Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Wotc_Mark 12-06-04, 02:21 PM	Dragonshards: The Gnomes of Zilargo, Part 2 While the gnomes value security over privacy, you don't see this aspect of things -- until you do something that requires the attention of the Trust. Find out more about playing or running a Zil gnome. http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ebds/20041206a Enjoy MJ :cool:
Edymnion 12-06-04, 02:40 PM	Urge to play a gnome... rising... And I have *NEVER* even looked twice at gnomes.
nyysjan 12-06-04, 02:48 PM	my character died a little while ago and i made myself a dwarf artificer i have not yet played with it am in the middle of begging my DM to let my change for a gnome rogue :D and Edymnion same goes for me
polt 12-06-04, 02:52 PM	it was cool, not as cool as the first one though, but cool. What's next?!?!
Ectoplasmoid 12-06-04, 02:58 PM	You fell victim to one of the classic blunders. The most famous is "Never get involved in a land war in Khorvaire." But only slightly less well known is this: "Never go in against a Zil when death is on the line!" These critters are vicious, man!
Edymnion 12-06-04, 04:21 PM	it was cool, not as cool as the first one though, but cool. What's next?!?!Actually, I think I remember Keith saying the Warforged articles would come out after the gnome articles (doesn't mean that they will literally come out next, but they're still out there, obviously, since we haven't had them yet). Or the Shifters. Changlings and Kalashtar I can live without seeing right away. Half-Orcs are still out there though, and so are the Halflings. Here's hoping the next one is the WF.
polt 12-06-04, 04:22 PM	I wanna see something about the Druids.
ydirbut 12-06-04, 04:30 PM	How about an article about the Shadow Marches, as that's prime adventure territory.
ENHenry 12-06-04, 04:38 PM	I have to admit I never would have come up with the things about the scents - that's pretty neat, and obvious in hindsight, considering humans do it now, and various animals have used pheromones this way forever.
Wotc_Mark 12-06-04, 04:42 PM	The next one is entitled "Monastic Orders" MJ
Splendide 12-06-04, 05:41 PM	I want part three! :( :D
Dex The King 12-06-04, 05:46 PM	Really, you told us? For real? I'm astonished, that's very uncharacteristic of the powers that be. I don't suppose you know what's happening after monastic orders? Is there a schedule you might share with us? On to the subject of the gnomes, I'm afraid I've never liked them. My experience of them has always shown them to be weak, annoying, absent minded little pranksters with very odd sounding names. I could never take them seriously. Sadly, even after reading this fine pair of articles by the infernal bovine, I still don't like gnomes. Perhaps owing in part to my previous prejudices, or the fact I'm not fond of the smaller races, I yet find myself disassociated with them, even in their toughened up, back-stabbing secret police state. Call me a bigot, but I find all of Eberron's clandestine orginizations to be more intimidating and more threatening than the Trust. I would much rather waltz through Korranberg as a shifter who was tactless, drunken, mangy looking, and smelling of troglodyte musk than do the same in one of House Phiarlan's enclaves.
Wotc_Mark 12-06-04, 05:52 PM	Really, you told us? For real? I'm astonished, that's very uncharacteristic of the powers that be. I don't suppose you know what's happening after monastic orders? Is there a schedule you might share with us?Yep that is really the title ... And I do have the two after that in my in-box but I think we can wait to see what they are about ... A little suspense never hurt anyone ... mwehehe :devil: MJ :cool:
JohnnyONeal 12-06-04, 07:50 PM	That was awesome. Possibly my favorite Dragonshards duo yet. The wererat connection is priceless. The next one is entitled "Monastic Orders" Hooray! I've been hungry for information about the Sovereign Host since before Eberron was released. Hopefully we'll learn a bit about the Sovereigns' monastic orders next week.
Splendide 12-06-04, 08:00 PM	Call me a bigot, but I find all of Eberron's clandestine orginizations to be more intimidating and more threatening than the Trust. I would much rather waltz through Korranberg as a shifter who was tactless, drunken, mangy looking, and smelling of troglodyte musk than do the same in one of House Phiarlan's enclaves.Which means that The Trust is working in the fashion that it wishes to. I guess if they're lulling all of those NPCs into a false sense of safety, it might work with the occasional player too ;)
Dex The King 12-06-04, 08:19 PM	As a full-time DM, I have not yet gotten the chance to play in Eberron yet, and confirm my sense of security. Gnomes don't impress me, and certainly don't make me feel insecure, sorry, but now I just really want to go mess with them. I can't explain it. I have a great idea that my next (or first) Eberron PC shall rashly insult the first well off Zil gnome he sees. It sounds like fun to me, and if I get targeted by lots of tiny daggers, then the gnomes can bring it. Could be far worse (middle of the Mournlands, Demon Wastes, Khyber, Riedra, Vol's island, etc.).
JabBond 12-06-04, 08:20 PM	Just what I was thinking, Splendide! I mean, think about it, the Trust might be a way for you to convince your DM to let you play a non-evil assassin! (The requisite kill coming from a Trust assignment, not a random kill) On the other end of the stick, I'm playing a LG rogue gnome who may not be so good at intrigue, but is seriously into the protection of Zil. My philosophy: the gnome's "surrender" to the Breland forces in the Great War was considered a victory. They didn't have the costs incurred in prepping an army for battle, since they knew what they would do, and probably no loss of life since they started negotiations immediately. The gnomes jockey for position politically the same way they do in combat: take advantage of those who underestimate you, and know that a bit of planning can undo a whole lot of aggression. This was a great 'shard. I'm sure my DM will be quizzing my gnome on how she fits in the picture.
JabBond 12-06-04, 08:22 PM	Dex, I think you missed the point. Words wouldn't mean a thing, they'd probably just take it as a challenge and roundly beat you in a war of wits (or maybe not, as it is dishonorable to fight with an unarmed person). Until you threaten the well-being, laws, or security (financial, intellectual property, etc) of the gnomish people, they probably won't give you a second look.
Hellcow 12-06-04, 09:13 PM	Actually, I think I remember Keith saying the Warforged articles would come out after the gnome articles (doesn't mean that they will literally come out next, but they're still out there, obviously, since we haven't had them yet). Actually, there's some sort of crossed wire here, because I haven't written a warforged article yet. It's on my list, but warforged are covered in great detail in Races of Eberron, so there are other topics that have precedence...
Edymnion 12-06-04, 09:58 PM	Actually, there's some sort of crossed wire here, because I haven't written a warforged article yet. It's on my list, but warforged are covered in great detail in Races of Eberron, so there are other topics that have precedence...And there was a great wailing and gnashing of teeth... :weep:
Teron Gorefiend 12-06-04, 10:52 PM	Actually, there's some sort of crossed wire here, because I haven't written a warforged article yet. It's on my list, but warforged are covered in great detail in Races of Eberron, so there are other topics that have precedence... I'm guessing the same is true of shifters. :( How about the Daelkyr and their minions, eh? Anyway, I must praise you Keith for making the gnomes cool, at least to me. On a barely related note, the Quori that appeared in Dragon a few months back were awesome... I'd meant to say so but didn't get around to it. Hopefully you'll notice my compliments if you check for responses to your post. :clap:
nyysjan 12-07-04, 04:17 AM	WOOO :w00t: The DM allowed me to use a NE Gnome Rogue level-3 :D 3 more level ups and i'm an assassin :evillaugh
hiryuu 12-07-04, 04:29 AM	I just printed out all the Dragonshards articles. It's pretty thick so far, a nice stack of paper. It's like an all-creamy nougat sourcebook. Can't wait for more.
Bluebrush 12-07-04, 04:48 AM	Gnomes don't impress me, and certainly don't make me feel insecure, That's what they WANT you to think!
MarkB 12-07-04, 04:51 AM	Since we've already had Dragonshards covering Valenar Elves, Dwarves, Gnomes and Half-Elves, I'd guess that we're due some articles on Talenta Halflings soon, with Aerenal Elves and Shadow Marches Half-Orcs following to complete the coverage of the standard races who won't feature heavily in Races of Eberron. Well, I can hope... :)
Just another user 12-07-04, 05:52 AM	Since we've already had Dragonshards covering Valenar Elves, Dwarves, Gnomes and Half-Elves, I'd guess that we're due some articles on Talenta Halflings soon, with Aerenal Elves and Shadow Marches Half-Orcs following to complete the coverage of the standard races who won't feature heavily in Races of Eberron. Well, I can hope... :) You are forgeting those pesky humans. :)
Gez 12-07-04, 06:03 AM	Call me a bigot, but I find all of Eberron's clandestine orginizations to be more intimidating and more threatening than the Trust. I would much rather waltz through Korranberg as a shifter who was tactless, drunken, mangy looking, and smelling of troglodyte musk than do the same in one of House Phiarlan's enclaves. Exactly the reverse from me. Because I know that if I were to waltz through the Phiarlan enclave as a foul-smelling shifter, any elf that would try to threaten me would faint from the odor before he can reach me. Elves are wimps! :D (-2 Con for elves. +2 Con for gnomes.)
Dex The King 12-07-04, 10:47 AM	I realize now that I wholeheartedly missed the point, and in my pig-headed beligerence of accepting the charm oif the Zil I proved exactly why it works. They're so non-threatening that no one would suspect them, even thought they should. I imagine many PCs will fall into the same mindset I did, if the DM portrays them properly, after all, these Zil are just gnomes, what could they possibly do? As in turns out, a lot! I have learned to identify with the sly underhandedness of the Zil (It helps that I remembered the picture from the ECS), and now I am even considering one as a PC (they are the best core race for arcane casters, after all). I'm refering to them as Zil, because as far as I'm concerned, they're not gnomes any more, they're indeed much, much better. At the time of the Zil "surrender" to Breland, they likely had no way of possibly stopping the might of possibly the strongest of the five nations in an up front war. But the Zil never fight up front. Instead, their diplomats worked out a lucrative business deal with King Boranel, one he would see the benefits of. He wouldn't need to use any troops, and his country would benefit from the commerce. Of course, the Zil would benefit more than the Brelish. Unless faced with an inreconciable enemy, the Zil will always make some place for themselves in the grand scheme of things. As a DM, I probably won't use them in my current campaign, but who knows about the future?
raventongue 12-07-04, 11:34 AM	gnomes rock. Rock gnomes... er.. well nevermind. But the Trust has amazing potential. Ofcourse you really CAN mess with gnomes if you're willing to face the consequences. You can waste their time. Hours and days and weeks and months and years with a few small lies backed up with a lot of truth. Hint at a threat to their way of life and they'll set to it with a will. Drop different ones in different places. Get the ball rolling on a few dozen different rumors. It would be like spamming their intelligence network. Sure they'll hunt you down and do terrible things to you but if you do a good enough job maybe they wont. Maybe you'll get recruited. Or polymorphed into a gnome.
Beleriphon 12-07-04, 12:02 PM	gnomes rock. Rock gnomes... er.. well nevermind. But the Trust has amazing potential. Ofcourse you really CAN mess with gnomes if you're willing to face the consequences. You can waste their time. Hours and days and weeks and months and years with a few small lies backed up with a lot of truth. Hint at a threat to their way of life and they'll set to it with a will. Drop different ones in different places. Get the ball rolling on a few dozen different rumors. It would be like spamming their intelligence network. Sure they'll hunt you down and do terrible things to you but if you do a good enough job maybe they wont. Maybe you'll get recruited. Or polymorphed into a gnome. There's an interesting adventure idea. One of the great houses hires your group to go on all kinds of madcap adventures, often collecting the oddest bits and pieces of stuff. It all seems to be somehow connected, but its actually nothing more than a giant misinformation campaign.
Edymnion 12-07-04, 01:08 PM	I just printed out all the Dragonshards articles. It's pretty thick so far, a nice stack of paper. It's like an all-creamy nougat sourcebook. Can't wait for more.Shoot, if you had told me you were going to do that, I could have made it much cooler for you. I've got a high quality scan of the parchment paper from the original core books on my HD (high quality as in its over 2300x3200 pixels in size). You could have gone through and printed that out as a background on your sheets, then fed them back through for the Dragonshards so it would look all parchment-y and cool :D
nyysjan 12-07-04, 01:13 PM	My DM's gonna let me play a gnome rogue :D if i just could find rules for poison brewing :P
raventongue 12-07-04, 01:21 PM	oh that's easy. step 1. gather ingredients step 2. mix into pot and bring to low boil step 3. season to taste step 4. ...oops
nyysjan 12-07-04, 01:26 PM	oh that's easy. step 1. gather ingredients step 2. mix into pot and bring to low boil step 3. season to taste step 4. ...oops :rofl: :heehee but to be serious i havent found anything on how to make poisons no craft DC's or times i checked and if the most expensive poison has craft DC of 30 it will take 50 weeks to make a 1 dose of it :banghead:
Lara Flynn 12-07-04, 04:11 PM	Making poison is so inherently evil that it had to be put into the BoVD. :) Just look there.
Bluebrush 12-07-04, 05:29 PM	Just a thought: We had an explanation for why dwarves get combat bonuses against giants (There's a load of giant subtype monsters in the Mror mountains), but we've had no explanation for gnomes. Maybe there's giants in the mountains around Zilargo.
EvilDrPuma 12-08-04, 02:57 AM	Just a thought: We had an explanation for why dwarves get combat bonuses against giants (There's a load of giant subtype monsters in the Mror mountains), but we've had no explanation for gnomes. Maybe there's giants in the mountains around Zilargo. It's very possible that the Dhakaani used troll and ogre mercenaries back in the day, so the gnomes may have developed their combat skills against giant-type monsters far back in their history. It might be that there are still a few bands of trolls living in the Seawall Mountains, for that matter, although the goblinoids no doubt vastly outnumber them.
JoeCrow 12-08-04, 06:05 AM	I keep getting this vision of some anti-Zil conspiracy gathered around a table in some hidden room, with everybody holding a hand crossbow pointed at everybody else. Somebody clears their throat. "So, is anybody here NOT an agent of The Trust?" Reeeeeally long pause. "Oh, for Vol's sake..." "This never gets put in the report." Germany had a problem like this a few years back, as I recall. Turned out that about 80% of the Nazi underground were actually agents of the government, trying to infiltrate the movement. Kinda embarrassing. So, how good is the Trust about keeping track of individual agents and making sure they aren't stepping on each other's toes?
Gez 12-08-04, 06:33 AM	Reminds me of The Man Who Was Thursday (http://www.dur.ac.uk/martin.ward/gkc/books/thursday.txt), by Gilbert Keith Chesterton. (Another Keith!)
LazarusX 12-08-04, 08:01 AM	Making poison is so inherently evil that it had to be put into the BoVD. :) Just look there. Poisons, poisons, poisons....to your heart's content in that book. I use it quite often; but because of the difficulty in brewing them, and the friggin cost!!! I have yet to come across an enemy worthy enough to be the applicant of the ones I have already made ;)
nyysjan 12-08-04, 08:43 AM	Check out my gnome :P Click This ! (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?p=5001407#post5001407) cool :D
LazarusX 12-08-04, 08:49 AM	Check out my gnome :P Click This ! (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?p=5001407#post5001407) cool :D Yes nyysjan...believe it or not; we read more threads than just this one So; we've seen the gnome bud :heehee
raventongue 12-08-04, 11:22 AM	My DM's gonna let me play a gnome rogue :D if i just could find rules for poison brewing :P --- (I know this is off gnome topic sorry. Gnomes rule.) Page 25 of Song and Silence covers a Primer on Poison including the craft DC for several. The list in Song and Silence supersedes that of the one in the DMG v. 3.0 The DMG v3.5 may have a newer revised list of poisons and prices but I don't think it includes the DC for creating them. I would stick with Song and Silence for now unless there is a newer resource (preferably 3.5) for your wicked ways. Though personally I don't think poison use is evil. It's an alchemical/herbal resource and is certainly no more underhanded than using magic. The one thing I haven't found is a DC on detecting the presence of poison use. Sure if there's a sticky black liquid dripping off a blade you've got a pretty big clue but what about the roasted chicken served to a player with the hints of rosemary and garlic to it. Is it a seasoning or a subtle poison. Some (hopefully the extremely expensive kind) probably don't even have a scent. This post was brought to you by the makers of Iocaine. Iocaine Poison: Takes care of 99% of all powermad Zil gnomes attempting to kidnap and kill beautiful princesses to start wars with neighboring kingdoms.
EvilDrPuma 12-08-04, 11:39 AM	I keep getting this vision of some anti-Zil conspiracy gathered around a table in some hidden room, with everybody holding a hand crossbow pointed at everybody else. Somebody clears their throat. "So, is anybody here NOT an agent of The Trust?" Reeeeeally long pause. "Oh, for Vol's sake..." "This never gets put in the report." Germany had a problem like this a few years back, as I recall. Turned out that about 80% of the Nazi underground were actually agents of the government, trying to infiltrate the movement. Kinda embarrassing. So, how good is the Trust about keeping track of individual agents and making sure they aren't stepping on each other's toes? It's a good question. I can only assume there is some kind of code or calling card so Trust agents can tell when they are dealing with other Trust agents and not criminals. By the way, whoever said "Oh, for Vol's sake..." got shot. Obviously compromised by the Emerald Claw. :D
polt 12-08-04, 11:59 AM	I bet the Trust have a lot of different kind of recounizing eachother and talking together without being noticed.
Serpentine 12-08-04, 02:42 PM	I bet the Trust have a lot of different kind of recounizing eachother and talking together without being noticed. One of the uses of Bluff that people always forget about is— Delivering a Secret Message: You can use Bluff to get a message across to another character without others understanding it. The DC is 15 for simple messages, or 20 for complex messages, especially those that rely on getting across new information. Failure by 4 or less means you can’t get the message across. Failure by 5 or more means that some false information has been implied or inferred. Anyone listening to the exchange can make a Sense Motive check opposed by the Bluff check you made to transmit in order to intercept your message (see Sense Motive). Passing off a specific signal given by a known (to you) Trust agent probably sets the DC at 15.
Gez 12-08-04, 02:45 PM	There's a secret handshake. And a magical ring that, when worn, allows its wearer to understanding the actual meaning of the special Trust innuendo (it is known as a decoder ring).
JabBond 12-08-04, 11:16 PM	Nah, you could be a non-evil worshipper of Vol. And not all worshippers of Vol are involved with the Emerald Claw. It even states that gnomes dabble in several religions in the ECS. So just because a Trust agent swore by Vol wouldn't be cause to shoot them. Trust agents don't necessarily have to be good, even. Or heck, it could be a (perhaps vulgar) saying, like "Oh, for [manure]'s sake!"