Lyrandar Airship Questions [Archive] - Wizards Community

Lyrandar Airship Questions [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Horathgar
04-24-05, 01:25 PM On of my friends is running a Lyrandar airship captain, I'm thinking Han Solo type character that got a loan or maybe won it. But i'm thinking a Loan from the family, that has been turned over to the Dwarven Banks, consequently passed down to brute thuggish types to coerce the money out of him fasterlike.

Now, The REAL Issue is the fact that there aren't any real useful gameplay type info on the Lyrandar airships, and i don't have alot of info on ships and naval type things for D&D. I can't even think of much 3 or 3.5 that has much info on it all. Arg. Any advice on how to work this?

Rath
Monk_of_Fallen_Star
04-24-05, 02:26 PM You say an awful lot here, but what exactly is the nature of your question? How an airship works or.. what prescisely?
Isran_Imrador
04-24-05, 02:45 PM the pilot and the elemental make opposed CHA checks....the PC wins he can guide the ship! Read Marked for Death :)
Xaxor
04-24-05, 03:42 PM Well there is always the Arms and Equipment Guide from 3.0, it had all sorts of vehicles. I haven't had the chance to read that section, but it might have just what you're looking for.
Horathgar
04-25-05, 08:59 AM I'm wanting to know approximations of how to control it.
Size
Crew Size
Turn radii
Basic Mechanics of the Binding of the Elemental, IE how large is the Dragonshard to bind it to the ship.

Theres alot of small details I can just FUDGE here. However, I wanted to get some insightful input on these details. The explorers handbook will clear it all up in about 3-4 months i'm sure. I'm not wanting to wait that long for specifics. So i'll just make some up, and or base it on a regular boat, but alter crew sizes and capacities. Any input would be helpful.

Rath
Isran_Imrador
04-25-05, 09:25 AM IE how large is the Dragonshard to bind it to the ship.

i dont think it needs to be large, just very pure if its small....
MarkB
04-25-05, 10:18 AM A few things to think about:

There's no rigging, and we don't know if bound elementals require much wrangling, so you're probably not looking at the massive crews of traditional Elizabethan-style galleons. Maybe 20-30 crewmembers would be more than enough.

On the other hand, only a person with a Lesser Dragonmark of Storm and the Wind's Favour ability can pilot an elemental airship absolutely reliably - and they can't do it all the time. That means you'd need, ideally, at least 3-4 such marked Lyrandar heirs as helmsmen, and since their marks give them seniority in House heirarchy, they might as well be your officers too.

In my airship-based game, a Lyrandar airship is commanded by a captain and five lieutenants. A lieutenant must have at least the Least Dragonmark of Storm, and is considered junior-grade until they develop their Lesser mark. A captain must have at least the Lesser Mark, and many have the Greater Mark. The rest of the crew consists of midshipmen, ensigns and able-skymen, not all of whom need to be dragonmarked or even Lyrandar family members. I added a special rank - Midship Chief - for non-dragonmarked crewmembers who achieve sufficient seniority to take on major posts aboard ship. A Midship Chief is considered equivalent in rank to a lieutenant of similar seniority, except that they are not in the line of command - only a dragonmarked Lyrandar Heir can command a Lyrandar Airship. In my game, the Chief Engineer and Chief Weapons Officer are both Midship Chiefs, and neither are half-elves.

My visualisation of an elemental 'engine' is a large (about 6 inches wide by 12 inches tall) cylindrical Khyber shard, surrounded by concentric rings of much smaller Khyber, Eberron and Siberys shards in a complex metallic framework, around a meter wide in all. A filigree of metallic connections like interwoven vines or roots run from this engine through joists and gantries to both the elemental ring and the Wheel of Wind and Water, and when the airship is underway, these connections are illuminated by motes of golden light racing up and down them.

None of this is particularly canonical, but hopefully it'll be useful food for thought.
Horathgar
04-25-05, 12:53 PM Oh yeah, Very useful. I don't think he's going to be that analytical with the ranks, but the general rules of the sea still apply, IE, do what the captain says.

But other than that, Your post was helpful, thank you.

I'm also thinking that no rigging and no Birdsnest/Lookout, because no Mainmast. ....However you are a flying vessel...soooo really do you need one?

Rath
MarkB
04-25-05, 01:14 PM I'm also thinking that no rigging and no Birdsnest/Lookout, because no Mainmast. ....However you are a flying vessel...soooo really do you need one?
Not really. But as a flying vessel, your really major blind spot is directly beneath you. I believe the green hemisphere in the base of the Elemental airship (http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/eb_gallery/82108.jpg) pictured in the ECS is commonly considered to be an observation dome.
darkthought
04-25-05, 04:28 PM Not really. But as a flying vessel, your really major blind spot is directly beneath you. I believe the green hemisphere in the base of the Elemental airship (http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/eb_gallery/82108.jpg) pictured in the ECS is commonly considered to be an observation dome.

Yeah, that would make sense. Of course you wouldn't want to be down there when someone starts shooting large missles, ala catapult stones and ballistas at your ship... not to mention magical forms of attack.

You know, if you're a really good pilot and have a fire-elemental airship, you'd be the deadliest thing against ground troops. Just fly the ship a few feet off the ground, really fast, and fry the knights on thier horses.
Horathgar
04-26-05, 03:49 PM How about hiring a Ranger with a Pegasus mount to be your scout?

Or wands made by a artificier that makes wands of fireball or lightning for cannon like defense.

Or you've got Homonculii that don't wear out or whatever, and even if they do they can swap out.

There are a few ways to get around the blind spots i'm thinking. Yes i think that green observation dome is a nice idea.
darkthought
04-26-05, 04:07 PM How about hiring a Ranger with a Pegasus mount to be your scout?

Or wands made by a artificier that makes wands of fireball or lightning for cannon like defense.

Or you've got Homonculii that don't wear out or whatever, and even if they do they can swap out.

There are a few ways to get around the blind spots i'm thinking. Yes i think that green observation dome is a nice idea.

There's also flying carpets and the Broom of Flying. And anybody with a high enough ride and handle animal to be able to deal with hippogriffs, griffons, dire bats, etc. An Eternal Wand of Flying could be helpful too, just have the CL of it be a few higher to stay aloft. I'd think that the Houses are experimenting with parts of the hull that could open up and allow flight-capable people/critters to kinda leap out and into the air, then land on the top deck.
Ravenscroft
04-26-05, 09:33 PM Dont know if anyone else mentioned this , but there are deck plans for an airship in "Whispers of the Vampire's Blade".

While its probably not cool to promote other companies , you might like to look at "Airships" from Bastion Press
http://www.bastionpress.com/Products/airships.htm

The bound Fire Elemental does seem to do a lot of damage (at least in 'Marked for Death').Fire damage from even an 'Elder Fire Elemental' adds only 2d8. Even if the target fails a reflex save and burns for 1d4 rounds still doesnt do as much damage as an average fireball i would think.

a 'Wheel of Wind and Water' (page 263 , ECS) allows control of an airship/galleon w/o making opposed Cha checks for House Lyrandar DrM Heirs.
Page 267 in ECS allows for the use of 'Charm Monster' or similar spell to do the same thing.

Also no reason your airship cant have a Crystal Ball on a fixed mount to scry with (or more than one).Clairvoyant Flying Goggles could also be used.

Since we have a large number of magical beasts available , i can see Giant Eagles or possibly some of the smaller intelligent raptor types being hired as crew/scouts on airships.

Hope this is of some help
Graham.
Ravenscroft
04-26-05, 09:40 PM http://p.webring.com/hub?ring=zeppring

Ring Hub for stuff on real world rigid airships , while not an Eberron airship , you may find some deckplans and real world figures on speed and maneuverability.
EagleVT94
05-01-05, 09:33 AM I used this description of a Lyrander Airship getting ready for departure from Wroat in my Eberron campaign (www.plothook.net/RPG)...sorta similar to MarkB with differing levels of House Lyrander ranks...the scene unfolds as a couple player characters are escorting a piece of valuable cargo onto the lower level...

"Another House Lyrander dragonmarked individual was walking back towards the safety of the tower. He waves his hand in a signal to others unseen. The two massive panels slowly begin to drop and a roar like you've never heard rushes across the dock, as well as a blast of heat and wind. You can now see the airship is not resting on the panels, but that they were essentially blast deflectors for the crew loading supplies and luggage in the belly of the ship, while above, the passengers were sheltered as they entered the craft in peace and quiet.

The head of the ground crew that helped with the crates signals the dragonmark dock chief. He sees the crates and nods in understanding, somehow sending another signal to the ship. A door lowers in the belly, even as the ship rocks and vibrates in its moorings.

"Let's go! The ship is getting ready to depart!" Everyone is yelling over the roar. The panels are now fully recessed. You can see at the front and rear of the ship the results of pure fire elemental power as they race around the bow and sterns circumference generating power to depart. The air is hot and races by you in powerful bursts. Everyone leans into their work to maintain balance against the blasts of hot air.

The ground crew members lower goggles over their eyes and raise the scarves about their necks to shield their face. You are forced to shield your eyes with a free hand. Somehow the elder, silvery haired dragonmark seems impervious to the chaos, standing calm and observant, with barely a hair out of place as he maintains order. Another man jumps out of the belly of the airship to assist, “Get inside, we’ll take it from here!” he yells loud and slow so you understand. The wind is now deafening, and the heat becoming unbearable."

~ DM Sphinx
The Fireballed Mage
05-01-05, 12:33 PM As was mentioned, no need for a crow's nest since there are no sails to block the view.

However that green observation dome from the ECS airship is probably for viewing in the ship's blind spot, below... I'm going to start calling it the rat's nest.
Horathgar
05-02-05, 09:05 AM It makes good sense about the observation dome. deck plan has been made. The only rules that really are left open to confuse are the ability to control them. I know the ECS states something about the wheel of water/fire/ blah, to be able to control the elemental without opposed charisma checks. But what about those who do not have the Lyrandar mark of storm?

I'm thinking a Huge negative is conferred. but i'm sure i'll find out more specifics in the Explorers handbook, Can't wait for that.

Rath
Ravenscroft
05-02-05, 09:12 AM Page 267 in ECS allows for the use of 'Charm Monster' or similar spell to control the elemental
treehouse916
05-02-05, 12:51 PM One of the forum members at dundjinni.com did an awesome comprehensive map of a Lyrandar airship. It's actually what caused me to buy the Eberron book in the first place (and later, the dundjinni software as well).

You can find it here. (http://www.dundjinni.com/forums/forum_posts.asp?TID=1350&PN=23)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Horathgar 04-24-05, 01:25 PM	On of my friends is running a Lyrandar airship captain, I'm thinking Han Solo type character that got a loan or maybe won it. But i'm thinking a Loan from the family, that has been turned over to the Dwarven Banks, consequently passed down to brute thuggish types to coerce the money out of him fasterlike. Now, The REAL Issue is the fact that there aren't any real useful gameplay type info on the Lyrandar airships, and i don't have alot of info on ships and naval type things for D&D. I can't even think of much 3 or 3.5 that has much info on it all. Arg. Any advice on how to work this? Rath
Monk_of_Fallen_Star 04-24-05, 02:26 PM	You say an awful lot here, but what exactly is the nature of your question? How an airship works or.. what prescisely?
Isran_Imrador 04-24-05, 02:45 PM	the pilot and the elemental make opposed CHA checks....the PC wins he can guide the ship! Read Marked for Death :)
Xaxor 04-24-05, 03:42 PM	Well there is always the Arms and Equipment Guide from 3.0, it had all sorts of vehicles. I haven't had the chance to read that section, but it might have just what you're looking for.
Horathgar 04-25-05, 08:59 AM	I'm wanting to know approximations of how to control it. Size Crew Size Turn radii Basic Mechanics of the Binding of the Elemental, IE how large is the Dragonshard to bind it to the ship. Theres alot of small details I can just FUDGE here. However, I wanted to get some insightful input on these details. The explorers handbook will clear it all up in about 3-4 months i'm sure. I'm not wanting to wait that long for specifics. So i'll just make some up, and or base it on a regular boat, but alter crew sizes and capacities. Any input would be helpful. Rath
Isran_Imrador 04-25-05, 09:25 AM	IE how large is the Dragonshard to bind it to the ship. i dont think it needs to be large, just very pure if its small....
MarkB 04-25-05, 10:18 AM	A few things to think about: There's no rigging, and we don't know if bound elementals require much wrangling, so you're probably not looking at the massive crews of traditional Elizabethan-style galleons. Maybe 20-30 crewmembers would be more than enough. On the other hand, only a person with a Lesser Dragonmark of Storm and the Wind's Favour ability can pilot an elemental airship absolutely reliably - and they can't do it all the time. That means you'd need, ideally, at least 3-4 such marked Lyrandar heirs as helmsmen, and since their marks give them seniority in House heirarchy, they might as well be your officers too. In my airship-based game, a Lyrandar airship is commanded by a captain and five lieutenants. A lieutenant must have at least the Least Dragonmark of Storm, and is considered junior-grade until they develop their Lesser mark. A captain must have at least the Lesser Mark, and many have the Greater Mark. The rest of the crew consists of midshipmen, ensigns and able-skymen, not all of whom need to be dragonmarked or even Lyrandar family members. I added a special rank - Midship Chief - for non-dragonmarked crewmembers who achieve sufficient seniority to take on major posts aboard ship. A Midship Chief is considered equivalent in rank to a lieutenant of similar seniority, except that they are not in the line of command - only a dragonmarked Lyrandar Heir can command a Lyrandar Airship. In my game, the Chief Engineer and Chief Weapons Officer are both Midship Chiefs, and neither are half-elves. My visualisation of an elemental 'engine' is a large (about 6 inches wide by 12 inches tall) cylindrical Khyber shard, surrounded by concentric rings of much smaller Khyber, Eberron and Siberys shards in a complex metallic framework, around a meter wide in all. A filigree of metallic connections like interwoven vines or roots run from this engine through joists and gantries to both the elemental ring and the Wheel of Wind and Water, and when the airship is underway, these connections are illuminated by motes of golden light racing up and down them. None of this is particularly canonical, but hopefully it'll be useful food for thought.
Horathgar 04-25-05, 12:53 PM	Oh yeah, Very useful. I don't think he's going to be that analytical with the ranks, but the general rules of the sea still apply, IE, do what the captain says. But other than that, Your post was helpful, thank you. I'm also thinking that no rigging and no Birdsnest/Lookout, because no Mainmast. ....However you are a flying vessel...soooo really do you need one? Rath
MarkB 04-25-05, 01:14 PM	I'm also thinking that no rigging and no Birdsnest/Lookout, because no Mainmast. ....However you are a flying vessel...soooo really do you need one? Not really. But as a flying vessel, your really major blind spot is directly beneath you. I believe the green hemisphere in the base of the Elemental airship (http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/eb_gallery/82108.jpg) pictured in the ECS is commonly considered to be an observation dome.
darkthought 04-25-05, 04:28 PM	Not really. But as a flying vessel, your really major blind spot is directly beneath you. I believe the green hemisphere in the base of the Elemental airship (http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/eb_gallery/82108.jpg) pictured in the ECS is commonly considered to be an observation dome. Yeah, that would make sense. Of course you wouldn't want to be down there when someone starts shooting large missles, ala catapult stones and ballistas at your ship... not to mention magical forms of attack. You know, if you're a really good pilot and have a fire-elemental airship, you'd be the deadliest thing against ground troops. Just fly the ship a few feet off the ground, really fast, and fry the knights on thier horses.
Horathgar 04-26-05, 03:49 PM	How about hiring a Ranger with a Pegasus mount to be your scout? Or wands made by a artificier that makes wands of fireball or lightning for cannon like defense. Or you've got Homonculii that don't wear out or whatever, and even if they do they can swap out. There are a few ways to get around the blind spots i'm thinking. Yes i think that green observation dome is a nice idea.
darkthought 04-26-05, 04:07 PM	How about hiring a Ranger with a Pegasus mount to be your scout? Or wands made by a artificier that makes wands of fireball or lightning for cannon like defense. Or you've got Homonculii that don't wear out or whatever, and even if they do they can swap out. There are a few ways to get around the blind spots i'm thinking. Yes i think that green observation dome is a nice idea. There's also flying carpets and the Broom of Flying. And anybody with a high enough ride and handle animal to be able to deal with hippogriffs, griffons, dire bats, etc. An Eternal Wand of Flying could be helpful too, just have the CL of it be a few higher to stay aloft. I'd think that the Houses are experimenting with parts of the hull that could open up and allow flight-capable people/critters to kinda leap out and into the air, then land on the top deck.
Ravenscroft 04-26-05, 09:33 PM	Dont know if anyone else mentioned this , but there are deck plans for an airship in "Whispers of the Vampire's Blade". While its probably not cool to promote other companies , you might like to look at "Airships" from Bastion Press http://www.bastionpress.com/Products/airships.htm The bound Fire Elemental does seem to do a lot of damage (at least in 'Marked for Death').Fire damage from even an 'Elder Fire Elemental' adds only 2d8. Even if the target fails a reflex save and burns for 1d4 rounds still doesnt do as much damage as an average fireball i would think. a 'Wheel of Wind and Water' (page 263 , ECS) allows control of an airship/galleon w/o making opposed Cha checks for House Lyrandar DrM Heirs. Page 267 in ECS allows for the use of 'Charm Monster' or similar spell to do the same thing. Also no reason your airship cant have a Crystal Ball on a fixed mount to scry with (or more than one).Clairvoyant Flying Goggles could also be used. Since we have a large number of magical beasts available , i can see Giant Eagles or possibly some of the smaller intelligent raptor types being hired as crew/scouts on airships. Hope this is of some help Graham.
Ravenscroft 04-26-05, 09:40 PM	http://p.webring.com/hub?ring=zeppring Ring Hub for stuff on real world rigid airships , while not an Eberron airship , you may find some deckplans and real world figures on speed and maneuverability.
EagleVT94 05-01-05, 09:33 AM	I used this description of a Lyrander Airship getting ready for departure from Wroat in my Eberron campaign (www.plothook.net/RPG)...sorta similar to MarkB with differing levels of House Lyrander ranks...the scene unfolds as a couple player characters are escorting a piece of valuable cargo onto the lower level... "Another House Lyrander dragonmarked individual was walking back towards the safety of the tower. He waves his hand in a signal to others unseen. The two massive panels slowly begin to drop and a roar like you've never heard rushes across the dock, as well as a blast of heat and wind. You can now see the airship is not resting on the panels, but that they were essentially blast deflectors for the crew loading supplies and luggage in the belly of the ship, while above, the passengers were sheltered as they entered the craft in peace and quiet. The head of the ground crew that helped with the crates signals the dragonmark dock chief. He sees the crates and nods in understanding, somehow sending another signal to the ship. A door lowers in the belly, even as the ship rocks and vibrates in its moorings. "Let's go! The ship is getting ready to depart!" Everyone is yelling over the roar. The panels are now fully recessed. You can see at the front and rear of the ship the results of pure fire elemental power as they race around the bow and sterns circumference generating power to depart. The air is hot and races by you in powerful bursts. Everyone leans into their work to maintain balance against the blasts of hot air. The ground crew members lower goggles over their eyes and raise the scarves about their necks to shield their face. You are forced to shield your eyes with a free hand. Somehow the elder, silvery haired dragonmark seems impervious to the chaos, standing calm and observant, with barely a hair out of place as he maintains order. Another man jumps out of the belly of the airship to assist, “Get inside, we’ll take it from here!” he yells loud and slow so you understand. The wind is now deafening, and the heat becoming unbearable." ~ DM Sphinx
The Fireballed Mage 05-01-05, 12:33 PM	As was mentioned, no need for a crow's nest since there are no sails to block the view. However that green observation dome from the ECS airship is probably for viewing in the ship's blind spot, below... I'm going to start calling it the rat's nest.
Horathgar 05-02-05, 09:05 AM	It makes good sense about the observation dome. deck plan has been made. The only rules that really are left open to confuse are the ability to control them. I know the ECS states something about the wheel of water/fire/ blah, to be able to control the elemental without opposed charisma checks. But what about those who do not have the Lyrandar mark of storm? I'm thinking a Huge negative is conferred. but i'm sure i'll find out more specifics in the Explorers handbook, Can't wait for that. Rath
Ravenscroft 05-02-05, 09:12 AM	Page 267 in ECS allows for the use of 'Charm Monster' or similar spell to control the elemental
treehouse916 05-02-05, 12:51 PM	One of the forum members at dundjinni.com did an awesome comprehensive map of a Lyrandar airship. It's actually what caused me to buy the Eberron book in the first place (and later, the dundjinni software as well). You can find it here. (http://www.dundjinni.com/forums/forum_posts.asp?TID=1350&PN=23)