Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Gilgamet 05-23-05, 11:13 AM	Our party seems to ignore action points as well. Another thread on this board suggested house rules for trading in Action Points for either an additional 10 feet of movement or stepping in for another character. Can you think of balanced trades for a Cleric class? What do you think the right number of action points would be to trade in for an extra turning? One extra healing spell? To recall a spell used? Can you think of other Cleric related tasks that we could trade things for? I think 2 APs for an extra turning may be fair. 1AP for a 0 level cleric spell 2 for a 1st level etc. Perhaps 4APs for a Recall? Thanks.
Streamweaver 05-23-05, 11:20 AM	I like the idea in general of expanding the role of action points. I'm a bit hesitant though becuase the Eberron way of doing it seems to be to take feats for the expanded use of action points. Does anyone else have balancing concerns about this if we start expanding the role for free? What about players that have already taken the feats to expand action points, what about the Dragonmarked Prestige class that has expanded AP use as their special ability? Any thoughts on this?
kenichi 05-23-05, 11:20 AM	Well a cleric already has the option to spend 2 Action Points for another use of Turn Undead. As for regaining or casting another spell, I think there is a feat in Races of Eberron that allows a caster to do something like this, but can't remember what it was called.
Pseudolife 05-24-05, 12:33 AM	The idea I had originally was definitly not to replace the feats, but to show the players that they ARE useful. If the players never take any of the feats, theirs no way for them to appreciate their usefulness. BUT if you give them a slightly different version of the feat, or ability... (One that isn't as good, AND more expensive!) They might realize what a GREAT DEAL the feats are, and how much better having them is! Anyway, for clerics instead of just giving additional uses... I'd suggest something more creative. Here's an example of what I mean: Why are clerics usually limited to turning undead? Why not in the right circumstance, let them spend AP to try turning a demon, devil, or aberration? I havn't put too much thought into it... but how about a feat to spend AP and heal say, 1+wis modifier hipoints as an immediate action? You know stuff like that...
AvonRekaes 05-24-05, 12:42 AM	WHy are they usually limited to turning undead? Well from a flavor standpoint, its becaue they are channeling positive energy, which is strictly anethema to undead. It might bother demons and devils a bit (holy water, sacred weapons [Libris Mortis]), but they can still be healed by curel spells, so positive energy isn't... "poisonous" to them like it is undead. From a mechanics standpoint, I'm fairly certain it's a balance issue. Possibly. *shrug*
MarkB 05-24-05, 05:19 AM	WHy are they usually limited to turning undead? Well from a flavor standpoint, its becaue they are channeling positive energy, which is strictly anethema to undead. It might bother demons and devils a bit (holy water, sacred weapons [Libris Mortis]), but they can still be healed by curel spells, so positive energy isn't... "poisonous" to them like it is undead. From a mechanics standpoint, I'm fairly certain it's a balance issue. Possibly. *shrug* Also, if you let Clerics turn fiends you're stepping on the toes of the Exorcist of the Silver Flame PrC.
Logos 05-24-05, 07:16 AM	I think AP are more than likely usefull enough already. Mayhap what the Pc's need to run up against is a foe who uses Ap more than giving them more ways to use ap than already exist ( your game your rules, but why botcher the system just to make sure players use it) haven't had a p[layer yet who hasn't once they realized what a boon ap where used them. Logos
Pseudolife 05-25-05, 05:12 AM	Something I tried today: roll 1d4's to make a DC higher for a spell or ability you use on a foe!
darkthought 05-25-05, 11:34 AM	A friend and I both use this house rule. When bleeding to death, spend an action point to instantly stablize. You're still at -9, but you're not bleeding to death.
kenichi 05-27-05, 01:37 PM	Actually that is not a house rule. Stabilizing is a normal use of action points.
Shades 05-28-05, 02:44 AM	There's a lot you can do with action points. I like what we've done now and then in our game, which I've seen a few other GMs have done... Let players suggest uses. Anything decently heroic they can think of that they want to do... that the gm approves of. Maybe they want to jump in and take the place of another player who's about to get attacked... Or they want to summon up their rage and berserk, in revenge for a fallen/wounded ally... Or they spy an extra sword and want to wildly attack the big baddy that just attacked with both swords at once (And temporarily bypass the penalties) While the party was up on ground level fighting off the Emerald claw's army, my artificer (who had been operating the lift that takes you from sub level to ground level) was stuck below. He knew the lift took five rounds to make the trip down and back...which would be too late to help. So I asked my GM if I could hero-rig / reprogram the console to make the lift move faster. He decided two AP and an infusion would get me up in a single round. So bam, my artificer, in a brilliant and desperate move, fashions a magical bypass out of a coil of hair, chainmail links, gold coins and a dagger. He shoves it into the console's guts, jumps aboard the now fast-moving wildly sparking lift, and up to the surface to help the others. I see AP as a tool to better prove the true heroic nature of the PCs. And I think once the other players see that AP can be used in various ways besides just boosting an attack or skill roll...they'll remember using them more often. You want them to makee the crazy moves more often... most of which can be produced by a specific mechanic (Swinging from ropes, leaping to catch hold of the airship, etc.) but some that aren't so specifically clear. The issue of feats is up to the GMs... I'd rather not have the extra feats, and just let players go ahead and suggest heroic actions without them. (Talking the non action adding feats... Heroic Spirit, Action Surge, and Action Boost give a point altering mechanic, which is seperately useful), to keep creativity and let players run wild. But that's just personal preference, and the GM rules. Just trying to give some extra ideas...sorry if I talked too long.
Shai 05-28-05, 12:56 PM	I am a bit fuzzy on the Action Point rules when it comes to Psionics. I am playing Human Psion in an Eberron Campaign, and while there seem to be feats for spellcasters and Action Points, there seems to be nothing comperable for Psionicists. I was thinking that, while I cannot replace Power Points with Action Points, in a fit of rage (which would have been nice last week), could I possibly boost up the anti of my Psionic Power by using an Action Point or two? Or is this a question better left for the Psionics board?
Arcane Guyver 05-30-05, 02:20 PM	I think the best way to re-introduce the group to AP is have an enemy use them. There's nothing more predictable than a player wanting to turn the tables on an annoying enemy. "He rolls an eleven, plus his various attack bonuses of seven....he's going to roll an ACTION POINT...that puts him up to twenty-two. That'll hit Tordek, yes?" As far as psionic uses for action points, how about a feat that lets you reduce the cost to manifest a power by two points (minimum one)? Or perhaps a feat that allows you to regain your psionic focus immediately after expending it?
Shai 06-01-05, 02:04 AM	Brilliant! Thanks so much, I will bring this up to the DM tomorrow. Again, thanks.
Crimsonsun 06-01-05, 02:16 AM	Or perhaps a feat that allows you to regain your psionic focus immediately after expending it? I wouldnt put that as a feat, but just allow you to burn an AP or 2(?) to keep your PSI focus through whatever you'd use it for. The PSI characters kinda got the short end of the stick when it comes to AP uses, compared to normal spellcasters or anything with a */day ability