Eberron Arcane PrCs [Archive] - Wizards Community

Eberron Arcane PrCs [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Gafgarion
04-05-07, 12:38 PM Why are there so few good Arcane PrCs in Eberron? And why do the decent ones have so few levels. The only really great one is the Recaster. Primal Scholar and Unbound Scroll are all right, but nowhere near as strong as the Recaster. And all of those are only 5 levels long. Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love Eberron and it's by far my favorite setting, but the lack of Arcane PrCs in it as compared to, oh say Faerun is striking. And it's not like Eberron lacks good PrCs. Sovereign Speaker. Planar Shepherd. Warforged Juggernaught. Revenant Blade. All fantastic PrCs. I'm just wondering why we don't get more Arcane love? I hate being forced to look to those blasted Realms for good PrCs for my Arcane characters. Any thoughts?
Belabras
04-05-07, 01:38 PM Is there something wrong with all the non-setting specific ones?
Gafgarion
04-05-07, 02:05 PM Not particularly, no. The non campaign-specific ones aren't really my concern, though. What I'm concerned with is the quality of Eberron's arcane Prcs. They just seem a bit lackluster in comparison with the ones found in the Realms books and to Eberron's non-arcane PrCs. I just find it a bit confusing. Why does Eberron have nothing on par with the Magelord, Incantatrix, or Hathran?
Belabras
04-05-07, 02:20 PM Because the Realms have power bloat?
Hideous Phidias
04-05-07, 02:30 PM List of arcane prestige classes from the Eberron World Books

Heir of Siberys
Primal Scholar
The Cataclysm Mage
Windwright Captain
Cyran Scout
Nosomatic Chirurgeon
Sharn Skymage
Unbound Scroll
Knight Phantom
Cyran avenger
Alchemist Savant
Dreadgrim
Dragon Prophet
Impure Prince
Rengeade Mastermaker

One should also remeber that any prestige class found in any of the core book came also be found in the world of Eberron. I find that there is a lack of good prestige class for arcane characters in general. I know when ever I play one I never can find one that seems to fit what I want. My advise to you is find one that comesclosest to what you are looking for and with your DM work it into what you want. Add a power loss a power, remember to try keep it balanced. Another thing you can try is if there is a prestige class in another setting you like you can change its back story to fit the Eberron setting.
Kid SixXx
04-05-07, 02:32 PM Because the Realms have power bloat?

Hey! :mad:

@ Gafgarion:

The Brelish don't seem to use magic any more differently than the Aundarians & the Karrnathi merely have strong traditions in necromancy which should be covered by either specialization in necromantic magic or by the True Necromancer PrC.

Actually, most of the spellslinging PrC's in the setting are multipurpose. Dragon Prophets, for example, can be either arcane spellcasters or artifcers. IMO, they should've made room for divine spellcasters, but that's just me nitpicking.

Of the specifically arcane PrC's, I quite enjoy that Primal Scholar.

The Hathran, flavor wise, is as much a divine spellcaster as it is an arcane spellcaster. I would tinker with that PrC to make it available to a sect like the Gatekeepers since the whole concept of magical strength being tied to a particular geographic location would work well for them.

Most of your weirder magical traditions that might warrant PrC's are probably found outside of Khorvaire. The Serens probably practice a lot of dragon magic, you probably have lots of elemental magical traditions amongst the Akiak, the Eneko, and the Talona Shifters in Sarlona, and of cours the beloved Aerenal probably practice some unique form of necromancy.

I personally can appreciate the lack of abundance in Eberron Arcane PrC's because mechanically, there's enough for wizards to do already.
Nundahl
04-05-07, 02:41 PM I won't list all of them as the poster before me, but there are some fantastic Arcane PRC's in the Eberron setting.

My favorites would have to be the Alchemist Savant (and not just because of the art that goes with it ...) and the Cataclysm Mage.

I have a player in my game gunning for Cataclysm Mage in spite of the fact that it will take him so very long to achieve the prereqs, because the class is that great. I mean, I'll paraphrase for the sake of not getting kicked off the boards, but watching your targets flesh melt and drip UPWARDS makes that class beyond worthwhile. Its more flavor than crunch, the ability isn't all that great ... but I'm ok with that.
Roland the Crownbreaker
04-05-07, 02:55 PM Knight Phantom is much like an Eldritch Knight, only with special abilities in place of a single fighter bonus feat. Oh, and a higher hit die.

Silver Pyromancer is a great fit for a paladin/sorcerer, and being only 5 levels leaves it enough room for Abjurant Champion. (hey, my games allow only 1 10 level PrC or 2 5 level ones)

Cataclysm Mage looks sweet, nice abilities and incredible flavor.

Heir of Syberis can be a caster or melee prestige class, depending on what you were when you took it.

But part of why there are only a few is that Eberron prestige classes are designed in large part to develop the world they are part of. As a result, you are more likely to see prestige classes that develop things only found on Eberron. Classes for Eberron races, classes for Dragonmarked characters, classes for Eberron religions, and classes for Artificers. You can easily import arcane stuff from other books and easily fit it in. It gets harder to import classes meant for Forgotten Realms and Grayhawk deities. And there is nothing to import for all that stuff that is unique to Eberron, so therefore it gets more attention. I don't see this as a bad thing myself. I have a boatload of other books I want to use in addition to the Eberron stuff.
Vharuck
04-05-07, 04:06 PM Just to let you know, the lack of non-arcane PrCs in FR is more striking.
timothyx
04-27-07, 02:24 AM off the top of my head, the best two PRC's for mages in Eberron would be War Weaver (heroes of battle) and Nightmare Spinner (complete mage), and honestly, any PRC can be changed with some flavor ideas to fit eberron.

Red wizards of Thay? The 12 of Karnnath
Cultist of the Shattered Peak? Bunch of Nuts in the Shadow Marches

Heck, I took the whole, Mysteries of the Moonsea, and re-named all the places, and decide that the Lhazar Principalities were much bigger.

and I completely agree, Cataclysm Mage is great, til you hit level 10, when you're struck dead instantly upon taking the level (as soon of course, as you roll your hit points, etc), because every single person who has even the most passing interest already knows you're at level 9 and figure you should die for what you know, or to keep you from finding out what you don't. I also include the Rahkshasha's who simply want you dead for no other reason than you're breathing, and Pun Pun because you looked in his general direction (north, south, east, west, doesn't matter).
TheAnthroDM
05-01-07, 12:44 AM Dreadgrim
Isn't this a Divine PrC?
Hideous Phidias
05-01-07, 02:31 AM Isn't this a Divine PrC?

Yeah it is, my bad. I made that list fast off the top of my head and looking at a list of all Eberron prestige classes,
ChristopherGroves
05-02-07, 09:32 AM And really ....

Heir of Siberys - great class in so many ways
Nosomatic Chirurgeon - huge class for Warlocks
Unbound Scroll - no downside if you're specialized
Knight Phantom - very good gish class
Alchemist Savant - no downside if you're specialized
Escalation Mage - no downside, and esp. great for Invocation-based classes
johnandrehart
05-04-07, 05:22 PM in which book can you find the cataclysm mage?
Lord Splendor
05-05-07, 12:46 AM I actually don't allow setting specific prestige classes in my Eberron games. Why? Because their not Eberron. Just like I wouldn't allow someone in a Forgotten Relms game to take dragonmarks or play a warforge.

I think the reason they don't have alot of prestige classes in Eberron is because of the NPCs level. Not many even qualify for prestige classes as it is. Your not going to find anyone who is a ArchMage. They have to be 13th level just to pick up the class. How many arcane spell casters in eberron can even cast 7th level spells?

If there is no one high enough level to be the prestige class, why would they have one?

Eberron seems more like a roleplaying setting then the others that have come out. Thats why they have prestige classes like the The Cataclysm Mage, The Sharn Sky Mage, Reforged, Rune Carved Soldier, and Thunder Guide. Roleplaying prestige classes.
RogueElement
05-05-07, 01:35 AM Because the Realms have power bloat?

Compared to a Warforged Juggernaut?? "Hi, I'm a Barbarian who can rage whenever I want without getting tired and by 10th level I'm also immune to everything!"

I agree with the OP, Eberron is too fighter and cleric heavy. I'm hoping for a Morgrave University and Arcane Congress book to come out for the arcane classes. And hopefully it won't be like the Complete "Mage" book that actually helps clerics and druids out more than wizards and sorcerers.
RogueElement
05-05-07, 01:56 AM in which book can you find the cataclysm mage?

Secrets of Xendrik

Where is the Nosomatic Chirurgeon?
Wizardman
05-05-07, 04:52 AM Where is the Nosomatic Chirurgeon?

Dragonmarked.
johnandrehart
05-05-07, 09:12 AM uhmm...i hate to do this to the op....sorry again
but the cataclysm mage is not in secrets of xendrik i think you were refering to the primal scholar...
anyways if anybody else could please answer my question....

in which book do i find the cataclysm mage?
thanks in advance!
angledragonofearth
05-05-07, 04:31 PM cataclysm mage is in Magic of Eberron
Belabras
05-05-07, 04:39 PM Compared to a Warforged Juggernaut?? "Hi, I'm a Barbarian who can rage whenever I want without getting tired and by 10th level I'm also immune to everything!"

Put simply, yes. But I'll leave it at that, since I don't want to have the Eberron vs FR arguement.
ClobberinTime
05-08-07, 05:35 PM Seems to me that the old tried and true arcane PRCs are really good for eberron, i.e. Loremaster and Archmage if you make it that far.

I see the lack of Arcane firepower as an opportunity to be the greatest mage on Khovaire, not a hinderance, :)
Vharuck
05-08-07, 06:30 PM Compared to a Warforged Juggernaut?? "Hi, I'm a Barbarian who can rage whenever I want without getting tired and by 10th level I'm also immune to everything!"

Because melee already outshined casters at those levels? And being healed isn't too important.
RogueElement
05-08-07, 07:49 PM True, but all the classes are wussies compared to the Artificer. Finally, some love for the engineers! Take THAT you tree-hugging FR druids! w00t! :D
Wymarc
05-08-07, 08:04 PM cataclysm mage is in Magic of Eberron

wow, 2 wrong out of 2....

It's in The Explorer's Handbook
ChristopherGroves
05-08-07, 11:37 PM And really, the Divine PrCs in the completes are pretty poor all things considered, so the Eberron divine PrCs naturally outshine them.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Gafgarion 04-05-07, 12:38 PM	Why are there so few good Arcane PrCs in Eberron? And why do the decent ones have so few levels. The only really great one is the Recaster. Primal Scholar and Unbound Scroll are all right, but nowhere near as strong as the Recaster. And all of those are only 5 levels long. Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love Eberron and it's by far my favorite setting, but the lack of Arcane PrCs in it as compared to, oh say Faerun is striking. And it's not like Eberron lacks good PrCs. Sovereign Speaker. Planar Shepherd. Warforged Juggernaught. Revenant Blade. All fantastic PrCs. I'm just wondering why we don't get more Arcane love? I hate being forced to look to those blasted Realms for good PrCs for my Arcane characters. Any thoughts?
Belabras 04-05-07, 01:38 PM	Is there something wrong with all the non-setting specific ones?
Gafgarion 04-05-07, 02:05 PM	Not particularly, no. The non campaign-specific ones aren't really my concern, though. What I'm concerned with is the quality of Eberron's arcane Prcs. They just seem a bit lackluster in comparison with the ones found in the Realms books and to Eberron's non-arcane PrCs. I just find it a bit confusing. Why does Eberron have nothing on par with the Magelord, Incantatrix, or Hathran?
Belabras 04-05-07, 02:20 PM	Because the Realms have power bloat?
Hideous Phidias 04-05-07, 02:30 PM	List of arcane prestige classes from the Eberron World Books Heir of Siberys Primal Scholar The Cataclysm Mage Windwright Captain Cyran Scout Nosomatic Chirurgeon Sharn Skymage Unbound Scroll Knight Phantom Cyran avenger Alchemist Savant Dreadgrim Dragon Prophet Impure Prince Rengeade Mastermaker One should also remeber that any prestige class found in any of the core book came also be found in the world of Eberron. I find that there is a lack of good prestige class for arcane characters in general. I know when ever I play one I never can find one that seems to fit what I want. My advise to you is find one that comesclosest to what you are looking for and with your DM work it into what you want. Add a power loss a power, remember to try keep it balanced. Another thing you can try is if there is a prestige class in another setting you like you can change its back story to fit the Eberron setting.
Kid SixXx 04-05-07, 02:32 PM	Because the Realms have power bloat? Hey! :mad: @ Gafgarion: The Brelish don't seem to use magic any more differently than the Aundarians & the Karrnathi merely have strong traditions in necromancy which should be covered by either specialization in necromantic magic or by the True Necromancer PrC. Actually, most of the spellslinging PrC's in the setting are multipurpose. Dragon Prophets, for example, can be either arcane spellcasters or artifcers. IMO, they should've made room for divine spellcasters, but that's just me nitpicking. Of the specifically arcane PrC's, I quite enjoy that Primal Scholar. The Hathran, flavor wise, is as much a divine spellcaster as it is an arcane spellcaster. I would tinker with that PrC to make it available to a sect like the Gatekeepers since the whole concept of magical strength being tied to a particular geographic location would work well for them. Most of your weirder magical traditions that might warrant PrC's are probably found outside of Khorvaire. The Serens probably practice a lot of dragon magic, you probably have lots of elemental magical traditions amongst the Akiak, the Eneko, and the Talona Shifters in Sarlona, and of cours the beloved Aerenal probably practice some unique form of necromancy. I personally can appreciate the lack of abundance in Eberron Arcane PrC's because mechanically, there's enough for wizards to do already.
Nundahl 04-05-07, 02:41 PM	I won't list all of them as the poster before me, but there are some fantastic Arcane PRC's in the Eberron setting. My favorites would have to be the Alchemist Savant (and not just because of the art that goes with it ...) and the Cataclysm Mage. I have a player in my game gunning for Cataclysm Mage in spite of the fact that it will take him so very long to achieve the prereqs, because the class is that great. I mean, I'll paraphrase for the sake of not getting kicked off the boards, but watching your targets flesh melt and drip UPWARDS makes that class beyond worthwhile. Its more flavor than crunch, the ability isn't all that great ... but I'm ok with that.
Roland the Crownbreaker 04-05-07, 02:55 PM	Knight Phantom is much like an Eldritch Knight, only with special abilities in place of a single fighter bonus feat. Oh, and a higher hit die. Silver Pyromancer is a great fit for a paladin/sorcerer, and being only 5 levels leaves it enough room for Abjurant Champion. (hey, my games allow only 1 10 level PrC or 2 5 level ones) Cataclysm Mage looks sweet, nice abilities and incredible flavor. Heir of Syberis can be a caster or melee prestige class, depending on what you were when you took it. But part of why there are only a few is that Eberron prestige classes are designed in large part to develop the world they are part of. As a result, you are more likely to see prestige classes that develop things only found on Eberron. Classes for Eberron races, classes for Dragonmarked characters, classes for Eberron religions, and classes for Artificers. You can easily import arcane stuff from other books and easily fit it in. It gets harder to import classes meant for Forgotten Realms and Grayhawk deities. And there is nothing to import for all that stuff that is unique to Eberron, so therefore it gets more attention. I don't see this as a bad thing myself. I have a boatload of other books I want to use in addition to the Eberron stuff.
Vharuck 04-05-07, 04:06 PM	Just to let you know, the lack of non-arcane PrCs in FR is more striking.
timothyx 04-27-07, 02:24 AM	off the top of my head, the best two PRC's for mages in Eberron would be War Weaver (heroes of battle) and Nightmare Spinner (complete mage), and honestly, any PRC can be changed with some flavor ideas to fit eberron. Red wizards of Thay? The 12 of Karnnath Cultist of the Shattered Peak? Bunch of Nuts in the Shadow Marches Heck, I took the whole, Mysteries of the Moonsea, and re-named all the places, and decide that the Lhazar Principalities were much bigger. and I completely agree, Cataclysm Mage is great, til you hit level 10, when you're struck dead instantly upon taking the level (as soon of course, as you roll your hit points, etc), because every single person who has even the most passing interest already knows you're at level 9 and figure you should die for what you know, or to keep you from finding out what you don't. I also include the Rahkshasha's who simply want you dead for no other reason than you're breathing, and Pun Pun because you looked in his general direction (north, south, east, west, doesn't matter).
TheAnthroDM 05-01-07, 12:44 AM	Dreadgrim Isn't this a Divine PrC?
Hideous Phidias 05-01-07, 02:31 AM	Isn't this a Divine PrC? Yeah it is, my bad. I made that list fast off the top of my head and looking at a list of all Eberron prestige classes,
ChristopherGroves 05-02-07, 09:32 AM	And really .... Heir of Siberys - great class in so many ways Nosomatic Chirurgeon - huge class for Warlocks Unbound Scroll - no downside if you're specialized Knight Phantom - very good gish class Alchemist Savant - no downside if you're specialized Escalation Mage - no downside, and esp. great for Invocation-based classes
johnandrehart 05-04-07, 05:22 PM	in which book can you find the cataclysm mage?
Lord Splendor 05-05-07, 12:46 AM	I actually don't allow setting specific prestige classes in my Eberron games. Why? Because their not Eberron. Just like I wouldn't allow someone in a Forgotten Relms game to take dragonmarks or play a warforge. I think the reason they don't have alot of prestige classes in Eberron is because of the NPCs level. Not many even qualify for prestige classes as it is. Your not going to find anyone who is a ArchMage. They have to be 13th level just to pick up the class. How many arcane spell casters in eberron can even cast 7th level spells? If there is no one high enough level to be the prestige class, why would they have one? Eberron seems more like a roleplaying setting then the others that have come out. Thats why they have prestige classes like the The Cataclysm Mage, The Sharn Sky Mage, Reforged, Rune Carved Soldier, and Thunder Guide. Roleplaying prestige classes.
RogueElement 05-05-07, 01:35 AM	Because the Realms have power bloat? Compared to a Warforged Juggernaut?? "Hi, I'm a Barbarian who can rage whenever I want without getting tired and by 10th level I'm also immune to everything!" I agree with the OP, Eberron is too fighter and cleric heavy. I'm hoping for a Morgrave University and Arcane Congress book to come out for the arcane classes. And hopefully it won't be like the Complete "Mage" book that actually helps clerics and druids out more than wizards and sorcerers.
RogueElement 05-05-07, 01:56 AM	in which book can you find the cataclysm mage? Secrets of Xendrik Where is the Nosomatic Chirurgeon?
Wizardman 05-05-07, 04:52 AM	Where is the Nosomatic Chirurgeon? Dragonmarked.
johnandrehart 05-05-07, 09:12 AM	uhmm...i hate to do this to the op....sorry again but the cataclysm mage is not in secrets of xendrik i think you were refering to the primal scholar... anyways if anybody else could please answer my question.... in which book do i find the cataclysm mage? thanks in advance!
angledragonofearth 05-05-07, 04:31 PM	cataclysm mage is in Magic of Eberron
Belabras 05-05-07, 04:39 PM	Compared to a Warforged Juggernaut?? "Hi, I'm a Barbarian who can rage whenever I want without getting tired and by 10th level I'm also immune to everything!" Put simply, yes. But I'll leave it at that, since I don't want to have the Eberron vs FR arguement.
ClobberinTime 05-08-07, 05:35 PM	Seems to me that the old tried and true arcane PRCs are really good for eberron, i.e. Loremaster and Archmage if you make it that far. I see the lack of Arcane firepower as an opportunity to be the greatest mage on Khovaire, not a hinderance, :)
Vharuck 05-08-07, 06:30 PM	Compared to a Warforged Juggernaut?? "Hi, I'm a Barbarian who can rage whenever I want without getting tired and by 10th level I'm also immune to everything!" Because melee already outshined casters at those levels? And being healed isn't too important.
RogueElement 05-08-07, 07:49 PM	True, but all the classes are wussies compared to the Artificer. Finally, some love for the engineers! Take THAT you tree-hugging FR druids! w00t! :D
Wymarc 05-08-07, 08:04 PM	cataclysm mage is in Magic of Eberron wow, 2 wrong out of 2.... It's in The Explorer's Handbook
ChristopherGroves 05-08-07, 11:37 PM	And really, the Divine PrCs in the completes are pretty poor all things considered, so the Eberron divine PrCs naturally outshine them.