Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Galen_Michael 04-18-06, 02:01 AM	Is it just me or is the web support for Eberron pretty non-existent these days? I mean, I used to be excited for Monday mornings because they would bring with them articles such as Dragonshards, Steal this Hook, Eberron Expanded, Eberron Under Glass and so forth. Now we just have a long string of (much appreciated but very limited) Sharn Inquisitive articles to look forward to each week. I am aware of WotC's imposed limitations on Dragonshards and Keith's own time constraints, but can't they find another contributor to give us SOME offerings beyond the Sharn Inquisitive? When I look at the copious Realms updates on Wednesdays, I just feel... shafted. What can we Eberron fans do to get some web-based loving for our favorite setting? Galen P.S. Now I look forward to Fridays more than Mondays - I love the new Design & Development column!
ChronosCrow 04-18-06, 04:52 AM	Is it just me or is the web support for Eberron pretty non-existent these days?... Now I look forward to Fridays more than Mondays - I love the new Design & Development column! I'm completely with you on this one. At one point the Eberron page was blessed with copious amounts of bountiful articles that expressed the great horizon of Khorvaire, but recent times show a dreadful draught with no gratification for times untold. To be simply put, we once had it all & now I fear we have so very little. What happened to that wonderful idea, Eberron Expanded, I remember reading all of 3 articles. They were probably my favorite, it is a very classic question to wonder where something from the D&D books will fit in eberron & that article was a great solution.
Splendide 04-18-06, 05:32 AM	If its because they've pulled resources away from web material to throw them into making better books, its a winning move in my opinion. Common sense says that your best material should be in the books you sell, not free on your website.
Sieylianna 04-18-06, 07:30 AM	If its because they've pulled resources away from web material to throw them into making better books, its a winning move in my opinion. Common sense says that your best material should be in the books you sell, not free on your website. I'm sorry, but I have yet to see any better books. Same old typos, same old ignorance of the rules. I'm speaking in general - Complete Psionics, Tome of Magic, Power of the Realms, not specifically about Eberron. Ed
Kid SixXx 04-18-06, 07:56 AM	I'm sorry, but I have yet to see any better books. Same old typos, same old ignorance of the rules. I'm speaking in general - Complete Psionics, Tome of Magic, Power of the Realms, not specifically about Eberron. I don't think Splendide is referring to editing quality, but fluff / crunch quality. WoTC isn't going to release the information from Keith's pending Dragonmarked sourcebook as a series of free articles on the website: we're going to have to pay for it. I also lament the loss of the materiel, but it's pretty much a universal thing. At least I'm not playing Star Wars or D20 Modern because they rarely (if ever) get updated. Otherwise, I absolutely support your statement because the editing of some sourcebooks is really suspect. I'd rather see more web enhancements & eratta than fluff articles. The SRD needs to be updated as often as possible in order to keep pace with the new sourcebooks. There are still some rules, PrC's etc. that are HORRIBLY BROKEN. (ie. Everyone loves the Frenzied Berserker PrC until they figure out that there is a good chance that they'll murder everyone in the party.) We generate enough pure fluff here on the Eberron boards to keep most campaigns going at a modest pace. What's needed are fixes for mechancal issues so that ruleslawyering can be brought down to a lower level.
Euangelion 04-18-06, 10:37 AM	I was disappointed but understanding when the end came for the Dragonshards articles, since it was apparently getting hard to coordinate the information in them with the information in the sourcebooks. I didn't completely buy that explanation, but I was at least going to give them the benefit of the doubt. Then a couple of weeks ago I notice something odd. There's good ol' Ed Greenwood being allowed to put out canonical information on the Forgotten Realms setting in web articles. We're not just talking about what color the roof tiles are in this area or that, we're talking about canonical descriptions of towns and the such in the Border Kingdoms. So, then, they can release canonical FR material on the web but not canonical Eberron material? Talk about a kick in the crotch for Eberron fans. I've said it before and I'll say it again: I believe the bottom line problem isn't with one person, but with a system breakdown. WOTC just didn't handle well how material was going to be developed and who would be developing it for Eberron. "Too many cooks spoils the stew" and all that. I can see arguments that sharing the development of Eberron far and wide is ultimately beneficial for the setting, since it helps to foster a sense of pride and commitment to the setting among the whole crew at WOTC. That's fine. But as the information was being developed, much more care should have been taken to make sure it all fit together. Heck, I wonder if they still don't know if the term "demon" refers to outsiders with the Evil and Chaotic subtypes like the Tanari'i or just another shorthand way of referring to fiends. There's still plenty of information that could safely be published as web articles. For instance, take the Knights of Thrane, not to be confused with the knights templar of the Church of the Silver Flame. It's a technically secular organization but answers to the Council of Cardinals. But are they responsible for law enforcement in Thrane? Are they in charge of border patrols (since I doubt Thrane really wants to leave that up to House Deneith)? How are they organized? What are some of the issues with being technically secular but overwhelmingly filled with worshippers of the Silver Flame? There's no sourcebook anywhere on the horizon that appears to be set to describe the Knights of Thrane (it should have been the Thrane organization described in Five Nations rather than the Argentum, which is just like the Acquisitions Directorate), and yet anyone who travels through Thrane is bound to deal with them in one way or another.
Galen_Michael 04-18-06, 10:44 AM	I don't think Splendide is referring to editing quality, but fluff / crunch quality. Probably true. Also a good point about saving fluff for the books. Even so, I can't help but point to the seemingly endless amount of Realmslore WotC posts on the web every Wednesday. Why is it OK for Ed Greenwood to write what essentially amounts to two Dragonshards for the Forgotten Realms (Realmslore, Border Kingdoms) each week, but Keith (or someone else) can't give us a similiar offering for Eberron? If anything, you'd think Eberron fans would be more eager for new Eberron material as there is so little out there (compared to the Forgotten Realms). And if Ed Greenwood is still turning out articles on underdeveloped parts of the Realms 20 years later, I'm sure Keith (or someone else) can find some cool little tidbit they probably won't be covering in a sourcebook. Which, as I understand it, was the reason given for the prohibition on Dragonshards. Just some more thoughts. Galen P.S. I actually wrote this before I saw Euangelion's post (I think we were writing at the same time) but I still have to say, "What he said."
Belabras 04-18-06, 11:21 AM	While I'm all for more print work for KB, I would really love to see a few more Eberron Expandeds and some much, much needed errata. Of course, we wouldn't need the errata if the editing were better :P
PoeticJustice 04-18-06, 11:54 AM	Gone, and without undue haste! We've got enough stuff from the Dragonshards to last for years, even if a game plays weekly. Keith Baker deserves a chance to rest and work on other projects. Let us not forget he's been working diligently on Secrets of Xen'Drik until now. Not only that, but too much Eberron is worse than too little. It's at the point where newcomers ask what supplements they need to buy and what they need to read, as if the Campaign Setting itself weren't enough to run Eberron. Finally, I suspect Wizards has decided to alter their business model. The Forgotten Realms Campaign setting has outsold the ECS three-to-one in the past year and a half, according to my FLGS. If anyone up there is listening, I would certainly be happy with only one book a year, if it's a guaranteed smash hit.
Vharuck 04-18-06, 11:55 AM	I do actually love the new Eberron hook generator.
Kid SixXx 04-18-06, 12:12 PM	Keith Baker deserves a chance to rest and work on other projects. Let us not forget he's been working diligently on Secrets of Xen'Drik until now. A very good point. No sense in distracting Keith with side projects when he's got sourcebooks to work on. Finally, I suspect Wizards has decided to alter their business model. The Forgotten Realms Campaign setting has outsold the ECS three-to-one in the past year and a half, according to my FLGS. Probably two-to-one at my FLGS, but that's with the caveat of compairing the ongoing popularity of a setting that's about two decade's old, has a trans-generational cult following, & has enjoyed about two decade's worth of support to a fledgeling setting that's barely scratching the surface on it's potential. With folks like Bruce Cordell, STAN!, and Nick Logue on board for the long haul & supporting Keith, Eberron can only get better.
ekomega 04-18-06, 12:36 PM	Ed Greenwood owns the rights to FR and the right to publish canonical material. He obtained special powers when he sold his stuff to TSR and WotC. Since WotC invented Eberron, and can do whatever they want without asking some dude, they decided to ruin everything (gross exaggeration). I like what some authors are doing, they seem to really be interested in the setting. But it seems anyone who's been at WotC for awhile doesn't really get it. Not that WotC should underpay its workers and not offer benefits because they're contract employees and not salaried employees (re: destruction of America). As for sales numbers, well, it's always harder to sell something new when the same old product (for 20 years) is still popular.
jonthegm 04-18-06, 12:40 PM	Oh man, if only I had the hubris to figure out how to pitch an article to WotC online...
PoeticJustice 04-18-06, 01:58 PM	. Probably two-to-one at my FLGS, but that's with the caveat of compairing the ongoing popularity of a setting that's about two decade's old, has a trans-generational cult following, & has enjoyed about two decade's worth of support to a fledgeling setting that's barely scratching the surface on it's potential. For clarity, the figures I was given were national, not regional or local. I agree that there's a wider audience for Forgotten Realms, but come on: 3 to 1 in it's first year? After a yearlong ad blitz, rave reviews, and winning the Origins Award for best Supplement? In competition with something that's been around for four years? I suspect that the only thing holding back the setting is the lack of a charismatic Drizzt-like character. Like it or lump it, R.A. Salvatore's books got hundreds of people fired up about Forgotten Realms in the early 90s. When Wizards bought D&D, FR and Dragonlance were the only settings with a large enough following to make 3.0 adaptations. Is this the result of coincidence or the fact that both had incredible book sales? Also consider that RPG sales are down 45% from last year. From Wizards' perspective, something's gone terribly wrong, and restructuring is required to correct it.
Jonathan Drain 04-18-06, 02:51 PM	I assume Keith's hard at work on some project or other, which is why we haven't seen any Dragonshards in a fair while.
Kid SixXx 04-18-06, 04:48 PM	For clarity, the figures I was given were national, not regional or local. I agree that there's a wider audience for Forgotten Realms, but come on: 3 to 1 in it's first year? After a yearlong ad blitz, rave reviews, and winning the Origins Award for best Supplement? In competition with something that's been around for four years? A testament to the staying power of the FR. Heck, it supplanted Greyhawk as the de facto "go to" setting for a long time. I'm old enough to remember the near panic in the streets when it looked like 3.0 development / re-invention of Greyhawk threatened to dig into the re-introduction of the FR. I think we all remember the massive backlash from FR fans when they feared that push of Eberron materiels might occur at the expense of FR development. That was an ugly period of time.
Subtle Knife 04-18-06, 06:42 PM	I agree that it would be quite nice to see some more supplemental articles on various and sundry aspects of Eberron. However, I have one good question... Why aren't we (as DMs, players, etc.) trying to put together our own material? There are some good sites out there, but it would be nice to see some modular material (ie discrete, packaged, such that a DM can pick and choose) "published" on some sites such that DMs can expand the information as they like! Many thanks to those who have endeavored to this end ie. (Save vs DM). As a very busy individual, I'd personally like to see a site where one might submit articles/files/etc. that can be examined, critiqued, and shared about. SK
Euangelion 04-18-06, 08:09 PM	I can put together my own material, and I do. In fact, there are some things that I like my version of something more than the official version that came out after I put mine together. But there's certain issues/aspects that I would prefer more attention paid to from the developers, i.e. the Knights of Thrane I mentioned before. It certainly doesn't have to be Keith that does it, either. All I'm saying is that there's still room for free web material that won't interfere with the written material that's currently under development. Or think about it this way: when was the last time we saw a Web Enhancement article for an Eberron sourcebook? (Sharn:City of Towers, if I'm not mistaken.)
DoveArrow 04-18-06, 08:21 PM	Finally, I suspect Wizards has decided to alter their business model. The Forgotten Realms Campaign setting has outsold the ECS three-to-one in the past year and a half, according to my FLGS. OOC, where'd your FLGS get national statistics for the number of books sold by Wizards? Oh, and incidentally, for those of you who, like me, didn't know what FLGS meant, it means Friendly Local Gaming Store.
Edymnion 04-18-06, 08:23 PM	From my understanding, the reason the Eberron material dried up essentially boils down to WotC telling everybody "You can't write a web article on any topic we could possibly put in a book at any point for the remaining lifetime of the setting." Which basically means "If its worth reading, you can't write about it." Who would want to write meaningless dribble? They're restricted to writing only stuff that isn't worth being in a book, which generally means stuff so limited in scope that no one would really use it anyway. I know I couldn't work under those restrictions.
DoveArrow 04-18-06, 08:29 PM	From my understanding, the reason the Eberron material dried up essentially boils down to WotC telling everybody "You can't write a web article on any topic we could possibly put in a book at any point for the remaining lifetime of the setting." The funny thing is, I actually liked Keith's last article in the dragonshards that was written under these restrictions. I wish they'd put up more like it.
Sieylianna 04-18-06, 10:14 PM	As for sales numbers, well, it's always harder to sell something new when the same old product (for 20 years) is still popular. IMO, the lack of adventures for Eberron is a huge part of the problem. IIRC, there are a total of 5. It's a whole lot easier to adapt a module for Forgotten Realms than it is for Eberron. Eberron is supposed to have a "feel" to it, but WotC has done an incredibly poor job of giving a DM the tools or even a good example to create his own or modify modules from other settings. A lot of companies are getting out of modules because the sales and profits are low. But you've got to have adventures if you are trying to build a new setting. Ed
silversai 04-18-06, 10:50 PM	I like the input on this thread, but i think WoTC Eberron setting is letting DM's have the "freedom" to create your own adventures based on the DM's creativity. The modules of the past created include various themes, settings, and monsters. But alot of scenario's have already been done from the published modules to DM's creating there own worlds over the years. In my opinion these threads have more detailed ideas and creative juices than published material anyway. Peace out, Silversai
Setherial 04-19-06, 05:40 AM	dargon shards where the only reason I visited the Wizards main website, now I don't anymore. That means I don't see their adds for new books anymore either and I'll buy less stuff. Screw them if that is their new strategy, there are excellent 3th party products out there from companies like green ronin publishing and Fantasy Flights that offer better stuff then WOTC.
Kid SixXx 04-19-06, 05:57 AM	It's a whole lot easier to adapt a module for Forgotten Realms than it is for Eberron. I dunno about that. We had a field day on this board adopting Red Hand of Doom for Eberron. Thanks to the goblin history already established in the setting, I think we had an easier time of it than FR folks did, from what I've gathered from other message boards. Screw them if that is their new strategy, there are excellent 3th party products out there from companies like green ronin publishing and Fantasy Flights that offer better stuff then WOTC. I doubt I'll use anything other than Airships (http://www.bastionpress.com/Products/airships.htm) by Bastion Press as my reference for House Lyrandar, unless Keith himself does an airship book.
Sieylianna 04-19-06, 08:05 AM	I like the input on this thread, but i think WoTC Eberron setting is letting DM's have the "freedom" to create your own adventures based on the DM's creativity. That's fine if you have time. When I was in college, I had plenty of time, but no money to buy books. Now that I've been working for a while, I have money to buy anything which comes out (including 2 1/2 cases of each D&D miniatures release), but I don't have the time to create my own adventures. Ed
Kid SixXx 04-19-06, 08:12 AM	That's fine if you have time. When I was in college, I had plenty of time, but no money to buy books. Now that I've been working for a while, I have money to buy anything which comes out (including 2 1/2 cases of each D&D miniatures release), but I don't have the time to create my own adventures. I feel your pain. I barely have enough time to monitor these boards, much less craft an entire adventure. I rely quite a bit on this board to help with angles, hooks, & flesh out my own scenarios. I think that transitioning Age of Worms & RHoD has been easier because so many folks on the Eberron boards are creative savants.
Hellcow 04-20-06, 12:26 PM	FYI, I *am* going to get back to Dragonshards and Eberron Expanded as soon as possible. I only just finished work on an unannounced Eberron sourcebook a few days ago, and I have another project to finish that will keep me busy for at least the next three weeks. After that, I intend to get back online. I've already talked with the web director about a number of possible subjects. So, while I may seem to have fallen off the face of Eberron, both Dragonshards and I will return.
Belabras 04-20-06, 12:34 PM	FYI, I *am* going to get back to Dragonshards and Eberron Expanded as soon as possible. I only just finished work on an unannounced Eberron sourcebook a few days ago, and I have another project to finish that will keep me busy for at least the next three weeks. After that, I intend to get back online. I've already talked with the web director about a number of possible subjects. So, while I may seem to have fallen off the face of Eberron, both Dragonshards and I will return. :dancin: Best news ever! :dancin:
Euangelion 04-20-06, 12:34 PM	FYI, I *am* going to get back to Dragonshards and Eberron Expanded as soon as possible. I only just finished work on an unannounced Eberron sourcebook a few days ago, and I have another project to finish that will keep me busy for at least the next three weeks. After that, I intend to get back online. I've already talked with the web director about a number of possible subjects. So, while I may seem to have fallen off the face of Eberron, both Dragonshards and I will return. Good news all around!
Phantomcrossing 04-20-06, 12:35 PM	YAY!!!!!!!!!!! I am ready for any and all new material pertaining to this world.... Unanounced sourcebook you say? Nice, I'm already on the edge of my seat waiting for Secrets of Xendrik and Faiths of Eberron.
DoveArrow 04-20-06, 12:36 PM	IT'S KEITH! :dancin:
Seth of the First Brigade 04-20-06, 12:37 PM	FYI, I *am* going to get back to Dragonshards and Eberron Expanded as soon as possible. I only just finished work on an unannounced Eberron sourcebook a few days ago, and I have another project to finish that will keep me busy for at least the next three weeks. After that, I intend to get back online. I've already talked with the web director about a number of possible subjects. So, while I may seem to have fallen off the face of Eberron, both Dragonshards and I will return. VIVA LA KEITH, VIVA LA EBERRON :w00t: BRAVISIMO, BRAVISIMO!!!!!!! :clap:
Falen 04-20-06, 02:55 PM	I'm glad to see that KB is bringing back Dragonshards and Eberron Expanded (although didn't Tome of Magic have some Eberron notes in it? If sourcebooks continue to have adaptation notes, do we need Eberron Expanded?). What I would really like to see is on the website is: Web Enhancements: Expanded material that requires you to have the sourcebook, especially if ties it to previous books (i.e. exalted and vile, monster classes). Wormfood-type for Eberron: With the RPGA adventures of Mark of Heroes and the new one coming soon involving Xen'drik, it would be cool if they gave players material based on what is presented in the adventures (This was done in Dragon magazine for their Adventure Path series Age of Worms in Dungeon magazine). I only buy Dungeon when there is an Eberron adventure in it, but the Wormfood articles in Dragon can be used for any campaign. That's all I can think of right now. PGtE was probably my favorite sourcebook, partily due to its format. One thing I really didn't like though was that the Shulussakar from Dragonshards were demoted to yuan-ti. I've made my own material involving them. I'm not really into Sharn Inquisitive. I read them and their entertaining, but I have not used them for any adventures or NPC-building. but, never say never.
DBlizzard 04-20-06, 06:37 PM	If sourcebooks continue to have adaptation notes, do we need Eberron Expanded?Need? We don't need any web articles? Want? I do (at least for books I own). Keith goes into more detail, and has a unique viewpoint that I appreciate and enjoy about fitting those works into Eberron.
Majorafire77 04-20-06, 07:39 PM	I think that the main reason that FR is more popular than Eberron is because FR is standard fantasy and Eberron is not. Is Eberron still D&D? Sure. However, many people play D&D because they're looking for straight, Tolkienesque fantasy, which is what FR provides.
Euangelion 04-20-06, 08:57 PM	That's all I can think of right now. PGtE was probably my favorite sourcebook, partily due to its format. One thing I really didn't like though was that the Shulussakar from Dragonshards were demoted to yuan-ti. I've made my own material involving them. It's probably a huge long shot, but I'm hoping that somehow the Shulassakar made it into MM4, with modified abilities more fitting with their flavor (like daylight instead of darkness, etc.) They'd be fun for any setting, IMHO.
Atlictoatl 04-22-06, 12:48 PM	OOC, where'd your FLGS get national statistics for the number of books sold by Wizards? Oh, and incidentally, for those of you who, like me, didn't know what FLGS meant, it means Friendly Local Gaming Store.I run a FLGS, and I'm skeptical of the statistic that was quoted. WotC is very tight-fisted with data about their numbers, so the best the industry can do is estimate sales based on the sales of the major distributors, who do release their data to the industry. The problem with that, though, is that anyone who retails any volume of Wizards material purchases their stuff directly from Wizards, and Wizards doesn't share that information with anyone. So any stats out there are going to be based on the sales of those retailers who sell the least amount of WotC product and, possibly, mega-stores like Walmart if they make their numbers public; it's not a good metric overall for the hobby. In my store, Eberron greatly outsells Forgotten Realms. I've sold 2-3 times more Eberron novels, and I preorder 4-5 new Eberron RPG books to 1-2 of the FR books. That's my locale, of course; I can't speak to other areas.
Joni-san 04-22-06, 03:33 PM	FYI, I *am* going to get back to Dragonshards and Eberron Expanded as soon as possible. I only just finished work on an unannounced Eberron sourcebook a few days ago, and I have another project to finish that will keep me busy for at least the next three weeks. After that, I intend to get back online. I've already talked with the web director about a number of possible subjects. So, while I may seem to have fallen off the face of Eberron, both Dragonshards and I will return. Keith is back! Hooray! Hooray! :D The Dragonshards and EE are coming back! Hooray! :P
PoeticJustice 04-23-06, 06:13 PM	I run a FLGS, and I'm skeptical of the statistic that was quoted. WotC is very tight-fisted with data about their numbers, so the best the industry can do is estimate sales based on the sales of the major distributors, who do release their data to the industry... To be honest, other than having seen bottom line my FLGS and his friends compile for sales in the Washington DC-area, I cannot confirm Wizards' status, and in Richmond, Va, Eberron appears to be more popular than Forgotten Realms Despite this, I stand by my original statement: On a whole, Eberron is a lot harder to convince people to start playing, and is therefore more difficult to sell. There are no access points other than passion for the setting itself. And I can, however, speak with some certainty that RPG purchases did in fact drop 45% between DEC 31 2004 and DEC 31 2005 (Comics and Games Retailer Magazine, April issue). A related and equally gloomy note: According to another friend who owns my Richmond FLGS, RPG sales indsutry-wide amounted to less than 20 million. That's a hearsay figure, admittedly, exchanged between shots of tequila and rounds of Descent: Journeys into the Dark, so take it with a grain of salt, but still... Palladium is on the Brink of going under... (http://www.gamingreport.com/article.php?sid=20909) HackMaster is reining in production, according to its VP (http://www.kenzerco.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20830) and Monte Cook's telling us the RPG bubble has burst (http://www.montecook.com/cgi-bin/page.cgi?mc_los_155) One cannot ignore so many reports from so many different sources. If gaming is going through a renaissance right now (and I actually believe it is, given the year I've had), then "the industry" was not invited. Even if Eberron's a great product, it's release hasn't jump started a buying frenzy or anything/
Korhal_IV 04-23-06, 11:04 PM	PoeticJustice, while I haven't read the C&GR article, none of your sources really point to a huge decline in RPG sales. Palladium's problems are due to legal and internal issues, not to sales. Hackmaster's not reining in production; they're explaining why they already did so - and frankly, if you have a staff of 10 or so individuals, how many 100+ page books can you realistically expect to put out per year? Three? Four? Editing, compiling, artwork, and printing all put up bottlenecks to production. Monte Cook points that out - there was just too much crap being put out. I mean, seriously, have you seen the shelves and shelves of d20 garbage? There's gotta be at least a thousand new core classes in any game store's shelves, most of them sharing the same names (how many "witch" classes have we got?) and similarly complicated gimmicks. The 3.5 switch also caused havoc with RPG sales. What we're going through is a bubble burst, much like the computer industry's. People are still using computers, and there's activity going on, but the winnowing of the incompetent has commenced. :) For that sales drop to actually signal the end of RPGs would require nearly 50% of gamers to quit the hobby wholesale in one year. That hasn't happened at all, as far as I know.
PoeticJustice 04-24-06, 12:06 AM	*SNIP* I agree with you (on the bubble bursting), and what set off my posts was the possibility of a new business model for Wizards. I have to stand on my sources when they say last year was horrible for RPG sales, as well as my own experience. Everything I've bought that was released last year I've taken back or given away. I was (and remain) a foolish young man. I wonder at how many customers were wiser than me and refused to buy what I inevitably returned. It could make all the difference on the margin. On the other hand, it's been a good year for minis.
Korhal_IV 04-24-06, 12:21 AM	Everything I've bought that was released last year I've taken back or given away. I was (and remain) a foolish young man. I wonder at how many customers were wiser than me and refused to buy what I inevitably returned. It could make all the difference on the margin. On the other hand, it's been a good year for minis. Even the Eberron stuff? I didn't buy many sourcebooks last year, but I haven't returned anything.
Falen 04-24-06, 09:32 AM	I think the gaming industry is hurt by the retailers. I have lived in most of the states west of the Mississippi, including Alaska, and more often than not the retailers are snobbish and rude to customers. I've been gaming for over 20 years and I can't stand the attitudes these people have. I would rather order online or go to a national retailer and get no customer service than get bad customer service at a LGS (notice no F). On Game Day, last year or the year before that, there were only 3 young kids there. One of the DMs ran the Eberron adventure and the entire time he was badmouthing it only because he had never even looked at any of the material. I could tell the kids were not having a good time. I've seen retailers get into arguements with parents over little things. I've worked in retail and sales almost half of my life, so I have learned a lot about customer service and retaining repeat customers and bringing in new ones. WotC can only do so much without the help of retailers. Man, this makes want to go work at a LGS and bring in new customers. I for one really like Eberron. It's new and refreshing. I am completely worn out with FR (especially with Ed Greenwoods writing style, but I'll stop there). I've played and loved many of the old worlds.
PoeticJustice 04-24-06, 11:39 AM	Even the Eberron stuff? I didn't buy many sourcebooks last year, but I haven't returned anything. Even the Eberron stuff. In february I sold the Explorer's Handbook, Five Nations, Magic of Eberron, and Races of Eberron along with most of the Races and Complete series. I kept Sharn, the Player's Guide, and my two copies of ECS, along with a few other generic supplements (MM3, Libris Mortis, Complete Adventurer). You know what? It felt fantastic to get rid of all that worthless stuff. I no longer feel compelled to pore over all the books when making a character. I no longer feel constrained to present the setting in a certain way. Eberron is a fine product, and perhaps those supplements are necessary for certain people, but I am better off without them.
TarlSS 05-02-06, 04:47 AM	I'm pretty sure the RPG industry is growing along with the Computer gaming industry- as Video games become more and more legitimate, so does interest in your traditional RPG. Retailswise, RPGs have never gone through a 'golden age' of any sort, and the quality of product still increases. And it's the very nature of the hobby that older materials simply don't out date themselves, as with computer games- As fans get older their buying power increases. The mere fact is that the P&P RPG has always struggled, and probably will always struggle as a niche product. The fact that WOTC is making headway in making the P&P RPG more legitimate in it's maturity is good. RPG sales aren't going down, the fact is they've never even been up! When someone goes into the business of making RPGs, I don't think there is any illusion that any great return of money will be involved. Since primarily RPGs are a labor of love, it doesn't have the masters of marketing that computer gaming managed to attract. We don't have the ridiculously adept money managers, cut throat promotional folks, or armies of lawyers. The thing is the RPG industry is still run like a hobby, and not like a business- WOTC is the closest that it's come to. And frankly, I could trip and fall into a business with more acumen than WOTC. The thing is, if we even had the resources ( I doubt we do, if the entire industry is 20 million a year, which is frankly a sneeze to other gaming companies like say..EA.) Would we want to invite the world of cutthroat business? As we can see, no. I don't think RPGs will ever turn a real profit unless game companies are willing to cut their hearts out and play Walmart. The only other way I could see it is if someone came in and took a serious gamble on the industry- say some young businessman freshly retired from walstreet with 30 million burning a hole in his pocket suddenly rediscovered D&D from his college years and did something risky- TV advertising, and drastically reduced prices- to make big money, a company has to be willing to take an initial hit for a few years before profits kick in. As long as the walls of your store aren't tumbling down and your kids are starving, I don't think you really have to worry about the fate of the Hobby. As with all small businesses, FLGS tend not to turn a real profit- they wouldn't be small businesses if they did. (As in, most of that profit probably goes right back into living expenses- IE kid's colleges.) I wouldn't sweat it if you see a couple of them closing here and there.