Post/Author/DateTime	Post
suparman999 03-30-07, 04:06 AM	I was wondering if someone could judge my characters history and say what I could do to improve it. The character is an elf thug(fighter variant) with focus in dexterity. Celimir, an elf, the middle-child of 3 siblings, was raised by humans after his parents, both professional soldiers in a band of mercenaries, settled down in Khorvaire but died later of wounds. Afterwards, guardian rights of Celimir and his siblings were given to an old human war-buddy of his parents, a savant, skilled in combat, who taught young Celimir and his siblings skills with the sword and bow. Tragically, after a few years he was stricken with pox and died. Afterwards Celimir was sent to an orphanage, where, among other things, he, at one point, got into a fight with another child in the orphanage who was picking on his younger sibling, and the child cut Celimir across his face with a piece of broken glass before an adult stepped in. The three siblings were close growing up but began to drift apart as they got older, after his older sibling seemingly vanished, and his younger sibling, being a bit of a lost soul, joined the Emerald Claw, which led him to to try to kill Celimir and, tragically, Celimir was forced to kill the younger sibling in self-defense. And, after a very short trial, charged with murder and locked in a dungeon under the Governors mansion until, after 12 months, with the help of an Orcish Rogue who he shared a cell with, named Vak, he escaped, but had to flee the city as they would most likely look for him, as such, Vak gave Celimir some gold, some rations, and an old bedroll. Celimir is distrustful, taciturn, antisocial, and seemingly very cold and unfeeling. Also, he despises the Emerald Claw, which is one of his main goals, along with a better life.
Moblin 03-30-07, 09:30 AM	I was wondering if someone could judge my characters history and say what I could do to improve it. The character is an elf thug(fighter variant) with focus in dexterity. Well lets have a look then shall we :) (I've allowed myself the freedom of correcting some of the horrible formatting) Celimir, an elf, the middle-child of 3 siblings, was raised by humans after his parents, both professional soldiers in a band of mercenaries, settled down in Khorvaire but died later of wounds. Afterwards, guardian rights of Celimir and his siblings were given to an old human war-buddy of his parents, a savant, skilled in combat, who taught young Celimir and his siblings skills with the sword and bow. Tragically, after a few years he was stricken with pox and died. Was him and his siblings born on Khorvaire or where they brought along with their parents as the moved to the continent? Where did his parents come from since they settled on Khorivaire? Seeing as it takes an elf 110 years to mature how much of the last war did he experience? Did his parents die in the war? Many people die of wounds but it is usually of more interest to know who killed them and under what circumstances. What or who killed the parents? Do you really need the old human war buddy? There's plenty of death already in this story. Wouldn't it be a bit simpler simply to say that the parents thought them before they died? (or are you going for the "I never knew my parents" angle"?) Instead of the pox why not let him die of old age? Less tragic and entirely possible considering the time it takes for an elf to mature. Afterwards Celimir was sent to an orphanage, where, among other things, he, at one point, got into a fight with another child in the orphanage who was picking on his younger sibling, and the child cut Celimir across his face with a piece of broken glass before an adult stepped in. I take it that both of his siblings where sent there along with him. You should probably assign a gender to the siblings so that you can write little sister/brother instead of younger sibling (unless your going the Vaarsuvius route ;)). I assume that you mention the glass incident because it scared him for life so he now has a bad ass scar across his face. You should mention that. The three siblings were close growing up but began to drift apart as they got older, after his older sibling seemingly vanished, and his younger sibling, being a bit of a lost soul, joined the Emerald Claw, which led him to to try to kill Celimir and, tragically, Celimir was forced to kill the younger sibling in self-defense. Wow, again with a whole lot of tragedy. You should probably give some thought as to how long they stayed at the orphanage. Also how big is the age difference between the three siblings? If the Oldest sibling (You should give that one a gender as well) is around 20 years then Celimir then he/she could have left the orphanage before the other two in an attempt to earn enough gold so that he/she could build a home for all of them. (see how the sibling leaving got a lot more positive, and him/her not returning more of a mystery). The youngest sibling got in with the Emerald Claw because? Why did he/she have to try and kill his/her brother? Test of loyalty perhaps? And, after a very short trial, charged with murder and locked in a dungeon under the Governors mansion until, after 12 months, with the help of an Orcish Rogue who he shared a cell with, named Vak, he escaped, but had to flee the city as they would most likely look for him, as such, Vak gave Celimir some gold, some rations, and an old bedroll. A trial? Where did they fight? How come they didn't believe the self defense thing? Is there a bigger conspiracy a work here? Celimir is distrustful, taciturn, antisocial, and seemingly very cold and unfeeling. Also, he despises the Emerald Claw, which is one of his main goals, along with a better life. I take it that his goal is to improve his standing in life and destroy the Emerald Claw but how does he wish to accomplish this? If he's antisocial and distrustful then why is he going to join the party? Over all assessment: I'm guessing English isn't your first language but your formatting is still horrible. I can't see the reason for you to use the Enter key that much. Also you need something resembling a sentences structure. The story is ok but a bit on the bland side. What you have is the standard bad ass loner sitting in the dark corner of the tavern who doesn't trust anyone. Every single person he's been in touch with is either dead or missing (mostly they're dead). Try to answer some of my questions and make the whole thing a little less grim. Give him a happy experience or two. Find at least one thing that would make him smile that does not involve killing members of the Emerald Claw. Hell give him a hobby and a quirk and you've already made him a lot more interesting. Hope I wasn't to hard on you and good luck :)
suparman999 03-30-07, 11:35 AM	Oh yeah, sorry about the formatting, it was late when I wrote that and I was running on zero sleep, I copied and pasted it from Notepad, and I was also thinking up an uber powerful villain build that involves a Nymph as the base. Was him and his siblings born on Khorvaire or where they brought along with their parents as the moved to the continent? Where did his parents come from since they settled on Khorivaire? Seeing as it takes an elf 110 years to mature how much of the last war did he experience? Did his parents die in the war? Many people die of wounds but it is usually of more interest to know who killed them and under what circumstances. What or who killed the parents? Do you really need the old human war buddy? There's plenty of death already in this story. Wouldn't it be a bit simpler simply to say that the parents thought them before they died? (or are you going for the "I never knew my parents" angle"?) Instead of the pox why not let him die of old age? Less tragic and entirely possible considering the time it takes for an elf to mature. Yeah, old age is alot better, didn't think about that. He was in early childhood when his parents brought him, slightly too young to remember his parents, unlike his older sibling (a girl, his sister) who was about 17 years older. His younger (a boy, his brother) was about 15 years younger. But before that, they made the human guy their legal god father. I assume that you mention the glass incident because it scared him for life so he now has a bad ass scar across his face. You should mention that. Actually yes, that was the exact reason. The youngest sibling got in with the Emerald Claw because? Why did he/she have to try and kill his/her brother? Test of loyalty perhaps? Yes, they had the younger brother try to kill Celimir as a test of loyalty. Min/Maxing while writing something is destracting. A trial? Where did they fight? How come they didn't believe the self defense thing? Is there a bigger conspiracy a work here? Behind the orphanage. Even after he grew up, Celimir hung around there alot, and so the younger brother knew exactly where to find Celimir. The governor was a very zealous Emerald Claw, so he was kind of biased towards the younger brother. I take it that his goal is to improve his standing in life and destroy the Emerald Claw but how does he wish to accomplish this? If he's antisocial and distrustful then why is he going to join the party? He hasn't decided on how, he needed to leave the city. He's antisocial and distrusting, yes, but he's willing to join a party, he just watches them really carefully, and is generally suspicious and untrusting of them. He's distrusting, yes, but he's not stupid, and believes a party is a necessary risk to achieve his goals. As for things that make him smile, he likes dogs, there was one that hung out around the orphanage. He played with it, and put food in his pocket to give the dog, and they liked each other very much. As for hobbies, after he does the revenge thing, he's planning on making a living carving toys out of wood. Thanks for the review. And do you think a half-fiend, vampire lord nymph paragon with a couple of druid levels and absurdly (yet legally) high charisma would make a good villain?
Zombomaniac 03-30-07, 11:51 AM	Oh yeah, sorry about the formatting, it was late when I wrote that and I was running on zero sleep, I copied and pasted it from Notepad, and I was also thinking up an uber powerful villain build that involves a Nymph as the base. Don't worry man it happens to all of us.:) Yeah, old age is alot better, didn't think about that. He was in early childhood when his parents brought him, slightly too young to remember his parents, unlike his older sibling (a girl, his sister) who was about 17 years older. His younger (a boy, his brother) was about 15 years younger. But before that, they made the human guy their legal god father. If the younger was about 15 years younger then the middle then the middle is about 15 years old. Now most races start having the real long therm memory around the age of 4. So why can't the middle kid (you character) remeber his parents at age 15? Yes, they had the younger brother try to kill Celimir as a test of loyalty. Makes sense, but why was the younger one joining? Behind the orphanage. Even after he grew up, Celimir hung around there alot, and so the younger brother knew exactly where to find Celimir. The governor was a very zealous Emerald Claw, so he was kind of biased towards the younger brother. And of course no one knows that the governor is of the Claw? He hasn't decided on how, he needed to leave the city. He's antisocial and distrusting, yes, but he's willing to join a party, he just watches them really carefully, and is generally suspicious and untrusting of them. He's distrusting, yes, but he's not stupid, and believes a party is a necessary risk to achieve his goals. As for things that make him smile, he likes dogs, there was one that hung out around the orphanage. He played with it, and put food in his pocket to give the dog, and they liked each other very much. As for hobbies, after he does the revenge thing, he's planning on making a living carving toys out of wood. Ever read the Evris Cale trilogy? There was an assissen dog loving character in it. Thanks for the review. And do you think a half-fiend, vampire lord nymph paragon with a couple of druid levels and absurdly (yet legally) high charisma would make a good villain? :uh-huh: Those are a lot of templates.... The history and goal of a villian are more important then what the villian is. I've seen some really good villians that where nothing more the Fighter/Wizard Humans.:)
Faithful_One 03-30-07, 11:54 AM	There are still questions that need to be answered: Were him and his siblings born on Khorvaire or where they brought along with their parents as the moved to the continent? Where did his parents come from since they settled on Khorivaire? Seeing as it takes an elf 110 years to mature how much of the last war did he experience? Did his parents die in the war? Many people die of wounds but it is usually of more interest to know who killed them and under what circumstances. What or who killed the parents? There are more but I am typing this in class and the bell just rang so i need to go.:)
suparman999 03-30-07, 12:20 PM	And of course no one knows that the governor is of the Claw? Oh yeah, they know the governor is an Emerald Claw, of course they know that. If the younger was about 15 years younger then the middle then the middle is about 15 years old. Now most races start having the real long therm memory around the age of 4. So why can't the middle kid (you character) remeber his parents at age 15? He's an elf, they age physically much slower than humans, and I think I remember reading that they age slower mentally as well. Makes sense, but why was the younger one joining? He was a lost soul. He was trying on different shoes in the shoe store of life to see which one fit best, so to speak. Ever read the Evris Cale trilogy? There was an assissen dog loving character in it. No, I haven't. What's it about? Those are a lot of templates.... The history and goal of a villian are more important then what the villian is. I've seen some really good villians that where nothing more the Fighter/Wizard Humans. Which reminds me, she also has 3 levels in bard :P , see, she uses illusions, and her singing voice, to lure travellers (males in particular) to her, then she sucks their blood and feeds their remains to her (also perfectly legal, which is just terrifying) half Green Dragon Troll with an amulet of fire immunity. This is, of course, before allying with this bandit king, then kills him in his sleep to become his bandit clans ruler. She's neutral evil, in case you didn't already guess.
Moblin 03-30-07, 05:38 PM	Glad that I could be of some help (and glad that it turned out that you actually know a little about formatting ;)) There's still a few unanswered questions (and I have to get up early tomorrow) so I'll not comment any more on Celimir just now. As to your villain I do infact have a few comments. First of all: NO I do not believe that a bunch of templates make for a great BBEG. There's two reasons for this. The first is purely mechanical while the other as something to do with how you chose to DM. 1.It's a freaking glass canon. Have you looked at how few hit points that thing has? Before adding druid levels it'll have 39hp unless the paragon template gives it a bit extra (I don't own SS so I don't know). Yes It's a vampire and therefore won't "die" from getting blow to bits by a single second level spell but come on. At that level it'll get torn to bits by one successful attack. The low hitpoints are the biggest problem with high LA's and more then one template pr monster. 2. DM's don't have to min/max (This is more of a philosophical debate and I hope it won't derail this thread to much). You're the DM and therefore you can ALWAYS kill the entire party. It doesn't matter how much they min/max you can still pull out a great wyrm red dragon and tear them to shreds if you wanted to (and if that didn't work a god with snuff mortal life ability). Creating hard encounters is easy for a DM (seeing as you control everything) it is creating challenging encounters that's the hard part. If a strait fighter at the same level as th PC's wont cut it just give him a few more levels. You don't even have to give them extra xp for defeating him if you don't feel he was worth that much. Now I'm not saying that the NPC wizard should have single digit INT and skill focus: Origami crane folding but trying to abuse the rules isn't necessary either. Trust me, the players won't be more satisfied knowing that the TPK you just committed was done with a technically "legal" build instead of a monster that had to high a CR. They'll feel cheated either way. Now what I'd suggest is thinking a little about what you want the BBEG to do. Vampires are great reoccurring villains because of how hard they are to kill permanently. But what is the BBEG's goals and what is her method? Once you have these down start thinking about what build would give her some abilities that support her methods. Your two template-monsters are indeed tough but why do you use them? If your answer is along the lines of: because they're cool or because they're invincible you're probably on the wrong track. Mann I'm coming down hard on you today huh. Well just remember I'm not trying to be mean just giving my honest opinion :). I'll be back later with more of my ramblings but for now... good night :zzz:
Zombomaniac 03-30-07, 06:12 PM	No, I haven't. What's it about? I'll say this much. It is freaking AMAZING! The first book is called Twilight Falling and I would suggest you read it. You'll love Riven, the dog lover. It's a Forgotten Realms book so I'm kind of praising the enemy right now.:incog: So if you'll excuse me I am going to go hide for awhile.:hides: ;)
suparman999 03-31-07, 12:29 AM	Thanks. Oh, and I accidently missed the part about the older sibling in Moblins first post, I'll answer that now. he/she could have left the orphanage before the other two in an attempt to earn enough gold so that he/she could build a home for all of them. (see how the sibling leaving got a lot more positive, and him/her not returning more of a mystery). The older sister, yeah, went to earn enough gold to build a home and a better life for all of them, and yeah, she's about 21 years older. Sorry, I didn't even notice that. First of all: NO I do not believe that a bunch of templates make for a great BBEG. There's two reasons for this. The first is purely mechanical while the other as something to do with how you chose to DM. Yes I know, but it has to do with her character (except the paragon) and to make a nymph with clothes a powerful foe. 1.It's a freaking glass canon. Have you looked at how few hit points that thing has? Before adding druid levels it'll have 39hp unless the paragon template gives it a bit extra (I don't own SS so I don't know). Yes It's a vampire and therefore won't "die" from getting blow to bits by a single second level spell but come on. At that level it'll get torn to bits by one successful attack. The low hitpoints are the biggest problem with high LA's and more then one template pr monster. That's what the troll's for. She found it abandoned as a baby, and raised it to be her personal bodyguard and to not let the enemy kill her, no matter what the cost. And all of her skil points are put in skills that keep her from dying (lot of points in heal, lots of points in diplomacy and bluff, lots in move silenlty and lots in move) and she tries to talk her way out of trouble when things turn against her, and failing that, she flees and sends the entire bandit clan after you. 2. DM's don't have to min/max (This is more of a philosophical debate and I hope it won't derail this thread to much). You're the DM and therefore you can ALWAYS kill the entire party. It doesn't matter how much they min/max you can still pull out a great wyrm red dragon and tear them to shreds if you wanted to (and if that didn't work a god with snuff mortal life ability). Creating hard encounters is easy for a DM (seeing as you control everything) it is creating challenging encounters that's the hard part. If a strait fighter at the same level as th PC's wont cut it just give him a few more levels. You don't even have to give them extra xp for defeating him if you don't feel he was worth that much. Now I'm not saying that the NPC wizard should have single digit INT and skill focus: Origami crane folding but trying to abuse the rules isn't necessary either. Trust me, the players won't be more satisfied knowing that the TPK you just committed was done with a technically "legal" build instead of a monster that had to high a CR. They'll feel cheated either way. Good point. Now what I'd suggest is thinking a little about what you want the BBEG to do. Vampires are great reoccurring villains because of how hard they are to kill permanently. But what is the BBEG's goals and what is her method? Once you have these down start thinking about what build would give her some abilities that support her methods. Your two template-monsters are indeed tough but why do you use them? If your answer is along the lines of: because they're cool or because they're invincible you're probably on the wrong track. I've got something. The nymph has a nymph mother and a tan'ari father. Later in life, Verica found a half dragon troll with an odd amulet. She saved him, and raised him to guard her with his very life. Verica, naturally mischievous, already began practicing illusion magic, luring travelers to her, and robbing them. One of them was a powerful vampire lord, who turned her into a vampire, but offered to make her his apprentice rather than kill her or her troll, who she told to back down (she craves power, always has). After she learns all her master will teach her, she kills him and takes everything he has, then returns to her old pond in her old forest to lure travelers to her, to suck their blood, and feed their remains to her troll (this is how you meet her) eventually she attracts a powerful bandit king and aspiring emperor who offers to pay her 100,000gp and make her his queen. She accepts, but kills him in his sleep as soon as she can, taking his clan and everything he had, of course this leads to a civil war of sorts between the ones willing to serve vs. the ones who wont. She starts having more people join as her ranks are, by the end, very few, and has her bandits raid nearby towns and bring her all the really nice things. Eventually, she has her clan begin work on a massive gold statue of the Traveler, though no one knows exactly why... Mann I'm coming down hard on you today huh. Well just remember I'm not trying to be mean just giving my honest opinion . I'll be back later with more of my ramblings but for now... good night Don't worry about it, and you're really not.;) I'll say this much. It is freaking AMAZING! The first book is called Twilight Falling and I would suggest you read it. You'll love Riven, the dog lover. It's a Forgotten Realms book so I'm kind of praising the enemy right now. So if you'll excuse me I am going to go hide for awhile. Sounds good, I'll see if I can find it.
SquirrelMortis 03-31-07, 10:24 AM	Oh yeah, they know the governor is an Emerald Claw, of course they know that. First off, he's the governor of where, exactly? And the Emerald Claw isn't just a sort of club you join, you'd be a pathetic member of the Order if everyone knew you were part of it. It's a wanted terrorist organization in Karrnath, and its status harldy improves in the other 5 nations (or Zilargo, Mror Holds, etc.). He's an elf, they age physically much slower than humans, and I think I remember reading that they age slower mentally as well... ...As it says in Races of the Wild, a book whos fluff has no bearing on Eberron. I never liked that crap about elves aging slower any way. If you like it to be that way, sure, but check with your DM to see what he says. He was a lost soul. He was trying on different shoes in the shoe store of life to see which one fit best, so to speak. It's not quite that easy. You don't just go in for a job interview with some Claw members and say: "I'm looking for my place in life, I'll join you guys." They won't just let you join with out some foundations any way, and if you found it's not for you, I sincerely doubt the Claw is gonna let you go. If he was a lost soul, he could have joined hundred of other organizations that aren't criminal, or a billion different professions. Why did he choose the Claw? Does he share some of their ideals?
suparman999 03-31-07, 10:43 AM	Thanks First off, he's the governor of where, exactly? And the Emerald Claw isn't just a sort of club you join, you'd be a pathetic member of the Order if everyone knew you were part of it. It's a wanted terrorist organization in Karrnath, and its status harldy improves in the other 5 nations (or Zilargo, Mror Holds, etc.). Karrnath. And it slipped my mind actually, I came up with that part about everyone knowing off the top of my head, so I'll say, no one knew. Totally slipped my mind. ...As it says in Races of the Wild, a book whos fluff has no bearing on Eberron. I never liked that crap about elves aging slower any way. If you like it to be that way, sure, but check with your DM to see what he says. Will do. Personally, I never liked it that much either, makes it hard to make exact statements on related characters age. It's not quite that easy. You don't just go in for a job interview with some Claw members and say: "I'm looking for my place in life, I'll join you guys." They won't just let you join with out some foundations any way, and if you found it's not for you, I sincerely doubt the Claw is gonna let you go. If he was a lost soul, he could have joined hundred of other organizations that aren't criminal, or a billion different professions. Why did he choose the Claw? Does he share some of their ideals? I forgot, he liked the Emerald Claw, thought they had style and could give him power to make a better life for himself in the shortest amount of time. So he was willing to do just about anything to get in. They wanted him to prove his loyalty by taking the life of a sibling. He agreed, although he briefly had second thoughts.
SquirrelMortis 03-31-07, 01:39 PM	Your welcome (sorry if it came off as harsh). :)