Metamagic Wands [Archive] - Wizards Community

Metamagic Wands [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
swarthmore
11-15-04, 07:00 AM Can Artificers create a Metamagic Wand?
I know I can use a wand and do so in conjunction with, say Maximize. In that way I have used more charges but that one use does max damage. What if I made a wand for a fellow party member who does not have Item Creation Feats or Metamagic Feats? Can he use a wand that I have infused with Maximize and always get max damage out of it?
ChronosCrow
11-15-04, 07:52 AM I beleive so, but you need to look at the technicalites. I don't wish to look them up myself right now. I know it will have to deal with the wand being more expensive. To figure that out a maximized spell usually counts as 2 spell slots higher so you have to take that into account when making a wand. So most of the time you won't be able to make maximized wands of your highest spell since you can't cast that.

Then again I'm not looking at any books right now so I could be off base.
Lujayne34
11-15-04, 09:12 AM Can Artificers create a Metamagic Wand?
I know I can use a wand and do so in conjunction with, say Maximize. In that way I have used more charges but that one use does max damage. What if I made a wand for a fellow party member who does not have Item Creation Feats or Metamagic Feats? Can he use a wand that I have infused with Maximize and always get max damage out of it?

I do not believe that that is possible. The magic item is simply that: "a spell imbedded in an item with enough power to cast it a certain number of times"

A feat is an ability "unique" to an individual that allow thems to do something they normally could not do or enhances an ability they already have (ie: casters using metamagic feats). A person can take that magic item and empower it themselves by using whatever metamagic feat they have. However, I don't think feats can be made permanent in an item.
Radiating Gnome
11-15-04, 11:08 AM It's possible that I'm missing something that's specific to Artificers in Eberron . . .

But I'm not clear about what you mean by a "Metamagic Wand". It sounds like you're trying to recreate the metamatic Rods without having to take the Rod feat.

Unless what you're talking about is a want of a spell that uses a specific metamagic feat in it's preparation. And that, I believe, should be possible, as long as you have access to the feat (and as an artificer, since you don't cast the spells, only infusions, and you need to make an UMD check to create a wand of a certain spell, I'm not sure how that would work). But the wand is created at the final level of the spell, and the final caster level. This may mean that some metamagic wands are not possible.

For example, you were referring to Maximize spell. A want can only hold up to 4th level spells, and Maximize adds three to the spells level, so only first level spells could be put in a wand.

That would also mean that the caster level (Caster level 7, which is the level required to cast 4th level spells like a Maximized Burning Hands) would make this a pretty ex*****ive want to make. (CL 7 x SL 4 x 750 = 21000 base price, 10500 in supplies, 840 xp) which would not be all that cost effective for a spell that will max out at 20 points of fire damage. The good news is that the save DF against the spell would be higher (rather than DC 11, it would be DC 16).

However, other metamagic feats, like energy substitution, that don't add to the caster level of the spell, might make good choices. A wand of Burning Hands (Energy Substitution - cold) created at caster level 5 (to take advantage of the best damage the spell can do) would be only (CL 5 x SL 1 x 750 = 3750 base price, 1875 in supplies and 150 xp).

-rg
Pinky's brain
11-15-04, 11:36 AM Maximize does not give you heighten for free (that would be nice, who needs heighten then ... just stack on other metamagic feats instead). So the save DC is unaffected.
Radiating Gnome
11-15-04, 12:00 PM ACK! My mistake. You're right, of course. That's what I get for not looking it up first before I spouted off.

That makes the idea of the maximized wand that much less useful, then.

-rg
swarthmore
11-15-04, 04:48 PM So, it looks like in the grand scheme of things, the Artificer is better off filling Feat Slots with something other than metamagic. Other threads on this forum have pointed to the Artificer as a magic item based character and not a significant spontanieous castor/infusor (except for Repair Damage infusions). That being said, I invision my character from 1st - 6th level moping around uslessly on the side of the "action" and just trying to not get killed. From 6th to 10th or 12th I'll be a gadjet maker and the one party member who can do it all (Heal, fight, buff, etc). After level 12 or so, though, I'll be a very powerfull party member. Capable of dealing out lots of damage in strange and wonderful ways; capable of buffing (or creating items that buff) fellow members in ways that are necessary, and not just secondary; capable of healing or fixing as well as any priest; and having a wide range of specific use items that gets us out of trouble when we need it or into trouble when we want it.
Sound about right?

One possible excetion to the above is becomming a wand specialist. Not being woried about additional expenditures of charges and metamagicing every shot. Sure I'll be depleeting wands left and right, but then I just make new ones, lots of them, and forgo the jack-of-all-trades lifestyle.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
swarthmore 11-15-04, 07:00 AM	Can Artificers create a Metamagic Wand? I know I can use a wand and do so in conjunction with, say Maximize. In that way I have used more charges but that one use does max damage. What if I made a wand for a fellow party member who does not have Item Creation Feats or Metamagic Feats? Can he use a wand that I have infused with Maximize and always get max damage out of it?
ChronosCrow 11-15-04, 07:52 AM	I beleive so, but you need to look at the technicalites. I don't wish to look them up myself right now. I know it will have to deal with the wand being more expensive. To figure that out a maximized spell usually counts as 2 spell slots higher so you have to take that into account when making a wand. So most of the time you won't be able to make maximized wands of your highest spell since you can't cast that. Then again I'm not looking at any books right now so I could be off base.
Lujayne34 11-15-04, 09:12 AM	Can Artificers create a Metamagic Wand? I know I can use a wand and do so in conjunction with, say Maximize. In that way I have used more charges but that one use does max damage. What if I made a wand for a fellow party member who does not have Item Creation Feats or Metamagic Feats? Can he use a wand that I have infused with Maximize and always get max damage out of it? I do not believe that that is possible. The magic item is simply that: "a spell imbedded in an item with enough power to cast it a certain number of times" A feat is an ability "unique" to an individual that allow thems to do something they normally could not do or enhances an ability they already have (ie: casters using metamagic feats). A person can take that magic item and empower it themselves by using whatever metamagic feat they have. However, I don't think feats can be made permanent in an item.
Radiating Gnome 11-15-04, 11:08 AM	It's possible that I'm missing something that's specific to Artificers in Eberron . . . But I'm not clear about what you mean by a "Metamagic Wand". It sounds like you're trying to recreate the metamatic Rods without having to take the Rod feat. Unless what you're talking about is a want of a spell that uses a specific metamagic feat in it's preparation. And that, I believe, should be possible, as long as you have access to the feat (and as an artificer, since you don't cast the spells, only infusions, and you need to make an UMD check to create a wand of a certain spell, I'm not sure how that would work). But the wand is created at the final level of the spell, and the final caster level. This may mean that some metamagic wands are not possible. For example, you were referring to Maximize spell. A want can only hold up to 4th level spells, and Maximize adds three to the spells level, so only first level spells could be put in a wand. That would also mean that the caster level (Caster level 7, which is the level required to cast 4th level spells like a Maximized Burning Hands) would make this a pretty ex*****ive want to make. (CL 7 x SL 4 x 750 = 21000 base price, 10500 in supplies, 840 xp) which would not be all that cost effective for a spell that will max out at 20 points of fire damage. The good news is that the save DF against the spell would be higher (rather than DC 11, it would be DC 16). However, other metamagic feats, like energy substitution, that don't add to the caster level of the spell, might make good choices. A wand of Burning Hands (Energy Substitution - cold) created at caster level 5 (to take advantage of the best damage the spell can do) would be only (CL 5 x SL 1 x 750 = 3750 base price, 1875 in supplies and 150 xp). -rg
Pinky's brain 11-15-04, 11:36 AM	Maximize does not give you heighten for free (that would be nice, who needs heighten then ... just stack on other metamagic feats instead). So the save DC is unaffected.
Radiating Gnome 11-15-04, 12:00 PM	ACK! My mistake. You're right, of course. That's what I get for not looking it up first before I spouted off. That makes the idea of the maximized wand that much less useful, then. -rg
swarthmore 11-15-04, 04:48 PM	So, it looks like in the grand scheme of things, the Artificer is better off filling Feat Slots with something other than metamagic. Other threads on this forum have pointed to the Artificer as a magic item based character and not a significant spontanieous castor/infusor (except for Repair Damage infusions). That being said, I invision my character from 1st - 6th level moping around uslessly on the side of the "action" and just trying to not get killed. From 6th to 10th or 12th I'll be a gadjet maker and the one party member who can do it all (Heal, fight, buff, etc). After level 12 or so, though, I'll be a very powerfull party member. Capable of dealing out lots of damage in strange and wonderful ways; capable of buffing (or creating items that buff) fellow members in ways that are necessary, and not just secondary; capable of healing or fixing as well as any priest; and having a wide range of specific use items that gets us out of trouble when we need it or into trouble when we want it. Sound about right? One possible excetion to the above is becomming a wand specialist. Not being woried about additional expenditures of charges and metamagicing every shot. Sure I'll be depleeting wands left and right, but then I just make new ones, lots of them, and forgo the jack-of-all-trades lifestyle.