Eberron using D20 Modern Classes [Archive] - Wizards Community

Eberron using D20 Modern Classes [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
13x13
09-07-05, 12:28 PM I was reading a thread where everyone was commenting on how superior they feel D20 Modern handles classes. So I was wondering, do you think you could swap out the existing classes in Eberron for D20 classes instead?

The most obvious changes would be to swap out modern skills for standard skills, same with feats.

I know I'm probably missing tons of other things as I have only looked over the D20 modern SRD in a cursory manner.

However, do you think it would be a good idea? Any interest at all?
Mula
09-07-05, 12:38 PM It could work. D20 Modern offers both divine and arcane casters, the Urban Arcana book giving even more options. Magic becomes weaker, but I think it fits the flavor of Eberron. There are some feats that give minor spellcasting even at 1st-level, so the concept of magewrights and adepts is still there.

Artificers are possibly a problem, though. Coming up with an Artificer advanced class shouldn’t be that hard, however, even if item creation feats tend to be class features of the caster classes and not feats like in DnD.

The number of advanced classes for Smart, Dedicated, and Charismatic heroes is probably smaller than the amount available to Strong, Fast, and Tough heroes. At least that’s the impression, since there are the techies and others.
Altaris13
09-07-05, 03:16 PM Though I like d20 Modern and the concept it has for Classes & Advanced Classes, Eberron is still a 'high fantasy' setting. The general rules for Modern really wouldn't fit the setting, IMO.

Artificers (as has been mentioned) would be the main issue. Ordinary vs Heroic base classes do not differ enough to signify the great advantage of Warforged Fighters over the typical Human Warriors. Low level casters are common enough that the D20 Modern method of casting would go against the grain. Such characters would have to be 5th to 7th level to cast, even as Magewrights. Sure, you could take one of the heritage feats, but then you only get a couple of 0 level spells one time per day each. And that would also mean that EVERY magewright would have the same "spell selection." I use the term "spell selection" loosely. Note that this "spell selection" would be slightly different for Arcane or Divine Magewrights.

D20 Modern also has no place for Adepts, which are certainly more common than Clerics. Nor does Modern work for Druids (in any capacity) or Paladins (for the most part.) Monks would also not fit.

And then you have the issues of Prestige Classes. In Modern, you have a Base class and can freely multi-class without penalty. Advanced classes replace Prestige Classes, but Advanced classes really aren't prestigious. Nor are they belief or organization oriented (for the most part.)

In general, DnD has an EXTREMELY different feel from D20 Modern and supplements. The method of classes is very different, and would radically alter the setting.
makeshiftwings
09-07-05, 03:19 PM I really dislike the d20 Modern system. It's basically an attempt to shoehorn the d&d rules into a "classless" format, which doesn't really work. People who haven't played classless RPGs before see it as some kind of breakthrough... "Oh my god, I can be a 'Strong Hero' instead of a Fighter! I'm no longer limited by the horribly stringent Fighter stereotype!" But really, a lot of this could be solved by just being a Fighter and making up your own fluff for it. Likewise, if you're a Rogue in d&d you don't HAVE to act shifty and steal things etc., you can act pretty much exactly as if you were a 'Swift Hero'.
Brastan
09-07-05, 03:39 PM Try using the Basic(generic) Classes in Unearthed Arcane, cap them at 10th level and create some Advanced classes/modified PrC to achieve the rest. The Basic classes in Modern were intended for a modern setting but I could see the Generic Classes in UA making good substitutes.

That generates a good number of options at low level. The only thing I see being need is a general psionic class and a way to handle NPCs. NPCs versions should only get one Good save at most and no bonus feats or abilities.

The advantage that d20 Modern has over D&D is flexibility. It is easier to twist classes, skills and feats to match a character concept than it is in D&D. The big thing is the lack of a multi-classing penalty. The generic classes in UA are fairly close to this system.
Lady Morn
09-07-05, 06:06 PM The one thing Modern classes offer is greater flexibility and you acquire feats quicker. The downside is that many of the Modern classes have a smaller selection of class skills than an equivalent D&D class (Fast and Rogue, for example). Whether Modern classes are better or worse depends of your style of play.
Zalaz Mavi
09-07-05, 06:43 PM You can get the best of both worlds, in truth. Use the D&D classes in name only, then eliminate the multiclass penalty and allow your players to choose their class abilities a la carte. For the later, as long as the ability chosen is normally acquired at the character's current level or lower, there shouldn't be any balance issues...
Tek
09-07-05, 06:47 PM Toss in another good work for the Unearthed Arcana basic classes if you want a more 'classless' type system for Eberron. D20 modern classes were built for d20 modern, and translating them to D&D doesn't work aswell. And there are prestige classes for d20 modern, right alongside advanced classes.

Translating them means more work then its worth, and you're losing out on alot of D&D type stuff with them. By just using the Basic classes from UA, you still get most of the D&D abilities, the class skill choosing, etc.
Save-vs-DM
09-08-05, 02:28 AM I play both d20 Modern and Regular DnD.

I have to say that honestly, d20 modern classes don't quite work for Eberron. As stated previously, spellcasting is much to hard to obtain.

If you are dead set on it, I would use the Urban Arcana rules as it does incorporate some fantasy elements.

Be warned that if you like psionics d20 modern uses the 3.0 version of psionics, more or less.

I would suggest, as others have, using the Unearthed Arcana generic classes. It's pretty easy to make some class features feats. THe artificer Item Creation becomes a feat, as does Retain Essence and Craft Reserve. It's pretty easy to make an artificer using the generic expert.

Cheers,
Save vs DM
Altaris13
09-08-05, 06:10 PM Just found this over on the d20 Fantasy board. Man that place is empty... ;)

Another great work (in progress) (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=397683) by Skritti.

Elysium Nebulae over on d20 Sci-Fi (and recently d20 Future) is just AWESOME!

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
13x13 09-07-05, 12:28 PM	I was reading a thread where everyone was commenting on how superior they feel D20 Modern handles classes. So I was wondering, do you think you could swap out the existing classes in Eberron for D20 classes instead? The most obvious changes would be to swap out modern skills for standard skills, same with feats. I know I'm probably missing tons of other things as I have only looked over the D20 modern SRD in a cursory manner. However, do you think it would be a good idea? Any interest at all?
Mula 09-07-05, 12:38 PM	It could work. D20 Modern offers both divine and arcane casters, the Urban Arcana book giving even more options. Magic becomes weaker, but I think it fits the flavor of Eberron. There are some feats that give minor spellcasting even at 1st-level, so the concept of magewrights and adepts is still there. Artificers are possibly a problem, though. Coming up with an Artificer advanced class shouldn’t be that hard, however, even if item creation feats tend to be class features of the caster classes and not feats like in DnD. The number of advanced classes for Smart, Dedicated, and Charismatic heroes is probably smaller than the amount available to Strong, Fast, and Tough heroes. At least that’s the impression, since there are the techies and others.
Altaris13 09-07-05, 03:16 PM	Though I like d20 Modern and the concept it has for Classes & Advanced Classes, Eberron is still a 'high fantasy' setting. The general rules for Modern really wouldn't fit the setting, IMO. Artificers (as has been mentioned) would be the main issue. Ordinary vs Heroic base classes do not differ enough to signify the great advantage of Warforged Fighters over the typical Human Warriors. Low level casters are common enough that the D20 Modern method of casting would go against the grain. Such characters would have to be 5th to 7th level to cast, even as Magewrights. Sure, you could take one of the heritage feats, but then you only get a couple of 0 level spells one time per day each. And that would also mean that EVERY magewright would have the same "spell selection." I use the term "spell selection" loosely. Note that this "spell selection" would be slightly different for Arcane or Divine Magewrights. D20 Modern also has no place for Adepts, which are certainly more common than Clerics. Nor does Modern work for Druids (in any capacity) or Paladins (for the most part.) Monks would also not fit. And then you have the issues of Prestige Classes. In Modern, you have a Base class and can freely multi-class without penalty. Advanced classes replace Prestige Classes, but Advanced classes really aren't prestigious. Nor are they belief or organization oriented (for the most part.) In general, DnD has an EXTREMELY different feel from D20 Modern and supplements. The method of classes is very different, and would radically alter the setting.
makeshiftwings 09-07-05, 03:19 PM	I really dislike the d20 Modern system. It's basically an attempt to shoehorn the d&d rules into a "classless" format, which doesn't really work. People who haven't played classless RPGs before see it as some kind of breakthrough... "Oh my god, I can be a 'Strong Hero' instead of a Fighter! I'm no longer limited by the horribly stringent Fighter stereotype!" But really, a lot of this could be solved by just being a Fighter and making up your own fluff for it. Likewise, if you're a Rogue in d&d you don't HAVE to act shifty and steal things etc., you can act pretty much exactly as if you were a 'Swift Hero'.
Brastan 09-07-05, 03:39 PM	Try using the Basic(generic) Classes in Unearthed Arcane, cap them at 10th level and create some Advanced classes/modified PrC to achieve the rest. The Basic classes in Modern were intended for a modern setting but I could see the Generic Classes in UA making good substitutes. That generates a good number of options at low level. The only thing I see being need is a general psionic class and a way to handle NPCs. NPCs versions should only get one Good save at most and no bonus feats or abilities. The advantage that d20 Modern has over D&D is flexibility. It is easier to twist classes, skills and feats to match a character concept than it is in D&D. The big thing is the lack of a multi-classing penalty. The generic classes in UA are fairly close to this system.
Lady Morn 09-07-05, 06:06 PM	The one thing Modern classes offer is greater flexibility and you acquire feats quicker. The downside is that many of the Modern classes have a smaller selection of class skills than an equivalent D&D class (Fast and Rogue, for example). Whether Modern classes are better or worse depends of your style of play.
Zalaz Mavi 09-07-05, 06:43 PM	You can get the best of both worlds, in truth. Use the D&D classes in name only, then eliminate the multiclass penalty and allow your players to choose their class abilities a la carte. For the later, as long as the ability chosen is normally acquired at the character's current level or lower, there shouldn't be any balance issues...
Tek 09-07-05, 06:47 PM	Toss in another good work for the Unearthed Arcana basic classes if you want a more 'classless' type system for Eberron. D20 modern classes were built for d20 modern, and translating them to D&D doesn't work aswell. And there are prestige classes for d20 modern, right alongside advanced classes. Translating them means more work then its worth, and you're losing out on alot of D&D type stuff with them. By just using the Basic classes from UA, you still get most of the D&D abilities, the class skill choosing, etc.
Save-vs-DM 09-08-05, 02:28 AM	I play both d20 Modern and Regular DnD. I have to say that honestly, d20 modern classes don't quite work for Eberron. As stated previously, spellcasting is much to hard to obtain. If you are dead set on it, I would use the Urban Arcana rules as it does incorporate some fantasy elements. Be warned that if you like psionics d20 modern uses the 3.0 version of psionics, more or less. I would suggest, as others have, using the Unearthed Arcana generic classes. It's pretty easy to make some class features feats. THe artificer Item Creation becomes a feat, as does Retain Essence and Craft Reserve. It's pretty easy to make an artificer using the generic expert. Cheers, Save vs DM
Altaris13 09-08-05, 06:10 PM	Just found this over on the d20 Fantasy board. Man that place is empty... ;) Another great work (in progress) (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=397683) by Skritti. Elysium Nebulae over on d20 Sci-Fi (and recently d20 Future) is just AWESOME!