Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Arcane_Mark 03-17-07, 12:15 AM	Hola! We are know about the War of the Mark. Sadly, it created alot of negative propraganda (sp?) towards people who have Aberrant Dragonmarks. I was wondering what would happen if the aberrant dragonmarks would form THEIR OWN NEW DRAGONMARKED HOUSE? ;) They would be good and not try and take over everything. They would want to create a better image for Aberrant Dragonmark users.:angelhide I know it would take out the 13-1=12 theme.:weep: I am thinking their "business" would be charity. Raising money to give back othe community.:confused: I know somepeople like the whole "Aberrant being bad" thing but they can still be that. They could still hold on the "House of Tar.." thing or just embrace the idea that they are evil.:devil: Thoughts?
wolffman007 03-17-07, 01:23 AM	what about house Tarkanan? they are pretty much out for themselves & helping/recruiting others w/ an abberrant mark as i recall they also do assassination they also do research into abberant marks
jonci 03-17-07, 04:57 AM	I'm in a campaign where our group (dragonmarked house members) is eventually going to war with House Tarkanan. If I remember right, Player's Guide writes about special schools for Aberrant marked children of Dragonmarked Houses. You could always just work off that idea that one school decides to make their students good-standing members of society that don't have to hide their marks.
The Dreaming Duck 03-17-07, 04:24 PM	You could always just work off that idea that one school decides to make their students good-standing members of society that don't have to hide their marks. I have no problem with a group of aberrants who decide to defy the stereotypes, to perform charitable acts or do good. But I think it would take decades before such an organization had enough influence to ensure that people didn't have to hide their marks. You're fighting against 1,500 years of engrained tradition which teaches that aberrant marks cause madness and death. It's not a question of people believing that aberrants are have poor upbringing; the issue is that people believe that aberrants are cursed, that they bring misfortune to all around them and ultimately will turn to evil. So great, you're doing charity work NOW... but every tale I've heard teaches me that within a year or two you'll be burning down houses with your vile mark. It's not your fault - but I'm still not going to trust you. Remember, propaganda aside, aberrants DESTROYED the first incarnation of Sharn, and parents still frighten their children with tales of the Lady of Plagues. This is a very powerful, very active superstition. Can this be overcome? Probably. But again, I see it as being the work of ages - not something you can counter in a few months. So I'd see you needing to do your charity work, establish yourself as a positive force in the community, and once everyone knows you and trusts you, slowly reveal your true nature to the wisest people around you, people who may be willing to press past superstition. Rely on their help to slowly convince the others. Eventually, you may be able to show your aberrant mark in public - but I'd see this as the work of years, not days. And even then, you might simply convince them that YOU have somehow overcome the curse, not that all aberrants are just misunderstood. And as for the 12-1 thing, this doesn't change it at all. There's already 13 houses, due to the Thuranni-Phiarlan split. The 12-1 applies to dragonmarks, and this doesn't really change that. Nonetheless, I don't see an aberrant house getting invited to the Twelve anytime soon; if you're too public too early, I think it's more likely the Twelve would send Deneith, Thuranni, and Phiarlan to take you out. The point of House Tarkanan is that they know the dragonmarked houses will seek to eliminate them in time - and they're making sure that when the next war of the mark comes, they're ready for it.
Edymnion 03-17-07, 04:46 PM	We are know about the War of the Mark. Sadly, it created alot of negative propraganda (sp?) towards people who have Aberrant Dragonmarks. I was wondering what would happen if the aberrant dragonmarks would form THEIR OWN NEW DRAGONMARKED HOUSE? ;) What would happen? They'd base themselves in Sharn and call themselves House Tarkanan. Aka, there's already an Abberant Marked House, its in the ECS.
ChimericalWolf 03-17-07, 07:06 PM	This is a very powerful, very active superstition. The old superstitions remain, but they are losing their power. Few believe the old claim that the aberrant dragonmarked are the children of the Dragon Below, as the horrors of the Last War have driven such concerns from the mind of the common folk. Mandatory text
Arcane_Mark 03-17-07, 10:06 PM	What would happen? They'd base themselves in Sharn and call themselves House Tarkanan. Aka, there's already an Abberant Marked House, its in the ECS. Yes I know about them but they are trying to fight while this house I am trying to create will help. Give back to community. I got the idea from reading the Dragonmarked section. It says that the the ideas of madness are dying out (in the Aberrant Section) so I thought "This might be a perfect point to do it!" (Arcane_Mark)
Shady314 03-18-07, 04:22 AM	Hola! We are know about the War of the Mark. Sadly, it created alot of negative propraganda (sp?) towards people who have Aberrant Dragonmarks. I was wondering what would happen if the aberrant dragonmarks would form THEIR OWN NEW DRAGONMARKED HOUSE? ;) They would be good and not try and take over everything. They would want to create a better image for Aberrant Dragonmark users.:angelhide I know it would take out the 13-1=12 theme.:weep: I am thinking their "business" would be charity. Raising money to give back othe community.:confused: I know somepeople like the whole "Aberrant being bad" thing but they can still be that. They could still hold on the "House of Tar.." thing or just embrace the idea that they are evil.:devil: Thoughts? The problem with this is the same problem the aberrant marks always had with forming a "House." They can't. The marks are random in power and random in who gets them. They aren't passed down reliably to children and the vast majority of the powers kill. The best bet would be getting the Houses to start interbreeding again which they aren't going to do. That was the largest and most reliable source of aberrant marks. Great you're a whole charitable house of people that can throw out burning hands or even a cloudkill (if you've got a greater mark). You're just a charitable group with useless powers! It's one thing to be like a marked Cannith and fix stuff or a Lyrandar and call rain. It's another to try and find a use for your burning hands ability or cloudkill. There just no unifying theme. They can organize into a group to combat the negative image a la X-men. But unlike in X-men where everyone's kid got powers a lot of their children won't. So they'll have a hell of a time recruiting. They've got to scour Khorvaire for people that are trying to hide. Hmmm it's a LOT like X-men isn't it? My suggestion for anyone looking to break the negative image? Join the army. Become a national hero. The current House Tarkanan came about from Breland trying to make a bunch of aberrants assassins and agents. Have Breland start up some abberrant marked unit akin to the Japanese American infantry of WWII. http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/agency/army/100-442in.htm
Cifer 03-18-07, 11:31 AM	I, too, would foresee this to go down very quickly. As soon as they go public, the houses would probably make sure that a good deal of misfortune is attributed to them - and then be so kind as to agree with national leaders that conducting another purge will be regrettable, yet neccessary, since we all know what happened the last time, don't we?
The Dreaming Duck 03-18-07, 01:13 PM	Mandatory text Fair enough. But as long as we're quoting Dragonmarked, let's look at a few things. To those versed in the lore and legends of the Five Nations, aberrant dragonmarks conjure up images of monsters in human form - terrifying creatures driven mad by their own powers, who can kill with a touch or control the forces of fear and fire. In Sharn, mothers still frighten their children with tales of the Lady of the Plague. Even the most reasoned people whisper that aberrant dragonmarks are signs of the Dragon Below, and that those who bear the symbols are cursed souls who spread misfortune wherever they go. That sounds pretty grim... and it's attributed to "even the most reasoned." In other developments... Common superstition holds that aberrant marks are a taint on the soul - that the bearer of one of these marks will invariably fall ill or go mad... Between these stories of madness and the clear threat posed by these deadly marks, people view the bearers of aberrant dragonmarks with a mix of fear and suspicion. (An aberrant-marked half-orc) was driven from the Marches, tainted and touched by the Deep Wyrm, and if he returned to his family they would do their best to kill him. Lei: "The aberrant marks are dangerous to body and soul! Fire, darkness, death... these are not forces the living were meant to channel!" How do these things jibe with the quote CW gave above? Simple. "The old superstions remain, but are losing their power" - because the superstitions used to be so severe that they would cause aberrants to be killed on sight, whereas today they largely result in "fear and suspicion". There's a vast difference between "losing power" and "have been completely abandoned". The Dragonmarked section opens by emphasizing how strong the supersitions still are. House Tarkanan is secretive for a reason, and the foundation of House Tarkanan is the belief that the dragonmarked houses WILL try to eliminate the aberrants if they return in greater numbers. What Dragonmarked says is that, like all things, this is in the hands of the DM. Before a player character takes an aberrant dragonmark, both player and dungeon master should discuss the idea. How does the player want the mark to affect the character's life? Does he like the notion of being an outcast, feared for who he is? ... It is possible to minimize the impact of aberrant dragonmarks in a campaign. If a character's mark is hidden on his body, if it holds a passive power, and if he avoids aberrant feats, people might never even know he bears an aberrant dragonmark. The DM might also decide that in his campaign, the majority of the population have let go of the old prejudices and that the character can reveal his mark without fear. So... if you want, you can say that people just aren't that scared of aberrants any more. But the clear default is that they are - that a character may not be killed on sight, but he must conceal his mark or be treated with fear and suspicion. The X-Men analogy is a good one. In the Marvel Universe, people fear mutants - and they don't even have a "Mutants destroyed New York City" event to justify it, as people do on Eberron. The X-Men ARE, in essence, a charitable organization performing good deeds. But they are still met with prejudice and fear, and until very recently have kept their base of operations hidden. What's emphasized time and again is that aberrant marks are dangerous, and that the legends of madness add to this. If I know that you could kill me with a touch and that any day now you might go mad? I'd probably keep my distance, even if you do seem like a good guy. So, as Dragonmarked says, you can choose to ignore all of this if that's what YOU want to do in your game, because it's a fundamental principle of Eberron that you can do WHATEVER you want in your game. But by default, the common attitude of "even the most reasoned" is that "those who bear the symbols are cursed souls who spread misfortune wherever they go."
The Dreaming Duck 03-18-07, 01:19 PM	As soon as they go public, the houses would probably make sure that a good deal of misfortune is attributed to them - and then be so kind as to agree with national leaders that conducting another purge will be regrettable, yet neccessary, since we all know what happened the last time, don't we? Bingo. People already believe that aberrants "spread misfortune wherever they go". All the houses have to do is stage calamities that can be attributed to the aberrants, and use their media influence to reinforce the stories of the Lady of the Plague, Tarkanan's destruction of Sharn, the aberrant who "burned down a thorp with a wave of his hand because he 'desired warmth'" and they can get the general public baying for another purge. If you were raised on tales of the aberrant queen whose breath was poison and who killed cities with painful diseases, would YOU want to live next door to the new Aberrant house? The superstitions are losing strength because there is no focal point for the fear; the destruction of Sharn took place long ago. But House Tarkanan keeps a low profile precisely so it CAN'T be used in this manner. An aberrant house that steps into the spotlight stands every change of being turned into a scapegoat, used by the pure houses to reinforce the old fears, and likely used as the trigger for a new purge.
Metamagick 03-18-07, 02:02 PM	So just create a "x-men" thingy. Create a school (House of Xavo or something) that teaches Aberrant Dragonmarked students to use their powers to help. Yes people will say "Burning Hands! How could you help with something like that!?!" Take Bobby from Xmen. He can freeze people! But he uses it to help. Just as if the Aberrant-Men would do. :::Metamagick:::
The Dreaming Duck 03-18-07, 03:54 PM	Yes people will say "Burning Hands! How could you help with something like that!?!" Take Bobby from Xmen. He can freeze people! But he uses it to help. Right. But the point is that despite using their powers to help, the X-Men are still feared and distrusted by the common people, and persecuted by bigots, extremists, and on occasion, the government. And all of this is WITHOUT the level of destruction that's been attributed to the aberrants, or a force as entrenched in society as the Dragonmarked Houses to oppose them. Think of the Dragonmarked Houses as the Hellfire Club but with the integration into society of Starbucks and Microsoft and you can see how easy it is for them to make trouble for the Aberrant-Men. Essentially, House Tarkanan are Magneto's Brotherhood. Thora is gathering aberrants together and training them to use their abilities. She considers them to be her family. But she believes that conflict with the pure-marked is inevitable, and she intends to win the next War of the Mark. If you want to add in a Xavier-style Aberrant house that pursues a dream of peace, there's obviously room for it - but like the X-Men, you'll still face fear and prejudice from the people you are trying to help.
Edymnion 03-18-07, 04:00 PM	And really, wouldn't it be better to simply change the flavor on House Tarkanan to match what you want, and use whats already in the setting to create as few ripples as possible, instead of dropping in an entirely new House?
UnderworldLord 03-18-07, 08:53 PM	If you did do the X-men stylization, this threat would help: http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=769890
Ellorin 03-19-07, 07:48 AM	And really, wouldn't it be better to simply change the flavor on House Tarkanan to match what you want, and use whats already in the setting to create as few ripples as possible, instead of dropping in an entirely new House? Or become a member and chamnge things from the inside, possibly becoming the new head of it in the process- or, at least, put your favourite candidate in that position.
Edymnion 03-19-07, 08:33 AM	Or become a member and chamnge things from the inside, possibly becoming the new head of it in the process- or, at least, put your favourite candidate in that position.Yeah, I could definately see House Tarkanan as being one where you could assisinate your way to the top and take control by force, and then try to work at making it all warm and cuddly like a big old teddy bear. If teddy bears came with built in flame throwers, anyway.
Syltorian 03-19-07, 01:18 PM	Yeah, I could definately see House Tarkanan as being one where you could assisinate your way to the top and take control by force, and then try to work at making it all warm and cuddly like a big old teddy bear. If teddy bears came with built in flame throwers, anyway. Personally (though I am by no means able to defend this with anything but gut-feeling), I'd see Tarkanan as being actually very loyal towards their own. They know they are on their own, and need unity to overcome the Dragonmarked Houses. The very core of the house was part of the same Brelish special unit, which was for a large part destroyed: they'll have gone through much together, and share strong bonds. The newer recruits will be carefully treated to make them loyal to the only family that gives them a sense of belonging. Some might call that brainswashing, but I would not even see Halas Tarkanan as being manipulative here. From what we know, she really cares about the aberrant marked; she is evil because she kills other people, but I can actually see her as being a very nice person to her "family", and loved by them in return. Another of the Eberronian alignment-is-not-clear-cut cases.
Ellorin 03-22-07, 06:14 AM	Yeah, I could definately see House Tarkanan as being one where you could assisinate your way to the top and take control by force, and then try to work at making it all warm and cuddly like a big old teddy bear. If teddy bears came with built in flame throwers, anyway. Assassinate?Seems I've given the wrong impression here. I meant gathering power in a Sivis-like way.Syltorian's unity arguments were very good.Besides, I was underte-the impression that the assasinations are merely a means, not the point that the House was created. If you want to change its practices you don't kill the ones in charge, YOU take that place.