How do the Elementals feel? [Archive] - Wizards Community

How do the Elementals feel? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
ChronosCrow
08-03-04, 05:30 PM Some of my PC's came across a rather interesting idea. If elementals are the force of movement behind the new magitech vehicles, how exactly do they feel about it? To me it looks a lot like forced servitude really. I kinda skirtted around the issue at the time it came up in game and was able to maintain consitancy, but this will probably arise again.

So, really, how do the elementals feel about being bound to ships and being forced to act as transportation?
DireHawk
08-03-04, 05:46 PM Way I look at it, they are coerced into thinking its a good deal, but really its just slavery. They aren't very smart apparently, but that was the feeling I got from the CS. Also, I found info on the Cult of Four with a fanatical sect which causes terrorist like activities (destroying ships and such) in the name of elemental abolition. Pretty interesting, and definitely being implemented into my campaign.
Just another user
08-03-04, 06:44 PM My 2 cp

Elementals are essentialimmortal, maybe for them passing a couple of centuries working as an airship engine could be an interesting variation from their normal lives in the elemental plane , an occasion to see the world, (maybe is just me, but I think that living in an elemental plane for all eternity must be a little boring, every fire mountains, fire rivers, fire forests.... booo-ring, the material plane is a little more variegate and "weird")and sooner or later the ship will break down or the spell will wan off and they will be able to go back at home.
Saurenda
08-03-04, 07:37 PM My name is Burnia, the fire elemental. I'm sad that I'm in an item =(

Um, I think Just another user is right here. A fire elemental is very ow intelligence to keep it happy it just needs to keep burning. If they keep fueling it, it's happy.
Kaverael
08-05-04, 11:34 AM SPOILER ALERT

One of the encounters in the SOFLW takes place against two fire elementals who have escaped from the machine that they were bound in, they think that the adventurers want to bind them back in the machine. They attack with vengance and fight to the death because they do not want to go back. This leads me to believe that they do not want to be there, and will fight if released.
Just another user
08-05-04, 02:39 PM Remember that even elementals are individuals, I still think soemone could even enjoy it.
Teslacoil1138
08-05-04, 03:15 PM In the ECS, it specifically states that the creator of the item must make an opposed Charisma check to force the elemental into the shard. Most elementals have a Cha bonuse of +0, so it wouldn't be too hard to pull off with an experienced artificer or magewright, for example.

So I would guess that most elementals grudgingly accept it. Another question you'd have to ask is, how elementals who are summoned by mages feel about their service (albeit temporary) to said mage. It could just be strolling along in its native elemental plane one day and suddenly be pulled out to fight for some fleshling that it doesn't know or care about...
ChronosCrow
08-05-04, 07:28 PM Hhhmm, well I'm sure it could be argued either way really. I think it all depends on the elementals interactions with other beings. Although, there has to be some kind of norm and the tendancy to be more caring takes too much effort for a large majority so I'm probably wanning to the idea that most elementals actually hate their forced servitude and in extreme cases if one got loose it may even seek vengeance.
Zen Storm
08-05-04, 09:20 PM I would think the fire elementals would be pretty hot:D
and the air or wind elementals are kind of oblivious to their situation being air- headed and all...:D
Seriously though, It wouldn't suprise me that creatures of such low intelligence would go with more of a primal reaction to being bound. especially fire. It by its very nature is raging and chaotic. I think once free, they would be very angry almost berzerker like if they were forced back into enslavement.
I think that the nature of the air/wind elementals is a longing to be free flowing like the element that they are. Being bound might just tend to make an air elemental "sad". I mean take anythings freedom away and and force it into labor for you with no say so, it would tend to lean toward one of those two emotions; anger or sadness. I think once free the air elemental would be more focused on escape and freedom and fight only if it had to in order to escape.
That is until someone stopped it and ask it :
"How do you keep an air elemental in suspense?"
Air Elemental : "I don't know. How?"
PC: "How do you keep an air elemental in suspense?"
Air Elemental : I don't know. How?
PC : "How do you keep an air elemental in suspense?"
and on, and on, and on, and on... because man they're dense ... to be air and all.
ChronosCrow
08-05-04, 10:13 PM The reason I ask is because one of my kalashtar PC's tried to "mindlink" to a Lighting Rail elemental.
Save_vs_DM
08-06-04, 03:53 AM Hmm, it's odd. The highest int an elemental has is 6. That's not too bright (but brighter than a few half-orcs I know).

Given the fact that the elementals recieve a saving throw to resist and that you must make an opposed charisma check to drive the vehicle, I would assume that the elemental's are UNWILLING to do this. They are probably slaves.

This is quite curious...as I think the characters most likely to make trouble with this are the CG individuals...espeically Holy Liberators...could make for a good plot hook. Druids would also be quite unhappy about this.

Cheers,
Save vs DM
Steven Snyder
08-06-04, 01:38 PM Elementals have feelings?

Preposterous I say! What consideration should I give to an animated pile of rocks or a puddle?

Elementals exist to service us, and nothing more. Those that we deem incompatible for that role should be destroyed, this is how we tamed the wolf into the dog you know.
greatfrito
08-06-04, 05:29 PM Lol

Actually, the whole "culling of the defiant" thing actually sounds like it would happen... and might end up doing so if I ever run a game...

Everyone would -prefer- "tame" elementals... they just don't get them yet.

So yes, I think they're pretty angry about it (though with the right Cha check, they can easily be convinced otherwise).
The Pinata
08-06-04, 05:34 PM I can just see the bored warforged on the ship who's job is to "motivate" the elemental. If it was a fire elemental, you know just to toss a bucket of water on it.
a_psh
08-06-04, 10:43 PM Originally posted by Steven Snyder (excerpt)
Elementals exist to service us, and nothing more.

I don't mean to nitpick, but I think it's my duty to point out that "serving" someone and "servicing" them are generally very different acts before you go off and get slapped for missing that distinction in a social setting.
Steven Snyder
08-09-04, 08:47 AM Originally posted by a_psh
I don't mean to nitpick, but I think it's my duty to point out that "serving" someone and "servicing" them are generally very different acts before you go off and get slapped for missing that distinction in a social setting.

I think it is time to consult Webster.com

Main Entry: 1ser·vice
Pronunciation: 's&r-v&s
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English, from Middle French, from Latin servitium condition of a slave, body of slaves, from servus slave
1 a : the occupation or function of serving <in active service> b : employment as a servant <entered his service>
2 a : the work performed by one that serves <good service> b : HELP, USE, BENEFIT <glad to be of service> c : contribution to the welfare of others d : disposal for use <I'm entirely at your service>
4 : the act of serving : as a : a helpful act <did him a service> b : useful labor that does not produce a tangible commodity -- usually used in plural <charge for professional services> c : SERVE
7 a : a facility supplying some public demand <telephone service> <bus service> b : a facility providing maintenance and repair <television service>

Where I come from, if you have serviced a woman you have fixed her car. But A_Psh, you have done your duty and pointed out a possible meaning to the term I used. Ironic how one word could take on so many meanings...maybe it's time for a fresh, new, language.
Gurv
08-09-04, 10:22 AM I think that it can be agreed that the elementals are less than willing to be used to power the various things that they are used for. Else, one would not need Khyber shards to bind them. But even though they have been captured, the planar binding spell upon which all such things hinge suggests that the elemental has been "compelled" to do as it is bid.

Neither the lightning reins nor the wheel of wind and water suggest that any kind of a check is required to make the elemental do as it is told.

IMC I am going to assume that such elementals are Indifferent, and simply do what they are told when appropriate. If someone managed to communicate with them in another fashion (such as the above-mentioned minlink), then Charisma checks to shift its attitude will determine what it does.

If said elemental gets free, its Indifferent attitude suggests that it will just do as it would normally. Likely start looking for a way back to its home plane (which could cause some inadvertant destruction in the case of many elementals). Trying to rebind the elemental is going to make it Unfriendly at the least.
Remnant
08-09-04, 10:41 AM Elementals are people too!

Quick, let's start a group called "E peace"! We can hold protest marches outside Lyrandar facilities, and use zodiac hot air baloons to block airshipping channels!

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
ChronosCrow 08-03-04, 05:30 PM	Some of my PC's came across a rather interesting idea. If elementals are the force of movement behind the new magitech vehicles, how exactly do they feel about it? To me it looks a lot like forced servitude really. I kinda skirtted around the issue at the time it came up in game and was able to maintain consitancy, but this will probably arise again. So, really, how do the elementals feel about being bound to ships and being forced to act as transportation?
DireHawk 08-03-04, 05:46 PM	Way I look at it, they are coerced into thinking its a good deal, but really its just slavery. They aren't very smart apparently, but that was the feeling I got from the CS. Also, I found info on the Cult of Four with a fanatical sect which causes terrorist like activities (destroying ships and such) in the name of elemental abolition. Pretty interesting, and definitely being implemented into my campaign.
Just another user 08-03-04, 06:44 PM	My 2 cp Elementals are essentialimmortal, maybe for them passing a couple of centuries working as an airship engine could be an interesting variation from their normal lives in the elemental plane , an occasion to see the world, (maybe is just me, but I think that living in an elemental plane for all eternity must be a little boring, every fire mountains, fire rivers, fire forests.... booo-ring, the material plane is a little more variegate and "weird")and sooner or later the ship will break down or the spell will wan off and they will be able to go back at home.
Saurenda 08-03-04, 07:37 PM	My name is Burnia, the fire elemental. I'm sad that I'm in an item =( Um, I think Just another user is right here. A fire elemental is very ow intelligence to keep it happy it just needs to keep burning. If they keep fueling it, it's happy.
Kaverael 08-05-04, 11:34 AM	SPOILER ALERT One of the encounters in the SOFLW takes place against two fire elementals who have escaped from the machine that they were bound in, they think that the adventurers want to bind them back in the machine. They attack with vengance and fight to the death because they do not want to go back. This leads me to believe that they do not want to be there, and will fight if released.
Just another user 08-05-04, 02:39 PM	Remember that even elementals are individuals, I still think soemone could even enjoy it.
Teslacoil1138 08-05-04, 03:15 PM	In the ECS, it specifically states that the creator of the item must make an opposed Charisma check to force the elemental into the shard. Most elementals have a Cha bonuse of +0, so it wouldn't be too hard to pull off with an experienced artificer or magewright, for example. So I would guess that most elementals grudgingly accept it. Another question you'd have to ask is, how elementals who are summoned by mages feel about their service (albeit temporary) to said mage. It could just be strolling along in its native elemental plane one day and suddenly be pulled out to fight for some fleshling that it doesn't know or care about...
ChronosCrow 08-05-04, 07:28 PM	Hhhmm, well I'm sure it could be argued either way really. I think it all depends on the elementals interactions with other beings. Although, there has to be some kind of norm and the tendancy to be more caring takes too much effort for a large majority so I'm probably wanning to the idea that most elementals actually hate their forced servitude and in extreme cases if one got loose it may even seek vengeance.
Zen Storm 08-05-04, 09:20 PM	I would think the fire elementals would be pretty hot:D and the air or wind elementals are kind of oblivious to their situation being air- headed and all...:D Seriously though, It wouldn't suprise me that creatures of such low intelligence would go with more of a primal reaction to being bound. especially fire. It by its very nature is raging and chaotic. I think once free, they would be very angry almost berzerker like if they were forced back into enslavement. I think that the nature of the air/wind elementals is a longing to be free flowing like the element that they are. Being bound might just tend to make an air elemental "sad". I mean take anythings freedom away and and force it into labor for you with no say so, it would tend to lean toward one of those two emotions; anger or sadness. I think once free the air elemental would be more focused on escape and freedom and fight only if it had to in order to escape. That is until someone stopped it and ask it : "How do you keep an air elemental in suspense?" Air Elemental : "I don't know. How?" PC: "How do you keep an air elemental in suspense?" Air Elemental : I don't know. How? PC : "How do you keep an air elemental in suspense?" and on, and on, and on, and on... because man they're dense ... to be air and all.
ChronosCrow 08-05-04, 10:13 PM	The reason I ask is because one of my kalashtar PC's tried to "mindlink" to a Lighting Rail elemental.
Save_vs_DM 08-06-04, 03:53 AM	Hmm, it's odd. The highest int an elemental has is 6. That's not too bright (but brighter than a few half-orcs I know). Given the fact that the elementals recieve a saving throw to resist and that you must make an opposed charisma check to drive the vehicle, I would assume that the elemental's are UNWILLING to do this. They are probably slaves. This is quite curious...as I think the characters most likely to make trouble with this are the CG individuals...espeically Holy Liberators...could make for a good plot hook. Druids would also be quite unhappy about this. Cheers, Save vs DM
Steven Snyder 08-06-04, 01:38 PM	Elementals have feelings? Preposterous I say! What consideration should I give to an animated pile of rocks or a puddle? Elementals exist to service us, and nothing more. Those that we deem incompatible for that role should be destroyed, this is how we tamed the wolf into the dog you know.
greatfrito 08-06-04, 05:29 PM	Lol Actually, the whole "culling of the defiant" thing actually sounds like it would happen... and might end up doing so if I ever run a game... Everyone would -prefer- "tame" elementals... they just don't get them yet. So yes, I think they're pretty angry about it (though with the right Cha check, they can easily be convinced otherwise).
The Pinata 08-06-04, 05:34 PM	I can just see the bored warforged on the ship who's job is to "motivate" the elemental. If it was a fire elemental, you know just to toss a bucket of water on it.
a_psh 08-06-04, 10:43 PM	Originally posted by Steven Snyder (excerpt) Elementals exist to service us, and nothing more. I don't mean to nitpick, but I think it's my duty to point out that "serving" someone and "servicing" them are generally very different acts before you go off and get slapped for missing that distinction in a social setting.
Steven Snyder 08-09-04, 08:47 AM	Originally posted by a_psh I don't mean to nitpick, but I think it's my duty to point out that "serving" someone and "servicing" them are generally very different acts before you go off and get slapped for missing that distinction in a social setting. I think it is time to consult Webster.com Main Entry: 1ser·vice Pronunciation: 's&r-v&s Function: noun Etymology: Middle English, from Middle French, from Latin servitium condition of a slave, body of slaves, from servus slave 1 a : the occupation or function of serving <in active service> b : employment as a servant <entered his service> 2 a : the work performed by one that serves <good service> b : HELP, USE, BENEFIT <glad to be of service> c : contribution to the welfare of others d : disposal for use <I'm entirely at your service> 4 : the act of serving : as a : a helpful act <did him a service> b : useful labor that does not produce a tangible commodity -- usually used in plural <charge for professional services> c : SERVE 7 a : a facility supplying some public demand <telephone service> <bus service> b : a facility providing maintenance and repair <television service> Where I come from, if you have serviced a woman you have fixed her car. But A_Psh, you have done your duty and pointed out a possible meaning to the term I used. Ironic how one word could take on so many meanings...maybe it's time for a fresh, new, language.
Gurv 08-09-04, 10:22 AM	I think that it can be agreed that the elementals are less than willing to be used to power the various things that they are used for. Else, one would not need Khyber shards to bind them. But even though they have been captured, the planar binding spell upon which all such things hinge suggests that the elemental has been "compelled" to do as it is bid. Neither the lightning reins nor the wheel of wind and water suggest that any kind of a check is required to make the elemental do as it is told. IMC I am going to assume that such elementals are Indifferent, and simply do what they are told when appropriate. If someone managed to communicate with them in another fashion (such as the above-mentioned minlink), then Charisma checks to shift its attitude will determine what it does. If said elemental gets free, its Indifferent attitude suggests that it will just do as it would normally. Likely start looking for a way back to its home plane (which could cause some inadvertant destruction in the case of many elementals). Trying to rebind the elemental is going to make it Unfriendly at the least.
Remnant 08-09-04, 10:41 AM	Elementals are people too! Quick, let's start a group called "E peace"! We can hold protest marches outside Lyrandar facilities, and use zodiac hot air baloons to block airshipping channels!