Help fighting the Daelkyr [Archive] - Wizards Community

Help fighting the Daelkyr [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Ibbins
04-17-06, 10:47 PM Okay, I'm starting a new campaign soon, and the basic concept is that three (lvl 1) PCs join together in various clashes with the Cults of the Dragon Below, find themselves hopelessly outmatched, and must seek the help of the fourth PC, who will join the game in the second session.

To make this work, however, I need to do 3 things:
1. Clearly demonstrate that greater knowledge of the enemy will help the party. I'm not sure how to do this without appearing to be a power-tripping DM out to kill the party.
2. Follow through with this by providing ample knowledge and resources that can be used to combat the cults and the Daelkyr creations, beyond just telling them that Byeshk weapons bypass their DR.
3. Make this new knowledge have a noticeable effect on following conflicts, done in a more creative way than lowering ELs and "going easy" on the players.

Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.

Also, I have Magic of Eberron, and I have some vague ideas about employing the Daelkyr Half-blood as the main/recurring villain.
Charles Phipps
04-17-06, 11:10 PM My suggestion is giving the players knowledge of a "kryptonite" weakness of the Daelkyr. Perhaps something like 'blessed' crossbow bolts will kill instantly Rakahasha minions and the garlic equivalent for them.

I also recommend that there's an Eldritch Machine in some place that the player knows about that if they retrieve it can capture or destroy it.
Subedei
04-17-06, 11:13 PM We'll Byeshk weapons are one thing, as you've noted.

The main weapons of the Daelkyr are mental attacks, render the PCs helpless in the first confruntation and give the fourth PC a magical item of some kind (perhaps a consumable item) that can shield them from such things. The item shouldn't completely negate the weapons, just grant them noticeable resistance.

Increase the deadliness of their poisons but make them very slow acting, slow acting yet impossible to stop! No spell or alchemical item has any effect on the poisons spread because no one knows how to make an antidote for the alien venom...except the fourth PC! This could also be an excellent way to get him into the group, one of the PCs is injured by the poison and it slowly starts to spread through his/her body. The PC will grow weaker and weaker each day until eventual death, forcing them to seek out some way of stopping poison.

Consider giving them all Favored Enemy (Daelkyr) as a 1st level Ranger after the fourth PC has a chance to instruct them thuroughly on anti-Daelkyr tactics and the creatures weaknesses, etc. If the fourth PC is a ranger himself bump his favored enemy bonus up by one step as well or give him a feat that works off favored enemy, he should remain better at fighting the Daelkyr as he's obviously had a lot more experience.

Rule that only those with intimate knowledge of the Daelkyr can make Daelkyr bane weapons. If the fourth PC is capable of making weapons then that's another thing he can do.
ekomega
04-17-06, 11:19 PM It's difficult to give a party of 1st level characters (only 3) a "hard time" without just killing them. Even a measly ogre is likely to kill one (or more) party members.

I'd go the RP route for "outmatched" and have the PCs walk in on some weird secret rituals when investigating a Cultist hideout. The ritual could be a few measly humans and dolgrims raising a Dolgaunt (or Mindflayer if you want to go nuts) from some kind of hibernation pod. They could all wear cloaks and be chanting and stuff. That should sufficiently scare the crap out of any low level PCs.
Subedei
04-18-06, 12:05 AM Oh right, they're level 1. Yeah, that could be a problem. Couldn't you just raise it a bit? I mean, straight out of basic training troopers are level 1, defective warforged are level one! If these people aren't kids and are supposed to have great potential and aptitude (they're hero's, probably the center of some great plot) it seems like they should be at least level 3 to represent the rest of their presumably eventful lives.

Not talking about you, but some DMs are just nuts. Starting a 40 year old veteran cyran captain of the last war at level 1 because of some strange notion that campaigns should be started at level 1 just doesn't make sense!

We've also had some kind of elite Warforged Commando start at level 1. "So bob, they want one for some kind of vital top secret mission then, right?" "yeah, but you know, we always make such powerful killing machines...Wouldn't it be funny if we intentionally made one poorly and then didn't put it through advanced combat training with the other ones?" "Yeah, that'd be hilarious! Think we can make some built in glitch that doesn't allow it to learn anything until the war ends?"
Ibbins
04-18-06, 12:06 AM These ideas so far are excellent. The garlic(Gatekeeper druid spells?), the poison, the bane weapons(PC 4 happens to be an artificer). I'd better write these down...

I'd go the RP route for "outmatched" and have the PCs walk in on some weird secret rituals when investigating a Cultist hideout. The ritual could be a few measly humans and dolgrims raising a Dolgaunt (or Mindflayer if you want to go nuts) from some kind of hibernation pod. They could all wear cloaks and be chanting and stuff. That should sufficiently scare the crap out of any low level PCs.

Well I was planning to run them into a mining operation to recover a Daelkyr artifact, but the "hibernation pod" is too good to pass up. The PCs can witness the birth of the antichrist. Sweeet. :devil:
Subedei
04-18-06, 12:12 AM Hmm, if the PCs try to do anything about it (they tend to, if they don't maybe you should encourage it) you don't necessarily have to attack them lethally.

Evil mastermind types have a tendancy to not take any threats seriously, whatever comes out of that pod may just disable them all with non lethal psionics, leaving them helplessly writhing on the ground in pain for a few hours as a demonstration of its power, not bothering to to go through the effort of killing them.

Bad guys leave, PCs eventually come to their senses.
Ibbins
04-18-06, 12:19 AM Not talking about you, but some DMs are just nuts. Starting a 40 year old veteran cyran captain of the last war at level 1 because of some strange notion that campaigns should be started at level 1 just doesn't make sense!

I'm with you, man. I just love those low levels too much. And I try to make sure that the character backgrounds descibe them all as new to the field; I got pretty annoyed when one player's backstory(some time ago) was about an accomplished changeling assassin who serve about 7 armies during the war, and happened to be a level 1 sorc.

Anyhoo, in this game the party's patron is going to point out right off the bat that the PCs are all new, and inexperienced, and that this is a recon mission and nothing more. And they'll be "the only ones for the job" because it'll be mostly a personal rivalry between the party and the villain, rather than plots that threaten nations(at least for a while).

And, once the public does learn of the Daelkyr threat, the arrogant and proud Aundarian guards will be ready to oust the PCs and take over the duties themselves. I've even got an angry rant ready for when that comes up:

"You know what? It's adventurers like you who undermine the very foundations of our society. Sure, you win once and you're heroes, but meanwhile you're taking away my job and the jobs of my fellows, and in the end you're unreliable, because in five minutes you're gallivanting off on another adventure! So, no thank-you, we'll handle it."

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Ibbins 04-17-06, 10:47 PM	Okay, I'm starting a new campaign soon, and the basic concept is that three (lvl 1) PCs join together in various clashes with the Cults of the Dragon Below, find themselves hopelessly outmatched, and must seek the help of the fourth PC, who will join the game in the second session. To make this work, however, I need to do 3 things: 1. Clearly demonstrate that greater knowledge of the enemy will help the party. I'm not sure how to do this without appearing to be a power-tripping DM out to kill the party. 2. Follow through with this by providing ample knowledge and resources that can be used to combat the cults and the Daelkyr creations, beyond just telling them that Byeshk weapons bypass their DR. 3. Make this new knowledge have a noticeable effect on following conflicts, done in a more creative way than lowering ELs and "going easy" on the players. Any ideas would be greatly appreciated. Also, I have Magic of Eberron, and I have some vague ideas about employing the Daelkyr Half-blood as the main/recurring villain.
Charles Phipps 04-17-06, 11:10 PM	My suggestion is giving the players knowledge of a "kryptonite" weakness of the Daelkyr. Perhaps something like 'blessed' crossbow bolts will kill instantly Rakahasha minions and the garlic equivalent for them. I also recommend that there's an Eldritch Machine in some place that the player knows about that if they retrieve it can capture or destroy it.
Subedei 04-17-06, 11:13 PM	We'll Byeshk weapons are one thing, as you've noted. The main weapons of the Daelkyr are mental attacks, render the PCs helpless in the first confruntation and give the fourth PC a magical item of some kind (perhaps a consumable item) that can shield them from such things. The item shouldn't completely negate the weapons, just grant them noticeable resistance. Increase the deadliness of their poisons but make them very slow acting, slow acting yet impossible to stop! No spell or alchemical item has any effect on the poisons spread because no one knows how to make an antidote for the alien venom...except the fourth PC! This could also be an excellent way to get him into the group, one of the PCs is injured by the poison and it slowly starts to spread through his/her body. The PC will grow weaker and weaker each day until eventual death, forcing them to seek out some way of stopping poison. Consider giving them all Favored Enemy (Daelkyr) as a 1st level Ranger after the fourth PC has a chance to instruct them thuroughly on anti-Daelkyr tactics and the creatures weaknesses, etc. If the fourth PC is a ranger himself bump his favored enemy bonus up by one step as well or give him a feat that works off favored enemy, he should remain better at fighting the Daelkyr as he's obviously had a lot more experience. Rule that only those with intimate knowledge of the Daelkyr can make Daelkyr bane weapons. If the fourth PC is capable of making weapons then that's another thing he can do.
ekomega 04-17-06, 11:19 PM	It's difficult to give a party of 1st level characters (only 3) a "hard time" without just killing them. Even a measly ogre is likely to kill one (or more) party members. I'd go the RP route for "outmatched" and have the PCs walk in on some weird secret rituals when investigating a Cultist hideout. The ritual could be a few measly humans and dolgrims raising a Dolgaunt (or Mindflayer if you want to go nuts) from some kind of hibernation pod. They could all wear cloaks and be chanting and stuff. That should sufficiently scare the crap out of any low level PCs.
Subedei 04-18-06, 12:05 AM	Oh right, they're level 1. Yeah, that could be a problem. Couldn't you just raise it a bit? I mean, straight out of basic training troopers are level 1, defective warforged are level one! If these people aren't kids and are supposed to have great potential and aptitude (they're hero's, probably the center of some great plot) it seems like they should be at least level 3 to represent the rest of their presumably eventful lives. Not talking about you, but some DMs are just nuts. Starting a 40 year old veteran cyran captain of the last war at level 1 because of some strange notion that campaigns should be started at level 1 just doesn't make sense! We've also had some kind of elite Warforged Commando start at level 1. "So bob, they want one for some kind of vital top secret mission then, right?" "yeah, but you know, we always make such powerful killing machines...Wouldn't it be funny if we intentionally made one poorly and then didn't put it through advanced combat training with the other ones?" "Yeah, that'd be hilarious! Think we can make some built in glitch that doesn't allow it to learn anything until the war ends?"
Ibbins 04-18-06, 12:06 AM	These ideas so far are excellent. The garlic(Gatekeeper druid spells?), the poison, the bane weapons(PC 4 happens to be an artificer). I'd better write these down... I'd go the RP route for "outmatched" and have the PCs walk in on some weird secret rituals when investigating a Cultist hideout. The ritual could be a few measly humans and dolgrims raising a Dolgaunt (or Mindflayer if you want to go nuts) from some kind of hibernation pod. They could all wear cloaks and be chanting and stuff. That should sufficiently scare the crap out of any low level PCs. Well I was planning to run them into a mining operation to recover a Daelkyr artifact, but the "hibernation pod" is too good to pass up. The PCs can witness the birth of the antichrist. Sweeet. :devil:
Subedei 04-18-06, 12:12 AM	Hmm, if the PCs try to do anything about it (they tend to, if they don't maybe you should encourage it) you don't necessarily have to attack them lethally. Evil mastermind types have a tendancy to not take any threats seriously, whatever comes out of that pod may just disable them all with non lethal psionics, leaving them helplessly writhing on the ground in pain for a few hours as a demonstration of its power, not bothering to to go through the effort of killing them. Bad guys leave, PCs eventually come to their senses.
Ibbins 04-18-06, 12:19 AM	Not talking about you, but some DMs are just nuts. Starting a 40 year old veteran cyran captain of the last war at level 1 because of some strange notion that campaigns should be started at level 1 just doesn't make sense! I'm with you, man. I just love those low levels too much. And I try to make sure that the character backgrounds descibe them all as new to the field; I got pretty annoyed when one player's backstory(some time ago) was about an accomplished changeling assassin who serve about 7 armies during the war, and happened to be a level 1 sorc. Anyhoo, in this game the party's patron is going to point out right off the bat that the PCs are all new, and inexperienced, and that this is a recon mission and nothing more. And they'll be "the only ones for the job" because it'll be mostly a personal rivalry between the party and the villain, rather than plots that threaten nations(at least for a while). And, once the public does learn of the Daelkyr threat, the arrogant and proud Aundarian guards will be ready to oust the PCs and take over the duties themselves. I've even got an angry rant ready for when that comes up: "You know what? It's adventurers like you who undermine the very foundations of our society. Sure, you win once and you're heroes, but meanwhile you're taking away my job and the jobs of my fellows, and in the end you're unreliable, because in five minutes you're gallivanting off on another adventure! So, no thank-you, we'll handle it."