Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Dawn_of_an_Age 01-16-07, 03:24 PM	I am starting a campaign in which one of the protagonist is either going to be a Knight of Thrane, or a Knight of Old Cyre (right now I am leaning more towards Old Cyre). In addition to this he will also be, or rather become the first "Heir of Siberys" in a Dragonmarked House; in this case the house will be Deneith. (Though the character will not actually be born within the House, he will be born into a "normal family" and his dragonmark will not manifest until somwhere between his 14th and 16th birthday thereabouts.). How do you think House Deneith will respond to this? I was thinking of going with something along the lines of; the first time his dragonmark manifests itself, it would do so with such power that those of importance within the House would sense its presence, or rather sense a surge of great power being unleashed. The overall effect of the manifestation would probably only be the Least or Lesser effect of the Mark of the Sentinel. What the "Powers that be" would be sensing then would be the innate raw power of a Siberys Mark (This would be a mystery to House Deneith, because they would have never sensed a power such as this before.) to be, which would at the time of manifest be untapped.
Alex_ 01-16-07, 03:48 PM	Dragonmarks in and of themselves, no matter how powerful, aren't very powerful in and of themselves. The Dragonmarked houses are powerful because they bring many Dragonmarked together and consolidated their power. Anyone with a dragonmark is pressured to remain in the house, serve the house, and marry within the house. The last thing the houses want is their consolidated power running loose abroad and not contributing to them, or worse yet, competeing with them. So they'll want to keep this individual in the house as well. Just one of him isn't going to be enough to give them any kind of economic boost, but if they can figure out how he got the mark, and better yet, how they can get him to pass it on, then it could have a more profound affect. So I'd imagine he'd be like most of the higher ranking dragonmarked, only even more important.
DarkWarriorKarg 01-16-07, 04:39 PM	So, in your campaign, no one has ever manifested the Deneith Syberis mark? The house doesn't know it exists? BTW, the "echoes of power" you're suggesting doesn't match the theme of it's power (mind blank)
Just another user 01-16-07, 04:42 PM	Wow!! 14th-16th years old!? you know that an heir of syberis must be at least of 13th level, right?
tacoronte 01-16-07, 04:59 PM	I believe House Deneith's official stance will likely be to court him *heavily* to come join the house: paying off all his debts, generous offers of wealth and power within the house, even using deception to recruit him. There is certainly room for other reactions, the obvious one is envy from some mid-level heirs that can feel threatened by this person coming into the house. The reaction from these can range from trying to "dig up dirt" from the past and tarnish his reputation to deceiving him into breaking his oath. Assassination attemps will also be in order. I would even bring in some involvement from House Tharashk, with their well known rivalry with Deneith, they may want to prevent this new heir to bring further power to their rival house.
Dawn_of_an_Age 01-16-07, 05:04 PM	So, in your campaign, no one has ever manifested the Deneith Syberis mark? The house doesn't know it exists? BTW, the "echoes of power" you're suggesting doesn't match the theme of it's power (mind blank) No no one has ever manifested a Siberys Mark period. his character will be the first. Consider the "echoes of power" to be fluff. Fluff sadly to say more often than not, does not match the crunch in D&D. The crunch is usually far less than the fluff. Also the "echoes of power" are relative. Meaning, relative to Dragonmarks it is a power unlike any has seen before. Another stage of the "Prophecy" perhaps. Also having such powers in a world where others do not is pretty intense. For instance if I could toss a small refrigerater with great force across a room, I would be considered in our world to be extremely strong. However if you put next to spiderman I would be very week, and if you put spider man next to the Hulk...so forth and so on...scales of power, all relative. (Sorry, I couldnt think of a better example, but hopefully you get the picture of what I am trying to say.)
Dawn_of_an_Age 01-16-07, 05:10 PM	Wow!! 14th-16th years old!? you know that an heir of syberis must be at least of 13th level, right? The Siberys Mark wont actually maifest in its entirety when he is 14 or 16; rather his dragonmark will manifest, though one would sense that his dragonmark has much more potential than seems evident at the time, more than anyone to date has seen. That is why it would be an enigma.
Shady314 01-16-07, 05:47 PM	Everything about the idea so completely changes the canon of Dragonmarks it's hard to give suggestions. The Siberys mark manifests with the first level of HoS but has no power. The earliest that is possible is 13th level. Siberys mark's don't ever mimic the powers of the least, lesser or greater marks. Just the Siberys power. How would House Deneith respond? How do they even know it's a Deneith mark? No one has seen a Siberys Mark before period in your campaign world before and he isn't from a Deneith family. So they just have oracles or something? They aren't the Jedi. every Deneith looks around going "I feel a large dragonmark has appeared somewhere?" So House Deneith won't know about it till someone hears about this freak somewhere with a huge mark that looks like a dragonmark. Seems the first logical response would be Aberrant mark! on par with the powers of Halas or the Lady of Plague based on the size of it. (Bigger the Dragonmark the more powerful it is.) When the dragonmark manifests with the first level of Heir of Siberys it has no power. It's not until second level he'll be able to use mindblank. So they'll want to kill him before whatever awful power manifests itself. Eventually cooler heads may realize the familiar patterns in the center and that the coloring is wrong and maybe it isn't an abberant mark. Then he'll become a test subject. Poked and prodded as they try to figure out the power of the mark, if others can start manifesting it. If he is the first ever there are no dragonmark focus items he can use. All he can do is cast mindblank once a day. Eventually maybe twice. He'll get paid to cast it on the Baron everyday or possible some other high paying client. Monarchs and such. He's too important to ever let go. It's up to you how far Deneith will go to keep him around.
Cifer 01-16-07, 05:50 PM	@Dawn There's the problem that Syberis marks manifest directly. No least, lesser or greater mark precedes them. In fact, if someone has one of those marks, he will never develop a Syberis.
aelryinth 01-16-07, 08:11 PM	@Dawn There's the problem that Syberis marks manifest directly. No least, lesser or greater mark precedes them. In fact, if someone has one of those marks, he will never develop a Syberis. That's a fluff issue. IF he says a Siberys Mark manifests and grows over time until it 'goes off' at level 12, then that is what it does. He's looking for story ideas, not adherence to canon. ==Aerlyinth
Shady314 01-17-07, 04:38 AM	That's a fluff issue. IF he says a Siberys Mark manifests and grows over time until it 'goes off' at level 12, then that is what it does. He's looking for story ideas, not adherence to canon. ==Aerlyinth Actually that's crunch. Anyways it's possible the OP may be unaware of how the Siberys mark works so it's not outrageous to point it out. :rolleyes:
Dawn_of_an_Age 01-17-07, 11:26 AM	That's a fluff issue. IF he says a Siberys Mark manifests and grows over time until it 'goes off' at level 12, then that is what it does. He's looking for story ideas, not adherence to canon. ==Aerlyinth I think Aerlyinth has the right idea. I have not read Dragonmarked in its entirety, so some of the information being shared I am not familiar with. What I am looking for is more from the perspective of this is how the first Siberys Mark will manifest in MY Eberron. It starts as either a Least or Lesser Dragonmark, and develops over time, however other select Dragonmark carriers/Heirs can sense its power (not sure if I want this to be reserved for the affiliated Dragonmarked House only, or for all the Houses, no matter which Mark manifests), its innate untapped power. (No one knows why this is the case, currently it is a mystery, maybe something to do with another evolution of the Draconic Prophecy). Though it seems by all appearances (physical) to be nothing more than a Least or Lesser Mark it whispers of rawer untapped power, power yet for some reason to be released. This is for both crunch and fluff purposes. So the general question then becomes, how House Deneith would respond to the phenomenon of a new, more powerful Dragonmark manifesting within its line. And additionally, what implications does that hold in regards to the other Dragonmarked Houses who have not yet manifested such a Mark? How would they respond to all of this? Now that I really start to think about it. Once this got out it would have a ripple affect through several organizations; all of The Dragonmarked Houses, The Twelve, and The Chamber. With the universal question being, what is this new power that has come about? and for those who believe in the Prophecy; "what implications does this hold"? Is there any canon material that talks about the first manifestation of a Siberys Mark, if so I would love to reference it to see if I can glean any ideas from it.
DargonSwift 01-17-07, 11:38 AM	Is there any canon material that talks about the first manifestation of a Siberys Mark, if so I would love to reference it to see if I can glean any ideas from it. One of the novels talks about a barbarian from the Shadow Marches (who is of the Dennieth bloodline) spontaneously developing a Siberys Dragonmark. Its in the Dragon Below series (one of the better Eberron trilogies).
Wolfrunner 01-17-07, 02:39 PM	The house would more than likely accept someone with a dragonmark after checking their family history, and even if a relative had been forced from the house they would still probably accept the person...after all the sins of the father are not the sins of the son.
Cifer 01-17-07, 06:21 PM	They would always accept him - a Syberis mark is too important to lose.
(Psi)SeveredHead 01-17-07, 08:39 PM	Ignoring the rules "errors", I figure Deneith would accept him. In fact, they'd make it hard for him to avoid entering House Deneith. Mercenaries would keep coming to his door, in order to "train him to fight bandits/goblins/whatever the local threat is" but they really want to befriend him and get him to join House Deneith.
aelryinth 01-18-07, 03:08 AM	Actually that's crunch. Anyways it's possible the OP may be unaware of how the Siberys mark works so it's not outrageous to point it out. :rolleyes: It's not a crunch issue unless it affects Gameplay. For instance, it having lesser powers is a 'crunch' issue. If all it does is pop up on the character and do nothing, it's no different then having a magic sword that gains powers suddenly when the character hits level 12, as opposed to that same sword being able to be drawn from its sheath by characters level 12 or higher. So, having it manifest at lower levels and able to do nothing is 'fluff'...it just paints an image. He still has to take the feat and meet the pre reqs at level 12 to turn it 'on'. Everyone knowing its coming is fluff, too...story, not mechanics. ====Aelryinth