A delicate situation... [Archive] - Wizards Community

A delicate situation... [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Arryn
05-08-07, 11:03 PM DISCLAIMER: I realize that this thread might be more appropriate for a more generic board, but I play in Eberron and I respect the opinions of the people who post on these boards. Plus, we have an Artificer in the party which creates options that are Eberron specific.

Ok... so my DM is sick and twisted... our next quest involves going into Karrnath to "rescue" the body of one of the party member's mother. The problem? She's been turned into an Undead. Now obviously we have to bring her body back, but it's a delicate matter of how we are going to do that. Of course we could just whack the thing until it stops moving... but imagine the therapy bills for the poor party member. So the question is... how do you take out Undead with the least amount of violence. Liberal usage of Cure spells is an obvious option, but I was wondering if anyone else has other ideas.. The party is made up of a Ranger/Barbarian, a Bard, a Druid and an Artificer between 4th and 6th level.

Thoughts?
Warforged Goblin
05-09-07, 09:32 AM Uh... command undead?
UnderworldLord
05-09-07, 10:10 AM I was unaware that those classes could command undead. You could alwaystry taking her own like a human captive: have your strongest member(s) pin her and get someone to Use Rope and tie her down.

Alternatively, at least in beating down the zombie your party member would get to release all that pent up frustration from when his mommy wouldn't let him go to play in Cyre :D .
Syltorian
05-09-07, 10:16 AM What kind of undead? Unless it's a mindless zombie or skeletton, she could perhaps be argued with. If that fails, she could be lure back (get some meat if she is a ghoul, that kind of thing). If she is a vampire, or another undead which has a coffin, put a stake through her, nail the coffin shut, and take it home.

If she is a Karrnathi zombie/skeletton, go to the authorities. The bard might want to check up on filing a complaint with them; as far as I am aware, creating undead is not supposed to happen anymore after the Treaty of Thronehold. Could be wrong on that, though, but perhaps you can get some help from them, and the right contacts in the Ministry of the Dead. Perhaps even do them some service for... decomissioning the dear mother.

If the question is how to destroy the unholy abomination she has become, and return the body without having it walk itself home, all this in the most 'humane' manner, that's difficult without a cleric. Consider getting (borrowing?) a disruption weapon; say, quarterstaves; roleplay that you try to hit her only very gently, by, say, poking her (use non-lethal damage, her immunity shouldn't matter as the secondary effect is what you want - eventually, she'll fail that will-save). Provided you can find the money for this, of course.
Arryn
05-09-07, 11:42 AM We don't know what kind of Undead, but considering we are relatively low level, I suspect she's one of the weaker mindless varieties. As for the lawfulness, we know that this is a rogue group not sanctioned by the government.... I'm sure there will be some outlaw justice taken out on those degenerates. The Disruption idea is a valid one but I think it is out of the current power level of our Artificer... don't have the books with me at the moment. Are there any obscure spell the Artificer could make a scroll of that could help us?
Nevarre
05-09-07, 11:47 AM What does the PC whose mother is now undead want?
What are the reasons for rescuing the body - a decent burial or something else?

What options you have depend on the answers to those questions really.

If the PC is really going to be traumatised by the rest of you thumping her to bits (just so that you can get the body), then politely suggest that "it would be best if you stay here whilst we er....go and get her."

If it's imperative that he/she is involved in the capture then go for the simplest option - a net!
Of course it's very much dependant on the actual type of undead (capturing a wraith isn't going to be easy!)
Wait a sec... she's not a mummy is she?? :D
Syltorian
05-09-07, 12:06 PM Greater Disrupt Undead (Spell Compendium p.68), a third-level spell, should be available to your artificer. Most spells that do away with undead straightaway are higher-level and often expensive.

Using that spell might still give the mother's son a shock depending on how your DM tries to describe it. If you want to be really sure, get some advice at a friendly priest about this. You will either be forewarned, or even be told a special way of casting that spell (special in flavour only, no rules changed) in the most peaceful manner possible.

Alternatively, take the culprits alive and make them undo their crime, whether using blackmail, threats or charms. Lesser geas (brd 3) could be used too, depending on whether the enemy has more or less than 7 HD.

Also, if your DM is up for this, you could try and research an incantation (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/magic/incantations.htm) of a sort. Checks are high, but with various aid another and magical help, it might be just about possible. It's a variant rule, however, so your DM will probably not accept it.
Syltorian
05-09-07, 12:08 PM If the PC is really going to be traumatised by the rest of you thumping her to bits (just so that you can get the body), then politely suggest that "it would be best if you stay here whilst we er....go and get her."

Aye, I agree.

Of course it's very much dependant on the actual type of undead (capturing a wraith isn't going to be easy!)

If she is an incorporeal undead, trouble will only really start when you try to get the body back home. Though of course, it is possible that the body is somewhere else. Then just don't bother with the spirit; take the body and leave :D.
retillin
05-09-07, 09:49 PM What about the spell "Hold Undead". Once held secure her in somthing stronger and hall her back. Just a thought, it seems like those scrolls should be rather easy to come by in Thane.
UnderworldLord
05-10-07, 12:17 AM I guess I'm still failing to see how it wouln't be most expedient just to grab her and tie her up. Zombie or not, it should work, so long as someone is watching to make sure she doesn't get free.

If your DM works with you decently, you could probably wrangle a cleric out of the authorities. This may require diplomacy, deceit, and deniability (later). Could work though if you come up with just the right way to pitch it.
Warforged Goblin
05-11-07, 08:35 AM I was unaware that those classes could command undead.

Step 1: Artificer.
Step 2: Scribe Scroll.
Step 3: Command undead.
Step 4: ???
Step 5: Profit.

Or something along those lines...
UnderworldLord
05-11-07, 04:18 PM I generally don't like giving artificers the ability to emulate divine spells, so I guess that one is just my house rule keeping me from appreciating that. My apologies.
Warforged Goblin
05-11-07, 04:39 PM Command undead is on the wizard/sorcerer list also.
UnderworldLord
05-12-07, 12:22 AM Wierd. I must have overlooked it. Chalk one more up for not paying attn!
Phalo
05-12-07, 02:06 AM ya got a druid so entangle is a good option
clint_weststone
05-13-07, 08:22 AM i guess the boat left and i missed it.

tell the dude who's mom is now an undead that if he cant stomach his mom being beaten down to stop crying and do his freaking job as an adventure and to hit his mom in the face or go home and cry like a little girl that lost her bottle. he needs to know that there is a job to be done and if it means that he will have to take one for the team then so be it.... but i would agreee that if the druid could use entangle that would be the best. then have the barb knock it down and use the rope.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Arryn 05-08-07, 11:03 PM	DISCLAIMER: I realize that this thread might be more appropriate for a more generic board, but I play in Eberron and I respect the opinions of the people who post on these boards. Plus, we have an Artificer in the party which creates options that are Eberron specific. Ok... so my DM is sick and twisted... our next quest involves going into Karrnath to "rescue" the body of one of the party member's mother. The problem? She's been turned into an Undead. Now obviously we have to bring her body back, but it's a delicate matter of how we are going to do that. Of course we could just whack the thing until it stops moving... but imagine the therapy bills for the poor party member. So the question is... how do you take out Undead with the least amount of violence. Liberal usage of Cure spells is an obvious option, but I was wondering if anyone else has other ideas.. The party is made up of a Ranger/Barbarian, a Bard, a Druid and an Artificer between 4th and 6th level. Thoughts?
Warforged Goblin 05-09-07, 09:32 AM	Uh... command undead?
UnderworldLord 05-09-07, 10:10 AM	I was unaware that those classes could command undead. You could alwaystry taking her own like a human captive: have your strongest member(s) pin her and get someone to Use Rope and tie her down. Alternatively, at least in beating down the zombie your party member would get to release all that pent up frustration from when his mommy wouldn't let him go to play in Cyre :D .
Syltorian 05-09-07, 10:16 AM	What kind of undead? Unless it's a mindless zombie or skeletton, she could perhaps be argued with. If that fails, she could be lure back (get some meat if she is a ghoul, that kind of thing). If she is a vampire, or another undead which has a coffin, put a stake through her, nail the coffin shut, and take it home. If she is a Karrnathi zombie/skeletton, go to the authorities. The bard might want to check up on filing a complaint with them; as far as I am aware, creating undead is not supposed to happen anymore after the Treaty of Thronehold. Could be wrong on that, though, but perhaps you can get some help from them, and the right contacts in the Ministry of the Dead. Perhaps even do them some service for... decomissioning the dear mother. If the question is how to destroy the unholy abomination she has become, and return the body without having it walk itself home, all this in the most 'humane' manner, that's difficult without a cleric. Consider getting (borrowing?) a disruption weapon; say, quarterstaves; roleplay that you try to hit her only very gently, by, say, poking her (use non-lethal damage, her immunity shouldn't matter as the secondary effect is what you want - eventually, she'll fail that will-save). Provided you can find the money for this, of course.
Arryn 05-09-07, 11:42 AM	We don't know what kind of Undead, but considering we are relatively low level, I suspect she's one of the weaker mindless varieties. As for the lawfulness, we know that this is a rogue group not sanctioned by the government.... I'm sure there will be some outlaw justice taken out on those degenerates. The Disruption idea is a valid one but I think it is out of the current power level of our Artificer... don't have the books with me at the moment. Are there any obscure spell the Artificer could make a scroll of that could help us?
Nevarre 05-09-07, 11:47 AM	What does the PC whose mother is now undead want? What are the reasons for rescuing the body - a decent burial or something else? What options you have depend on the answers to those questions really. If the PC is really going to be traumatised by the rest of you thumping her to bits (just so that you can get the body), then politely suggest that "it would be best if you stay here whilst we er....go and get her." If it's imperative that he/she is involved in the capture then go for the simplest option - a net! Of course it's very much dependant on the actual type of undead (capturing a wraith isn't going to be easy!) Wait a sec... she's not a mummy is she?? :D
Syltorian 05-09-07, 12:06 PM	Greater Disrupt Undead (Spell Compendium p.68), a third-level spell, should be available to your artificer. Most spells that do away with undead straightaway are higher-level and often expensive. Using that spell might still give the mother's son a shock depending on how your DM tries to describe it. If you want to be really sure, get some advice at a friendly priest about this. You will either be forewarned, or even be told a special way of casting that spell (special in flavour only, no rules changed) in the most peaceful manner possible. Alternatively, take the culprits alive and make them undo their crime, whether using blackmail, threats or charms. Lesser geas (brd 3) could be used too, depending on whether the enemy has more or less than 7 HD. Also, if your DM is up for this, you could try and research an incantation (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/magic/incantations.htm) of a sort. Checks are high, but with various aid another and magical help, it might be just about possible. It's a variant rule, however, so your DM will probably not accept it.
Syltorian 05-09-07, 12:08 PM	If the PC is really going to be traumatised by the rest of you thumping her to bits (just so that you can get the body), then politely suggest that "it would be best if you stay here whilst we er....go and get her." Aye, I agree. Of course it's very much dependant on the actual type of undead (capturing a wraith isn't going to be easy!) If she is an incorporeal undead, trouble will only really start when you try to get the body back home. Though of course, it is possible that the body is somewhere else. Then just don't bother with the spirit; take the body and leave :D.
retillin 05-09-07, 09:49 PM	What about the spell "Hold Undead". Once held secure her in somthing stronger and hall her back. Just a thought, it seems like those scrolls should be rather easy to come by in Thane.
UnderworldLord 05-10-07, 12:17 AM	I guess I'm still failing to see how it wouln't be most expedient just to grab her and tie her up. Zombie or not, it should work, so long as someone is watching to make sure she doesn't get free. If your DM works with you decently, you could probably wrangle a cleric out of the authorities. This may require diplomacy, deceit, and deniability (later). Could work though if you come up with just the right way to pitch it.
Warforged Goblin 05-11-07, 08:35 AM	I was unaware that those classes could command undead. Step 1: Artificer. Step 2: Scribe Scroll. Step 3: Command undead. Step 4: ??? Step 5: Profit. Or something along those lines...
UnderworldLord 05-11-07, 04:18 PM	I generally don't like giving artificers the ability to emulate divine spells, so I guess that one is just my house rule keeping me from appreciating that. My apologies.
Warforged Goblin 05-11-07, 04:39 PM	Command undead is on the wizard/sorcerer list also.
UnderworldLord 05-12-07, 12:22 AM	Wierd. I must have overlooked it. Chalk one more up for not paying attn!
Phalo 05-12-07, 02:06 AM	ya got a druid so entangle is a good option
clint_weststone 05-13-07, 08:22 AM	i guess the boat left and i missed it. tell the dude who's mom is now an undead that if he cant stomach his mom being beaten down to stop crying and do his freaking job as an adventure and to hit his mom in the face or go home and cry like a little girl that lost her bottle. he needs to know that there is a job to be done and if it means that he will have to take one for the team then so be it.... but i would agreee that if the druid could use entangle that would be the best. then have the barb knock it down and use the rope.