Adventure Help...its over? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Adventure Help...its over? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Board_Rider
07-10-05, 12:07 AM Hey Party People,

Currently I am an a player in what is quickly becoming a downer of a campaign. We all reached 6th level and are going through (modified) Whisper of a Vampires Blade. Currently we have lost one player on the airship (after the masqeraude) and that put us at 4. So we track down Lucan at the temple and he has some invisible potions and he proceeds to whoop booty. He hides and heals and generally sneak attacks (he did it twice) with his slam attacks almost killing a party member who then has to fall back. His second SA with slam does kill a party member. Down to 3. Well 1 good 1 retreating and me.
I get dominated and am told to go outside the temple. I go.
Well 1 on 1 with Lucan and our Warlock happens and it becomes clear that Lucan can give and recieve equally well...Warlock bails.
We proceed to beat feet back to town when Lucan tells me (telepathically) he wants the other two PCs...I roll a save...and fail.

So here we are me chasing my 2 buddies.

Did any of you who played this find a way to defeat a guy who can heal and hide like Lucan does? How did you do it? Basically there is no way I can break that Dominate which means only the Warlock can hurt Lucan. The other PC is a very non combative rogue who can not break DR. He's the party's social guy.
Granted the encounters have been modified a bit due to our higher level. Even still, how would 4, 4th level people even over come a challenge such as Lucan? Makes no sense to me...
I ask only because I am pretty sure the campaign is done.
ILL34GL3
07-10-05, 02:01 AM Faerie Fire spell is pretty effective against invis.
Korhal_IV
07-10-05, 03:03 AM Lucan is one tough S.O.B. I'd advise using Faerie Fire, as Illegal mentions, and possibly as much anti-undead stuff as possible (like holy water). It might be possible for your social rogue to dig up reinforcements from the local garrisons.
Zedium
07-10-05, 03:16 AM To be fair, Lucan is a way too hard encounter for the whole adventure. The only way to truely beat him is to indeed overdo it on the anti-undead. But seeing he is seriously kicking your butts, don't hold back on the action points and hope you make it till dawn.
MarkB
07-10-05, 06:02 AM By a strict reading of the final encounter, Lucan's not interested in such sophisticated tactics - he's tough, he's angry, all he wants to do is kick their butts. And his default equipment does not include any potions.

Frankly, he's tough enough without them. I'm DMing this adventure, and my party just reached Lucan, after fighting through the first four chambers and getting seriously wounded on several occasions (their own fault - they have an excellent sneaky scout, but just trooped headlong into the chamber instead).

In the first round, Lucan won initiative and put the halfling barbarian on the ground with a single slam, and that was with me forgetting to add Sneak Attack damage - if I had, he'd have killed the halfling - and is placed to AoO anyone who tries to move more than 5 feet into the room, which is making it difficult to bring much force to bear against him. So far, the party Cleric has failed to Turn him (a hopeless cause, in fact, but he also blew his Knowledge (Religion) check to find that out), one party member has successfully Silversheened his +1 longsword, but is standing at the back of the group, the wizard fired off his remaining 3rd-level offensive spell - Lightning Bolt - which inflicted 1 point of damage after Energy Resistance after Lucan made his save, and the party Fighter managed to resist being Dominated.

With the party's condition at round two of the combat, I have no idea how I can realistically avoid a TPK when we pick things up next week. Nevermind hiding, special attacks and fast healing, right now he could just stroll through the group with slam attacks.
Zedium
07-10-05, 08:12 AM Well, you can always have Lucan grab the sword and lose his save so he runs off again controlled by the sword. Still, he is just too damn hard for the adventure, whoever thought of using Lucan there needs a good slap against the head.
ILL34GL3
07-10-05, 11:07 AM Yeah a character with Lucan's abilities is definitely a 4th level party killer. Bad design.
Board_Rider
07-10-05, 11:40 AM Yeah a character with Lucan's abilities is definitely a 4th level party killer. Bad design.
Thats what we all think too. Basically it comes down to his Dominate and Gaseous form. He keeps Dominating me (like I said NO way am I making that save...well unless I get a good roll) and every time he gets injured he flys away for a few rounds and comes back.
Now I could metagame and go get some Silversheen and a potion of Prot. from Evil but, having never battled undead before Lucan, my Warforged Fighter/Scout has no idea about those spells or Lucans DR.

The whole group just doesn't get how it would be feasible for a 4th level party to even consider beating Lucan and finishing the adventure.
ILL34GL3
07-10-05, 11:57 AM All I can really think of is you should consult or even enlist the aid of a cleric. Hopefully, a cleric could at least inform your characters of a vampire's weaknesses. (You'd be surprised how accurate those cheesy Hollywood horror flicks were on vampire weaknesses).

Also, at your level, I'd hope everyone in the party has at least one magical weapon to bypass his DR.

Finally, you might try starting threads on the Magic, Spells and Character Optimization boards on foiling Gaseous Form and vampires in general.
MarkB
07-10-05, 12:32 PM Now I could metagame and go get some Silversheen and a potion of Prot. from Evil but, having never battled undead before Lucan, my Warforged Fighter/Scout has no idea about those spells or Lucans DR.
One thing I did to give my party an edge was to equip the leader and a couple of soldiers of the group who attacked the airship with silversheen potions in addition to their wooden stakes. Without that, even though they knew by then that they needed silver weapons, there was simply no opportuinty for the party to go shopping for them.

All I can really think of is you should consult or even enlist the aid of a cleric. Hopefully, a cleric could at least inform your characters of a vampire's weaknesses. (You'd be surprised how accurate those cheesy Hollywood horror flicks were on vampire weaknesses).
My party has a Cleric - who managed to roll a natural 1 on his Knowledge check. Fortunately, one of the two fighters is working towards becoming an Order of the Bow Initiate (which I've made a Silver Flame monastic sect), and he had ranks in Knowledge (Religion), and managed a decent roll. Still only enough to know the basic damage reduction and resistances, but it at least saved him trying his initial intention of using masterwork silver arrows with a mundane bow.
Board_Rider
07-10-05, 01:23 PM All I can really think of is you should consult or even enlist the aid of a cleric. Hopefully, a cleric could at least inform your characters of a vampire's weaknesses. (You'd be surprised how accurate those cheesy Hollywood horror flicks were on vampire weaknesses).

Yeah I want to do that. However I am currently Dominated wandering the streets of the town searching for my two party friends. I am ordered to bring their unconcious bodies to Lucan..so we will see how that goes.
LugWrench
07-10-05, 06:30 PM Actually, my group hit on a way to deal with Lucian getting too close to them. In the Arms and Equipment Guide, theres a little device called a Sprayer. Kinda like a little Super Soaker..... Well, cast Create Water and fill it up...then Bless the water.... Instant Holy Watergun. It didnt do much, but I had to give them bonus XP for thinking up something like that. :)
Chiyo
07-10-05, 09:33 PM I think the fight against Lucan really depends on party preparation. While in Trolanport, our cleric went to the main temple of the Sovereign Host and gathered info on vampires. He had a great knowledge check I guess because we knew a lot about vampires (our characters not only the players).

So when we faced him, I had scribed 10 protection from evil scrolls and used on each of us so that he cannot dominate anyone. We also knew not to bother with cold/electricity damage but loaded up on fire spells and magic missiles including from the wand of his sister. I had 3 scrolls of detect undead so we weren't surprised as to where to find him. I twinned a CL5 wand of magic missiles and let him have it (two rounds of 6 magic missiles). We also had found silversheen vials from previous adventures (4 total) and had kept them. With bane (undead) weapon augmentations and silversheen, our two frontline guys were hitting him for 15+ every time.

Fight was over in 2 rounds. He didn't go invisible but he tried to go gaseous only to get hit by scorching ray and magic missiles. If he had turned invisible, I had a scroll of see invisible anyway (go scroll-o-matic artificer lol).

Maybe DM didn't play him to his full potential but I think it was also a question of preparation with some luck possibly on knowledge religion. Still, in the ball we could have figured a few things out from the fight even if we didn't know he was a vampire and what it meant. Also having taken out Grilsha early on meant he really didn't have her for support in the final fight. If he had her with him, it could have been messy.
themind
07-11-05, 12:27 AM My party got lucky. Lucan was able to Dominate two characters. One rogue to run, and one of the fighters to attack the other Rogue, in which he failed his saves. Then the Cleric cast Protection from Evil on the Fighter, negating the Domination effect. The Fighter than got a lucky hit, with a full out Power Attack with a Great sword taking a good chunck of Hp from Lucan.

For me, it was just luck of the Dice that helped the PC's.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Board_Rider 07-10-05, 12:07 AM	Hey Party People, Currently I am an a player in what is quickly becoming a downer of a campaign. We all reached 6th level and are going through (modified) Whisper of a Vampires Blade. Currently we have lost one player on the airship (after the masqeraude) and that put us at 4. So we track down Lucan at the temple and he has some invisible potions and he proceeds to whoop booty. He hides and heals and generally sneak attacks (he did it twice) with his slam attacks almost killing a party member who then has to fall back. His second SA with slam does kill a party member. Down to 3. Well 1 good 1 retreating and me. I get dominated and am told to go outside the temple. I go. Well 1 on 1 with Lucan and our Warlock happens and it becomes clear that Lucan can give and recieve equally well...Warlock bails. We proceed to beat feet back to town when Lucan tells me (telepathically) he wants the other two PCs...I roll a save...and fail. So here we are me chasing my 2 buddies. Did any of you who played this find a way to defeat a guy who can heal and hide like Lucan does? How did you do it? Basically there is no way I can break that Dominate which means only the Warlock can hurt Lucan. The other PC is a very non combative rogue who can not break DR. He's the party's social guy. Granted the encounters have been modified a bit due to our higher level. Even still, how would 4, 4th level people even over come a challenge such as Lucan? Makes no sense to me... I ask only because I am pretty sure the campaign is done.
ILL34GL3 07-10-05, 02:01 AM	Faerie Fire spell is pretty effective against invis.
Korhal_IV 07-10-05, 03:03 AM	Lucan is one tough S.O.B. I'd advise using Faerie Fire, as Illegal mentions, and possibly as much anti-undead stuff as possible (like holy water). It might be possible for your social rogue to dig up reinforcements from the local garrisons.
Zedium 07-10-05, 03:16 AM	To be fair, Lucan is a way too hard encounter for the whole adventure. The only way to truely beat him is to indeed overdo it on the anti-undead. But seeing he is seriously kicking your butts, don't hold back on the action points and hope you make it till dawn.
MarkB 07-10-05, 06:02 AM	By a strict reading of the final encounter, Lucan's not interested in such sophisticated tactics - he's tough, he's angry, all he wants to do is kick their butts. And his default equipment does not include any potions. Frankly, he's tough enough without them. I'm DMing this adventure, and my party just reached Lucan, after fighting through the first four chambers and getting seriously wounded on several occasions (their own fault - they have an excellent sneaky scout, but just trooped headlong into the chamber instead). In the first round, Lucan won initiative and put the halfling barbarian on the ground with a single slam, and that was with me forgetting to add Sneak Attack damage - if I had, he'd have killed the halfling - and is placed to AoO anyone who tries to move more than 5 feet into the room, which is making it difficult to bring much force to bear against him. So far, the party Cleric has failed to Turn him (a hopeless cause, in fact, but he also blew his Knowledge (Religion) check to find that out), one party member has successfully Silversheened his +1 longsword, but is standing at the back of the group, the wizard fired off his remaining 3rd-level offensive spell - Lightning Bolt - which inflicted 1 point of damage after Energy Resistance after Lucan made his save, and the party Fighter managed to resist being Dominated. With the party's condition at round two of the combat, I have no idea how I can realistically avoid a TPK when we pick things up next week. Nevermind hiding, special attacks and fast healing, right now he could just stroll through the group with slam attacks.
Zedium 07-10-05, 08:12 AM	Well, you can always have Lucan grab the sword and lose his save so he runs off again controlled by the sword. Still, he is just too damn hard for the adventure, whoever thought of using Lucan there needs a good slap against the head.
ILL34GL3 07-10-05, 11:07 AM	Yeah a character with Lucan's abilities is definitely a 4th level party killer. Bad design.
Board_Rider 07-10-05, 11:40 AM	Yeah a character with Lucan's abilities is definitely a 4th level party killer. Bad design. Thats what we all think too. Basically it comes down to his Dominate and Gaseous form. He keeps Dominating me (like I said NO way am I making that save...well unless I get a good roll) and every time he gets injured he flys away for a few rounds and comes back. Now I could metagame and go get some Silversheen and a potion of Prot. from Evil but, having never battled undead before Lucan, my Warforged Fighter/Scout has no idea about those spells or Lucans DR. The whole group just doesn't get how it would be feasible for a 4th level party to even consider beating Lucan and finishing the adventure.
ILL34GL3 07-10-05, 11:57 AM	All I can really think of is you should consult or even enlist the aid of a cleric. Hopefully, a cleric could at least inform your characters of a vampire's weaknesses. (You'd be surprised how accurate those cheesy Hollywood horror flicks were on vampire weaknesses). Also, at your level, I'd hope everyone in the party has at least one magical weapon to bypass his DR. Finally, you might try starting threads on the Magic, Spells and Character Optimization boards on foiling Gaseous Form and vampires in general.
MarkB 07-10-05, 12:32 PM	Now I could metagame and go get some Silversheen and a potion of Prot. from Evil but, having never battled undead before Lucan, my Warforged Fighter/Scout has no idea about those spells or Lucans DR. One thing I did to give my party an edge was to equip the leader and a couple of soldiers of the group who attacked the airship with silversheen potions in addition to their wooden stakes. Without that, even though they knew by then that they needed silver weapons, there was simply no opportuinty for the party to go shopping for them. All I can really think of is you should consult or even enlist the aid of a cleric. Hopefully, a cleric could at least inform your characters of a vampire's weaknesses. (You'd be surprised how accurate those cheesy Hollywood horror flicks were on vampire weaknesses). My party has a Cleric - who managed to roll a natural 1 on his Knowledge check. Fortunately, one of the two fighters is working towards becoming an Order of the Bow Initiate (which I've made a Silver Flame monastic sect), and he had ranks in Knowledge (Religion), and managed a decent roll. Still only enough to know the basic damage reduction and resistances, but it at least saved him trying his initial intention of using masterwork silver arrows with a mundane bow.
Board_Rider 07-10-05, 01:23 PM	All I can really think of is you should consult or even enlist the aid of a cleric. Hopefully, a cleric could at least inform your characters of a vampire's weaknesses. (You'd be surprised how accurate those cheesy Hollywood horror flicks were on vampire weaknesses). Yeah I want to do that. However I am currently Dominated wandering the streets of the town searching for my two party friends. I am ordered to bring their unconcious bodies to Lucan..so we will see how that goes.
LugWrench 07-10-05, 06:30 PM	Actually, my group hit on a way to deal with Lucian getting too close to them. In the Arms and Equipment Guide, theres a little device called a Sprayer. Kinda like a little Super Soaker..... Well, cast Create Water and fill it up...then Bless the water.... Instant Holy Watergun. It didnt do much, but I had to give them bonus XP for thinking up something like that. :)
Chiyo 07-10-05, 09:33 PM	I think the fight against Lucan really depends on party preparation. While in Trolanport, our cleric went to the main temple of the Sovereign Host and gathered info on vampires. He had a great knowledge check I guess because we knew a lot about vampires (our characters not only the players). So when we faced him, I had scribed 10 protection from evil scrolls and used on each of us so that he cannot dominate anyone. We also knew not to bother with cold/electricity damage but loaded up on fire spells and magic missiles including from the wand of his sister. I had 3 scrolls of detect undead so we weren't surprised as to where to find him. I twinned a CL5 wand of magic missiles and let him have it (two rounds of 6 magic missiles). We also had found silversheen vials from previous adventures (4 total) and had kept them. With bane (undead) weapon augmentations and silversheen, our two frontline guys were hitting him for 15+ every time. Fight was over in 2 rounds. He didn't go invisible but he tried to go gaseous only to get hit by scorching ray and magic missiles. If he had turned invisible, I had a scroll of see invisible anyway (go scroll-o-matic artificer lol). Maybe DM didn't play him to his full potential but I think it was also a question of preparation with some luck possibly on knowledge religion. Still, in the ball we could have figured a few things out from the fight even if we didn't know he was a vampire and what it meant. Also having taken out Grilsha early on meant he really didn't have her for support in the final fight. If he had her with him, it could have been messy.
themind 07-11-05, 12:27 AM	My party got lucky. Lucan was able to Dominate two characters. One rogue to run, and one of the fighters to attack the other Rogue, in which he failed his saves. Then the Cleric cast Protection from Evil on the Fighter, negating the Domination effect. The Fighter than got a lucky hit, with a full out Power Attack with a Great sword taking a good chunck of Hp from Lucan. For me, it was just luck of the Dice that helped the PC's.