (a militant sect of the Silver Flame)... but this is not the norm. That's just what made me think they had it. My sincerest apologies for my faulty memory. If I made a feat, though, it'd be more like: That's kinda blending multiple feats into one, isn't it? Proficiency with bows allows for a single character to gain 3 different weapon Proficiencies for the cleric (shortbow, longbow, greatbow, not to mention the composite counterparts) 2 of those are exotic, in addition, your trade a Cleric's throw away stat for their primary stat, very powerful as it will allow him to concentrate on a single stat for boosting his spellcasting and ranged attack power. My feat was just a limited focus, flavor feat a cleric would pick up at first level (weapon group variant from UA) that would add and diversify a whorshipper of the Silver Flame. And yes, Elven weapon proficiencies do help out, they give elven wizards and rogues and clerics access to weapons they otherwise wouldn't normally have, increase their situational diversity. Like I said, I use the UA weapon group variant, in which a first level character picks a certain number of weapon group feats such as the one I presented. Anyway, hope this helps. Excuse me, I would probably clear that up to say "longbows, shortbows, composite shortbows, and composite longbows." I should say it's already been suggested that gaining proficiency with bows from a feat (as well as weapon focus) should apply generally to bows and their composite counterparts by Wizards of the Coast. Anyways, I would not intend to grant any exotic weapon proficiencies... heh. I did not intend to add anything like greatbows, and really that was just a for-instance sort of thing... I didn't really look over it closely. Anyways, it's not uncommon for classes to add things like a choice of class skills depending on your choice of specialization (such as a psion, for example) or something similar. I just thought it would be alright to give them the proficiency... since it's something that people want for flavor, but would be penalized for wasting a feat on (for example, why would you get a martial weapon proficiency feat for a longbow when you could grab exotic weapon proficiency for a greatbow? Or maybe something actually more useful to your class, like Scribe Scroll or Divine Ward?). Getting a martial proficiency feat is a waste of a feat for a cleric, pretty simply. It's something I'm willing to give out as a freebie. The thing is, I basically see all the clerics of the Silver Flame as being proficient with bows, at least as muchso as they would be with, say, maces. A lot of other people I know seem to think this too, but I don't want to make everyone waste a feat to be consistent with the concept. It seems like something that should come as a class feature, to me.
Neofish 09-17-06, 04:53 PM	:embarrass Wow, you're right. They don't normally get the War domain. I can't believe I overlooked something like that! In actuality, members of a certain sect get access to the War domain according to a supplement (a militant sect of the Silver Flame)... but this is not the norm. That's just what made me think they had it. My sincerest apologies. dude, no worries. Excuse me, I would probably clear that up to say "longbows, shortbows, composite shortbows, and composite longbows." I figured as much, I was just trying to point out that sometimes decisions without forethought will lead to confusion or abuse at a later date. Anyways, it's not uncommon for classes to add things like a choice of class skills depending on your choice of specialization (such as a psion, for example) or something similar. I just thought it would be alright to give them the proficiency... since it's something that people want for flavor, but would be penalized for wasting a feat on. Getting a martial proficiency feat is a waste of a feat, pretty simply. It's something I'm willing to give out as a freebie. No arguement from me dude. The thing is, I basically see all the clerics of the Silver Flame as being proficient with bows, at least as muchso as they would be with, say, maces. A lot of other people I know seem to think this too, but I don't want to make everyone waste a feat to be consistent with the concept. It seems like something that should come as a class feature, to me. Like I said, I use weapon group feats in which at first level a character gets to choose a number of them. All my idea would incorporate would be an option a first for a silver flame cleric to choose from at first level. For the most part, it's no different from you just adding it do a silver flame cleric's weapon prof. list. Just be prepaired for players of other faiths wishing to be proficient with their diety's favored weapon for free aswell.
OneWinged4ngel 09-17-06, 05:01 PM	dude, no worries. I figured as much, I was just trying to point out that sometimes decisions without forethought will lead to confusion or abuse at a later date. No arguement from me dude. The Like I said, I use weapon group feats in which at first level a character gets to choose a number of them. All my idea would incorporate would be an option a first for a silver flame cleric to choose from at first level. For the most part, it's no different from you just adding it do a silver flame cleric's weapon prof. list. Just be prepaired for players of other faiths wishing to be proficient with their diety's favored weapon for free aswell. Blood of Vol, Path of Light, Undying Court all have theirs free already. As for the Host, there's the clerics of Balinor, Onatar, Dol Dorn, and Dol Arrah, The Devourer, the Fury, the Keeper, and the Traveler not getting theirs free. Might have missed a couple... but eh. It doesn't seem to be as much a flavor issue for the others , and so far I've only heard questions about why the SF clerics don't have bows, and no one's even mentioned the others to me. Weapons of the deities are nice and flavorful, and no one wants to take the martial weapon proficiency. I might actually make the same allowance for other deities if the players came to me about it. It just seems to be more of a flavor issue for the SF than, say, the Sovereign Host.
Always-Late 09-17-06, 05:24 PM	Actually I think +2 Con, a couple skill bonuses, Darkvision, and a fighter feat might make a decent +0 LA Hobgoblin. Maybe with a stat penalty to balance things out. Force the fighter feat to be Weapon Focus if you want to cut down on versatility. Remember, compared to the human they still have less skill points and less versatility in feat selection, which certainly counts for something.So, mechanically a dwarf with +2 Cha, a couple skill bonuses, and a free Fighter feat. Or, if you're planning to go into fighter (Think about it: Who doesn't take weapon focus?,) it's a human with -1 skill points, +2 Con, and Darkvision. Or a medium-dized Kobold with -2 Dex, +4 Con, +4 Str, and a fighter feat. (Bad example, but it goes to show how far apart LA +0 can be.) I recommend that it be given a -2 to something, even if it's choice.
OneWinged4ngel 09-17-06, 05:39 PM	So, mechanically a dwarf with +2 Cha, a couple skill bonuses, and a free Fighter feat. Or, if you're planning to go into fighter (Think about it: Who doesn't take weapon focus?,) it's a human with -1 skill points, +2 Con, and Darkvision. Or a medium-dized Kobold with -2 Dex, +4 Con, +4 Str, and a fighter feat. (Bad example, but it goes to show how far apart LA +0 can be.) I recommend that it be given a -2 to something, even if it's choice. Yeah... I don't agree with the idea for a Fighter feat, as I've said.
OneWinged4ngel 09-21-06, 01:13 AM	Added ruling that construct related infusions such as disable construct can affect golems and similar creatures with spell immunity.
Tolby 09-21-06, 02:09 PM	I plan on changing the way HP are rolled. 1d4=1d4 1d6=1d4+2 1d8=1d4+4 1d10=1d4+6 1d12=1d4+8 This shifts the standard deviation of the big HD classes.
igotsmeakabob!! 09-21-06, 11:14 PM	I think that 1d4=1d2+2! yay!
OneWinged4ngel 09-22-06, 12:08 AM	I plan on changing the way HP are rolled. 1d4=1d4 1d6=1d4+2 1d8=1d4+4 1d10=1d4+6 1d12=1d4+8 This shifts the standard deviation of the big HD classes. That's not a bad idea; it certainly makes your class's hit die more meaningful.
Trollbasher 09-22-06, 05:17 PM	I like the flavor of all the house rules. We don't allow perma stat boast items. gloves of dex and such. Amazing how disallowing just one class of items totally altered the way my people fight. Jade Phoenix Mage is cheesetactically awesome. Just starting playing one and Arcane Wrath rules.
OneWinged4ngel 09-22-06, 07:42 PM	I like the flavor of all the house rules. We don't allow perma stat boast items. gloves of dex and such. Amazing how disallowing just one class of items totally altered the way my people fight. Jade Phoenix Mage is cheesetactically awesome. Just starting playing one and Arcane Wrath rules. Thanks for the positive feedback. On a side note, what's the JPM have to do with anything? o.0
OneWinged4ngel 09-30-06, 01:13 AM	A new idea: It's long been held that Charisma is... one of the less attractive stats. Only the 'face of the party' really needs it, and it doesn't have any benefits besides affecting skill bonuses (something EVERY ability score does along with other things) and being used by a few classes. Everybody needs Will saves or skill points. What can Charisma give uniquely? Charisma is what makes you that dashing hero you are! So what makes you a dashing hero besides a bonus to diplomacy or something? Why, ACTION POINTS, of course! How about if you gained a bonus on action points per level equal to your charisma modifier? Your force of personality can be used to push you farther, taking you above and beyond what you can normally do. By the same note, a low charisma means you have a weak and flaccid or meek personality, rather than being that big-time hero. Your Charisma penalty takes away from your action points per level. This makes Charisma do something for everyone, and stops it from being a dump stat. This would, of course, use your *inherent* charisma, much like the skill bonus from int only uses your inherent intelligence. Thus, you don't gain or lose an action point from putting on or taking off a cloak of charisma. Your thoughts?
HarmonysRage 09-30-06, 01:22 AM	I actually give 3 + 1/2 lvl rounded down + CHA Mod AP/lvl
Eela6 09-30-06, 02:16 PM	I can see some inherent things you'd have to clarify for this to work. First off - Temporary Charisma. Let's say I have a 12th level Aasimar bard who started with 19 (17) Charisma. She put all three points into Charisma, giving her a base of 22 Charisma. From there, she has the spell Inner Beauty cast upon her (Fiend Folio I), giving her an additional +4 Charisma, and also Eagle's Splendor, for an additional +4. She has 30 Charisma now. Are her action points based off this or her base, 22 Charisma? What's the case for 'almost temporary' buffs? (Persistent ones recast daily? Items of +X to a stat?) Do they add to action points? Or is it like Intelligence, where it's only the base that counts? Secondly - How does this work with NPCs? Do they simply 'not get all that much benefit' from Charisma, making it the 'only for flavor' NPC stat (as it always has been, since cha-based diplomacy skills [with the exception of bluff] don't work on PCs. Please clarify.
OneWinged4ngel 09-30-06, 03:16 PM	I can see some inherent things you'd have to clarify for this to work. First off - Temporary Charisma. Let's say I have a 12th level Aasimar bard who started with 19 (17) Charisma. She put all three points into Charisma, giving her a base of 22 Charisma. From there, she has the spell Inner Beauty cast upon her (Fiend Folio I), giving her an additional +4 Charisma, and also Eagle's Splendor, for an additional +4. She has 30 Charisma now. Are her action points based off this or her base, 22 Charisma? What's the case for 'almost temporary' buffs? (Persistent ones recast daily? Items of +X to a stat?) Do they add to action points? Or is it like Intelligence, where it's only the base that counts? Secondly - How does this work with NPCs? Do they simply 'not get all that much benefit' from Charisma, making it the 'only for flavor' NPC stat (as it always has been, since cha-based diplomacy skills [with the exception of bluff] don't work on PCs. Please clarify. I've already clarified most all of this in the original post, if you would just read more closely. Please look where I wrote... This would, of course, use your *inherent* charisma, much like the skill bonus from int only uses your inherent intelligence. Thus, you don't gain or lose an action point from putting on or taking off a cloak of charisma. Action points are based off *inherent* charisma. Thus, if you get buffed, you don't get more AP. I've said it's like intelligence. Secondly... NPCs still have to take Heroic Spirit to get AP.
Eela6 09-30-06, 03:24 PM	I apologize, I didn't see the part qualifying Inherent Charisma. However, I have one more point to clarify about NPCs. While they require Heroic Spirit to gain Action Points, do they gain (3+Cha) Action points per level once they have the feat? Or simply just 3 action points from the feat?
OneWinged4ngel 09-30-06, 03:36 PM	I apologize, I didn't see the part qualifying Inherent Charisma. However, I have one more point to clarify about NPCs. While they require Heroic Spirit to gain Action Points, do they gain (3+Cha) Action points per level once they have the feat? Or simply just 3 action points from the feat? Since it probably doesn't even really matter (What NPCs are using more than 3 AP in their fights with the PCs?) I just sorta glossed over that detail. I suppose I'd give them just the 3 AP. However, one might certainly decide that such noteworthy, repeat NPCs might deserve 3+Cha, or 3+(1/2)Cha, rounded down. *shrug*
HarmonysRage 10-01-06, 05:12 AM	We've used the 3+CHA (Perm score only) rule for AP since 2004. I thank Johnny O'Niel for the help with that... What ever happened to him?
Save-vs-DM 10-01-06, 07:13 AM	Here are our current house rules: Edits: Changed how forced casting works. Background Feats Any player who submits a background prior to the first play session receives a free background feat taken from the list below. This background feat must fit the background you submitted. Submitting a background is an excellent way to get personal adventures styled around your character. Because this campaign is focused around Aundair, you must either be from Aundair or have a very good reason to support that nation. Background Feats: Acrobatic, Agile, Alertness, Animal Affinity, Athletic, Deceitful, Diligent, Education, Investigator, Magical Aptitude, Negotiator, Nimble Fingers, Persuasive, Research, Self-Sufficient, Skill Focus, Stealthy, Toughness. Alternative background feats may be granted at DM discretion. Races The following changes have been made to the Player’s Handbook races. Half-Elf Half-elves have all the normal game statistics plus: • 4 extra skill points at 1st level and 1 extra skill point at each additional level, since half-elves inherit the versatility of their human parents. Half-Orc Half-orcs have all the normal game statistics plus: • +2 racial bonus on saving throws against fear: Half-Orcs are difficult to frighten. • +2 racial bonus on saving throws against natural diseases: Half-Orcs are hardy and resistant to most common diseases. • +2 racial bonus on Survival checks: Half-Orcs are adept at surviving by their wits alone. • +4 racial bonus on Intimidate checks: Half-Orcs are large and intimidating. • Weapon Familiarity: Half-Orcs may treat the orc double axe as a martial weapon, rather than an exotic weapon. Hobgoblin Hobgoblins have the following changes: • Hobgoblins do not gain a +4 racial bonus on Move Silently checks. • Level Adjustment: +0 Orc Orcs have all the normal game statistics plus: • +2 racial bonus on saving throws against fear: Orcs are difficult to frighten. • +2 racial bonus on saving throws against natural diseases: Orcs are hardy and resistant to most common diseases. • +2 racial bonus on Survival checks: Orcs are adept at surviving by their wits alone. • +4 racial bonus on Intimidate checks: Orcs are large and intimidating. • Weapon Familiarity: Orcs may treat the orc double axe as a martial weapon, rather than an exotic weapon. Classes The following changes have been made to the Player’s Handbook classes. Skill Points per Level All classes gain an additional 2 skill points per level (8 at 1st level). Sorcerer • The sorcerer gains Eschew Materials as a bonus feat at first level. • Sorcerers gain Forced Casting at 1st level (see below). Wizard • The cost to scribe a spell into your spellbook is equal to the gold piece cost of scribing a scroll of the same level. • Wizards gain Forced Casting at 1st level (see below). Forced Casting (Ex): You can attempt to cast more spells per day than normal. To force cast a spell you must succeed on a Concentration check (DC 15 + 2 x spell level + 1 for each previous attempt). If you succeed on this check, you can either cast a spell known (if you cast spells spontaneously) or a spell you have mastered with the Spell Mastery feat without expending a spell slot. You take 1 point of subdual damage per spell level after casting the spell, as the effort required is taxing on your body. If you fail the Concentration check, you must make a Fortitude save (DC 10 + spell level) or take 1d6 points of subdual damage per level of the spell. You may force cast a 0 level spell with a DC 10 Concentration check. If you fail this check you are dazed for the rest of the round. Wizards may force cast any cantrip they have in their spellbook. You may not take 10 on Concentration checks when force casting a spell. Action Points The following changes have been made to action points: Characters now gain 3 + ˝ character level action points at each level (instead of 5 + ˝ level). Your pool of action points now refreshes at the start of each adventure. Skills The following changes have been made to skills. • Open Lock has been folded into the Disable Device skill. Any prestige class that requires the Open Lock skill now requires an equal number of ranks of Disable Device. ------------------------------------------------------- Thing's I've been toying with: Folding Hide and Move Silently into a single Stealth skill. I honestly find that rolling both Hide and Move Silently for stealth to be rather pointless. If someone is sneaky, why wouldn't they just be good at both? Folding Listen and Spot into a single Alertness skill. As with Hide and Move Silently, this just takes too much time. Plus it cuts down on the "Oh, I failed my Spot check, can I roll Listen?" It would also allow for other senses to be rolled, such as touch or smell. That's about it. Cheers, Save vs DM
Neofish 10-01-06, 01:19 PM	Thing's I've been toying with: Folding Hide and Move Silently into a single Stealth skill. I honestly find that rolling both Hide and Move Silently for stealth to be rather pointless. If someone is sneaky, why wouldn't they just be good at both? Folding Listen and Spot into a single Alertness skill. As with Hide and Move Silently, this just takes too much time. Plus it cuts down on the "Oh, I failed my Spot check, can I roll Listen?" It would also allow for other senses to be rolled, such as touch or smell. That's about it. Cheers, Save vs DM Staying put i nthe shadows and creeping on your tip toes are to different things in my opinion, that's why there are 2 different skills for them. One deals with knowing where to hide the bulk of your mass from sight. The other deals with proper weight and foot placement while moving. Same thing with Spot listen. Seeing a dude down a corridor is different from hearing a dude around a corner. One deals with a purely visual effect while one deals with sonic one.
OneWinged4ngel 10-01-06, 02:19 PM	Here are our current house rules: Background Feats Any player who submits a background prior to the first play session receives a free background feat taken from the list below. This background feat must fit the background you submitted. Submitting a background is an excellent way to get personal adventures styled around your character. Because this campaign is focused around Aundair, you must either be from Aundair or have a very good reason to support that nation. Background Feats: Acrobatic, Agile, Alertness, Animal Affinity, Athletic, Deceitful, Diligent, Education, Investigator, Magical Aptitude, Negotiator, Nimble Fingers, Persuasive, Research, Self-Sufficient, Skill Focus, Stealthy, Toughness. Alternative background feats may be granted at DM discretion. Races The following changes have been made to the Player’s Handbook races. Half-Elf Half-elves have all the normal game statistics plus: • 4 extra skill points at 1st level and 1 extra skill point at each additional level, since half-elves inherit the versatility of their human parents. Half-Orc Half-orcs have all the normal game statistics plus: • +2 racial bonus on saving throws against fear: Half-Orcs are difficult to frighten. • +2 racial bonus on saving throws against natural diseases: Half-Orcs are hardy and resistant to most common diseases. • +2 racial bonus on Survival checks: Half-Orcs are adept at surviving by their wits alone. • +4 racial bonus on Intimidate checks: Half-Orcs are large and intimidating. • Weapon Familiarity: Half-Orcs may treat the orc double axe as a martial weapon, rather than an exotic weapon. Hobgoblin Hobgoblins have the following changes: • Hobgoblins do not gain a +4 racial bonus on Move Silently checks. • Level Adjustment: +0 Orc Orcs have all the normal game statistics plus: • +2 racial bonus on saving throws against fear: Orcs are difficult to frighten. • +2 racial bonus on saving throws against natural diseases: Orcs are hardy and resistant to most common diseases. • +2 racial bonus on Survival checks: Orcs are adept at surviving by their wits alone. • +4 racial bonus on Intimidate checks: Orcs are large and intimidating. • Weapon Familiarity: Orcs may treat the orc double axe as a martial weapon, rather than an exotic weapon. Classes The following changes have been made to the Player’s Handbook classes. Skill Points per Level All classes gain an additional 2 skill points per level (8 at 1st level). Sorcerer • The sorcerer gains Eschew Materials as a bonus feat at first level. • Sorcerers gain Forced Casting at 1st level (see below). Wizard • The cost to scribe a spell into your spellbook is equal to the gold piece cost of scribing a scroll of the same level. • Wizards gain Forced Casting at 1st level (see below). Forced Casting (Ex): You can attempt to cast more spells per day than normal. To force cast a spell you must succeed on a Concentration check (DC 15 + spell level + 1 for each previous attempt). If you succeed on this check, you can either cast a spell known (if you cast spells spontaneously) or a spell you have mastered with the Spell Mastery feat without expending a spell slot. If you fail the Concentration check, you take 1d6 points of subdual damage per level of the spell. You may force cast a 0 level spell with a DC 10 Concentration check. If you fail this check you are dazed for the rest of the round. Wizards may force cast any cantrip they have in their spellbook. You may not take 10 on Concentration checks when force casting a spell. Action Points The following changes have been made to action points: Characters now gain 3 + ˝ character level action points at each level (instead of 5 + ˝ level). Your pool of action points now refreshes at the start of each adventure. Skills The following changes have been made to skills. • Open Lock has been folded into the Disable Device skill. Any prestige class that requires the Open Lock skill now requires an equal number of ranks of Disable Device. ------------------------------------------------------- Thing's I've been toying with: Folding Hide and Move Silently into a single Stealth skill. I honestly find that rolling both Hide and Move Silently for stealth to be rather pointless. If someone is sneaky, why wouldn't they just be good at both? Folding Listen and Spot into a single Alertness skill. As with Hide and Move Silently, this just takes too much time. Plus it cuts down on the "Oh, I failed my Spot check, can I roll Listen?" It would also allow for other senses to be rolled, such as touch or smell. That's about it. Cheers, Save vs DM Looks like you came up with the same solution I did for many of the races, except that your bonus to intimidate is a bit bigger ^_^ Focused Casting, however, bothers me a bit. It seems like you could very easily double or triple your castings per day... and subdual damage won't even *do* anything to you unless you're in combat. You could just keep going and going and going... it just seems very abuseable. The background feats idea sounds nifty, as it can help differentiate characters a bit more according to their background, and lets some of the less optimal feats see the light of day.
Save-vs-DM 10-01-06, 08:42 PM	Focused Casting, however, bothers me a bit. It seems like you could very easily double or triple your castings per day... and subdual damage won't even *do* anything to you unless you're in combat. You could just keep going and going and going... it just seems very abuseable. Yeah, it seems like it would let you go on forever, but the DCs start getting really rediculous rather quickly. We're going a slight rethink on this one. Save vs DM
taski 10-02-06, 12:52 AM	OneWinged4ngel, you might want to have a look at the expanded Decypher Script rules in Complete Adventurer (p. 98). It handles code-breaking/making as an opposed check. That seems like a good way to handle it, but your durations for decyphering make more sense than theirs (the Complete Adventurer doesn't take into account that tougher codes should take longer to decypher).
OneWinged4ngel 10-02-06, 12:53 AM	OneWinged4ngel, you might want to have a look at the expanded Decypher Script rules in Complete Adventurer (p. 98). It handles code-breaking/making as an opposed check. That seems like a good way to handle it, but your durations for decyphering make more sense than theirs (the Complete Adventurer doesn't take into account that tougher codes should take longer to decypher). Thanks! I'll look into that. On focused casting again... it's worth noting that it's really easy to buff up Concentration, and moreover... even if you can't make the concentration check, it's subdual damage! You can shrug it off after a few minutes. This basically means you can take the hit without any worry at all for out of combat spells.
Save-vs-DM 10-03-06, 04:40 AM	On focused casting again... it's worth noting that it's really easy to buff up Concentration, and moreover... even if you can't make the concentration check, it's subdual damage! You can shrug it off after a few minutes. This basically means you can take the hit without any worry at all for out of combat spells. IN general, yeah. But there are a few things about our games (that and I changed how it works slightly, it's a concentration check and you still take damage, but if you fail the check, you have to make a Fort save to avoid taking even more damage). 1. We hardly ever play past level 10 at the highest, so spellcasters never really get "the cool spells." Most people will play fighter types over spellcasters, becuase it's all the sucky levels and very few of the fun levels. 2. We have low magic and low item games...I can't remember the last time we actually handed out an item that granted a skill bonus. My artificer only even had enough gold to barely make an item of +5 UMD. It's not going to work for all games, but in most games, the spellcasters don't need this kind of help. In our games, they kind of do, since we're a very low level kind of group. Though I have to say, I really like that it's tied to Spell Mastery for wizards...it makes that feat worth it beyond "what spells do I master in case I'm ever captured and stripped of my spellbook. Cheers, Save vs DM
operations 10-03-06, 06:57 PM	Paper: I went about this problem from a different direction, namely by significantly increasing the "wage" of your average joe. Thus, the 1sp/day laborer earns 1gp/day instead. Really makes sense. As the 'technology' curve goes up IRL, so the average wage follows. In this case, the 'technology' curve is magic, and the blood empires of the Dragonmarked houses.
OneWinged4ngel 10-05-06, 01:10 AM	Really makes sense. As the 'technology' curve goes up IRL, so the average wage follows. In this case, the 'technology' curve is magic, and the blood empires of the Dragonmarked houses. Sure enough!
OneWinged4ngel 10-06-06, 12:57 PM	Two things have come up: One, I've decided to remove the Balance, Use Rope, Sleight of Hand, and Tumble skill combinations. I've been iffy about these for a while, and decided to just take 'em out. Two, I'm considering a change to the Action Point rule: Cha doesn't give you *MORE* action points, but instead modifies your AP roll. For example, someone with 16 Cha would roll 1d6+3 for their AP, instead of being able to roll that d6 more times than someone with low Cha. This was suggested on the House Rules board. So, the choice is... does Charisma make you use AP better/worse, or does it give you more/less of them?
ryanroyce 10-06-06, 04:17 PM	nevermind... that'll teach me to post before reading the whole thread. :embarrass:
travellersside 10-10-06, 08:30 AM	I'm considering a change to the Action Point rule: Cha doesn't give you *MORE* action points, but instead modifies your AP roll. For example, someone with 16 Cha would roll 1d6+3 for their AP, instead of being able to roll that d6 more times than someone with low Cha. This was suggested on the House Rules board. So, the choice is... does Charisma make you use AP better/worse, or does it give you more/less of them? Well, from a certain point of view, using an AP to boost your roll won't have a major impact. It's only an average of +3.5 (increases slightly at higher levels). Since you can only do this once for each roll, getting more APs doesn't matter all that much. It's certainly a nice thing to have, but it doesn't change the expected results very much, just how often you can do this. It has more of an effect on fuelling abilities, but again, if you know what you're doing, you're probably not running too short normally. Getting +Cha uses just gives you a bit more leeway in when you can use them. However. If you add base Cha to the roll, it gets more troublesome. You won't be able to fuel abilities any more than in the base rules, but when you're adding to roll, the expected results will be heavily skewed. The problem is that some classes really like a high Cha. Really, really like it. I'm mostly thinking of bards and sorcs, although paladins certainly come into it. If you're playing a sorc or bard, you should have at least a 16 Cha at level 1. You're also probably going to put your HD stats into Cha too, which means that when it comes time to add Cha to an AP roll, you're going to probably get roughly double what most people get. At level 8, you're going to have at least an 18 Cha. Consequently, even on a minimum AP result, you've got a guaranteed +5 on your roll. The higher you push your charisma, the better you'll get. However, since the average party member (from a non-Cha class) is likely to have no more than a base Cha of 12, and unlikely to increase this, he gets little appreciable benefit. Basically: If you add Cha to your roll, it applies in less situations. This means that there's less incentive to take a decent Cha, since unless it's going to be particularly good, you only get a minor bonus when you roll. If you are likely to want to use APs for any other purposes, Cha has no effect, so you just dump it. On the other hand, if Cha affects the number of APs, there's a genuine use for everyone. It's still true that some will benefit more than others, but even the ones with a comparatively low Cha will still see an increase in flexibility. Just an opinion. ;)
Euangelion 10-10-06, 10:59 AM	Dragonmark Heir I think that Dragonmarked Heirs should get a class skill based on their dragonmark, based on the bonuses they receive to skills, unless they already have those skills as class skills. Something like, as follows: Mark of Detection: Spot Mark of Finding: Search Mark of Handling: Handle Animal Mark of Healing: Heal Mark of Hospitality (Diplomacy is already a Dragonmarked Heir class skill. Hmm...): Knowledge (local) Mark of Making: Craft Mark of Passage: Survival Mark of Scribing: Decipher Script Mark of Sentinel (Sense Motive already a class skill): Listen Mark of Shadow (Gather Info too): Disguise Mark of Storm: Balance Mark of Warding: Search This house rule was gotten from somewhere on these boards, but I cannot recall who posted this dragonmarked heir variant. Props to whoever it was... and if I can find out I'll give credit where it's due. I think that this class should also have Craft and Profession as class skills. ( I can't remember if this is in the errata, but the D&D site seems to be down at the moment.) Also, I suggest that those whose region of origin is Thrane should treat the longbow and shortbow as simple weapons (because, really, they are), but not the composite versions of each. Thus even Thranish commoners can be proficient in either the longbow or shortbow without being less skilled in their crafts or professions than those of other nations (in other words, they don't lose out on Skill Focus (Profession [farmer]) just because they happen to know how to use a longbow.) This fits with what's been said about Thrane being able to field large units of archers during the Last War. Monks and wizards (and any other class that doesn't have full access to all simple weapons, except perhaps druid) from Thrane can select to be proficient in the longbow and shortbow in place of their crossbow proficiency. Then maybe there could be a Thranish version of the Mror Stalwart or Shadow Marches Warmonger feats for the bow available to any native of Thrane despite their race (since it won't grant an exotic weapon proficiency as part of the feat).
OneWinged4ngel 10-12-06, 04:54 PM	Added two minor rules... that natural attacks can now deal 0 damage instead of minimum one (so that no one's getting killed by rats, which we all know is retarded as hell unless it's some sort of giant swarm), and a bit of a change to Warmages.
Dcourt99 10-12-06, 11:26 PM	I talked to my DM about peoples concerns with Persistant Spell. Specificly about spells like Wraithstrike and the like. He didn't want to completely ban the feat so he decided that Presistant wouldn't work on any spell that looked like it was designed to be short term. Specificly any spells with a duration of 1 round. That way you can still have persistant Bull's Strength and the like, but not presistant Wraithstrike. Thought I'd mention that here to see what other people thought of the ruling.
Elemental_Elf 10-13-06, 01:21 AM	-Warmages use Intelligence as their casting stat, because they are practiced spellcasters. It never really has made sense for them to use Charisma. In addition, Warmages gain Read Magic and Detect Magic on their spell lists. Shame on the creators of this class for not including those spells! Shame! This is the only ruling I have a problem with. Warmages are not practiced spellcasters... Well they are but sense they can cast any spell on their list, that's a CHA dominate caster not an INT. Warmages use their spells by getting a rush from battle, from their own will to survive and achieve higher skills and spells. They fight and cast not for intellectual curiosity but for fighting for their nation/college and their superiors. To me Warmages are the types of people that should have been Fighters but happened to possess a knack for casting and so they became Fighter/Casters. Also I don't think Warmages should have the Read Magic spell. I never saw Warmages learning their spells from books; they learn them through example of their teachers and compatriots. Each Warmage has the same spell list then that leads one to believe there is a homogenized lesson plan that all Warmages follow. To me it feels out of place to allow Warmages to Read Magic. I don't see the Warmages going of to Hogwarts and letting their imaginations flow in and out of thousands of books, developing the skills necessary for a wondrous fanciful life free of hardship. No, no the Warmage's training is like Boot camp; hard, dirty, boorish far from the fanciful fairy tales of Hogwarts. They train and train and train. They don't go to camp to learn ‘social’ spells and social skills, they're there to learn war tactics and cast spells so their nation/college can live to fight another day. To me Charisma is the perfect attribute to guide the Warmage's spells because, as the SRD says, Charisma measures a character’s force of personality [and] ability to lead, which I interpret as meaning Warmage's ability to Lead (crucial in War, especially considering Warmages would be like officers as they are highly trained and rarer then the average grunt) and their ability to inspire their men and comrades to continue even in the face of over whelming adversity. Ugh, I'm tired so I can't vocalize my complaint very well, sorry.
OneWinged4ngel 10-13-06, 02:10 AM	This is the only ruling I have a problem with. Warmages are not practiced spellcasters... Well they are but sense they can cast any spell on their list, that's a CHA dominate caster not an INT. Warmages use their spells by getting a rush from battle, from their own will to survive and achieve higher skills and spells. They fight and cast not for intellectual curiosity but for fighting for their nation/college and their superiors. To me Warmages are the types of people that should have been Fighters but happened to possess a knack for casting and so they became Fighter/Casters. Also I don't think Warmages should have the Read Magic spell. I never saw Warmages learning their spells from books; they learn them through example of their teachers and compatriots. Each Warmage has the same spell list then that leads one to believe there is a homogenized lesson plan that all Warmages follow. To me it feels out of place to allow Warmages to Read Magic. I don't see the Warmages going of to Hogwarts and letting their imaginations flow in and out of thousands of books, developing the skills necessary for a wondrous fanciful life free of hardship. No, no the Warmage's training is like Boot camp; hard, dirty, boorish far from the fanciful fairy tales of Hogwarts. They train and train and train. They don't go to camp to learn ‘social’ spells and social skills, they're there to learn war tactics and cast spells so their nation/college can live to fight another day. To me Charisma is the perfect attribute to guide the Warmage's spells because, as the SRD says, Charisma measures a character’s force of personality [and] ability to lead, which I interpret as meaning Warmage's ability to Lead (crucial in War, especially considering Warmages would be like officers as they are highly trained and rarer then the average grunt) and their ability to inspire their men and comrades to continue even in the face of over whelming adversity. Ugh, I'm tired so I can't vocalize my complaint very well, sorry. And yet whether it's books or boot camp, they're still casting the spells like a Wizard rather than naturally, like a Sorceror. *shrug* Also, I'm familiar with the idea of warmages training and training and training :). I talked to my DM about peoples concerns with Persistant Spell. Specificly about spells like Wraithstrike and the like. He didn't want to completely ban the feat so he decided that Presistant wouldn't work on any spell that looked like it was designed to be short term. Specificly any spells with a duration of 1 round. That way you can still have persistant Bull's Strength and the like, but not presistant Wraithstrike. Thought I'd mention that here to see what other people thought of the ruling. The thing is, I could abuse even this to get a 50 in all my stats all day. I'm not quite sure of the particulars, but a friend of mine who's good at powergaming has pointed it out to me how you could synergize the various spells in the PHB (and some spell compendium and such) and fill up a good portion of your spell list with Divine Metamagic (Persistent) to end up with utterly ridiculous stats. Persistent Spell is mostly broken with Divine Metamagic. It's only really broken with a few arcane spells (like Wraithstrike). It's also worth noting that with the 24 hour duration, you don't actually need to take up any of your spell slots. The night before you adventure, you cast your spells you want the next day, then rest 8 hours. You've now got your spells running for 16 hours (pretty much all the time of the next day you'll be awake) and get to refill your spell list. Persistent Spell is highly abusable in a variety of ways. I find it far easier to just ban it, since no one really needs its function.
Neofish 10-13-06, 02:26 AM	This is the only ruling I have a problem with. Warmages are not practiced spellcasters... Well they are but sense they can cast any spell on their list, that's a CHA dominate caster not an INT. Really? Explain the Assassin's spell list then? A magewright doesnt use a spellbook, but he still uses Int as the base stat for his spells. All it says is that he learns to recite those spells by memory so he doesnt need to bother with a spellbook, why should the Warmage be any different? Surly the Warcolleges could train the would be wizard into memorizing all the spells he will ever need on hte battlefield. Day in and day out, all a warmage does is recite lines of arcane text after text, being drilled on how to ponouce and sound every word from memory, even while perfoming so other taxing battlefield maneuver. I don't see WarMages as leaders, they'd be traind as Marshals or Knights or Fighters if they were meant to be leaders, no, the Warmage is a walking piece of artillery, not a like a regular foot slogger. I agree with OnewingedAngel about Warmages, they are mass produced Wizards, not unique and passonate Sorcerers. I've been using the same variant for quite some time and me and my player all feel it fits the Warmage better. Infact, I have been using it for some good RP aswell. I use the angle that during the war, almost every wizard was enlisted to his respected nation, so almost no wizards were training apprentinces. Instead, those who pocessed and knack for spellcasting were enlisted into warcolleges and became Warmages. They got the chance to learn the arcane art like they wanted, but it was in a limited format. So, im Campaign, Warmages are somewhat tragic, because they pocessed the potential to become great Wizards, but due to the war, were forced to settle for becoming weapons of war. EDIT- Also, OnewingedAngel, Might I suggest you do the same for Spellthieves. It seems to me that their spell progression if from picking up a few spells from captured spellbooks and just learning little tricks form constant exposure from enemy casters.
OneWinged4ngel 10-13-06, 11:25 AM	EDIT- Also, OnewingedAngel, Might I suggest you do the same for Spellthieves. It seems to me that their spell progression if from picking up a few spells from captured spellbooks and just learning little tricks form constant exposure from enemy casters. I'd have to actually read the spellthief class, then consider this :D (For some reason I've never gotten around to looking it over... and I've never had an NPC that I wanted to be a spellthief and no player has ever asked.) Really? Explain the Assassin's spell list then? A magewright doesnt use a spellbook, but he still uses Int as the base stat for his spells. All it says is that he learns to recite those spells by memory so he doesnt need to bother with a spellbook, why should the Warmage be any different? Surly the Warcolleges could train the would be wizard into memorizing all the spells he will ever need on hte battlefield. Day in and day out, all a warmage does is recite lines of arcane text after text, being drilled on how to ponouce and sound every word from memory, even while perfoming so other taxing battlefield maneuver. I don't see WarMages as leaders, they'd be traind as Marshals or Knights or Fighters if they were meant to be leaders, no, the Warmage is a walking piece of artillery, not a like a regular foot slogger. I agree with OnewingedAngel about Warmages, they are mass produced Wizards, not unique and passonate Sorcerers. I've been using the same variant for quite some time and me and my player all feel it fits the Warmage better. Infact, I have been using it for some good RP aswell. I use the angle that during the war, almost every wizard was enlisted to his respected nation, so almost no wizards were training apprentinces. Instead, those who pocessed and knack for spellcasting were enlisted into warcolleges and became Warmages. They got the chance to learn the arcane art like they wanted, but it was in a limited format. So, im Campaign, Warmages are somewhat tragic, because they pocessed the potential to become great Wizards, but due to the war, were forced to settle for becoming weapons of war. This is pretty much how I see Warmages as well. Mass produced wizards of a sort :)
OneWinged4ngel 11-22-06, 10:58 PM	Updated! Added a few new rulings.
pquekadl 11-23-06, 02:28 AM	Here are some house rules I came up with but haven't gotten to test out yet. Each character gets to choose two skills which they will treat as class skills regardless of class. These skills must relate to the characters back story. For example, a fighter who received his training as part of the town watch could add sense motive to his list of class skills to reflect his experience with questioning travelers at the town gate. He could not however add spell craft to his list of skills. All characters receive skill focus: knowledge local for their home region as a bonus feat. At the DM’s discretion an alternate skill focus may be chosen.
Neofish 11-23-06, 11:54 AM	Good call the on the casting defensivly amendment. I ruled something like that for tumble (moving through enemie's squares or negating AoO require a tumble check with a DC of 10+enemie's BAB).
johnkretzer 11-24-06, 03:56 PM	Two House Rules I have been toying with are: 1)Shifters get a bonus shifter feat at first level. 2)Trying to figure out a way to define exactly what you can do with the changeling's change ability. Which as to be one of the worst written abilities in the game.
Neofish 11-24-06, 05:06 PM	2)Trying to figure out a way to define exactly what you can do with the changeling's change ability. Which as to be one of the worst written abilities in the game. Changling's change shape ability= just like the disguise self spell minus the clothing change. What's the problem? If a player wants to grow claws, let him, its still just an unarmed strike. I'm interested in your plight, can you please explain your situation more clearly please?
johnkretzer 11-24-06, 05:40 PM	Changling's change shape ability= just like the disguise self spell minus the clothing change. What's the problem? If a player wants to grow claws, let him, its still just an unarmed strike. I'm interested in your plight, can you please explain your situation more clearly please? My problem with the ability is that it is like disguise-self minus the clothing change + the fact it ia a actualy change. Using disguise self as the basis was a poor design choice. Lets take the claw example... If a player casts Disguise Self to make it appear he has claws. These claws are illusionary so it would be a unarmed strike. A changeling who changes to have claws have claws. Their are physicaly there. The even feel like claws. So why aren't they claws? Now normaly I just usualy allow the plater some lee-way when it comes to using poorly defined abilities creatively( Allow a changeling to do claws, it was treated as a unarmed attack but was slashing and did leathal damage auto). But I am trying to put in effect a shared Eberron campaign with multiple GMs and play groups. So want to standardize what a changeling can do.
Neofish 11-24-06, 05:46 PM	A changeling who changes to have claws have claws. Their are physicaly there. The even feel like claws. So why aren't they claws? For the same reason Mystique didn't have adamantine claws in the X-men movie when she changed into wolverine. They may be tangible, indistiguisable claws, but they are not comprised of dead/ tough cuticle, they are the ends of the changling's fingers, nothing more. A changling takes on Shapes of other humanoids, but not their genetic makeup. A changling could grow scales or turn into a warforged, but that doesn't mean his skin is anymore dense than it already was. Do you get what i'm saying?
OneWinged4ngel 11-24-06, 07:09 PM	For the same reason Mystique didn't have adamantine claws in the X-men movie when she changed into wolverine. They may be tangible, indistigusable claws, but they are not comprised of dead/ tough cuticle, they are the ends of the changling's fingers, nothing more. A changling takes on Shapes of other humanoids, but not their genetic makeup. A changling could grow scales or turn into a warforged, but that doesn't mean his skin is anymore dense than it already was. Do you get what i'm saying? Awww, you got to it first. Yes, this is EXACTLY right, Neofish. Even if the Changeling grew claws, they are nothing more than shaped skin and fingernails. You don't have something capable of shredding someone up. It may look like claws, but what's it really made of? You may make your skin *appear* to be grey with a metallic sheen, but it doesn't have to be as tough as metal, etc. It's not a poorly written ability, you simply misinterpreted it, John. :)
SilverXXX 11-25-06, 04:10 AM	Never read this thread, it have a really good set of hr. I'll use some in my next EB game.
FreAkOuTRG 11-25-06, 01:14 PM	Looks nice, but one thing: RACES: HOBGOBLINS • +2 Constitution OR Dexterity. • Medium: As Medium creatures, hobgoblins have no special bonuses or penalties due to their size. • Hobgoblin base land speed is 30 feet. • Darkvision (Ex): Hobgoblins can see in the dark up to 60 feet. Darkvision is black and white only, but it is otherwise like normal sight, and hobgoblins can function just fine with no light at all. • +2 racial bonus on Move Silently checks. • Automatic Languages: Common and Goblin. Bonus Languages: Draconic, Dwarven, Elven, Giant, Gnoll, Gnome, Halfling and Orc. • Favored Class: (M) Fighter (F) Bard LA +0 Note: Effective? You bet. It's a good LA +0, but it's balanced when you look at the dwarf or warforged, I believe. The lack of a penalty generally doesn't matter for balance, much like a dwarf's -2 cha: It's a dump stat from a mechanical point of view, and only really works towards shoehorning them out of say, playing a sorceror, while having no real effect on what they would optimally be suited for. Hobgoblins are already underpowered for LA +1. They are actually perfectly balanced for an LA +0 by YabaTheWhat's system. Just removing the LA without changeing the other stats is ideal.
OneWinged4ngel 11-25-06, 04:10 PM	Hobgoblins are already underpowered for LA +1. They are actually perfectly balanced for an LA +0 by YabaTheWhat's system. Just removing the LA without changeing the other stats is ideal. I agree that they're fine at LA+0 as is, but I nerfed them just a bit. Anyways, please don't tell me anything about YabatheWhat's system, because it ignores many of the concepts that make a game balanced. Yaba's system allows for very overpowered or underpowered races to be dubbed "balanced" because of a few things, such as questionable valuing of abilities and a complete disregard for SYNERGY. For example, a race designed to be the best casters ever could easily be considered "balanced" by Yaba's system, but dominate enough so that it would seem silly to even consider being anything else from a balance perspective. I've seen some examples... like adding DC to spell levels, (The equivelent of spell focus in every school) adding extra int, adding resistance to spells, adding bonus spells per day, and giving bonuses to every relevant caster skill... and being "LA+0 balanced". It was ridiculous. YabatheWhat's system=Fail.
Siberys 11-25-06, 07:10 PM	Not to hijack the thread, but I jave some (read: a lot of) house rules here (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=745075), including a number inspired by this thread. If anyone could check them out, I'd appreciate it. Thanks! Cheers, Siberys
Jancarius 11-25-06, 08:21 PM	Eberron Campaign 1.3 Patch Notes *Dragonmarks that have multiple abilities at a level now allow the bearer to choose spontaneously which ability to cast. This change was made to bring the Dragonmarks more in line with how they seem to work in the novels and in the non-mechnical descriptions of their powers. *Warmages now have 3/4ths BAB. This change was made because Duskblades are ridiculously powerful, and Warmages should be comparable. Change subject to possible revision for higher level games. *Slightly expanded Shugenja spell list (Ice Dagger, Ray of Frost, both Water) *Warforged cannot take levels in the Sorcerer class. Access to the druid class is restricted. *Favored soul is a forbidden class. There are no favored souls in Eberron. Ever. The very nature of the god's interactions with the campaign world denies their existance. Also, overpowered on a scale comparable to clerics and druids. *Psionic (Expanded Handbook) classes are available, but only to Kalashtar at first level. *We are using the errated Weretouched Master. The non-errated is ridiculous. *Spell choices can be made from the PHB, PHB2, Eberron Campaign Setting, Magic of Eberron, Faiths of Eberron, Five Nations, the Spell Compendium, and by individual approval. *Feat choices may be made from PHB, PHB2, the Complete series, or the Eberron Campaign setting, or Eberron sourcebooks. *Reserve Feats are not allowed. While not mechanically overpowered, the concept makes about as little sense as the Warblade’s feat changing or the Chameleon period. *Alternate class features are generally not going to be approved. You may bring it to my attention to ask me, but I will probably say no. Don’t bother asking about Spell Reflection or Favored Enemy Arcanist, those are just bad. *Warlocks alignment restriction has been lifted. Warlocks are now required to provide in their background a source of their powers, which can range from a demon/devil/daelkyr/quori to a celestial or the Silver Flame. *All core classes from the PHB and the Complete series are available except Favored Soul, and the restrictions listed above. *Gnome spell like abilities have been changed. They may now choose a 0th level spell from the following list, which may not be changed once chosen: repair minor damage, arcane mark, or amanuensis (Spell compendium). *Disguise is a class skill for all changelings *Dragons shamans are a restricted class, as are dragon disciples and dragon prophets. This means “ask before you plan to be one.” The class may not be taken at first level unless your character is from Argonessen. *The 3rd level Wizard/Sorcerer spell Fly gives Perfect maneuverability, not Good as listed in the PHB. This is because there is no logical reason why magical flight should not grant perfect maneuverability. *Shugenja gain a bonus metamagic feat at 5th, 10th, 15th, and 20th levels. *Sorcerers gain the bonus feat: Eschew Material Components at 1st level. *Hit dice are rolled for each level. However, characters may reroll hit dice that are lower than half the maximum for their die. E.g. Wizards reroll 1s, rogues rerolls 1s and 2s, rangers reroll 1s, 2s, and 3s, fighters reroll 1s, 2s, 3s, and 4s, and barbarians reroll 1s, 2s, 3s, 4s, and 5s. This way, no one gets screwed on hp, but no one really gets favored more by the odds. *Psicrystals do not gain feats, ability bonuses, and skill points as they gain HD. I think this was merely an oversight on Wizards of the Coast's part, and that they were meant to be like familiars in this fashion. *Charisma now has a use other than giving bonuses to skills! When rolling action points, you now gain a bonus to your roll equal to your Charisma. This only uses your *inherent* charisma, much like the skill bonus from Int only uses your inherent intelligence. Thus, a Cloak of Charisma won't give you more AP. This finally gives Charisma some use for everyone, and prevents its use as a dump stat. The guy with the greater force of personality is more likely to be pulling the heroic stunts than the guy who can't work up the courage to talk to a girl or who nobody notices walking onto a stage who goes "testing, 1, 2, 3..." that no one ever notices is there. It's the guy with the heroic personality who everyone takes notice of who is more likely to jump towards the dragon's maw and throw a grenadelike weapon down its throat *Clerics, Priests, and Adepts of the Silver Flame add longbows, shortbows, composite longbows, and composite shortbows to their list of weapon proficiencies. *Paper in Eberron is more cheaply produced and readily available than in other D&D settings, and as such does not outstrip an average worker's salary in cost. Eberron has advanced enough to have efficient paper production. As a result, you can get 10 sheets of paper per 1cp, or 100 for 1sp. Higher quality paper costs 1cp per sheet. Subscriptions to newspapers typically cost only a couple gp per year, as detailed in Sharn: City of Towers. This change follows logically from that source, and the idea that newspapers can be available to an average citizen. *Printing Presses in Eberron are created through the efficient use of magic. A cantrip spell called Amanuesis (From Spell Compendium) which copies text combined with a simple magic item that prints to pages allows the creation of printing presses. There are two basic types of printing press-type items. One copies on a one-to-one basis, or directly produces text from inputted commands [an enchanted pen that writes on its own], called a Sivis Pen, the other transfers one text copy to multiple papers (large-scale printing press). The first type is relatively cheap and sees employ in sivis stations Khoirvare 'round, while the second is more specalized but extremely useful for it's given task. A Sivis Pen costs 500 galifars. A large-scale printing press costs 3000 galifars. Here's the houserules I use in my game, including some stolen from this topic.
Siberys 11-25-06, 09:29 PM	*Dragonmarks that have multiple abilities at a level now allow the bearer to choose spontaneously which ability to cast. This change was made to bring the Dragonmarks more in line with how they seem to work in the novels and in the non-mechnical descriptions of their powers. Yoinked *Charisma now has a use other than giving bonuses to skills! When rolling action points, you now gain a bonus to your roll equal to your Charisma. This only uses your *inherent* charisma, much like the skill bonus from Int only uses your inherent intelligence. Thus, a Cloak of Charisma won't give you more AP. This finally gives Charisma some use for everyone, and prevents its use as a dump stat. The guy with the greater force of personality is more likely to be pulling the heroic stunts than the guy who can't work up the courage to talk to a girl or who nobody notices walking onto a stage who goes "testing, 1, 2, 3..." that no one ever notices is there. It's the guy with the heroic personality who everyone takes notice of who is more likely to jump towards the dragon's maw and throw a grenadelike weapon down its throat. Yeah, but the type of person who WOULDN'T probably wouldn't have AP to begin with, although this is an interesting concept... *Maybe* yoinked. cheers, Siberys
OneWinged4ngel 11-25-06, 11:12 PM	Good to see you liked my rules, Jancarius! Just a few things I'd like to point out. Jancarius, Duskblades are not ridiculously powerful. Give it a closer examination, or see one in real play. They really aren't as powerful as a traditional gish build. The abilities they get prevent them from sucking, like the Hexblade, but doesn't make them exceed past, say, the Psychic Warrior. Also, using errata's not a houserule. It's RAW. I also would caution you against a certain spell in the PHB II which is *extremely* powerful. CELERITY. Basically, it gives you a flexible, undeclared ready action and a free, unprepared quickened spell (normally you have to prepare a spell as quickened) with no level adjustment. If you think this alone isn't overpowered, consider that the stunning effect can be negated by various means. I also recommend that you take Spell Compendium spells on a case-by-case basis, instead of allowing the whole book. Strongly recommend ;) The dragonmark ability, however, seems nifty! Allowing some variety is nice, and might make the feats a bit more worthwhile. I may just yoink it.
Jancarius 11-25-06, 11:20 PM	Well, I'm comparing them to Core classes. I've not played with psionics in any of my games (none of my players seem to be interested, despite the classes being available) so I can't compare it to Psionic Warrior. I've also never seen any Gith builds as I usually restrict race choices to Core and ECS without special approval. As far as using/not using errata, there's a lot of errata we just don't actually look up unless something seems off.
OneWinged4ngel 11-25-06, 11:22 PM	Well, I'm comparing them to Core classes. I've not played with psionics in any of my games (none of my players seem to be interested, despite the classes being available) so I can't compare it to Psionic Warrior. I've also never seen any Gith builds as I usually restrict race choices to Core and ECS without special approval. As far as using/not using errata, there's a lot of errata we just don't actually look up unless something seems off. Compared to the core classes Rogue, Sorceror, Druid, Cleric, and Wizard, a Duskblade is not overpowered (in fact, compared to four of those, it's underpowered... but most everything is). Core melee classes are generally considered underpowered. Also, gish build has NOTHING to do with race. It is a board slang term for Wizard/Fighter multiclass :). Quite simply, a normal melee caster build has a much greater access to spells than the Duskblade, while having comparable melee skills. The Duskblade is actually a very nicely balanced class. It has a smooth progression, and is useful from level 1-20. It may not be as powerful as a standard gish build, but it takes the hassle out off multiclassing and PrCing and such. Also, it is viable from first level (whereas a Wizard/Fighter is kinda screwy for several levels), and really combines melee and casting nicely. Anyways, Duskblades aren't as powerful as many players initially believe when they see it on paper. If you look at the big picture, and how it actually plays out, they're not that powerful.
Jancarius 11-25-06, 11:30 PM	Ah, I was unaware of the slang term. I dunno about straight rogue though. With the wide availablity of immune to crit nowadays, rogues can practically be shrugged off unless their UMD rogues.
OneWinged4ngel 11-25-06, 11:32 PM	The UMD is a large part of what makes the Rogue compete, to be honest :( . That, and their utility from a wide array of skills. Though when something's not immune, they can really slice into it. :) Anyways, what I'm getting at is that the Warmage is already comparable. He can dish out damage like the Duskblade (and more safely to boot, as well as better against groups), and he doesn't need a better BAB to do it (in fact, it's a very small power boost... since the Warmage doesn't really need BAB). The warmage gets a lot more spells, and he gets a lot more powerful spells. He also doesn't have the MAD that the Duskblade does. Well, from a certain point of view, using an AP to boost your roll won't have a major impact. It's only an average of +3.5 (increases slightly at higher levels). Since you can only do this once for each roll, getting more APs doesn't matter all that much. It's certainly a nice thing to have, but it doesn't change the expected results very much, just how often you can do this. It has more of an effect on fuelling abilities, but again, if you know what you're doing, you're probably not running too short normally. Getting +Cha uses just gives you a bit more leeway in when you can use them. However. If you add base Cha to the roll, it gets more troublesome. You won't be able to fuel abilities any more than in the base rules, but when you're adding to roll, the expected results will be heavily skewed. The problem is that some classes really like a high Cha. Really, really like it. I'm mostly thinking of bards and sorcs, although paladins certainly come into it. If you're playing a sorc or bard, you should have at least a 16 Cha at level 1. You're also probably going to put your HD stats into Cha too, which means that when it comes time to add Cha to an AP roll, you're going to probably get roughly double what most people get. At level 8, you're going to have at least an 18 Cha. Consequently, even on a minimum AP result, you've got a guaranteed +5 on your roll. The higher you push your charisma, the better you'll get. However, since the average party member (from a non-Cha class) is likely to have no more than a base Cha of 12, and unlikely to increase this, he gets little appreciable benefit. Basically: If you add Cha to your roll, it applies in less situations. This means that there's less incentive to take a decent Cha, since unless it's going to be particularly good, you only get a minor bonus when you roll. If you are likely to want to use APs for any other purposes, Cha has no effect, so you just dump it. On the other hand, if Cha affects the number of APs, there's a genuine use for everyone. It's still true that some will benefit more than others, but even the ones with a comparatively low Cha will still see an increase in flexibility. Just an opinion. ;) Good points! I was thinking along similar lines, which is why I kept it as is.
Neofish 11-26-06, 01:12 PM	Jancarius, why all the class restrictions? I'm just curious cause it kinda looks like a control freak kinda thing, I mean, aside from PC, are you really going to see a psion or druid warforged running around? Unless, of course, you instated these changes just to limit yourself from creating NPC of those specific class types, but if you did it just for that, my original question is stands. OneWinged4ngel pretty much sumed up everything else I was gonna asked you about except for this.
Jancarius 11-26-06, 03:39 PM	Well, the class restrictions are based on what I see as logical canon. I don't see how a Warforged could be a sorcerer. They have no heritage, as they have no ancestors. So how could they inherit magic in their blood? It has been pointed out to be that you could say that "warforged are magical in nature and warforged sorcerers are just drawing on that magic" or having a specially made warforged with dragons blood instead of oil or whatever they run on, but the first doesn't really satisfy me and the second is 'If you REALLY want to play one that bad, alright." With the druid restriction, I see warforged as unnatural creatures, and they'd have to present a very good story idea for their warforged to be a druid. I should note that restricted is not the same as forbidden. Restricted just means you have to pitch your concept and backstory to me, rather than just assuming I'll allow your particular race/class combo. The Dragon shaman is restricted because it seems like a class that would come from Argonessen almost exclusivly, and my game is very focused on Khorvaire and the politics of the Five Nations. If you wanted to play an Argonessen born character who was a Dragon Shaman, it'd be hard for me to explain why you were on Khorvaire in a politics oriented game. Duskblade probably should be limited to the elves as well, particularly the Valenar.
Hufish 11-26-06, 04:21 PM	The Dragon shaman is restricted because it seems like a class that would come from Argonessen almost exclusivly, and my game is very focused on Khorvaire and the politics of the Five Nations. If you wanted to play an Argonessen born character who was a Dragon Shaman, it'd be hard for me to explain why you were on Khorvaire in a politics oriented game. Duskblade probably should be limited to the elves as well, particularly the Valenar. Actually, I have an idea about that...it stems from the movie 'Brotherhood of the Wolf'. The Dragon Shaman could be there as a companion to an adventurer who has ties with a royal court, who met and befriended said shaman on one of his adventures. Fairly classic story of savage befriending 'civilized' man, and coming back into a strange world with him. EDIT: Something I forgot, I'd houserule actually that the duskblade class isn't available to the Valenar. Instead, I'd tie that class to a different branch of the Tairnadal, one that normally remains in Aerenal and focuses on studies there. The Valenar just don't seem to fit that class as a matter of flavor to me.
OneWinged4ngel 11-27-06, 08:48 PM	Actually, I can see plenty of ways that those races could fit into all of those roles. It just takes a smidgeon of imagination or a unique backstory. Warforged *are* magic. What's not to get on Warforged sorcerors? A newer model could be something like a wand! Who says sorcery has to be the result of heritage and blood? Heck, the PHB only posits that as one possibility. And if it does... the heritage of a warforged could be a unique model line or design or something. Use your imagination. Imagination is a good thing. A warforged druid is a unique concept, but I've seen one done very well before (though I won't go into details). It was a great character, and the backstory fit well. And why shouldn't warforged be able to be psions? After all, they have minds and are as sentient as anyone else. Heck, they could even be thought of as a sort of superdistilled dorje, as Tempest Stormwind suggested. Goes with the same idea as the wand thing. I find the class restrictions rather ridiculous myself, but to each his own. *shrug* ___ As for the Duskblade, I see no reason to link it to the elves any more than I would the Eldritch Knight. It really has nothing in its mechanics that correlates to the flavor they put in there, and quite frankly I consider it filler. One of my Duskblades was a dragonmarked Deneith mercenary, Sair d'Galell. He was a hardened soldier and mercenary who had begun to devote himself to mastering magic and integrating it with his fighting art. He was a very devoted and ambitious individual, always striving to master himself and drive himself to ever greater heights, expanding his potential. Why should it be restricted to the elves? Is there something wrong with a human who uses magic to enhance his sword skills? Is there anything particularly elven about the mechanics? Nope... Off the top of my head, I could think of dozens of reasons why an Argonesson Dragon Shaman would become involved in the politics of Khorvaire. For example: Perhaps it was destined by the Prophecy. You made the trip to Khorvaire after being visited by a dragon who had uncovered portents of the future, finding that he could alter fate to his liking by manipulating your course. You find yourself on a mission, and you have a goal to make changes in Khorvaire... I find class and race restrictions generally... bad. In a few cases they make sense, but in most it's just preventive. Edit: As for "restricted is not forbidden" (which I somehow missed before...), I personally think you should have to pitch the backstory before *any* PC class is allowed ;) Then again... I'm a very high RP sort of guy.
Eela6 11-27-06, 10:26 PM	Remember that you can adjust flavor significantly without changing mechanics one whit. Example: Menias Renan is an Aerenal expatriate. Dissatisfied by the passive, death-focused lives in the Aerenal Mainland, he quickly grew fascinated with the Vales Tairn - and the Valenar, the only elves who are truly showing the glory of the race - (to his eyes, at least). He found a ride on a trade ship and got himself to the mainland of Khoirvare, where he joined with the Valenar. Showing an insatiable lust for battle, within fifteen years he has become one of the most respected raid leaders within the state of Valenar, striking out on daring raids into the heart of Karrnath with his trusty steed and loyal Valenar compatriots. He has considerable battle prowess, quickly becoming skilled with the scimitar, and his arcane talent allows him to fire powerful blasts of electricity to rout his enemies - as well as giving him some power over the land. But more powerful than this is his immense and supernatural leadership talent - he's said to be able to inspire a war party to a rousing victory from near-death. _ What is he? A Druid1/Dragon Shaman 6, taking a Valenar War Horse as his animal companion [The Natural Bond feat allows him to do so.] The Druid level gives him some magical versatility [as well as proficiency with the Scimitar and an Animal Companion], and the Dragon Shaman levels give him a repeat-use breath weapon, as well as handy Auras to heal his buddies. Certainly doesn't sound like either, though, nu?
OneWinged4ngel 11-27-06, 10:30 PM	Exactly, Eela!
Barachiel 11-28-06, 01:51 AM	I personally have never been fond of cross-clas skill limitations, so anytime anyone takes a Feat that gives them a bonus to a skill, they get that skill as a class skill if they don't already have it as one. Also, all classes get an extra 2 skill points a level, just because I run social, skill-based games, not just combat encounters and I like everyone to have some ability to function besides the Rogue, the Bard, and the Paladin. Also, I have a house rule regard "prereq" Feats (feats that only exist to be a prerequisite for other feats and prestige classes) or Square Grid Feats (feats htat are really only useful if you use map and/or miniatures), that I allow any player to make a case to get me to overrule that particular prereq, or just grant it to them outright. Along the same lines, everyone gets an extra feat at first level and every at every fifth level beyond the normal Feat progression for Level and Class just because I find it annoying that Feats multiply even faster than spells but Feat Choice is so limited, most people will only take the ones they "know" to be "good." This way, players can stick to their "optimal builds" and still throw in a feat or two for RP purposes.
Jancarius 11-28-06, 12:38 PM	I personally have never been fond of cross-clas skill limitations, so anytime anyone takes a Feat that gives them a bonus to a skill, they get that skill as a class skill if they don't already have it as one. Also, all classes get an extra 2 skill points a level, just because I run social, skill-based games, not just combat encounters and I like everyone to have some ability to function besides the Rogue, the Bard, and the Paladin. I usually handle that by having what the players and my NPCs actual role play out saying to be much more important than their rolls (except stuff like "did the NPC believe me", which I still apply heavy circumstance modifiers to). Also, I have a house rule regard "prereq" Feats (feats that only exist to be a prerequisite for other feats and prestige classes) or Square Grid Feats (feats htat are really only useful if you use map and/or miniatures), that I allow any player to make a case to get me to overrule that particular prereq, or just grant it to them outright.You mean like Endurance, (Non-improved) Toughness, Run, etc? Along the same lines, everyone gets an extra feat at first level and every at every fifth level beyond the normal Feat progression for Level and Class just because I find it annoying that Feats multiply even faster than spells but Feat Choice is so limited, most people will only take the ones they "know" to be "good." This way, players can stick to their "optimal builds" and still throw in a feat or two for RP purposes.I'm kind of eh on this. It makes for a more powerful game, but don't forget to apply to all your monsters and NPCs too, unless the intention is kind of like action points.
Barachiel 11-28-06, 08:47 PM	I usually handle that by having what the players and my NPCs actual role play out saying to be much more important than their rolls (except stuff like "did the NPC believe me", which I still apply heavy circumstance modifiers to). Ehh, I tried that, but it rarely works. There's a reason the rules exist, and thats to keep arguable situations fair. If a player has a silver tongue and his charcter has a Charisma of 6, why should I let the player bluff his way past the guard simply because he knows how to spin a good line of BS without necessarily leaving his character's voice? It also means character classes that DO rely on those skills as a central feature have a bit less usefulness. This way, other classes still have to make a conscious in-game choice to be more rounded, but they don't have to completely cripple their character to do so, as under the current system. You mean like Endurance, (Non-improved) Toughness, Run, etc? Exactly. I'm kind of eh on this. It makes for a more powerful game, but don't forget to apply to all your monsters and NPCs too, unless the intention is kind of like action points. I always give my monsters a bit of a boost. Besides, in Eberron, I'm far more likely to give any creature with sentience class levels on top of its natural abilities, just because I find things are more interesting when opponents are capable of dishing out the same stuff that a PC can. It makes the rules lawyers hesitate about just assuming they can just fall back on their photographic memory of the entire Monster Manual series, and force a bit more in the way of tactical combat. After all, just because it looks like an goblin, it doesn't mean its not a 10th level sorcerer with a hair trigger and a few magic items up its sleave. But yes, I give the extra feats, skill points, and everything else to EVERYONE, not just PCs.
Destil 12-11-06, 12:20 AM	I really like the gnome racial feat. Consider that yoinked! Persistant spell- Good example of where 3.0 metamagic stacking (if you read the rules that way) was a good thing. Persistant is always a problem feat. IMC I still allow a 4x extend (which is 5x the original duration and 4 slots higher, of course). Or 3x or 6x. I've never really had a balance problem with stacking meta-magics aside from silly empower issues (simularicon & anaimal buffs). Persistant was only ever really worth it when it breaks somethting. For this reason and to make it absoutly clear I added a 'new' persistant spell feat IMC: Persistent Spell [Metamagic] You can cast spells that are more resilient to dispelling. Benefit: A persistent spell automatically re-activates itself 1d4 rounds after being dispelled, and is only considered suppressed during that time. This only happens once per use of persistent spell, these rounds count towards the duration normally. A persistent spell takes up a spell slot two levels higher than the original spell. Urban Tracking, Research, and Investigate- I did much the same: I upped the DCs for these new uses by 5 and anyone can try it, but I allow the feats and they grant a narrow +5 bonus forjust these checks. As far as half-elves and half-orcs, I came up with this, which I'm particuarlly proud of: Bonus feat at 1st level. New feat: Human Adaptavity Prerequisites: 1st level only. Half-elf or half-orc. Benifit: You gain 4 bonus skill points at 1st level and 1 bonus skill point per level beyond first. Half-Elves get PHB bonuses - diplomacy and the bonus feat. Half-Orcs get 1 extra feat at 1st level. Spell-Like Ability: 1/day—speak with animals as a Druid of their character level. Strong Willed: A half orc gains a +1 bonus to Will saving throws. -1 Skill Point per level (-4 at 1st level). (instead of -2 int) Sorcerers: Mine are very similar. However I killed knowledge (arcana) and spellcraft from the skill lists, as sorcerers aren't bookish nerds who study spells. Magic works because they do this! They don't really know why. (If you do this I recomend also changing impeded magic to be based on a 'caster power check' caster level + key ability score, rather than spellcraft. In fact spellcraft becomes just to identify spells and read scrolls, any other use is handled by caster power. New rules books love shoving more options into spellcraft, but in the core rules that's all it does for nonwizards. Why does my level 20 druid who can cast level 1-20 spells just fine with no spellcraft, thank you, suddenly need it at epic levels?) Exorcist of the Silver Flame - I let Silver Flame paladins smite at range and use either turn undead or excorise (shared number of uses / day). I give little bonuse to many classes like this (i.e. a cleric of the fire domain adds ignan to their class bonus language list), and since the 2nd is pretty a very limited DM controled ability it dosn't affect balance at all. Ranged smite is a small plus, but with paladin MAD already adding in dex to be a good archer makes it silly to worry about (as I only allow 28 point buy).
OneWinged4ngel 12-11-06, 02:09 AM	There is a feat to smite at range. As for the Paladin, I completely redid it. It's in my sig, and I highly recommend takin' a look. I daresay it's rather highly acclaimed :D
OneWinged4ngel 02-01-07, 10:34 PM	Going to be updating this more in the near future, as I'm DMing again (and, actually, recruiting for an online Eberron campaign). Added a few things to the list of stuff that just plain isn't allowed.
Pitiless_Interfector 02-03-07, 06:49 PM	About balancing hobgoblins: You don't necessarily have to change anything about their racial traits to make them more attractive. The +2 on Craft and Profession checks could be replaced by a +2 bonus on Sense Motive checks to see through combat feints, or by adding some additional, race-specific abilities, like lower-mid-level feats that grant Armored Mage w/o multiclassing, a` la` Githyanki Battlecaster (MM IV). Take the Spellscale; if it weren't for the fact that any other race (besides dragonborn, who have too many RP restrictions to fit most games, dragon-descended, who have LAs, and kobolds :pbbbtt:) has to spend a feat slot on Draconic Heritage to take Practical Metamagic (which allows for Quickened chain lightning, disintegrate,, and greater dispel magic effects before epic level), it'd really be no better than any other race (especially humans, who can get Infernal Sorcerer Howl at first level and create a 30-ft.-cone of 2d6 sonic [no SR or attack of opportunity] 3/day, and get enough skill points to actually qualify for good prestige classes).
RogueElement 02-04-07, 09:15 PM	...and, actually, recruiting for an online Eberron campaign). Ooo, ooo! <raises hand> I'll play. Let me know when and where and I am so there. (in a virtual sense)
OneWinged4ngel 02-04-07, 09:42 PM	Ooo, ooo! <raises hand> I'll play. Let me know when and where and I am so there. (in a virtual sense) Sure... but I'd need to get some sort of contact info so I can actually talk to you :rolleyes:
Pitiless_Interfector 02-06-07, 10:23 PM	...-Half-orcs get a +2 racial bonus to Survival and Intimidate, and +4 to saves to resist disease, and a +2 on morale checks and saving throws against fear. Orcs get the same. Also, half-orcs don't have a weak and flaccid personality! People just don't really like them so much :(... but this isn't what Charisma is! It's the strength of your personality! Anyways, they lose the -2 penalty to Cha (helping them to be better rangers and druids and such), but gain a -1 penalty to diplomacy and gather information checks. I disagree. Charisma represents confidence. Having the entire civilized world treat you like sh!t does not breed the aforementioned quality. It may make you bitter, but that doesn't strengthen your personality; take the football team at my school-they treat me like sh!t and snatch up all the nice girls, yet they are idiots. Yet, when in an attempt to save face in front of a particularly attractive specimen, I showed him up as being retarded nearly to the threshold of clinical diagnosis, he simply laughed, said "you're gay," basked in a wave of sycophantic laughter, and stalked off before I could return the insult. Did he understand a word I'd said? Probably not. Did I have the confidence to talk to the girl afterwards? Of course not-if I did, I'd actually have a real life. In short, half-orcs in general deserve the Cha penalty. Not to say charismatic exceptions don't exist; they're just the odd individual who puts a base 13 in Cha and winds up with a score higher than average for most people. And as for sorcerers, would a dragon really want to have sex with an orc? Needless to say, those dragons are rare in the extreme.
OneWinged4ngel 02-07-07, 01:23 AM	I disagree. Charisma represents confidence. Having the entire civilized world treat you like sh!t does not breed the aforementioned quality. It may make you bitter, but that doesn't strengthen your personality; take the football team at my school-they treat me like sh!t and snatch up all the nice girls, yet they are idiots. Yet, when in an attempt to save face in front of a particularly attractive specimen, I showed him up as being retarded nearly to the threshold of clinical diagnosis, he simply laughed, said "you're gay," basked in a wave of sycophantic laughter, and stalked off before I could return the insult. Did he understand a word I'd said? Probably not. Did I have the confidence to talk to the girl afterwards? Of course not-if I did, I'd actually have a real life. In short, half-orcs in general deserve the Cha penalty. Not to say charismatic exceptions don't exist; they're just the odd individual who puts a base 13 in Cha and winds up with a score higher than average for most people. And as for sorcerers, would a dragon really want to have sex with an orc? Needless to say, those dragons are rare in the extreme. I don't see why you wouldn't talk to the girl afterwards. I know I would have talked to her afterwards, provided I was actually interested. I got treated poorly for being the smart kid for a while, but I didn't let people give me that BS, and it didn't last long. Don't sweat the small stuff. Just get some confidence, man. Besides, if a girl would actually fall for a guy who's half as stupid as you described, then you're probably pursuing her for the wrong reasons. The same goes for if she's the kind of person who would give any credence to something as shallow as a declaration of "you're gay!" Heh... a little bit of spine goes a long way. Also, it's WAY better in college for smart guys. ;) Anyways, you may have a point as far as half-orcs in general go. That said, I think I'll offer the option to either take off the int or cha penalty, for the sake of making them a more attractive race that is less shoehorned into certain roles if nothing else. Also, you might consider that with the ability to manifest the Mark of Finding as well as Eberron's general acceptance of other races compared to some settings, half-orcs aren't exactly as universally badly treated as they might otherwise be. As for sexual attraction... well, you find various things unattractive by virtue of being a human, and thus are generally attracted to your own race. The only reason that humans are commonly attracted to things like half-elves and elves would be that they appear so similar to humans. In fact, they exemplify some of the traits of human beings that are considered most attractive to some. It's really a racial thing. And an appearance thing. At least, it is for the average individual.
RogueElement 02-08-07, 10:42 PM	Also, it's WAY better in college for smart guys. ;) Not to derail the thread, but hear! hear! Focus on your studies and once your brains land you a sweet IT job, a sports car gets you more chicks than you can swing a +2 sword at. And yes, even the smart girls really are that shallow. Like Scarface said: "First you get the certifications, then you get the money, then you get the women." Perhaps I'm paraphrasing. I'm exaggerating of course, I'm just saying don't sweat it, you'll figure out the tricks. It just takes time, effort, and a good marketing plan.
OneWinged4ngel 02-08-07, 11:05 PM	Not to derail the thread, but hear! hear! Focus on your studies and once your brains land you a sweet IT job, a sports car gets you more chicks than you can swing a +2 sword at. And yes, even the smart girls really are that shallow. Like Scarface said: "First you get the certifications, then you get the money, then you get the women." Perhaps I'm paraphrasing. I'm exaggerating of course, I'm just saying don't sweat it, you'll figure out the tricks. It just takes time, effort, and a good marketing plan. You thread derailer you :P Anyways, based on a recent ruling in a game I'm in, I've added a new house rule! We found it kind of weird when we couldn't find a level 1 infusion or anything that would let the artificer prepare items, so about 15 seconds of deliberation later we just gave them Make Whole.
RogueElement 02-08-07, 11:20 PM	You thread derailer you :POk, one more then. I think it was Abraham Lincoln who said "You can't be everything to every chick." Once you figure out what kinds of girls you like, you can figure out what kind of guy you have to be to get those kinds of girls. Oh and one last advice and I'll shut up: maybe you don't want to listen to advice about girls from a D&D forum... Sorry OneWinged4ngel, you can have your thread back. :blush:
OneWinged4ngel 03-08-07, 03:36 PM	Banned Thought Bottle. Added Magecraft to the list of 1st level artificer infusions.
Jancarius 03-08-07, 05:44 PM	I don't see why you wouldn't talk to the girl afterwards. I know I would have talked to her afterwards, provided I was actually interested. I got treated poorly for being the smart kid for a while, but I didn't let people give me that BS, and it didn't last long. Don't sweat the small stuff. Just get some confidence, man. Besides, if a girl would actually fall for a guy who's half as stupid as you described, then you're probably pursuing her for the wrong reasons. The same goes for if she's the kind of person who would give any credence to something as shallow as a declaration of "you're gay!" Heh... a little bit of spine goes a long way. Also, it's WAY better in college for smart guys. ;) I'm gonna go with Quoted for Truth on this one. I got picked on a lot when I was younger, but now I've got no problem talking to girls and getting them to go out with me.
OneWinged4ngel 04-04-07, 12:39 AM	Considering adding this clause to the material components ruling: Wizards and other prepared spellcasters still need to use some kind of material focus for their magic, however, but in these cases they turn to more conventional fantasy methods of using material components (as opposed to a practical joke) such as scribing runes into the ground with a knife, or using a dragonshard as a universal focus for most of their spells. Basically, players can choose the flavor of their components, making some sort of an item a focus that, if taken away, prevents them from using spells that require material components. Also, added the concept of Background Feats. And lastly, changed my sig ;)
FriendlyBiscuit 04-08-07, 08:24 AM	Many of your house rules are things that either: I've tried to implement, but haven't found a suitable game mechanic for, or deal with issues that have bothered me, but I haven't had time to address them yet. Needless to say, I'll be implementing a lot of them. :) I too am a big fan of house rules. I've been trying to organize them, but have had less success than you. I'm going to scrap it and start fresh sometime between now and the summer vacation, but I've got a lot of the rules set down in some fashion here. (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=728703) I'm especially proud of my universal caster transparency rule and my expanded uses for action points.
OneWinged4ngel 04-24-07, 01:26 AM	On further reflection, removed the psicrystal rule. Also, I allow a variety of custom classes, all linked to in the "Useful Resources" thread on my campaign website. Many of your house rules are things that either: I've tried to implement, but haven't found a suitable game mechanic for, or deal with issues that have bothered me, but I haven't had time to address them yet. Needless to say, I'll be implementing a lot of them. :) I too am a big fan of house rules. I've been trying to organize them, but have had less success than you. I'm going to scrap it and start fresh sometime between now and the summer vacation, but I've got a lot of the rules set down in some fashion here. (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=728703) I'm especially proud of my universal caster transparency rule and my expanded uses for action points. Glad to help.
ProdigalMadness 06-03-07, 02:51 AM	I'd say orcs and half-orcs are fairly confident. Would you honestly say that the average orc/half-orc wouldn't fully believe they couldn't tear the average human limb from limb? Charisma is supposed to tie both into the FORCE of your personality, and appearance. Otherwise, every High CHA guy without WIS/INT would be going around trying to take everyone on, because it's confidence. :p I scanned the first several posts... I'm fully in agreement with removing the shields of fluff and stuff, but what reasons do you have for removing the other spells/feats? Natural feat really gets me confused. Any druid worth their salt would be used to their alternate forms enough to figure out how to cast in them. I don't see a house rule saying you have to study for years to become a wizard, that you aren't allowed to just pick up a level of it at random. Which personally, would make much more sense than forbidding druids from being able to cast spells in a different form. Also, I fully agree with the saying no to giving Silver Flame clerics bows. What lore do you have that would support that they got specific training with that weapon? IMO, people going around in heavy armor typically don't go around using bows. Partially from weight, partially from movement restrictions.
OneWinged4ngel 06-04-07, 12:18 AM	I scanned the first several posts... I'm fully in agreement with removing the shields of fluff and stuff, but what reasons do you have for removing the other spells/feats? Natural feat really gets me confused. Any druid worth their salt would be used to their alternate forms enough to figure out how to cast in them. I don't see a house rule saying you have to study for years to become a wizard, that you aren't allowed to just pick up a level of it at random. Which personally, would make much more sense than forbidding druids from being able to cast spells in a different form. Wild Shape is *more* than good enough as it is. Besides, I'd much prefer to just ban Wild Shape altogether and use PHB II alternate forms or something. The reason is essentially... balance. Druids are amazing without natural spell, and with it there's no reason for them to ever leave their wild shape. As for other spells and feats, some are pretty badly designed (Rhino Rush feels in every way like it's a legacy ability, based on a 3.0 Rhino Armor instead of following the 3.5 trend) and Valorous seems to have been updated to Charging (which is more reasonable), and some are just ridiculous (Celerity, anyone?). I prefer a bit more balance. I have done a few things to try and reach a better balance with the various classes (and make them more fun to play), ranging from minor edits like giving the Sorceror signature cantrips and skill points (and more class skills) to more significant rewrites like the Rebalanced Paladin. Speaking of which, I use the Rebalanced Paladin, Tempest's Sublime Marshal, BlaineTog's Soulknife, the Society Mind, the Marksman, Radical's Sublime Ranger, and Tome of Battle. Also, I fully agree with the saying no to giving Silver Flame clerics bows. What lore do you have that would support that they got specific training with that weapon? IMO, people going around in heavy armor typically don't go around using bows. Partially from weight, partially from movement restrictions. The lore says that even average peasant followers often train with bows in the Silver Flame, as it is a form of meditation within the religion. Additionally, clerics are often given martial training as they are champions of the faith. I don't have the specific source and page available, but I can pretty much assure you it's correct ;) In fact, my memory's good enough to recall offhand that the example silver flame cleric in the ECS used a bow (and they forgot to put in the feat, which was later errata'ed in, since the DESIGNER apparently even thought that they just had the proficiency ;)) In any case, it just sucks to spend a MWP feat. Ever. Never mechanically worth it, but all the SF followers want bows, because that's what they use in just about all the fluff. Saves a headache.
Soltares 06-04-07, 04:45 AM	Neat stuff. Combining Balance & Tumble into an Acrobatics skill is a common 'fix.' Similarly, Hide & Move Silently often get thrown together into a 'Stealth' or 'Sneak' skill and Listen & Spot get turned into 'Notice.' (I particularly like the Listen & Spot one, since it is handy to roll for someone to *smell* something or taste poison in his drink. Otherwise you're stuck with the old joke, 'Listen! Do you smell that?') Definitely agree about the Half-Orc Charisma 'fix.' Very few races would have low self-esteem *as a racial trait.* Individual Half-Orcs, particularly depending on how they were raised, may well have low self-esteem (being weaker than the rest of their Orcish peers and bullied, or dumber than their Human townsfolk and derided) *or* they might be arrogant and feel superior (being smarter than their Orcish tribespeople and manipulate their dumb kin, or stronger than their Human playmates and act like bullies). Mongrelfolk, for instance, I can see having low self-esteem. Dwarves? Certainly not. If anything, such a proud and confident people would tend to have above-average Charisma scores! They may or may not have a lack of Diplomatic skill, or a dislike of the deceptive ways of the Bluff-meister, but it doesn't make them weak and selfless! I house-ruled Dwarves to have +2 Con and -2 Dex. It's not like Dex has any impact on Craft skills, so it doesn't affect their racial focus as skilled craftspeople. Charisma is too often a 'dump stat,' and I don't agree with any of the core races using it to balance out a positive stat. One Natural Spell 'fix' would be to make it a Metamagic feat. As a Metamagic feat, a Druid would have to actually prepare it in the beginning of the day as a 'Natural Spell,' and *only* be able to cast the specially prepared 'natural spells' in his Wild Shape. Further, he couldn't cast 'natural' spells in his human form, as they've been adapted to function with animal vocalizations! So the option is still there, but it becomes a very strategic thing, with the Druid having to figure out what spells he wants to be able to cast in human form, and which ones he's only going to be casting while in Wild Shape.
FriendlyBiscuit 06-05-07, 04:28 AM	(Note: This is reposted from the online chat gaming community I play on: The Tangled Web. I'll usually keep this updated, but that one may be *more* updated.)404!
FriendlyBiscuit 06-05-07, 10:06 AM	What would you think about a house rule that allows you to perform standard actions at the end of a charge? Being able to perform a martial maneuver or touch spell with a charge seems to have the kind of "I'm awesome!" appeal that players would enjoy, without being broken. Strike maneuvers, especially, seem to be facing an artificial and annoying restriction in not being combinable with charges. Other cool possibilities would occur, too. As the party tries to make their escape, the rogue can recklessly "charge" the door and try to quickly "scrub" the lock all in one round as the party tries to cover him. (he'd still have the -2 to AC) I'm considering it for my campaign, and would love to hear 4ngel's and everyone else's thoughts on it before I decide.
Puggins 06-05-07, 02:53 PM	Just as a bit of suggestion, you can use an "Iron Heroes"-like method of hit point generation and you'll get a barely different result from what you're doing: d4: d3+1 (exact match) d6: d4+2 (exact match) d8: d4+4 (6.5 as opposed to 6 using re-roll) d10: d6+4 (exact match) d12: d6+6 (9.5 as opposed to 9 using re-roll) It's not any better, it just involves rolling fewer dice.
OneWinged4ngel 06-05-07, 09:42 PM	404! Sorry, but I have quit playing on Tangled as a result of the community going... well, downhill. Too many stupid people came. In any case, I'm sorry I haven't kept this updated... I'll try to fix it up when I get a chance. My current site (which has just been basically torn down and had everything cleared off to make room for my new game) is www.freewebs.com/onewinged4ngel At the very least, I will change the URL in the first post ^^;; Just as a bit of suggestion, you can use an "Iron Heroes"-like method of hit point generation and you'll get a barely different result from what you're doing: d4: d3+1 (exact match) d6: d4+2 (exact match) d8: d4+4 (6.5 as opposed to 6 using re-roll) d10: d6+4 (exact match) d12: d6+6 (9.5 as opposed to 9 using re-roll) It's not any better, it just involves rolling fewer dice. I was considering doing that, though I wanted to keep it "simple" like that (people seem to be averse to changing the type of die you use for some reason). Considering that I often play online, I would use "non-real" dice like d5+3 and d7+5 for exact matches. What would you think about a house rule that allows you to perform standard actions at the end of a charge? Being able to perform a martial maneuver or touch spell with a charge seems to have the kind of "I'm awesome!" appeal that players would enjoy, without being broken. Strike maneuvers, especially, seem to be facing an artificial and annoying restriction in not being combinable with charges. Other cool possibilities would occur, too. As the party tries to make their escape, the rogue can recklessly "charge" the door and try to quickly "scrub" the lock all in one round as the party tries to cover him. (he'd still have the -2 to AC) I'm considering it for my campaign, and would love to hear 4ngel's and everyone else's thoughts on it before I decide. If I allowed this, it would at least require an action point or two, and a suitably fantastic description. The thing is, getting a double-move and then a standard action isn't something that's a giveaway... it is a significant benefit. I definitely wouldn't give away something like that for free. I tend to be "lenient" when it comes to action points. For example, I might allow a player to use an action point to pretend he's not Staggerred at zero hp, or to remain conscious while at negative hp (does anyone ever take diehard anyways? No. No one cares) One example of this (though I wasn't DMing) was basically when I was playing a solo game with my paladin, Lady Aerlyn Lovoth. She had confronted the BBEG Jorasco spellcaster (yes, an evil halfling doctor) in his lair, and was knocked down to exactly 0 hp by a spell. Meanwhile, her only ally is wasting away from the arcane disease the BBEG let loose while trying to hold the doors that are being beaten down from outside by the BBEG's maddenned minions, and fading fast. Aerlyn uses an Action Point, then rushes the BBEG, with her last of her breath saying "You... haven't... won... yet!", grapples him, and bashes his head into the nearby Altar of Resurrection for a coupla rounds until he dies. ...Cool scene, and I found it delightfully ironic. ("Cause of death: Altar of Resurrection") Anyways, I like to be lenient with AP to encourage cool stunts, and it works well ^^
OneWinged4ngel 06-07-07, 07:07 PM	A few new ideas... -The Sudden Stunning weapon enhancement (DMG2 261) has been updated to the Stunning Surge (MIC 44) weapon enhancement, despite the different names. -Swordsages gain (6 + Int) × 4 skill points at first level, not (6 + Int) × 6 as is stated in ToB 16. -Swordsages and Warblades gain Survival and Perform on their skill lists. Watch any wuxia for the reason why. -Shadow illusions can never be more than 100% real. Especially after a made-save. -Belt of Battle (MIC) has an attunement time of 24 hours. Thoughts? Edit: I just found these threads, and may be stealin' a bit in the future. Think they might be useful to you guys: http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=86768 http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=657631
OneWinged4ngel 06-14-07, 04:56 PM	http://caedrus.proboards81.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=general&thread=1176417288&page=1 Useful stuff.
Adrez Nesnsid 08-09-07, 11:13 AM	-Paper in Eberron is more cheaply produced and readily available than in other D&D settings, and as such does not outstrip an average worker's salary in cost. Eberron has advanced enough to have efficient paper production. As a result, you can get 10 sheets of paper per 1cp, or 100 for 1sp. Higher quality paper costs 1cp per sheet. Subscriptions to newspapers typically cost only a couple gp per year, as detailed in Sharn: City of Towers. This change follows logically from that source, and the idea that newspapers can be available to an average citizen. So, is the 10 sheets per cp paper newsprint quality paper, and the good paper regular paper, or is it higher quality than that with newsprint cheaper andf the good paper really high quality?
Adrez Nesnsid 08-09-07, 11:26 AM	-Half-orcs get a +2 racial bonus to Survival and Intimidate, and +4 to saves to resist disease, and a +2 on morale checks and saving throws against fear. Orcs get the same. Also, half-orcs don't have a weak and flaccid personality! People just don't really like them so much :(... but this isn't what Charisma is! It's the strength of your personality! Anyways, they lose the -2 penalty to Cha (helping them to be better rangers and druids and such), but gain a -1 penalty to diplomacy and gather information checks. I think that the charisma penalty is meant to represent them being rude and abrasive. The penalties to diplomacy and gather information cover that nicely as well however. Although, you might want to make the penalties bigger in order to counterbalance the new bonuses; maybe add a penalty to non-combat-related bluff checks too as well...
OneWinged4ngel 08-09-07, 04:53 PM	I think that the charisma penalty is meant to represent them being rude and abrasive. The penalties to diplomacy and gather information cover that nicely as well however. Although, you might want to make the penalties bigger in order to counterbalance the new bonuses; maybe add a penalty to non-combat-related bluff checks too as well... Counterbalance the new bonuses? :confused: Uhhm, the point was kinda to make half-orcs not suck. The bonuses were counterbalancing the penalties they already had.
Adrez Nesnsid 08-09-07, 06:39 PM	Counterbalance the new bonuses? :confused: Uhhm, the point was kinda to make half-orcs not suck. The bonuses were counterbalancing the penalties they already had. Well, what I'm saying is that Compensating for the penalties counterbalances the penalties, and removing the penalties counterbalances the penalties, but removing some of the penalties and then compensating for them kinda overbalances the penalties.
OneWinged4ngel 08-11-07, 03:02 AM	Well, what I'm saying is that Compensating for the penalties counterbalances the penalties, and removing the penalties counterbalances the penalties, but removing some of the penalties and then compensating for them kinda overbalances the penalties. Why? "Because I said so" isn't an answer. You have to actually have a reason as to why the new half-orc is somehow too powerful compared to dwarves, humans, or warforged. The reality is, people are *still* going to take the humans, dwarves, or warforged over the half-orcs. Honestly, I don't think you have the slightest clue what you're talking about o.0
Werebat 08-11-07, 09:20 AM	So, mechanically a dwarf with +2 Cha, a couple skill bonuses, and a free Fighter feat. Or, if you're planning to go into fighter (Think about it: Who doesn't take weapon focus?,) it's a human with -1 skill points, +2 Con, and Darkvision. Or a medium-dized Kobold with -2 Dex, +4 Con, +4 Str, and a fighter feat. (Bad example, but it goes to show how far apart LA +0 can be.) I recommend that it be given a -2 to something, even if it's choice. IMC I've taken away the +2 Con (they have no stat mods) and stuck with the +4 bonus to MS, the darkvision, and the bonus fighter feat (Favored Class: Fighter). LA +0. Comparable to a human, I think, maybe a smidgen less powerful. There wasn't anything I wanted to give them a -2 to, since they are supposedly leaders and good bards in Eberron as well as martially oriented. Wisdom, maybe, but that didn't really seem to fit. FWIW the only player choosing to play one is playing an Abjurer, using the fighter feat to take proficiency in the shield (not strictly possible with a "fighter feat" but I allowed it as it made sense to me). I think my hobgobs could use a tiny perk, but I'm not sure what to give them. +2 to some useful skill or other, maybe. Or, in Eberron, something to bump their bardic abilities. Listen? - Ron ^*^
OneWinged4ngel 08-28-07, 12:04 AM	Sorry folks but, unless WotC decides to stop stealing intellectual content from under our noses, I'm gone. This is the last straw.
Euangelion 08-28-07, 12:16 AM	Sorry folks but, unless WotC decides to stop trying to steal intellectual content from under our noses, I'm gone. To protect my property, I'm deleting all my posts. This is the last straw. This is a true betrayal of the consumers. What are you talking about?!?!? Edit: Oh, I see in post 1. Personally, I always assumed anything we posted here was fair game for them, since these are their boards. There's been many times I've restrained from posting something because I didn't want it to "go public" before I had a chance to pitch it to WOTC.
forsaken1111 08-31-07, 07:59 PM	Sorry folks but, unless WotC decides to stop stealing intellectual content from under our noses, I'm gone. This is the last straw. What exactly sparked this? You found out that stuff you post here is theirs to take or something actually got taken?
bhasu 09-01-07, 09:50 PM	I like how even though we give over control, we are still liable in case it was plagiarized.
Yadot 09-01-07, 10:00 PM	What exactly sparked this? You found out that stuff you post here is theirs to take or something actually got taken? OW4 found out Wizards can use your stuff and you can't sue them in case of parallel developement. Which is funny because the old Terms of Use gave the property totally over to WotC and the new one just has you share a non-exclusive ownership. It's funny people are raising a hub-bub about what is a change in our favor and not the old, T$R-like measures.