Post/Author/DateTime	Post
sooperspook 02-13-07, 08:21 AM	From what I've seen, theres no difference in cost, xp or gp, from normal magic items. Why would anyone waste a good feat to create items that can be duplicated by using Craft Wondrous Items? Is there a rule I've missed somewhere? Thanks in advance.
Just another user 02-13-07, 08:40 AM	I don't follow your reasoning 1st what the point of dragonshard item, it is called flavour, the assumption is that in Eberron to create some magic item (or even all of them) you need dragonshards in some form as raw material, part of the gps used to create the item are used to buy them. 2nd why anyone would waste a good feat to create items... etc which feat are you talking about exactly? Can you make some example.
Cifer 02-13-07, 08:55 AM	Dragonshards are simply a part of Eberron's items, in the same way that in another setting one may use a unicorn's horn to make a rod from it. There is no "Craft Dragonshard Item" feat - it's simply done with the standard Wondrous Item/Arms&Armor/whatever.
Ryoden_Anariavas 02-13-07, 09:12 AM	If you are refering to the Eberron/Siberys Shard style Arms and Armor/Wonderous Item type magic items then yes the only reason is perhaps for flavor. Of course many of the magic items are unique to Eberron and therefore they can easly be atributed to that settings flavor. The DM has more ability to enrich the treasure he gives out and therefore make the game more fun. The feat your refering to is most likely the "Bind Elementals" Item creation feat. I believe that this was included to once again distinguish this setting from others and to add flavor. However the items that have this feat as a prerequisite are unique for another reason entirley; they have LIVE Elementals powering them. Thus in most cases the item is more difficult to use than a regular item. An airship costs 92000GP but an Air Keel (from "Arms and Equipment Guide") costs more like 150000GP. The feat isnt really wasted because if you are going to be playing an item making character than you should be playing an Artificer and they get all of the standard Item creation feats as bonus feats anyway. They also have blank "Bonus Feat" slots at every fourth level so they aren't gonna be hurting for feats. If you honestly feel that there is no reason to have the Bind Elementals feat than you shouldnt be playing in Eberron
Cifer 02-13-07, 01:09 PM	If you honestly feel that there is no reason to have the Bind Elementals feat than you shouldnt be playing in Eberron Huh? You also overlook that from a fluff point, the feat is limited almost exclusively to the Zil gnomes. So there's plenty of reasons not to take it, beginning with "The trust would probably kill you if you did".
Wymarc 02-13-07, 01:30 PM	he didn't say that you should take it, just that it should exist
Cifer 02-13-07, 02:40 PM	Well, the wording of The feat isnt really wasted because if you are going to be playing an item making character than you should be playing an Artificer and they get all of the standard Item creation feats as bonus feats anyway. They also have blank "Bonus Feat" slots at every fourth level so they aren't gonna be hurting for feats. didn't sound that way. Of course the feat has a reason to exist - I wasn't debating that.
sooperspook 02-13-07, 09:49 PM	Hmmm. I seem to have hit a nerve with some people, for what reason i don't know. In anycase, I was under the impression that in order to create dragonshard items, I had to have a specific feat. If that is wrong,(can't check cos my books are with someone else), then ignore my ramblings as the result of late night and strong coffee. :) thanks for the replies though. :)
Ricohard_Draconis 02-13-07, 10:11 PM	no dragonshards are largely just a fluff term for some of the unknown items that go into the creation of magic items.
Edymnion 02-14-07, 09:09 PM	I think we may have a communication problem here. Sooperspook, please be a little more specific. Are you talking about specific dragonshard items, like the siberys shard dragonmark boosting items, or are you talking about any old generic magical item using dragonshards? If the latter, the answer is simple. You can't make "normal" magic items in Eberron without dragonshards (not specifically said in the rules, but its something I use in my games, and it is implied by the sourcebooks). The dragonshards (particularly Eberron shards) are an integral part of how all permanent magical items are made, and are a large part of that otherwise unspecific gold cost when making magical items. Its like asking "Why would anyone make a portable electronic device that uses batteries?" In some other reality, there might be a way to power your ipod without using batteries, but in this one, you gotta have that power source to make the other parts work. In Eberron, the dragonshards serve roughly the same purpose as the batteries. They hold and focus the magical energies that allow an item to be a permanent magical item. Any artificer can temporarly charge magic into an item, but that magic fades away over time. A high enough level spellcaster can bombard an item with magical energy via the Permanent spell to make an item hold a spell, but once that spell breaks (aka, its dispelled), the magic fades away like everything else.
sooperspook 02-16-07, 12:33 AM	Wait. All magic items use Dragonshards in Eberron? I thought that only those that specifically have it in their description do. (which were the ones I was talking about incidentally ).
Belabras 02-16-07, 12:39 AM	It's left up to the DM, but the implication is that many, if not all, do use some form of Dragonshard.
Assariel 02-16-07, 04:03 AM	That would implie, that dragonshards aren't that rare as I got the feeling by reading the ECS. In such a magical world as Eberron there would be a huge need for the dragonshards. Or is it possible to part one bigger shard into small bits which could be used for lets say more common magical items? Actually I find it more interesting if those shards would be really rare and therefore in stories an object people might kill for. So the PC's had to look after themselves.
Ryoden_Anariavas 02-16-07, 10:00 AM	There IS a huge need for Dragonshards they are what literaly and figuratively drive the economy An average Eberron dragonshard costs less than 10 GP and acording to the sourcebooks they can be found prety much anywhere there is topsoil so they are not that rare. The Siberys and Kyber vareties are much more powerful and rarer and cost that much more (500-1000GP) and yes are sometimes worth killing over.
Sereno 02-16-07, 10:09 AM	That would implie, that dragonshards aren't that rare as I got the feeling by reading the ECS. In such a magical world as Eberron there would be a huge need for the dragonshards. Or is it possible to part one bigger shard into small bits which could be used for lets say more common magical items? Actually I find it more interesting if those shards would be really rare and therefore in stories an object people might kill for. So the PC's had to look after themselves. It's the Eberron shards that are used in magical crafting ... and they usually come in geodes. Each geode holds lots of small shards (there's a picture of them, somewhere). Khyber shards are for binding. Siberys shards are for enhancing dragonmark abilities. Since they're essentially gemstones, I'd think cutting dragonshards would be similar to cutting any other gem. If you want to have dragonshards that people would kill for, it's probably best to invent "special" shards (like the ones Alina is looking for in Keith's DD novels) that are rather specific in purpose, rather than changing the rarity of ALL dragonshards.
Belabras 02-16-07, 11:42 AM	Also, easily accessible Khyber or Syberis shards have huge value - the economy for them is the basis of House Thrashak basically. A Khyber or Syberis shard of sufficiently size would not only be worth killing for, it would be worth fighting a small scale war over (see the strategy game Dragonshards for just such an example).
Assariel 02-16-07, 02:58 PM	Ah, okay, thanks for the replies. Actually I forgot there are three different shards. This distinction is already quite nice and useable. And thinking about some special dragonshard shouldn't be that problematic. :D
Ricohard_Draconis 02-16-07, 03:11 PM	Also most Siberysis shards land either in the centre of xen'drick or Argonessen neither of which is particularly hospitable to long term mining operations.
Edymnion 02-16-07, 10:03 PM	Wait. All magic items use Dragonshards in Eberron? I thought that only those that specifically have it in their description do. (which were the ones I was talking about incidentally ).Pretty much. Like was already said, its not specifically spelled out, but the flavor text strongly implies that all but the absolute most basic of permanent magical items require dragonshards to power them. And the dragonshards come in all shapes and sizes, as well as grades of quality. Its also never spelled out how many dragonshards, what quality dragonshards, or how big of a dragonshard is required for any given item, just that when you have an item who's base item costs 5 gp, and the enchanting cost is like 5,000 gp, the bulk of that 5k gp is assumed to be made up of dragonshards, either a lot of them, or some very high quality shards, or whatever. Its not said or implied, but I personally extend this to an extreme. The special ink required to scribe scrolls and make entries to spellbooks (which is in the rules as being special), in my game, is actually ink mixed with finely ground dragonshard dust. Basically, many of the shards that are found that are too small or low quality to be used in item creation get tossed in a grinder to make the dust which is then mixed with high quality ink, and it is the dragonshard powder in the ink on the scroll that actually holds the magical charge of the scroll, not just the words on paper. As for rarity, dragonshards have about the same rarity as normal gemstones. Rare enough to be very valuable, but not so rare that anybody with a little money can't get what they want. Heck, in my game, dragonshards *ARE* gemstones. I include them on the gemstone table for random treasure, and many pieces of upscale jewelry use them as centerpiece stones (which explains why magical jewelry is so common, like rings and broaches, they are a readily available pre-made item that come with dragonshards built right in).
Just another user 02-17-07, 01:44 PM	That would implie, that dragonshards aren't that rare as I got the feeling by reading the ECS. In such a magical world as Eberron there would be a huge need for the dragonshards. Or is it possible to part one bigger shard into small bits which could be used for lets say more common magical items? Actually I find it more interesting if those shards would be really rare and therefore in stories an object people might kill for. So the PC's had to look after themselves. There are many kinds and qualities of dragonshards for different kind of items, for exampe for a powerful item you could need a unflawed, high quality dragonshard the size of a egg (or something like that), for a scroll you only need some dragonshard dust, made from defective, low quality crushed dragonshards, to make the ink to write it.
Cifer 02-19-07, 09:09 PM	What Just_another_user said: It's the quality and size that matter, as with nearly all gemstones. For a 200k gp item, you would need a dragonshard worth maybe 70k - a perfect and pretty large one which would be integrated into the item during the creation process. This leaves room for lesser shards not costing as much and for an entire economy based on the damn things.
thebestideaieverhad 02-19-07, 09:30 PM	I think everyone here should give the ECS AND MoE another glance. Dragonshards do NOT give the magical power to ALL magic items in eberron. They usually give a magic item the power to enhance an existing ability given by a dragonmark. The other way they are most commonly used is for elemental binding. Dragonshards are the easiest method of binding elementals to enhance weapons, armor etc... Dragonshards ARE rare in Eberron to most people, simply because the demand. Eberron shards are the most popular of the 3 types and are somewhat available, but not "common". Siberys shards are uncommon even for dragonshards... and the Khyber shards are nearly impossible to find, due to the fact that they are formed underground in the depths of fiend territory. So the overall effect is that you have some that are easier to get than others, but the usefulness is ranked accordingly.
Belabras 02-19-07, 11:48 PM	I think everyone here should give the ECS AND MoE another glance. Dragonshards do NOT give the magical power to ALL magic items in eberron. They usually give a magic item the power to enhance an existing ability given by a dragonmark. The other way they are most commonly used is for elemental binding. Dragonshards are the easiest method of binding elementals to enhance weapons, armor etc... Dragonshards ARE rare in Eberron to most people, simply because the demand. Eberron shards are the most popular of the 3 types and are somewhat available, but not "common". Siberys shards are uncommon even for dragonshards... and the Khyber shards are nearly impossible to find, due to the fact that they are formed underground in the depths of fiend territory. So the overall effect is that you have some that are easier to get than others, but the usefulness is ranked accordingly. Pot, meet kettle. If you reread, you'll find that the elemental binding is done via Khyber shards, and the dragonmark enhancing items via Syberis shards. Eberron shards are used in more mundane items like endless wands.
clayball 02-20-07, 11:27 AM	As others are saying, some Dragonshards are used for specific things. Take the Eberron Dragonshards. Those are used in spell storing items.
sooperspook 02-21-07, 07:42 PM	Yeah, I kind of dislike the idea that Dragonshards are absolutely necessary for all magic items. That they make mass producing magic items easier or cheaper, that I like.
RogueElement 02-21-07, 09:06 PM	I'll chime in with a "like" for needing dragonshards for all magic item creation. It adds a lot of Eberron-specific flavor to the game. Besides, you aren't sprinkling gold dust on your magic items as you're creating them, you're buying something that costs a ton of money in order to craft each item, so it might as well be dragonshards.
UnderworldLord 02-21-07, 09:47 PM	I'd say that at most Eberron shards might be able to replace normal ingredients in magic item creation, but they wouldn't be required.
Edymnion 02-22-07, 07:27 AM	Yeah, I kind of dislike the idea that Dragonshards are absolutely necessary for all magic items.You prefer the idea that there's a little coin slot on the side of your item that you just keep plunking gold coins into until the spell takes hold? Guess that explains why crafting the big ticket item takes so long, it must take forever to put 200,000 coins in there. I know I get ticked when I have to buy my coke with nickels and dimes! ;)
Ryoden_Anariavas 02-22-07, 10:06 AM	I'll chime in with a "like" for needing dragonshards for all magic item creation. It adds a lot of Eberron-specific flavor to the game. Besides, you aren't sprinkling gold dust on your magic items as you're creating them, you're buying something that costs a ton of money in order to craft each item, so it might as well be dragonshards. I agree. I have always hated the hole "you're buying something that costs a ton of money " idea. If the something is Dragonshards for the most part than you can actualy go on a quest to get them. Therefore bypassing the whole need for coinage in the firstplace. I actualy like the idea of sprinkling gold dust. It gives a good reason for precious metals being precious in the first place. It also has merit in the RAW you cant use spells to replicate any of the precious metals or gems. It also explains why some monsters (specificaly dragons) hord treasure. The dragon gets its magical powers from all the gold it sleeps on. better than the big scaly jaybird reason IMO.
DMsDelight 02-22-07, 10:53 AM	As has been before, dragonshards are used in all manner of item creation, and while it doesn't specifically say "all items", it does list a lot of the usual "standard" magic items, leading o the obvious conclusion that most magic items use the shards in some manner, as well as psionic items for that matter. While they are somewhat rare, they are numerous enough that they can be used in such manner as to make a living producing, selling, and using such items. It's the truly BIG ones or NUMEROUS QUANTITY ones that people kill each other for it. And yes, to use the shards for item creation no extra feat is required EXCEPT for the Bind Elemental feat, for elemental bound items that aren't found in DMG. I know, these have all been said, but reiteration and summing it up makes for increased understanding...particularly for people like me who need it repeated to fully understand :p
DMsDelight 02-22-07, 10:56 AM	You prefer the idea that there's a little coin slot on the side of your item that you just keep plunking gold coins into until the spell takes hold? Guess that explains why crafting the big ticket item takes so long, it must take forever to put 200,000 coins in there. I know I get ticked when I have to buy my coke with nickels and dimes! ;) btw...omg I nearly spit my drink on my computer from laughter when I read that...it's like a parking meter...."Son of a....I ran out of spell power...someone give me 10,000 gp...no not silver, it'll take forever and I don't think the mind flayer will wait...I hope I don't get ticketed..."
sooperspook 02-25-07, 09:30 AM	You prefer the idea that there's a little coin slot on the side of your item that you just keep plunking gold coins into until the spell takes hold? Guess that explains why crafting the big ticket item takes so long, it must take forever to put 200,000 coins in there. I know I get ticked when I have to buy my coke with nickels and dimes! ;) Heh. I like that image. Anyway, I tend to think of the expenses in magic item cost as representing the wierd and wonderful things needed. comes from having made items in second ed I guess. Things like, a stone of pure granite, naturally formed, that has never been touched by light. How much do you think the cost of finding and transporting that is going to be? Some of it will be, incense made from rare woods, infused with oils from a Sahuagins pituitary gland. Or, a virgins first kiss. How much would that cost? And, yes, if the player comes up with a reasonable method of acquiring the stuff needed, i'll give them a discount in cost. (But not xp)
Edymnion 02-26-07, 12:54 PM	Heh. I like that image. Anyway, I tend to think of the expenses in magic item cost as representing the wierd and wonderful things needed. comes from having made items in second ed I guess. Things like, a stone of pure granite, naturally formed, that has never been touched by light. How much do you think the cost of finding and transporting that is going to be? Some of it will be, incense made from rare woods, infused with oils from a Sahuagins pituitary gland. Or, a virgins first kiss. How much would that cost? And, yes, if the player comes up with a reasonable method of acquiring the stuff needed, i'll give them a discount in cost. (But not xp)And there's nothing in the dragonshard argument that says that isn't still the case. Its just that instead of having to make up 100% of the fluff about what goes into making the item, you just have one ingrediant given to you as a default. Rather like baking pastries. Just because all of the recipies include flour doesn't mean you can't have near infinite diversity, or any ingrediant you want in there, it just means that one of the most basic ingrediants in any form of bread is some kind of flour. If it doesn't have that, then it isn't bread, its something else. Just like if it doesn't have dragonshards in it, its not a permanent magical item in Eberron, IMO. The inverse holds true as well. Just because it has flour in it does not make it bread, just like eberron jewelry can have dragonshards set into them as gemstones, and not be magical items.
Ryoden_Anariavas 02-26-07, 03:13 PM	And there's nothing in the dragonshard argument that says that isn't still the case. Its just that instead of having to make up 100% of the fluff about what goes into making the item, you just have one ingrediant given to you as a default. Rather like baking pastries. Just because all of the recipies include flour doesn't mean you can't have near infinite diversity, or any ingrediant you want in there, it just means that one of the most basic ingrediants in any form of bread is some kind of flour. If it doesn't have that, then it isn't bread, its something else. Just like if it doesn't have dragonshards in it, its not a permanent magical item in Eberron, IMO. The inverse holds true as well. Just because it has flour in it does not make it bread, just like eberron jewelry can have dragonshards set into them as gemstones, and not be magical items. well said
Nimrud 02-26-07, 11:48 PM	OK so if dragonshards are found in all magic items, does having access to a bunch of dragonshards lower the cost of crafting said magic items? In other words, how much of the component cost of magic items do you think should be represented by dragonshards? For example, let's say it is 25%. So if a magic item costs 20,000 gp, you can lower that cost by 25% if you have access to 5,000 gp worth of dragonshards of the appropriate type and quality. Does that make sense?
Belabras 02-26-07, 11:50 PM	I think having a bunch of dragonshards lowers the cost of making a magic item by basically the value of the dragonshards ;)
Ryoden_Anariavas 02-27-07, 09:37 AM	OK so if dragonshards are found in all magic items, does having access to a bunch of dragonshards lower the cost of crafting said magic items? In other words, how much of the component cost of magic items do you think should be represented by dragonshards? For example, let's say it is 25%. So if a magic item costs 20,000 gp, you can lower that cost by 25% if you have access to 5,000 gp worth of dragonshards of the appropriate type and quality. Does that make sense? Yeah that makes alot of sense. I would even go so far as to make it 50-75% 1: The DM gave the Dragonshards out as treasure just like they would have given gold coinage so it doesnt increase character wealth. 2:It is a heck of alot more satisfying for your artificer to take the "fifty pounds of Eberron shard" and turn it into whatever he is making than for him to sell off the loot and buy the unnamed material component.
Rowan_Whispercloak 02-27-07, 09:58 AM	I actualy like the idea of sprinkling gold dust. It gives a good reason for precious metals being precious in the first place. It also has merit in the RAW you cant use spells to replicate any of the precious metals or gems. It also explains why some monsters (specificaly dragons) hord treasure. The dragon gets its magical powers from all the gold it sleeps on. better than the big scaly jaybird reason IMO. It is pretty much the same thing if you think of the character's just minning for gold. And common treasure almost always includes coins, or items that sell for coins. In Eberron dragonshards could be seen as precious gemstone, but everyone is entitled to their own creative thinking and describtions of how fluff works. I will say that I really like the idea of the use of dragonshards into magical items, I could see using the proper forging techniqes to add specially prepared (that taking a lot of the time working on the item) dragonshards (ground or otherwise) into the creation of the item.
Edymnion 02-28-07, 07:43 PM	OK so if dragonshards are found in all magic items, does having access to a bunch of dragonshards lower the cost of crafting said magic items?In the same manner having a bunch of iron lowers the cost of crafting swords. Its a raw material. If you already have it, you don't have to go out and buy it. If you have 10,000 gp worth of dragonshards, and you say that 5,000 gp of the cost to enchant your new sword is in dragonshards, then you would lower the cost of the sword by 5k gp (but not the time), and mark off 5k gp of dragonshards from your character sheet. Basically, if you have a bunch of dragonshards, you treat it the same as having a bunch of gems, or tradegoods, or gold. Its treasure, its character wealth. You spend that wealth in order to get your item.
sooperspook 03-01-07, 12:47 AM	I kind of like having to make up 100% of the fluff for magic items, but that's probly just me. Requiring Dragonshards in all permanent magic items also makes me wonder, what do outsiders do? As far as I know, there are no Dragonshards in the planes, so how do outsiders and extraplanar non-outsiders make their magic items? I was under the impression that outsiders seldom pop over to Eberron prime, and I can't see an Angel wandering down into Q'barra looking for the shards he needs for his +4 Armour of Holy Niceness. Do they have their own special way of making magic that doesn't require Dragonshards? If so, can mortals learn such a way? Can Artificers duplicate it?
Ryoden_Anariavas 03-01-07, 09:59 AM	Requiring Dragonshards in all permanent magic items also makes me wonder, what do outsiders do? As far as I know, there are no Dragonshards in the planes, so how do outsiders and extraplanar non-outsiders make their magic items? Do they have their own special way of making magic that doesn't require Dragonshards? If so, can mortals learn such a way? Can Artificers duplicate it? I would say that the angel uses something like "the essence of true loves first kiss" something that for an angle is probably easy to harvest. While yes an artificer may be able to use the same non-shard materials it is by far easier to dig up a geode of eberron shards than it is to "boil the gizzard of a 1000 year old chicken" Heck you could go one step farther and say that the advent of the Artificer is a direct result of the ease that eberron shards have with storing magics A wizard/cleric be it human or angle needs to collect a supply newt eyes and dragon poo that is then ground into a paste, boiled for 333 minutes, mix it with troll blood and the tears of a chicken, smear it on the sword and presto you have a +1 sword. The artificer finds a shard of the right clarity and cut, sprinkles a little trolls blood on it, and inserts it into the hilt of the sword. It takes the same amount of time and money but the artificer doesnt have the demand for dragon poo or chicken tears. Not to mention the population of newts is on the rebound. (they are a protected species in Aundair, verge of exctinction and all) You could go one step further and say that the Artificers crafting pool is a result of the same ease that shards offer. Long and short of it. No, dragonshards are not a required part of crafting magical items however when they are used in the process it makes the "fluff" of crafting go more smoothly
sooperspook 03-02-07, 01:48 AM	Ryoden: Ok, thats an angle on item crafting I like. So, magic items can be made the traditional way (with strange often abstract requirements that must be made manifest somehow) or the easier 'modern' way. (using Dragonshards to replace some of the more difficult to find stuff). Sounds cool. I think I'll use that. P.s. I also like the idea that Artificers came about as a result of this 'modernizing' of magic.
Nimrud 03-02-07, 12:58 PM	I think having a bunch of dragonshards lowers the cost of making a magic item by basically the value of the dragonshards ;) Sounds simple I know. But think about the advantages to a PC. Instead of selling dragonshards you find for half price, now you have a way of getting full value out of the dragonshards through crafting, or by lowering cost of commissioned items.
Belabras 03-02-07, 01:45 PM	That's true. By cutting out the middle man they've made sure the gems aren't devalued in how they contribute towards the final product.
Ryoden_Anariavas 03-02-07, 02:40 PM	Sounds simple I know. But think about the advantages to a PC. Instead of selling dragonshards you find for half price, now you have a way of getting full value out of the dragonshards through crafting, or by lowering cost of commissioned items. I dont know if that was ever in the books but I thought that dragonshards were a comodity like art/gems/gold and not sold at half price. BTW thank you sooperspook
Just another user 03-02-07, 05:20 PM	Sounds simple I know. But think about the advantages to a PC. Instead of selling dragonshards you find for half price, now you have a way of getting full value out of the dragonshards through crafting, or by lowering cost of commissioned items. Dragonshards are "trade goods" like gems, they don't sell at half price. A diamond is not worth less because you bought it from someone else.
Edymnion 03-02-07, 08:54 PM	Dragonshards are "trade goods" like gems, they don't sell at half price. A diamond is not worth less because you bought it from someone else.Actually, gemstones are not trade goods (unless 3.5 changed it when I wasn't looking), and dragonshards are never mentioned as being trade goods either. Making gemstones into tadegoods is a very common houserule though.
RogueElement 03-02-07, 11:56 PM	You prefer the idea that there's a little coin slot on the side of your item that you just keep plunking gold coins into until the spell takes hold? Guess that explains why crafting the big ticket item takes so long, it must take forever to put 200,000 coins in there. I know I get ticked when I have to buy my coke with nickels and dimes! LOL. And those damn Canadian gold pieces never work.
RogueElement 03-02-07, 11:58 PM	Actually, gemstones are not trade goods (unless 3.5 changed it when I wasn't looking), and dragonshards are never mentioned as being trade goods either. Making gemstones into tadegoods is a very common houserule though. You just dig them up with a pickaxe if you have the Mining skill and sell them at the Auction House. Oops, sorry wrong game.
Just another user 03-03-07, 04:37 PM	Actually, gemstones are not trade goods (unless 3.5 changed it when I wasn't looking), and dragonshards are never mentioned as being trade goods either. Making gemstones into tadegoods is a very common houserule though. in the SRD trade goods are defined as "a valuable good that can be easily exchanged almost as if it were cash itself." and if gems (and by extension dragonshards) are not covered by this definition I don't know what is.
Edymnion 03-07-07, 12:43 PM	in the SRD trade goods are defined as "a valuable good that can be easily exchanged almost as if it were cash itself." and if gems (and by extension dragonshards) are not covered by this definition I don't know what is.Yes, but that definition could cover ANYTHING in the right situations. A shotglass is called a shotglass because in the old west, a bullet was worth 12 cents, and thats how much 12 cents of liquor cost. You could literally pay for a drink with a bullet, hence "Give me a shot of X". However, in the RAW, there is a list of trade goods, and gemstones are not on it, nor does the gemstone entry say they can be used as tradegoods. So, while you can (and probably should) houserule gems onto the list, they're not there automatically. And really, given the amount of skill needed to appraise a gemstone (unlike say, a pound of wheat), there would be many people that wouldn't know how much a stone was worth, making it useless as a trade good.
Cifer 03-07-07, 01:33 PM	And really, given the amount of skill needed to appraise a gemstone (unlike say, a pound of wheat), there would be many people that wouldn't know how much a stone was worth, making it useless as a trade good. I wouldn't be too sure about that one - after all, the cheapest gemstones are already worth 10 gp (which is still a sum that can be paid in gp easily, so no real need exists for them), but as soon as we get to sums that would be awkward to carry around in gold pieces, I'd expect merchants who deal with goods that valuable to have someone on hand who can appraise the stuff, simply because it's practical.
Lancer2010 03-07-07, 10:38 PM	LOL. And those damn Canadian gold pieces never work. Hey! Our gold pieces work just fine!