ideas for the start of the next war...... [Archive] - Wizards Community

ideas for the start of the next war...... [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Talkkno
04-17-06, 03:04 PM Hi, I need help on coming out for some ideas how the next war might start, as I will be running a war campain soon, and I need some ideas how the next war may start and a good reason/excuse for all out war
Kreistor1
04-17-06, 03:40 PM There are, of course, many.

Karrnath could move to bring the Mror Holds back into line. Dwarves splti off without permission, didn't they? BUt that's weak, since it would leave Karrnath in a wretched underground fight, making them vulnerable to the other nations. Karrnath is actually in the worst position to start the war, but has the greatest claim and will want to move. They'd probably just move on Thrane. Undead don't like the Silver Flame holding them at bay from attacking eerywhere else, too, so though a poor idea, it would gain favour.

Thrane is trapped between two powers (Aundair and Karrnath) and is the easiest to take down if anyone gets working together. Aundair and Karrnath could decide to ally for a single attack on Thrane to split it in half between them. I can't see anyone allying with Breland to split the country up.

Aundair has a beef with Thrane for a bit of stolen property that they could use to justify another war.

Breland is in the best position to not be attacked. Brelish terrain is probably the most defensible of the Four, thanks tot hose mountains on its borders, and most of its industry well away from threat. I could see Breland moving to absorb Zilargo, though, should someone else move elsewhere.

The Talentans are happy, but the Valenar aren't. I could see some fighting over the border spread to pull in allies to another war, much as WW1 did.

Eldeen Reaches are happy and unlikely to unite to move East. West, maybe, if the threat is there.

Shadow Marches? Nope. Drooam, yes, but North into Eldeen Reaches, I would expect. I can't see the Hags being anything other than a force to try to open up the Demon Wastes. Major losses crossing the mountains, but not as much as if the force crossing was human.

Could see Breland moving on Darguun, with Zilargo. Darguun is a serious threat to all Galifar peoples, since the Hobs have no love for the races that stole their continent. That drives them to find allies in the Karrnathi, and so on.

The safest of all is probably the Lhazaar Principalities, but they're in the greatest danger from Sarlona. An initial Inspired incursion into the LP would be the hardest for the mainland to deal with, and make for a great close range base of ops. If any fighting began in Khorvaire, it would likely be Riedra that benefits most.

Q'barra is off the radar. Too small, not important enough to start the war.

Mournland and LoB? Maybe. I would think he'd love to see the flesh nations fighting each other, weakening each other, so that when the day comes, no one could stand up to his armies.

Can't see Aerenal getting involved.

Anyway, lots of excuses, lots of poor reasons. Whoever attacks is likely the one tht will lose.
aelryinth
04-17-06, 04:52 PM The one that gets the most nods on the boards is the other monarchs finding out Kaius III is Kaius I, vampire. Thrane will go to war promptly, and the Thronehold accords are now void, since Kaius, as a vampire, has no legal authority.

Where it goes from there is up to you. Aundair might attack to free Thaliost while Thrane is crusading, the Valenar will probably get paid off to harass Karrnath's eastern flank, Breland will either fortify or press into Karrnath to remove him from power (or negotiate him off the Throne, more likely) and its entirely likely Karrnath could end up in a civil war as the Warlords revolt and split sides.

I always pictured it that if Kaius were revealed as a vampire, he'd do a 'purge' of the Blood of Vol temples, and then escape into the Mournland, dragging as many undead troops with him as he could (also getting them out of Karrnath). From a relatively safe position, he could become a true shadow power, and probably exercise enough influence to end the reborn War and exert quite an influence over whoever next rules Karrnath. It's not like anyone is going to throw a huge army into the Mournland after him.

===Aelryinth
Renvale999
04-19-06, 09:31 AM In short, I think a good idea would be the Dragons of Argo moving to "further the prophecy" and starting a war with Valenar (instead of attacking Aernal directly, really freaking out the other nations, causing them to band together to fight off the onslaught. Could be a good way to restore the Throne of Galifar if one would be so inclined, being that all the nations are working together for once in a century.
Korhal_IV
04-21-06, 09:19 PM I think Aundair would be very interested in a New War. Unlike the other nations of Khorvaire, Aundair was quite drastically humiliated in the Last War. They lost nearly half their nation to the Eldeen Reaches, and significant cultural centers to Thrane (Thaliost most notably). The ruler of Aundair is also power-hungry, which helps.

The next most likely to be involved in the New War is Karrnath. While I don't hold that being a vampire makes Kaius ineligible for the monarchy (if your definition of "citizen" includes goblins, sphinxes, and trolls, then there's no case for keeping vampires out - really, the one thing they all have in common is that they're sentient beings, which vampires are), nor that being Kaius I disqualifies him from signing the Treaty of Thronehold (if Kaius I is alive, then Kaius III is not the legitimate ruler of Khorvaire, and depending on your definition of "alive", he is), I do think the revelation of his status as a blood-sucker is going to cause major upheaval, especially in Thrane. People hate the undead, and many will not believe Kaius I is the legitimate ruler of Karrnath. I do not think it is overly difficult to believe that Thrane will go to war with Karrnath, because while Jaela is very wise and guided by the Silver Flame, she is still a child, and warmongers within Thrane - many of them equally devout and wise - will convince her or outmaneuver her into bringing the nation to war. Throw in the misdirections of the Whispering Flame and it becomes almost too easy.

With Karrnath and Thrane at war, I think Aundair will jump right in to seize back Thaliost and other provinces. The conflagration will remain there, I think - Boranel does not desire war and nothing in this scenario particularly convinces him to go to war, especially not with Breland's current isolation from the other three nations. If Boranel dies, all bets are off. His successor might try to lead the nation to war to solidify his/her grip on power - either the democratic elements within parliament will overthrow the monarchy and go to war a la French Revolution, or his legal heir will take over, throw the dissidents in jail or execute them, and potentially use the war as a pretext for authoritarian suppression. Remember, though, that Breland is flanked by Droaam and Darguun, both of which are militaristically powerful nations. It may not be in Breland's best interests to go to war with anyone

The Eldeen Reaches are a wild card. Reading their description in the ECS, it mentions "hunters and warriors of the Silver Flame" battling evil magical creatures to make the Reaches safe for civilization, but no such mention of paladins of the Sovreign Host or any other religion, indicating that the Silver Flame has a special place in the Reaches' history. It also mentions that during the Last War, "Bandit lords sponsored by Karrnath...harried the farms" of the Eldeen Reaches, meaning that the Eldeen Reaches are fairly hostile to the Karrnathi, and that the people of the Eldeen Reaches were "angry at the Aundairian crown for abandoning them", meaning some hostile sentiment still lingers against Aundair.
So we can pretty much assume that if an Aundair-Karrnath axis forms against Thrane in the New War, the Eldeen Reaches will be rooting for Thrane. Whether they actually go to war or not is your call, but remember that druids really, really hate the undead.

For all intents and purposes, the Valenar are already at war with Karrnath. Neither the Talenta Plains, Q'Barra, or Zilargo have the inclination or infrastructure to go to war for any reason whatsoever short of a direct aggressive attack by another power.
The Lhesh Haruuc of Darguun is described as "ambitious" and "a cunning tactician". He is also aging, which means his hold on power may be slipping in a society that values individual strength. He may choose to enter the New War, but I doubt it will be against Breland (which is, so far, neutral), because "the King of Breland quickly made a deal with Haruuc" when the warlord emerged. So they have a state of peace or alliance going back thirty years, which is impressive. I think Haruuc would go to war against Valenar, perhaps, renewing the ancient goblin-elf war. This would earn him Kaius' gratitude for sure, and given elven reliance on stealth and surprise, might even result in the embarrassing deaths of some prominent rivals in their bedrolls at night.

That leaves us with the Mror Holds, Droaam, and the Mournlands. The Mror Holds have no love for Karrnath, but Eberron dwarves are proto-capitalists. I think they'd start cashing in on war profits via mercenary companies and Kundarak activities. With Karrnath suffering the disastrous attentions of Thrane and the Valenar, it certainly won't be in Karrnath's interests to start a fight, and I don't think the Mror dwarves have cause to go to war now that they've secured their independence and ancestral home.
Droaam's leaders are the hags, and their agendas are anybody's business. Officially they're still part of Breland, which could cause nasty issues, but they may seek to attack the Eldeen Reaches or Breland if they're interested in widening their power base - unlikely, given the crude grasp on power the hags currently possess. Attacking Breland results in a one-on-one with indifferent results, but if the hags of Droaam go to war with the Eldeen Reaches, that has profound political implications, making Aundair, Karrnath, and Darguun much more likely to support their recognition as an independent nation. With that much provocation, even Boranel might go to war in Droaam, if only to reclaim Breland's original territory. This will draw ire from Aundair and Karrnath, throwing the continent into a truly wild international melee.
Finally, there's the Mournlands. The only known power group there is the Lord of Blades, who might or might not emerge to kick ass if he thinks he can claim a sufficiently enticing prize. With new regiments of warforged marching about, he might attempt to disguise his soldiers as someone else's, or to claim a Cannith creation forge as his own. A New War will also cause the forts stationed around the Mournlands to reduce themselves down to a skeleton crew, meaning more and greater horrors can slip through. Eventually, enough intelligences might emerge to form an Empire of the Mourning, a truly frightening thought.

Under all of this, you need to figure out how to get your PCs involved. Are they unmasking Kaius? Or protecting him from traitorous elements attempting to do so? Will they figure out that that regiment of warforged are really biding their time until nightfall to slaughter the fleshies? Can they seize and smash the bridge over a chasm in the Byeshk Mountains before a legion of legendary monsters from Droaam cross and smash Greenheart? Will they be able to sink the Karrnathi Doom Barges before they can reach Thrane's eastern shore?

Etc., Etc. :)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Talkkno 04-17-06, 03:04 PM	Hi, I need help on coming out for some ideas how the next war might start, as I will be running a war campain soon, and I need some ideas how the next war may start and a good reason/excuse for all out war
Kreistor1 04-17-06, 03:40 PM	There are, of course, many. Karrnath could move to bring the Mror Holds back into line. Dwarves splti off without permission, didn't they? BUt that's weak, since it would leave Karrnath in a wretched underground fight, making them vulnerable to the other nations. Karrnath is actually in the worst position to start the war, but has the greatest claim and will want to move. They'd probably just move on Thrane. Undead don't like the Silver Flame holding them at bay from attacking eerywhere else, too, so though a poor idea, it would gain favour. Thrane is trapped between two powers (Aundair and Karrnath) and is the easiest to take down if anyone gets working together. Aundair and Karrnath could decide to ally for a single attack on Thrane to split it in half between them. I can't see anyone allying with Breland to split the country up. Aundair has a beef with Thrane for a bit of stolen property that they could use to justify another war. Breland is in the best position to not be attacked. Brelish terrain is probably the most defensible of the Four, thanks tot hose mountains on its borders, and most of its industry well away from threat. I could see Breland moving to absorb Zilargo, though, should someone else move elsewhere. The Talentans are happy, but the Valenar aren't. I could see some fighting over the border spread to pull in allies to another war, much as WW1 did. Eldeen Reaches are happy and unlikely to unite to move East. West, maybe, if the threat is there. Shadow Marches? Nope. Drooam, yes, but North into Eldeen Reaches, I would expect. I can't see the Hags being anything other than a force to try to open up the Demon Wastes. Major losses crossing the mountains, but not as much as if the force crossing was human. Could see Breland moving on Darguun, with Zilargo. Darguun is a serious threat to all Galifar peoples, since the Hobs have no love for the races that stole their continent. That drives them to find allies in the Karrnathi, and so on. The safest of all is probably the Lhazaar Principalities, but they're in the greatest danger from Sarlona. An initial Inspired incursion into the LP would be the hardest for the mainland to deal with, and make for a great close range base of ops. If any fighting began in Khorvaire, it would likely be Riedra that benefits most. Q'barra is off the radar. Too small, not important enough to start the war. Mournland and LoB? Maybe. I would think he'd love to see the flesh nations fighting each other, weakening each other, so that when the day comes, no one could stand up to his armies. Can't see Aerenal getting involved. Anyway, lots of excuses, lots of poor reasons. Whoever attacks is likely the one tht will lose.
aelryinth 04-17-06, 04:52 PM	The one that gets the most nods on the boards is the other monarchs finding out Kaius III is Kaius I, vampire. Thrane will go to war promptly, and the Thronehold accords are now void, since Kaius, as a vampire, has no legal authority. Where it goes from there is up to you. Aundair might attack to free Thaliost while Thrane is crusading, the Valenar will probably get paid off to harass Karrnath's eastern flank, Breland will either fortify or press into Karrnath to remove him from power (or negotiate him off the Throne, more likely) and its entirely likely Karrnath could end up in a civil war as the Warlords revolt and split sides. I always pictured it that if Kaius were revealed as a vampire, he'd do a 'purge' of the Blood of Vol temples, and then escape into the Mournland, dragging as many undead troops with him as he could (also getting them out of Karrnath). From a relatively safe position, he could become a true shadow power, and probably exercise enough influence to end the reborn War and exert quite an influence over whoever next rules Karrnath. It's not like anyone is going to throw a huge army into the Mournland after him. ===Aelryinth
Renvale999 04-19-06, 09:31 AM	In short, I think a good idea would be the Dragons of Argo moving to "further the prophecy" and starting a war with Valenar (instead of attacking Aernal directly, really freaking out the other nations, causing them to band together to fight off the onslaught. Could be a good way to restore the Throne of Galifar if one would be so inclined, being that all the nations are working together for once in a century.
Korhal_IV 04-21-06, 09:19 PM	I think Aundair would be very interested in a New War. Unlike the other nations of Khorvaire, Aundair was quite drastically humiliated in the Last War. They lost nearly half their nation to the Eldeen Reaches, and significant cultural centers to Thrane (Thaliost most notably). The ruler of Aundair is also power-hungry, which helps. The next most likely to be involved in the New War is Karrnath. While I don't hold that being a vampire makes Kaius ineligible for the monarchy (if your definition of "citizen" includes goblins, sphinxes, and trolls, then there's no case for keeping vampires out - really, the one thing they all have in common is that they're sentient beings, which vampires are), nor that being Kaius I disqualifies him from signing the Treaty of Thronehold (if Kaius I is alive, then Kaius III is not the legitimate ruler of Khorvaire, and depending on your definition of "alive", he is), I do think the revelation of his status as a blood-sucker is going to cause major upheaval, especially in Thrane. People hate the undead, and many will not believe Kaius I is the legitimate ruler of Karrnath. I do not think it is overly difficult to believe that Thrane will go to war with Karrnath, because while Jaela is very wise and guided by the Silver Flame, she is still a child, and warmongers within Thrane - many of them equally devout and wise - will convince her or outmaneuver her into bringing the nation to war. Throw in the misdirections of the Whispering Flame and it becomes almost too easy. With Karrnath and Thrane at war, I think Aundair will jump right in to seize back Thaliost and other provinces. The conflagration will remain there, I think - Boranel does not desire war and nothing in this scenario particularly convinces him to go to war, especially not with Breland's current isolation from the other three nations. If Boranel dies, all bets are off. His successor might try to lead the nation to war to solidify his/her grip on power - either the democratic elements within parliament will overthrow the monarchy and go to war a la French Revolution, or his legal heir will take over, throw the dissidents in jail or execute them, and potentially use the war as a pretext for authoritarian suppression. Remember, though, that Breland is flanked by Droaam and Darguun, both of which are militaristically powerful nations. It may not be in Breland's best interests to go to war with anyone The Eldeen Reaches are a wild card. Reading their description in the ECS, it mentions "hunters and warriors of the Silver Flame" battling evil magical creatures to make the Reaches safe for civilization, but no such mention of paladins of the Sovreign Host or any other religion, indicating that the Silver Flame has a special place in the Reaches' history. It also mentions that during the Last War, "Bandit lords sponsored by Karrnath...harried the farms" of the Eldeen Reaches, meaning that the Eldeen Reaches are fairly hostile to the Karrnathi, and that the people of the Eldeen Reaches were "angry at the Aundairian crown for abandoning them", meaning some hostile sentiment still lingers against Aundair. So we can pretty much assume that if an Aundair-Karrnath axis forms against Thrane in the New War, the Eldeen Reaches will be rooting for Thrane. Whether they actually go to war or not is your call, but remember that druids really, really hate the undead. For all intents and purposes, the Valenar are already at war with Karrnath. Neither the Talenta Plains, Q'Barra, or Zilargo have the inclination or infrastructure to go to war for any reason whatsoever short of a direct aggressive attack by another power. The Lhesh Haruuc of Darguun is described as "ambitious" and "a cunning tactician". He is also aging, which means his hold on power may be slipping in a society that values individual strength. He may choose to enter the New War, but I doubt it will be against Breland (which is, so far, neutral), because "the King of Breland quickly made a deal with Haruuc" when the warlord emerged. So they have a state of peace or alliance going back thirty years, which is impressive. I think Haruuc would go to war against Valenar, perhaps, renewing the ancient goblin-elf war. This would earn him Kaius' gratitude for sure, and given elven reliance on stealth and surprise, might even result in the embarrassing deaths of some prominent rivals in their bedrolls at night. That leaves us with the Mror Holds, Droaam, and the Mournlands. The Mror Holds have no love for Karrnath, but Eberron dwarves are proto-capitalists. I think they'd start cashing in on war profits via mercenary companies and Kundarak activities. With Karrnath suffering the disastrous attentions of Thrane and the Valenar, it certainly won't be in Karrnath's interests to start a fight, and I don't think the Mror dwarves have cause to go to war now that they've secured their independence and ancestral home. Droaam's leaders are the hags, and their agendas are anybody's business. Officially they're still part of Breland, which could cause nasty issues, but they may seek to attack the Eldeen Reaches or Breland if they're interested in widening their power base - unlikely, given the crude grasp on power the hags currently possess. Attacking Breland results in a one-on-one with indifferent results, but if the hags of Droaam go to war with the Eldeen Reaches, that has profound political implications, making Aundair, Karrnath, and Darguun much more likely to support their recognition as an independent nation. With that much provocation, even Boranel might go to war in Droaam, if only to reclaim Breland's original territory. This will draw ire from Aundair and Karrnath, throwing the continent into a truly wild international melee. Finally, there's the Mournlands. The only known power group there is the Lord of Blades, who might or might not emerge to kick ass if he thinks he can claim a sufficiently enticing prize. With new regiments of warforged marching about, he might attempt to disguise his soldiers as someone else's, or to claim a Cannith creation forge as his own. A New War will also cause the forts stationed around the Mournlands to reduce themselves down to a skeleton crew, meaning more and greater horrors can slip through. Eventually, enough intelligences might emerge to form an Empire of the Mourning, a truly frightening thought. Under all of this, you need to figure out how to get your PCs involved. Are they unmasking Kaius? Or protecting him from traitorous elements attempting to do so? Will they figure out that that regiment of warforged are really biding their time until nightfall to slaughter the fleshies? Can they seize and smash the bridge over a chasm in the Byeshk Mountains before a legion of legendary monsters from Droaam cross and smash Greenheart? Will they be able to sink the Karrnathi Doom Barges before they can reach Thrane's eastern shore? Etc., Etc. :)