Turning of the tide: [Archive] - Wizards Community

Turning of the tide: [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
skrap-san
04-02-08, 11:06 AM I have just finished the dreaming dark trilogy, and I have read my fair share about the Dreaming dark, I haven't read Secrets of Sarlona yet, but it sits in my shelf mocking me with a couple of other books, but I digress... now for a disclaimer, most of the thoughts in this post is going to be a mix and match of Raw and ideas from these boards. So don't shoot me if its not cannon. And this train of thoughts assumes that the Dreaming dark wont manage to stop the turning.

What I was pondering is the fact that the Dreaming Dark in the end fear the turning of the tide or what ever it is called. In basic this is when the whole plane goes from "very very bad" to either "really really great" or "meh its OK" Now I don't use psionics that much in my settings due to a reluctance for me to learn the rules and well I don't have the book. But still as I warmed up to the thought I was wondering:
What happens to Sarlona when the tide turns, and the Inspired are turned into good or neutral spirits?

1) Do the new spirits have the knowledge about the open minds and vessels running around on the material plane?

2) What would happen to the Kalashtar?

3) And most importantly? what would happen to the people of Riedra when their spiritual leaders suddenly lost all contact with their "guiding spirits"?

Personally I think this:
The Kalashtar would not change in any way since they have escaped the world of dreams.
No the new spirits would not have any idea about the peoples on the material plane in the beginning. But I don't know what they would do with them once they found them.
And the last one depends on what the new dreams wanted to do with the inspired ones. If they learned about the dream turning they might pick up where the Dreaming Dark left and try to make it a better world.

Now I feel I have rambled on enough, feel free to correct me on things I might have missunderstood, your own thoughts on the matter etc, etc.
Syltorian
04-02-08, 11:49 AM All the following is IMO, of course.

1) Do the new spirits have the knowledge about the open minds and vessels running around on the material plane?

No. My reason for this claim, despite the fact that most outsiders who die and reform retain some memories, is that the current Quori do not have any memories of the previous age, or any idea what happened in the war against the giants. Also, since the Inspired lines are tied to individual Quori spirits (iirc - I'm not sure whether that was ever quoted officially, though, but I believe it was mentioned on the boards at least), the Empty Minds would not even be as accessible to the reborn spirits.

2) What would happen to the Kalashtar?

IMO, nothing. They have severed all ties to the Region of Dreams, just as you suggest yourself. Of course, this is not an absolute certainty, and the kalashtar themselves do not know. Perhaps they would feel that, now that the Age has turned, they should give up their spirits (somehow) and increase the good feelings... or they could become the agents of the new age, ensuring that it does not turn again.

Also, if the kalashtar remain, they can tell the Quori of question 1) about the previous age.

3) And most importantly? what would happen to the people of Riedra when their spiritual leaders suddenly lost all contact with their "guiding spirits"?

That the spiritual leaders lose contact will probably not be as bad as the Riedran Dreamcasting Corporation shutting down. People will lack the guidance offered by the monoliths. They'll experience chaotic dreams. Communication between the various provinces will break down. I would assume that some leaders try to conduct desperate and futile purges and inquisition to remove the taint that keeps them separated from the great spirits.

I would also assume that Riedra will eventually return to its pre-Sundering state of warfare, unless the good vibes from the new Dal Quor prevents such icky badness. But the Riedrans have been brainwashed for centuries, and it will take time for that to wear off; probably only with the next generation. Though the current ones will be rather confused, with the more chaotic dreams, they will more likely attribute it to sabotage by the evil spirits than see it as a chance to change their ways.

Some groups, such as the Heirs of Ohr Kaluun (evil necromancers following the traditions of an ancient Sarlonan kingdom, for short) could benefit and gain tremendous power.

Of course, that is assuming the kalashtar do not quickly tell the new Quori about the situation, and they somehow manage to possess (or channel) the Inspired; but if I am right in recalling that the lines are connected to specific spirits, that might be more difficult than it appears.
Rania
04-02-08, 03:06 PM For your third question, think about Russia in the late 80s / early 90s. Heck, think about all the countries that USED to be a part of the USSR and are now a -stan.
skrap-san
04-02-08, 06:55 PM Thank you Syltorian, I would also throw the nation into chaos, the Khalashtar on one side, the remnants of the old days on the other. The dragonhouses would sniff out that there was a "shift" of power pretty fast and would start lobbying for access into the land. In short, yes as Ranai said, it would be like Russia falling with all the economic powers of the world waiting patiently at the door.

Now I really need to make a campaign about this...
Hellcow
04-06-08, 09:28 PM No. My reason for this claim, despite the fact that most outsiders who die and reform retain some memories, is that the current Quori do not have any memories of the previous age, or any idea what happened in the war against the giants. Also, since the Inspired lines are tied to individual Quori spirits (iirc - I'm not sure whether that was ever quoted officially, though, but I believe it was mentioned on the boards at least), the Empty Minds would not even be as accessible to the reborn spirits.
Agreed on all counts. It took tens of thousands of years for the new quori to take a direct interest in Eberron after the last turning of the age; I think the most likely thing that would happen would be that the quori would go back to minding their own business, taking a few centuries to assimilate the change and determine their place in the multiverse.

As for Riedra, the loss of the guiding Voice would definitely result in chaos, and without psionic coordination the flow of supplies accross the nation could collapse. Combine that with actions of groups like the Horned Shadow and Heirs of Ohr Kaluun, and I think you'd definitely see the nation collapse into instability. With that said, remember that mind seeds and experienced vessels would still have the personalities of their quori spirits even when the spirits were no more - so they would remain as focal points in the chaos.
skrap-san
04-07-08, 02:09 AM Thank you all for your input. Its mostly a fun concept to play with right now, but I think I might go for it on a later adventure branch. That and the fact that it throws my players a bit "of balance" when it comes down to metagaming...

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
skrap-san 04-02-08, 11:06 AM	I have just finished the dreaming dark trilogy, and I have read my fair share about the Dreaming dark, I haven't read Secrets of Sarlona yet, but it sits in my shelf mocking me with a couple of other books, but I digress... now for a disclaimer, most of the thoughts in this post is going to be a mix and match of Raw and ideas from these boards. So don't shoot me if its not cannon. And this train of thoughts assumes that the Dreaming dark wont manage to stop the turning. What I was pondering is the fact that the Dreaming Dark in the end fear the turning of the tide or what ever it is called. In basic this is when the whole plane goes from "very very bad" to either "really really great" or "meh its OK" Now I don't use psionics that much in my settings due to a reluctance for me to learn the rules and well I don't have the book. But still as I warmed up to the thought I was wondering: What happens to Sarlona when the tide turns, and the Inspired are turned into good or neutral spirits? 1) Do the new spirits have the knowledge about the open minds and vessels running around on the material plane? 2) What would happen to the Kalashtar? 3) And most importantly? what would happen to the people of Riedra when their spiritual leaders suddenly lost all contact with their "guiding spirits"? Personally I think this: The Kalashtar would not change in any way since they have escaped the world of dreams. No the new spirits would not have any idea about the peoples on the material plane in the beginning. But I don't know what they would do with them once they found them. And the last one depends on what the new dreams wanted to do with the inspired ones. If they learned about the dream turning they might pick up where the Dreaming Dark left and try to make it a better world. Now I feel I have rambled on enough, feel free to correct me on things I might have missunderstood, your own thoughts on the matter etc, etc.
Syltorian 04-02-08, 11:49 AM	All the following is IMO, of course. 1) Do the new spirits have the knowledge about the open minds and vessels running around on the material plane? No. My reason for this claim, despite the fact that most outsiders who die and reform retain some memories, is that the current Quori do not have any memories of the previous age, or any idea what happened in the war against the giants. Also, since the Inspired lines are tied to individual Quori spirits (iirc - I'm not sure whether that was ever quoted officially, though, but I believe it was mentioned on the boards at least), the Empty Minds would not even be as accessible to the reborn spirits. 2) What would happen to the Kalashtar? IMO, nothing. They have severed all ties to the Region of Dreams, just as you suggest yourself. Of course, this is not an absolute certainty, and the kalashtar themselves do not know. Perhaps they would feel that, now that the Age has turned, they should give up their spirits (somehow) and increase the good feelings... or they could become the agents of the new age, ensuring that it does not turn again. Also, if the kalashtar remain, they can tell the Quori of question 1) about the previous age. 3) And most importantly? what would happen to the people of Riedra when their spiritual leaders suddenly lost all contact with their "guiding spirits"? That the spiritual leaders lose contact will probably not be as bad as the Riedran Dreamcasting Corporation shutting down. People will lack the guidance offered by the monoliths. They'll experience chaotic dreams. Communication between the various provinces will break down. I would assume that some leaders try to conduct desperate and futile purges and inquisition to remove the taint that keeps them separated from the great spirits. I would also assume that Riedra will eventually return to its pre-Sundering state of warfare, unless the good vibes from the new Dal Quor prevents such icky badness. But the Riedrans have been brainwashed for centuries, and it will take time for that to wear off; probably only with the next generation. Though the current ones will be rather confused, with the more chaotic dreams, they will more likely attribute it to sabotage by the evil spirits than see it as a chance to change their ways. Some groups, such as the Heirs of Ohr Kaluun (evil necromancers following the traditions of an ancient Sarlonan kingdom, for short) could benefit and gain tremendous power. Of course, that is assuming the kalashtar do not quickly tell the new Quori about the situation, and they somehow manage to possess (or channel) the Inspired; but if I am right in recalling that the lines are connected to specific spirits, that might be more difficult than it appears.
Rania 04-02-08, 03:06 PM	For your third question, think about Russia in the late 80s / early 90s. Heck, think about all the countries that USED to be a part of the USSR and are now a -stan.
skrap-san 04-02-08, 06:55 PM	Thank you Syltorian, I would also throw the nation into chaos, the Khalashtar on one side, the remnants of the old days on the other. The dragonhouses would sniff out that there was a "shift" of power pretty fast and would start lobbying for access into the land. In short, yes as Ranai said, it would be like Russia falling with all the economic powers of the world waiting patiently at the door. Now I really need to make a campaign about this...
Hellcow 04-06-08, 09:28 PM	No. My reason for this claim, despite the fact that most outsiders who die and reform retain some memories, is that the current Quori do not have any memories of the previous age, or any idea what happened in the war against the giants. Also, since the Inspired lines are tied to individual Quori spirits (iirc - I'm not sure whether that was ever quoted officially, though, but I believe it was mentioned on the boards at least), the Empty Minds would not even be as accessible to the reborn spirits. Agreed on all counts. It took tens of thousands of years for the new quori to take a direct interest in Eberron after the last turning of the age; I think the most likely thing that would happen would be that the quori would go back to minding their own business, taking a few centuries to assimilate the change and determine their place in the multiverse. As for Riedra, the loss of the guiding Voice would definitely result in chaos, and without psionic coordination the flow of supplies accross the nation could collapse. Combine that with actions of groups like the Horned Shadow and Heirs of Ohr Kaluun, and I think you'd definitely see the nation collapse into instability. With that said, remember that mind seeds and experienced vessels would still have the personalities of their quori spirits even when the spirits were no more - so they would remain as focal points in the chaos.
skrap-san 04-07-08, 02:09 AM	Thank you all for your input. Its mostly a fun concept to play with right now, but I think I might go for it on a later adventure branch. That and the fact that it throws my players a bit "of balance" when it comes down to metagaming...