Post/Author/DateTime	Post
DBlizzard 03-07-07, 12:42 AM	"WotC has said they won't be advancing the timeline." I've heard comments along these lines for quite a while now. However, besides a few comments from Keith that Eberron isn't intended to have a metaplot (which doesn't necessarily mean the timeline can't be advanced), I can't find any actual reference to such a comment from an official source. Does anyone know where this comment was made? I'm looking for specifics.
Kaleanae en'i Mori 03-07-07, 02:06 AM	My Ebrron year is 1001, quite advanced. We have seen Drooam and Breland go to war, the warforged form their own enclave int he SE corner of Drooam taking advantange of the war and the deposed Queen of Thrane in secreat talks with the exile Cyran Prince. My PC's over the last couple of years are now sitting around 15th level.
Sturm Jaeger 03-07-07, 02:18 AM	Did your Khorvaire suffer from the Y1K virus? :)
Shady314 03-07-07, 04:08 AM	"WotC has said they won't be advancing the timeline." I've heard comments along these lines for quite a while now. However, besides a few comments from Keith that Eberron isn't intended to have a metaplot (which doesn't necessarily mean the timeline can't be advanced), I can't find any actual reference to such a comment from an official source. Does anyone know where this comment was made? I'm looking for specifics. Someone that knows more may come into to correct me but my understanding of this statement is based on two concrete facts. The novels have been stated to NOT be canon. Unlike in FR where what happens in books happens in the setting, and since in books time progresses the setting must progress as well, the "official" Eberron does not suffer from this. If Khorvaire blows up in a novel that doesn't affect the setting. If a country blows up in an FR novel that country has blown up. Stemming from this is the fact all sourcebooks assume the year is 998YK. All the information we have received is centered around the same period of time. SoS shows what Sarlona is like now in 998YK. The ECS shows what Eberron is like in 998YK. SoX shows what Xendrik is like now in 998YK. ETC.
Kid SixXx 03-07-07, 06:42 AM	I tend to agree with Shady for once. I haven't heard any official statement on advancement of the Eberron timeline one way or the other, but all sourcebooks introduce the new materiel in the present day (998YK), and novels don't apply to what's going on inside individual campaigns. Unlike the FR, where if something happens in a novel it will show up in a splatbook sooner or later. FR folks will pretty much demand that it does in the hopes of yanking another regional splatbook out of the printing presses.
DBlizzard 03-07-07, 10:28 AM	The novels have been stated to NOT be canon. Where was this stated? I vaguely remember this, but without a reference it's pretty much in urban legend territory. Stemming from this is the fact all sourcebooks assume the year is 998YK. All the information we have received is centered around the same period of time. SoS shows what Sarlona is like now in 998YK. The ECS shows what Eberron is like in 998YK. SoX shows what Xendrik is like now in 998YK. ETC. Of course all the sourcebooks are in 998 YK. First you have to flesh out the starting section of the world before you do anything with advancing the storyline. Once they cover the breadth of the world, then you start playing with moving dates forward.
Melvin the Mediocre 03-07-07, 10:35 AM	"WotC has said they won't be advancing the timeline." I've heard comments along these lines for quite a while now. However, besides a few comments from Keith that Eberron isn't intended to have a metaplot (which doesn't necessarily mean the timeline can't be advanced), I can't find any actual reference to such a comment from an official source. Does anyone know where this comment was made? I'm looking for specifics. The Dreaming Dark.
Kid SixXx 03-07-07, 10:49 AM	Where was this stated? I vaguely remember this, but without a reference it's pretty much in urban legend territory. Well, here's the transcript from the chat at Breland Ledgers for starters: Brooklynknight <Taurren> I'm not certain if this is appropriate but here goes ... With all the discussions that are generated over whether-or-not certain novels are "canon" in the FR universe, what are your thoughts regarding Eberron novels? Should they be considered canon? KeithBaker Hmmm. KeithBaker Tough call. Brooklynknight Can i answer? It will be an opinion but it might satisfy the question. KeithBaker Certainly my goal in writing City of Towers (and the appendixes) was to provide more solid info about world, especially with the derth of sourcebooks out there. KeithBaker Let me finish first, then you can add in if still needed. Brooklynknight by all means KeithBaker I believe that as we continue generating RPG material, we will pay attention to what has been said in the novels; we don't want to contradict anything. KeithBaker However, that doesn't mean that you as a DM have to stick with the novels: if you want to do something different with the Mark of Death than Matt has, I think you should. With the caveat that the gameworld belongs to WoTC now and Keith is pretty much an advisor, it's a pretty good assumption that the novels don't monkey around with the info in the splatbooks. Otherwise, we'd have a harder job addressing that Half-Elven Dragomarked scion of House Orien issue from The Crimson Talisman that flies in the face of how most of us believe dragonmarks should work. I think that Keith has also said that the novels pretty much represent individual campaigns rather than what's going on in Eberron right now. After all, the spirit of the setting is that the PC's that DM's entertain are the premier heroes. Can't very well do that with Daine, Pierce and Lei running around hogging all of the good peril.
Ryoden_Anariavas 03-07-07, 10:49 AM	I dont know if there is any oficial awnser to this but another question is if WotC should or shouldn't have a metaplot for Eberron I feel that they shouldn't. It makes for alot of room for each DM to have "thier eberron" be how they want it to be and therefore more enjoyable. It also means that you dont have to worry about contradicting the metaplot. When a new book comes out you dont need to change your story you just fit the book into your story
DBlizzard 03-07-07, 07:20 PM	I dont know if there is any oficial awnser to this but another question is if WotC should or shouldn't have a metaplot for Eberron The reason I really want an answer to this is because I think a discussion about whether their should be an advancement of the timeline, or there should be some metaplots (not necessarily the same thing) could be interesting. However, whenever you start such a discussion you get the same people saying "WotC has said they won't advance the timeline" or "WotC has said their won't be metaplots." Looking through my resources, I've seen no authoritative comments on these subjects. I'm not a big fan of some of the effects of metaplots. However, I think no campaign setting is in a better position for an advancement of the timelinel than Eberron, even if it's just in "What if?" type scenarios. Eberron is a simmering pot just getting ready to boil. Not exploring the boiling and possibly explosive elements in some way is, to me, just leaving so much of the area of exploration off-the-table. So, I'm looking for where these people are getting their facts.
UnderworldLord 03-07-07, 08:07 PM	So what we've come to conclude is that there needs to be a source book of 'what ifs' for timeline advancement. I think some other thread had that idea in it.
DBlizzard 03-07-07, 11:39 PM	So what we've come to conclude is that there needs to be a source book of 'what ifs' for timeline advancement. I think some other thread had that idea in it. Yes, well it was my thread. However, exploring various options is more what I'm interested in. Still, right now I'm waiting for those who insist that WotC has stated there won't be a metaplot and they won't advance the timeline to back up their claims (or even those who haven't).
Lady Morn 03-08-07, 01:40 AM	Personally, I think that metaplots and advancing timelines disrepects the 3 years we've all had to flesh out and create our own Eberrons. I don't know about anyone else, but my campaign doesn't have an Infinities label slapped on it. :pbbbtt:
Shady314 03-08-07, 04:50 AM	Of course all the sourcebooks are in 998 YK. First you have to flesh out the starting section of the world before you do anything with advancing the storyline. Once they cover the breadth of the world, then you start playing with moving dates forward. Well perhaps they will but for now the world is frozen in the year 998YK and shall remain so for a very long time. It's one thing though to start all your sourcebooks with the same period of time. Quite another to have them start in the exact same year. And I feel compelled to point out we have had a number of novels so far. And yet the timeline has yet to advance or acknowledge the books at all. Except for one picture of Lei and possibly Pierce. Which I think was just a nice little cameo. :)
(Psi)SeveredHead 03-08-07, 07:42 AM	Personally, I think that metaplots and advancing timelines disrepects the 3 years we've all had to flesh out and create our own Eberrons. I don't know about anyone else, but my campaign doesn't have an Infinities label slapped on it. :pbbbtt: It doesn't have a "destroy with next novel" tag on it either. (Unless it does.) The power to change your campaign is up to you, not WotC or a novel author.
davethebrave371 03-08-07, 09:32 AM	Well perhaps they will but for now the world is frozen in the year 998YK and shall remain so for a very long time. It's one thing though to start all your sourcebooks with the same period of time. Quite another to have them start in the exact same year. And I feel compelled to point out we have had a number of novels so far. And yet the timeline has yet to advance or acknowledge the books at all. Except for one picture of Lei and possibly Pierce. Which I think was just a nice little cameo. :) Actually, the DD series was set prior to 998, if you look at the dates in the first book.
Lady Morn 03-08-07, 11:36 AM	The power to change your campaign is up to you, not WotC or a novel author. I never said WotC had a vote at my table. ;) But the fact still remains that we've all had time to decide what's down the road for our versions of the setting. And for WotC to attempt to steer things in a direction of their choosing is disrespectful toward those of us who have put in that time and effort. As much as I love and support the setting, I'm also very cognizant of the fact that WotC would have no qualms about loosing me, and those like me, as customers if they found just as many they could lead around by the nose. Sadly, by marketing every hack and no-count that writes a novel as spouting gospel truth, that would be exactly what they were aiming for. :weep:
Zalaz Mavi 03-08-07, 01:14 PM	As much as I love and support the setting, I'm also very cognizant of the fact that WotC would have no qualms about loosing me, and those like me, as customers if they found just as many they could lead around by the nose. This stems from one of the contradictions of gaming as both a business and a hobby. Although the game is about imagination and creativity, an imaginative and creative gamer is an unreliable and far from ideal customer. Yes, at the end of the day it is to Wizard's advantage to set adrift that segment of their customer base that doesn't view their products as necessities. It is also to Wizard's advantage to take their brands into as many media outlets as possible to generate profits from licensing. It should have been clear to everyone that the Eberron video game and Eberron comic book were measures to test market reaction to those products. The moment they feel they are in positive territory, a metaplot is an inevitability in order to create maximum ties to the brand and generate maximum returns...
DoveArrow 03-08-07, 03:06 PM	Personally, I wouldn't mind seeing Eberron's timeline advance. Not right now, of course, since there's still plenty of source material out there that hasn't been covered yet. However, there's going to come a day when all of Eberron will be covered in a sourcebook and there's going to be nothing left to do but go over the old stuff again in more detail, or advance the storyline. When that day comes, I think Wizards of the Coast is going to find it better to advance the storyline then to simply retread over what already exists. Meanwhile, for those of you who are against the idea of the storyline advancing, consider how it could benefit the campaign setting. An advancement in the timeline is an opportunity to introduce new monsters, new plots, new villains, and new concepts that wouldn't necessarily fit into the campaign setting the way it stands. You may be thinking good, I don't want it to change, but consider ten years down the road. How many games can you really run with the PCs fighting the Lord of Blades and the Daughters of Sora Kell before your game starts feeling like it's in reruns? Sure, you can argue that people can introduce their own villains. However, isn't the whole point of sourcebooks to give people ideas for new villains, new monsters, and new concepts so that they can weave those into their own storylines? Anyway, those are my thoughts on the matter. Take them for what they are.
OneWinged4ngel 03-08-07, 03:39 PM	Did your Khorvaire suffer from the Y1K virus? :) Yes. All the dragonshards stopped working. Airships plummeted from the sky. Good stuff. :P
(Psi)SeveredHead 03-08-07, 06:09 PM	I never said WotC had a vote at my table. ;) But the fact still remains that we've all had time to decide what's down the road for our versions of the setting. And for WotC to attempt to steer things in a direction of their choosing is disrespectful toward those of us who have put in that time and effort. Wait. I think we agree with each other! WotC isn't trying to steer things in a direction - they can't, due to lack of metaplot.
DoveArrow 03-08-07, 06:55 PM	Yes. All the dragonshards stopped working. Airships plummeted from the sky. Good stuff. :P Man, you'd think the progenitor dragons would've considered that issue when they created the multiverse in the first place. Sure, maybe they didn't have the space-time to handle that many millennia at first, but they could've uploaded draconic prophecy patches to fix the problem before the whole system crashed. Now they've shipped all of their tech support over to the Sovereign Host and the Silver Flame, who don't even speak Draconic, and who never seem to respond to your prayers. At least with the Forgotten Realms gods, they get back to you when you pray. Honestly, I don't understand how the progenitor wyrms have remained in the omnipotent business this long. Sheesh!
Arivia 03-08-07, 06:56 PM	Wait. I think we agree with each other! WotC isn't trying to steer things in a direction - they can't, due to lack of metaplot. Theme and mood are just an illusion, right? The line designer's job description is "sip cocktails in Tahiti"?
Lancer2010 03-09-07, 11:06 AM	Man, you'd think the progenitor dragons would've considered that issue when they created the multiverse in the first place. Sure, maybe they didn't have the space-time to handle that many millennia at first, but they could've uploaded draconic prophecy patches to fix the problem before the whole system crashed. Now they've shipped all of their tech support over to the Sovereign Host and the Silver Flame, who don't even speak Draconic, and who never seem to respond to your prayers. At least with the Forgotten Realms gods, they get back to you when you pray. Honestly, I don't understand how the progenitor wyrms have remained in the omnipotent business this long. Sheesh! ... Once I figure out how to hide sigs and everything, I call dibs on this one!
Edymnion 03-09-07, 01:17 PM	Where was this stated? I vaguely remember this, but without a reference it's pretty much in urban legend territory.It was, if I remember correctly, said by various officials (besides keith) on the boards here. Of course, the problem there is that anything along those lines would have been from back when the Eberron board first started, and those posts have likely been long since pruned. It has been said, by someone with the authority to say it, its just that the announcement has been thoroughly buried since then. Not unlike the classic 3.5 announcement that "Two people could sit side by side playing the game, one with 3.0 and one with 3.5, and never know they weren't using exactly the same rules!" that you won't find anywhere official now either, but that doesn't mean they didn't say it.
DoveArrow 03-09-07, 01:47 PM	... Once I figure out how to hide sigs and everything, I call dibs on this one! I'm being sigged. Yay. :D
Hellcow 03-09-07, 01:50 PM	And I feel compelled to point out we have had a number of novels so far. And yet the timeline has yet to advance or acknowledge the books at all. Actually, one key example is the docent Shira, who appears in both Secrets of Xen'drik and The Shattered Land. The key is that Secrets of Xen'drik says nothing about Shira's fate as shown in TSL, even though IIRC, TSL came out first. As the author of both, the point was that TSL shows you how I've used Shira in my "campaign" - but SoX carries the expectation that if YOU use Shira, you'll do something completely different with her. I don't know if WotC has ever officially stated that they will NEVER advance the Eberron timeline. It's clearly not the standard practice; as has been noted, sourcebooks are set in 998 YK. But if Eberron's still with us in five or ten years? Who knows. Maybe they will want to do a "Next War" book or something like that. What's clear, however, is that it is not part of the current strategy for the line.
mfaulkner 03-09-07, 04:17 PM	Actually, one key example is the docent Shira, who appears in both Secrets of Xen'drik and The Shattered Land. The key is that Secrets of Xen'drik says nothing about Shira's fate as shown in TSL, even though IIRC, TSL came out first. As the author of both, the point was that TSL shows you how I've used Shira in my "campaign" - but SoX carries the expectation that if YOU use Shira, you'll do something completely different with her. I don't know if WotC has ever officially stated that they will NEVER advance the Eberron timeline. It's clearly not the standard practice; as has been noted, sourcebooks are set in 998 YK. But if Eberron's still with us in five or ten years? Who knows. Maybe they will want to do a "Next War" book or something like that. What's clear, however, is that it is not part of the current strategy for the line. Well now, You can't get a better answer than that.
Shady314 03-09-07, 05:25 PM	Actually, one key example is the docent Shira, who appears in both Secrets of Xen'drik and The Shattered Land. The key is that Secrets of Xen'drik says nothing about Shira's fate as shown in TSL, even though IIRC, TSL came out first. As the author of both, the point was that TSL shows you how I've used Shira in my "campaign" - but SoX carries the expectation that if YOU use Shira, you'll do something completely different with her. I don't know if WotC has ever officially stated that they will NEVER advance the Eberron timeline. It's clearly not the standard practice; as has been noted, sourcebooks are set in 998 YK. But if Eberron's still with us in five or ten years? Who knows. Maybe they will want to do a "Next War" book or something like that. What's clear, however, is that it is not part of the current strategy for the line. Even though I completely forgot about Shira! I'll defend myself by saying even though she is a trapped spirit she's ultimately just a sentient magical item. :) And I don't have a problem with item cross-overs. I'd actually like to see mechanics on Lei's vest, Dane's sword or the Traveler's Tooth etc. just without their names attached. Still the fact I forgot about her is the perfect example of how the novels and sourcebooks in Eberron don't interact the way they do in FR. And yes thanks for the answer!
Korhal IV 03-10-07, 12:45 AM	... Once I figure out how to hide sigs and everything, I call dibs on this one! I've sent you a private message about that. I think WotC's demonstrated a reasonable commitment to not advancing Eberron's timeline - does anyone know how much time elapsed between FR's introduction and the first publication of a metaplot event (novel/sourcebook)? Because, to play devil's advocate, we may just be getting another handful of books before WotC's decided it's exhausted the reasonable supplement material (I can foresee Planes of Eberron, Secrets of Argonnessen, and The Other Seven Nations - then what?), and decides to kickstart lagging sales with a trilogy about King Boranel dying to an assassin pursued by a dual-scimitar-wielding drow and the ensuing Last War, which will involve much dramatic angsting on snow-covered knolls while having one's long, improbably-colored hair waving in the wind.
Arivia 03-13-07, 01:43 AM	I think WotC's demonstrated a reasonable commitment to not advancing Eberron's timeline - does anyone know how much time elapsed between FR's introduction and the first publication of a metaplot event (novel/sourcebook)? 3 years or so, by way of the beginning of 2e. It's important to differentiate company-imposed events from mere timeline advancement - the very first FRCS covers three different playable years and a multitude of events therein, including at least two wars - as the Realms has always been designed to advance.
cancerousmango 03-13-07, 02:25 AM	"I am a beautiful animal. I am a destroyer of worlds. I am Harry f*cking Potter"
goblin_pride 03-13-07, 03:31 AM	kickstart lagging sales with a trilogy about King Boranel dying to an assassin pursued by a dual-scimitar-wielding drow and the ensuing Last War, which will involve much dramatic angsting on snow-covered knolls while having one's long, improbably-colored hair waving in the wind. If Drizzt makes his way to Eberron, I'm going back to homebrew games. Don't get me wrong, I like angst-ridden heroes, but c'mon, could we at least get over the Drizzt worship already?
mightyix 03-13-07, 04:46 PM	I've been playing this game for a looooooooooong time. Longer than I'd care to admit. The first Greyhawk supplement to have campaign specific material was the Greyhawk Folio in 1980. 1st Edition saw the Greyhawk boxed set (1983) establish a relatively static, relatively detailed, and completely open ended campaign setting where anything was possible, and essentially replaced (but didn't timeline update the Folio). The Greyhawk Adventures hardbound book (1988) didn't update the campaign timeline much, but did provide more setting flavor. There was a later City of Greyhawk boxed set (1989) which advanced the timeline a little bit more, but not too terribly much, focusing mainly on the Free City of Greyhawk and the immediate environs. Then there was a Greyhawk Wars (1991) board game which started a change to the campaign maps. Then there was a new Greyhawk boxed set, From the Ashes (1992) that documented the official changes from Greyhawk Wars for second edition. There were a smattering of 2nd Ed modules (like Rary the Traitor, and Return of the Eight) which added some additional details to the progression of events in the game world, but the setting remained pretty stagnant from 1993 to 1998 - almost no new material was released for the setting. 3rd Edition put out some half-hearted updates for the campaign setting, and the timeline has been frozen since "Greyhawk Gazeteer" about 5 years ago. Forgotten Realms is the ONLY campaign setting that serially advances in timeline and events, and is pretty much the exception rather than the rule. But we're talking 20 years of campai
Edymnion 03-13-07, 08:35 PM	"I am a beautiful animal. I am a destroyer of worlds. I am Harry f*cking Potter"This is Fluffy, destroyer of worlds, and he contest your claim to that title. (http://web.mit.edu/kmwerts/www/fluffy.jpg)
davethebrave371 03-31-07, 04:31 PM	Don Bassingthwaite: The trilogy is called Legacy of the Empire and the first book will be The Doom of Kings. The area I get to explore is Darguun, the hobgoblin nation, so I’m looking forward to that. In this trilogy I get to do a continuity event, which in Forgotten Realms you might call it something like a RSE or Realms-shaking event. This isn’t on that level—no destroying cities, no killing off gods, no massive changes—but it will be something that will influence the game continuity. So I’m kind of proud to be able to do that. (http://www.mania.com/53287.html)
goblin_pride 03-31-07, 08:11 PM	Bah, I knew somebody would start fiddling with my Dhakaani eventually.
davethebrave371 03-31-07, 08:50 PM	Well, it might be that a united Dhakaan takes over from those pretender Darguun losers. ...but chances are, they won't.
DBlizzard 03-31-07, 11:24 PM	3rd Edition put out some half-hearted updates for the campaign setting, and the timeline has been frozen since "Greyhawk Gazeteer" about 5 years ago.i Arguable point. The Living Greyhawk campaign has significantly advanced the time line. It comes down to a discussion of what publications count as official. It really won't be significantly decided until WotC publishes an open product that either includes or specifically excludes the LG canon. Forgotten Realms is the ONLY campaign setting that serially advances in timeline and events, and is pretty much the exception rather than the rule. I beg to differ. IIRC, Dark Sun had some significant advancement of timeline and events. Ravenloft as well (with domains arriving and leaving). Non-D&D settings have had as well, but that varies quite a bit. Bah, I knew somebody would start fiddling with my Dhakaani eventually. Nobody is fiddling with "your Dhakaani." The only ones that can do that (or at least allow that) are you and your players.
davethebrave371 03-31-07, 11:50 PM	Nobody is fiddling with "your Dhakaani." The only ones that can do that (or at least allow that) are you and your players. I think he meant it in a "my favourite element of canon metaplot" fashion, not that literally.
goblin_pride 04-01-07, 08:10 AM	I think he meant it in a "my favourite element of canon metaplot" fashion, not that literally. Exactly what I meant, Dave. :cookie:
Kaodi 04-01-07, 11:20 AM	Whoever at Wizards decided to advance the metaplot, we should hunt them down and force them to repent before sentencing them to an eternity of... of... Well, I am sure we will think of something...
Taejix 04-01-07, 12:15 PM	Don Bassingthwaite: The trilogy is called Legacy of the Empire and the first book will be The Doom of Kings. The area I get to explore is Darguun, the hobgoblin nation, so I’m looking forward to that. In this trilogy I get to do a continuity event, which in Forgotten Realms you might call it something like a RSE or Realms-shaking event. This isn’t on that level—no destroying cities, no killing off gods, no massive changes—but it will be something that will influence the game continuity. So I’m kind of proud to be able to do that. (http://www.mania.com/53287.html) ... ... ... ...Anyone seen the video for Tenacious D's "Beelzeboss"? Remember their reaction to Beelzeboss' appearance? Yeah, that's what I'm doing now. I just hope that there's been some sort of mixup or prank, because otherwise this is very bad news for Eberron. The fact that the novels haven't been able to mess up the setting is one of the reasons the setting is so cohesive. If folks start being able to alter the setting in the novels, sooner or later some writer is going to come along without having properly read even the ECS and everything is gonna head back to the thrice-damned stereotypes. ya' know, with the goblins being weak and helpless monsters, the dragons rampaging across the countryside, and the gods making personal appearances ever so often. And then there'll be some Eberron version of Eliminster. It's a downward spiral I tell you. :weep:
davethebrave371 04-01-07, 12:37 PM	... ... ... ...Anyone seen the video for Tenacious D's "Beelzeboss"? Remember their reaction to Beelzeboss' appearance? Yeah, that's what I'm doing now. I just hope that there's been some sort of mixup or prank, because otherwise this is very bad news for Eberron. The fact that the novels haven't been able to mess up the setting is one of the reasons the setting is so cohesive. If folks start being able to alter the setting in the novels, sooner or later some writer is going to come along without having properly read even the ECS and everything is gonna head back to the thrice-damned stereotypes. ya' know, with the goblins being weak and helpless monsters, the dragons rampaging across the countryside, and the gods making personal appearances ever so often. And then there'll be some Eberron version of Eliminster. It's a downward spiral I tell you. :weep: Normally I don't buy into the slippery slope argument, but FR is a perfect example of how everything you predict is more likely to happen than not. Not exactly what you predict, but some stupid thing. The setting itself is supposed to be noir, intrigue-laden and swashbucklery. Major setting changes are always HUGE and EPIC, even when they aren't at a "RSE" level. HUGE and EPIC is FR and Greyhawk and Planescape. It is not Eberron.
Deekin 04-01-07, 02:00 PM	Don Bassingthwaite: The trilogy is called Legacy of the Empire and the first book will be The Doom of Kings. The area I get to explore is Darguun, the hobgoblin nation, so I’m looking forward to that. In this trilogy I get to do a continuity event, which in Forgotten Realms you might call it something like a RSE or Realms-shaking event. This isn’t on that level—no destroying cities, no killing off gods, no massive changes—but it will be something that will influence the game continuity. So I’m kind of proud to be able to do that. (http://www.mania.com/53287.html) Dude, you were one day early.
davethebrave371 04-01-07, 02:09 PM	Dude, you were one day early. This interview is from January 11th. I just found it, trying to find information about the Doom of Kings. It's real.
Altar_Boy 04-01-07, 03:27 PM	I'm not a big fan of some of the effects of metaplots. However, I think no campaign setting is in a better position for an advancement of the timelinel than Eberron, even if it's just in "What if?" type scenarios. Eberron is a simmering pot just getting ready to boil. Not exploring the boiling and possibly explosive elements in some way is, to me, just leaving so much of the area of exploration off-the-table. IMO, that's the point. Right now, there's a thousand suspects for who caused the Day of Mourning: Dragons, Demons, the Dreaming Dark, the Cabinet, House Cannith, and of course the Gnomes. All of them have the means to do it, and leaving it up in the air allows DMs to keep vague on who is the true power in Khorvaire. Or, by revealing who did it, make that group the BBEGs of the campaign. If we ever found out who dunnit, then one group would seem so much more bad arse than the other.
davethebrave371 04-01-07, 03:31 PM	IMO, that's the point. Right now, there's a thousand suspects for who caused the Day of Mourning: Dragons, Demons, the Dreaming Dark, the Cabinet, House Cannith, and of course the Gnomes. All of them have the means to do it, and leaving it up in the air allows DMs to keep vague on who is the true power in Khorvaire. Or, by revealing who did it, make that group the BBEGs of the campaign. If we ever found out who dunnit, then one group would seem so much more bad arse than the other. Time to play "Predict the Pro-Metaplot Response" "But that doesn't affect your game!" Neither do the novels, campaign setting book or further supplements. But we're not doing a homebrew game for a reason. FR is a prime example of "But you can ignore setting changes!" turning into "Time to ignore every single thing ever published if you want to play a good FR game!"
Forged_Fury 04-01-07, 03:54 PM	I think WotC's demonstrated a reasonable commitment to not advancing Eberron's timeline - does anyone know how much time elapsed between FR's introduction and the first publication of a metaplot event (novel/sourcebook)? It was a few years, if my rusty memory serves me right. The first major metaplot event in the FR that I recall was the Time of Troubles from the Avatar series. I believe this occured either between 1st and 2nd Editions or just after the 2nd Edition material came out, requiring a new FR Sourcebook. I could be way off though. -Forged_Fury
davethebrave371 04-01-07, 09:53 PM	It was a few years, if my rusty memory serves me right. The first major metaplot event in the FR that I recall was the Time of Troubles from the Avatar series. I believe this occured either between 1st and 2nd Editions or just after the 2nd Edition material came out, requiring a new FR Sourcebook. I could be way off though. -Forged_Fury I believe 1357 was 1st Edition's "present day" and the ToT was 1358, so I think you're right.
Hellcow 04-02-07, 11:54 AM	Bah, I knew somebody would start fiddling with my Dhakaani eventually. Your Dhakaani? How do you suppose I feel? With that said, much as I wish I had the opportunity to get to Darguun/Dhakaan first (I'd love to do a Droaam/Darguun/Demon Wastes/Shadow Marches/Q'barra sourcebook), I do have a great deal of respect for Don Bassingthwaite. So I may chew my fingers to the bone waiting to see what's been done to Darguun, but I am trusting Don to do a good job. As for this being a "continuity event", I'd like to see what it is before jumping to too many conclusions.
Jancarius 04-02-07, 12:36 PM	Otherwise, we'd have a harder job addressing that Half-Elven Dragomarked scion of House Orien issue from The Crimson Talisman that flies in the face of how most of us believe dragonmarks should work.Crimson Talisman was terrible anyway. I'm glad somebody else noticed that "Wait... so he's a half-elf... but he has an Orien mark?" And he apparently can use his mark to give himself Haste or something. Man I hated that one. I'm glad I bought it and Orb of Xoriat at the same time or I would have never read the rest of the War-Torn series. Anyway, as my actual contribution to the thread: I really would prefer the canon stay fixed where it is, or that Keith have sole-hand in moving it. And if canon most move (which I imagine, inevitably it will), I'd like to see a minimum of resolution of the plots that are kind of left there for the DMs to play with. I'd really hate to run into what I started having with my Dragonlance games before I gave up on the setting, where enough (meaning 1) of my players was another avid novel reader so pretty much any mystery of the setting was already known to him, unless I wrote it myself.
goblin_pride 04-02-07, 05:32 PM	Your Dhakaani? How do you suppose I feel? Betrayed, bewildered, annoyed, less than minty-fresh? I'm not comfortable with the whole "realms shaking event" that he aluded to more than anything else. I think a "realms shaking event" belongs far in the past in regards to the dhakaani unless WotC is planning to move the timeline forward. As far as your or my Dhakaani, I tried to draw a clear distinction that my Khesh'dar council is seperate from the Ghaal'dar, Kech Volaar and Kech Sharaat. They're no more or less related than any of the others in the imperial remnant. The one glorious thing about the way they were done in the setting originally is that it is mutable and flexible enough that you can use one or another in the remnants without revealing too much about the others. Hopefully Mr. Bassingthwaite's Dhakaani don't impact the world in a fashion that can't be reconciled within the campaign's base.
JustX 04-02-07, 06:16 PM	So I was running a game last night and when I decided to have Irda have a small role, the WOTC gamming police kicked down my door with erasable mechanical pens in hand to tell me that it wasn't cannon. I didn't know what to do. Maybe it's just me, but I like when things advance. It gives me ideas to take or leave and my universe doesn't collapse when I play my way. I think that anyone that wants to still solely to cannon should never pick up a RPG. The momment their PC does anything at all is the momment that world is no longer cannon. It doesn't make the game any less satisfying and personally I like to see if revealed secrets from WOTC writers come close to my ideas for what's behind the secrets. I don't even worry about changing my world to match if something doesn't quite fit. Now I have one question. What difference does it matter if the timeline actually advances. FR has done it and some people don't agree with what happened, but so have other games. Battletech, Shadowrun, Earthdawn, L5R, and even Ghostbusters had timelines that actually moved and it didn't seem to ruin the games.
Altar_Boy 04-02-07, 07:38 PM	Maybe it's just me, but I like when things advance. It gives me ideas to take or leave and my universe doesn't collapse when I play my way. I think that anyone that wants to still solely to cannon should never pick up a RPG. The momment their PC does anything at all is the momment that world is no longer cannon. It doesn't make the game any less satisfying and personally I like to see if revealed secrets from WOTC writers come close to my ideas for what's behind the secrets. I don't even worry about changing my world to match if something doesn't quite fit. Underline: We all agree with you. Unless you're playing the "Don't step on any butterflies or you'll alter the future" campaign." ;) Bold: But what happens afterwards? Do you pick up a mystery novel, read the first few chapters, then read the last few chapters, then finish off the middle? If there is change, I'd like it to introduce more posssibilities, mysteries, and plot hooks (think "Lost").
Jancarius 04-02-07, 09:10 PM	The problem is when they move the canon forward, they start publishing information from the later canon and no longer give any of the previous information. I live in fear that one day they'll just announce the who, what, and why of the Mourning.
davethebrave371 04-02-07, 09:51 PM	Now I have one question. What difference does it matter if the timeline actually advances. FR has done it and some people don't agree with what happened, but so have other games. Battletech, Shadowrun, Earthdawn, L5R, and even Ghostbusters had timelines that actually moved and it didn't seem to ruin the games. Battletech, Shadowrun, Earthdawn and L5R are all games I would never play because of that. That's why I play Eberron. That's "what the difference is" if the timeline advances, for me, and for many others who play (I can't speak for everyone, obviously).
ArcTan 04-03-07, 01:29 AM	Your Dhakaani? How do you suppose I feel? With that said, much as I wish I had the opportunity to get to Darguun/Dhakaan first (I'd love to do a Droaam/Darguun/Demon Wastes/Shadow Marches/Q'barra sourcebook), I do have a great deal of respect for Don Bassingthwaite. So I may chew my fingers to the bone waiting to see what's been done to Darguun, but I am trusting Don to do a good job. As for this being a "continuity event", I'd like to see what it is before jumping to too many conclusions. It's in a novel. It's not a problem unless they start automatically using novels as sources for gamebooks, right?
Sir Elton 04-03-07, 01:42 AM	Your Dhakaani? How do you suppose I feel? With that said, much as I wish I had the opportunity to get to Darguun/Dhakaan first (I'd love to do a Droaam/Darguun/Demon Wastes/Shadow Marches/Q'barra sourcebook), I do have a great deal of respect for Don Bassingthwaite. So I may chew my fingers to the bone waiting to see what's been done to Darguun, but I am trusting Don to do a good job. As for this being a "continuity event", I'd like to see what it is before jumping to too many conclusions. My heart is set on Stillstone Holt. :) I'll be designing characters around Stillstone Holt soon, to see what kind of a reaction I'd get. Elton.
davethebrave371 04-03-07, 09:54 AM	It's in a novel. It's not a problem unless they start automatically using novels as sources for gamebooks, right? Well, something which "influences the game continuity" probably will be in the game books.