Xen'drik only a high level place? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Xen'drik only a high level place? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Maldroth
06-19-07, 11:20 AM Having problems getting my Eberron campaign to take off I have one player that is adamant that Xen'drik is only for high level adventurers. I've been wanting to do an Explorer's Company type of game and Xen'drik is a very likely target. I could just remove the obstruction but we game at his house.

His arguement is that as soon as you enter the jungles you have giants and drow to contend with, second to get permits to go to Xen'drik is expensive and low level characters wouldn't have that kind of money nor would a sponsor back a low level party.

I guess I've never read such things in the books so far so I'm wondering am I reading the wrong information?

Need help to convince him that it would not only be feasable to do this but be a damn fun pulpy kind of game, just the sort of thing that Eberron is.
Symar
06-19-07, 11:35 AM Who says you're immediately heading into giant and drow infested terrain? Certainly there's other areas containing other creatures, that the giants and/or drow may leave alone or not frequent. Keep in mind you have Stormreach as a base of operations, and possibly have adventures within it, also. Maybe enough to get a couple of levels before heading out into the wilderness.
DragoonDarkfire
06-19-07, 11:48 AM Look at it from a certain perspective. Inform him that if you meet up with drow they might not instantly try and kill you and that if you meet up with giants you don't have to go out into a huge brawl against them.

Tact, diplomacy and sneaking can save you sometimes where a sword just can't.
Shady314
06-19-07, 04:01 PM Having problems getting my Eberron campaign to take off I have one player that is adamant that Xen'drik is only for high level adventurers. I've been wanting to do an Explorer's Company type of game and Xen'drik is a very likely target. I could just remove the obstruction but we game at his house.

His arguement is that as soon as you enter the jungles you have giants and drow to contend with, second to get permits to go to Xen'drik is expensive and low level characters wouldn't have that kind of money nor would a sponsor back a low level party.

I guess I've never read such things in the books so far so I'm wondering am I reading the wrong information?

Need help to convince him that it would not only be feasable to do this but be a damn fun pulpy kind of game, just the sort of thing that Eberron is.

Inform him that if his interpretation was accurate the list of people that could explore Xendrik would be tiny indeed and it would not be explored much at all and probably would not have a settlement on it's shores. What would be the point of Stormreach if there weren't a lot of people using it as a stepping off point to go into Xendrik? You're going to sail through Shargon's teeth and all that danger to get to Stormreach? No you're doing it to get to Xendrik. Stormreach is just where you dock. All Stormreach is is a big outpost for explorers and the economy that has built up around them.

It's not like the beach is magically safe from predators and the jungle has the only threats. Even getting to Xendrik is a dangerous sea voyage. And even by airship there are threats in the air. And those sailors and such are not all high level bad asses. Hey there are people that raid the Mournlands! Xendrik is badass but I'd say the Mournland is a way worse dungeon.

Argonnessen (the interior) is the exclusive high level threat. The whole continent is practically a mystery and the only people that could be said to EVER regularly step foot there are those Seren priests.

The jungle of Xendrik is dangerous but it's not "infested" with drow or giants or exclusively high level threats. Which incidentally are not automatically high level threats. Where does it say all Drow are high level and PC classed? Nowhere. Where does it say when you run into giants they will be a group and in perfect health. Maybe they do encounter a Giant but luckily it just encountered a Drow war party and is at half health etc. Slap a fairly powerful NPC on with them for awhile. Their guide provided by their patron. They'll do a lot of the heavy lifting while the PCs back him up and ultimately courier the "goods" back to the patron.

Morgrave and other universities have funded and gone on expeditions into Xendrik with mostly experts and warriors. This is where guides and track and the survival skill is useful. Instead of hunting things down you can use those skills to avoid beasties.

There's a trade in that serpent skin from SoX. I don't think high level awesome people are spending their time hunting pelts. I mean you COULD have a lvl 9 fighter that is doing that but it'd be pretty lame.

Plenty of patrons would be willing to finance a low level party going into Xendrik. Maybe not to go to the ultimate uber temple of doom no one has ever seen and lived to tell about. But if they'll fund a team of university professors and students to go why not a team of PCs? Anyone with PC class levels is automatically awesome in Eberron and better than like 90% of the entire population.

I think a case could be made Xendrik is "best" at mid levels up to high. But it's not exclusive.

Convince him it's fun? It's Indiana Jones man! You don't want to explore the shattered remnants of the greatest Empire in the history of Eberron? Not counting the Demons and Dragons of course.
You don't want to map unexplored lands or discover ruins, monuments, natural landmarks? Who do you think that stuff get's named after?
Maldroth
06-19-07, 04:08 PM well that's what I was thinking but he's making a huge deal on how dangerous it is to get there and no one would bother with the time. Then again he's also convinced that the mournlands is high level only since you can't use magical healing.

I'm thinking he's just digging in his heels becuase he doesn't want to play rather than a fact of he doesn't want to go there. Thanks for the input seems he's not really accurate about how much he knows about the setting.
Shady314
06-19-07, 04:20 PM well that's what I was thinking but he's making a huge deal on how dangerous it is to get there and no one would bother with the time. Then again he's also convinced that the mournlands is high level only since you can't use magical healing.

I'm thinking he's just digging in his heels becuase he doesn't want to play rather than a fact of he doesn't want to go there. Thanks for the input seems he's not really accurate about how much he knows about the setting.

Well disproving that about the Mournland is really easy. The first published Eberron adventure

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/eb/20040702a

has you go there. At like lvl 2 or 3.

The easiest argument to use on him about Xendrik is to just say if no one wanted to go to Xendrik then Stormreach could not exist.

If he doesn't want to play why is he even there?
Meloncov
06-19-07, 06:03 PM Xen'drik is survivable at low levels. Not necessarily "beatable" but survivable. You just have to gather information about what parts of the continent are relatively safe, and be willing to run when necessary.
Nived
06-19-07, 08:36 PM Have you considered doing something inside Stormreach? It is called "The City of Dungeons". Just as Sharn has The Cogs and the Depths which could be full of the Host knows what... the ruins Stormreach was built on extend down for miles. Could be many many many things hiding down there. (Just look at Dungeons & Dragons Online: Stormreach)

Or some of the coastal islands could be the sight of some adventures, that would give you a still foreign and dangerous though more managable eco-system.
Yakman
06-20-07, 12:02 PM xen'drik was carefully designed to be a gigantic dungeon, customized to the DM's choosing. it can be the ultimate low-level as well as the ultimate-high level encounter area.
kentonblack
06-20-07, 07:35 PM Have you considered doing something inside Stormreach? It is called "The City of Dungeons". Just as Sharn has The Cogs and the Depths which could be full of the Host knows what... the ruins Stormreach was built on extend down for miles. Could be many many many things hiding down there. (Just look at Dungeons & Dragons Online: Stormreach)

Or some of the coastal islands could be the sight of some adventures, that would give you a still foreign and dangerous though more managable eco-system.

duuuuude, i forgot about the ruins.

i have a party of 5th-7th players. they need a boost before tackling a Yuan-ti slaver/cult. I FORGOT about the undercity!

THANKS

(that and the kobold sorcerer or necromancer or warlock or WHATEVER that has his own keep there!)
Symar
06-24-07, 12:36 AM Have you considered doing something inside Stormreach? It is called "The City of Dungeons". Just as Sharn has The Cogs and the Depths which could be full of the Host knows what... the ruins Stormreach was built on extend down for miles. Could be many many many things hiding down there. (Just look at Dungeons & Dragons Online: Stormreach)

Or some of the coastal islands could be the sight of some adventures, that would give you a still foreign and dangerous though more managable eco-system.

Ah, never knew that about Stormreach. Helps me rationalize the fact half of Dungeons and Dragons Online takes place inside of it.
If you want DDO as an example, here's a sample of it's quest stories:The low level quests have you doing such things as clearing out kobold infestations from the sewers, and variants off of that. There's a quest for the Silver Flame to shut down a gambling hall. There's a merchant who had a "special shipment" (a dragonshard) stolen and you have to attack the rival's warehouse and defend the main guys warehouse, and it even wraps up at high levels where you assault the rival's HQ directly. Mid levels have you journeying to nearby ruins to do things such as help "friendly" hobgoblins and bugbears reclaim their ancestral ruins from a rival tribe, or go assist an outpost from an invasion of giants. Higher levels you head to the Menechtarun desert where there's a number of quests relating to both the drow and a marilith who has plans of conquering. There's a dragon that invaded one of House Kundarak's vaults and you need to take care of it. You get involved with the draconic prophecy some, too, at the current end game locations (which is only level 14).

There's plenty to do in Xend'rik, and it's not all high level. That's like saying it's like most MMOs, where even the deer and boar and rabbits are level 50 at the level 50 areas. D&D isn't an MMO, and you're bound to run into challenges of all levels all over, at the DM's discretion of course.
Kreistor2
06-24-07, 02:46 AM Xen'drik has a reputation as a place of Giants and Drow, and that's fine. You player knows that, and his character having that impression is just as fine.

You, as the DM, can do whatever you want. You are no forced by anyone to place a Storm Giant in the path of a 3rd level party. You can, if you wish, but the suggestion that the party has to face giants is woefully inaccurate.

Your player is automatically wrong, because Eberron is your world to do with as you please.

BTW, there is nothing outright wrong about a 3rd level party meeting a giant in Xen'drik, but it's wrong to wind up with the Storm Giant stomping the PC's into mush. Instead, the PC's should be inclined to talk to it, one way or another. It may have an interesting deal for them.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Maldroth 06-19-07, 11:20 AM	Having problems getting my Eberron campaign to take off I have one player that is adamant that Xen'drik is only for high level adventurers. I've been wanting to do an Explorer's Company type of game and Xen'drik is a very likely target. I could just remove the obstruction but we game at his house. His arguement is that as soon as you enter the jungles you have giants and drow to contend with, second to get permits to go to Xen'drik is expensive and low level characters wouldn't have that kind of money nor would a sponsor back a low level party. I guess I've never read such things in the books so far so I'm wondering am I reading the wrong information? Need help to convince him that it would not only be feasable to do this but be a damn fun pulpy kind of game, just the sort of thing that Eberron is.
Symar 06-19-07, 11:35 AM	Who says you're immediately heading into giant and drow infested terrain? Certainly there's other areas containing other creatures, that the giants and/or drow may leave alone or not frequent. Keep in mind you have Stormreach as a base of operations, and possibly have adventures within it, also. Maybe enough to get a couple of levels before heading out into the wilderness.
DragoonDarkfire 06-19-07, 11:48 AM	Look at it from a certain perspective. Inform him that if you meet up with drow they might not instantly try and kill you and that if you meet up with giants you don't have to go out into a huge brawl against them. Tact, diplomacy and sneaking can save you sometimes where a sword just can't.
Shady314 06-19-07, 04:01 PM	Having problems getting my Eberron campaign to take off I have one player that is adamant that Xen'drik is only for high level adventurers. I've been wanting to do an Explorer's Company type of game and Xen'drik is a very likely target. I could just remove the obstruction but we game at his house. His arguement is that as soon as you enter the jungles you have giants and drow to contend with, second to get permits to go to Xen'drik is expensive and low level characters wouldn't have that kind of money nor would a sponsor back a low level party. I guess I've never read such things in the books so far so I'm wondering am I reading the wrong information? Need help to convince him that it would not only be feasable to do this but be a damn fun pulpy kind of game, just the sort of thing that Eberron is. Inform him that if his interpretation was accurate the list of people that could explore Xendrik would be tiny indeed and it would not be explored much at all and probably would not have a settlement on it's shores. What would be the point of Stormreach if there weren't a lot of people using it as a stepping off point to go into Xendrik? You're going to sail through Shargon's teeth and all that danger to get to Stormreach? No you're doing it to get to Xendrik. Stormreach is just where you dock. All Stormreach is is a big outpost for explorers and the economy that has built up around them. It's not like the beach is magically safe from predators and the jungle has the only threats. Even getting to Xendrik is a dangerous sea voyage. And even by airship there are threats in the air. And those sailors and such are not all high level bad asses. Hey there are people that raid the Mournlands! Xendrik is badass but I'd say the Mournland is a way worse dungeon. Argonnessen (the interior) is the exclusive high level threat. The whole continent is practically a mystery and the only people that could be said to EVER regularly step foot there are those Seren priests. The jungle of Xendrik is dangerous but it's not "infested" with drow or giants or exclusively high level threats. Which incidentally are not automatically high level threats. Where does it say all Drow are high level and PC classed? Nowhere. Where does it say when you run into giants they will be a group and in perfect health. Maybe they do encounter a Giant but luckily it just encountered a Drow war party and is at half health etc. Slap a fairly powerful NPC on with them for awhile. Their guide provided by their patron. They'll do a lot of the heavy lifting while the PCs back him up and ultimately courier the "goods" back to the patron. Morgrave and other universities have funded and gone on expeditions into Xendrik with mostly experts and warriors. This is where guides and track and the survival skill is useful. Instead of hunting things down you can use those skills to avoid beasties. There's a trade in that serpent skin from SoX. I don't think high level awesome people are spending their time hunting pelts. I mean you COULD have a lvl 9 fighter that is doing that but it'd be pretty lame. Plenty of patrons would be willing to finance a low level party going into Xendrik. Maybe not to go to the ultimate uber temple of doom no one has ever seen and lived to tell about. But if they'll fund a team of university professors and students to go why not a team of PCs? Anyone with PC class levels is automatically awesome in Eberron and better than like 90% of the entire population. I think a case could be made Xendrik is "best" at mid levels up to high. But it's not exclusive. Convince him it's fun? It's Indiana Jones man! You don't want to explore the shattered remnants of the greatest Empire in the history of Eberron? Not counting the Demons and Dragons of course. You don't want to map unexplored lands or discover ruins, monuments, natural landmarks? Who do you think that stuff get's named after?
Maldroth 06-19-07, 04:08 PM	well that's what I was thinking but he's making a huge deal on how dangerous it is to get there and no one would bother with the time. Then again he's also convinced that the mournlands is high level only since you can't use magical healing. I'm thinking he's just digging in his heels becuase he doesn't want to play rather than a fact of he doesn't want to go there. Thanks for the input seems he's not really accurate about how much he knows about the setting.
Shady314 06-19-07, 04:20 PM	well that's what I was thinking but he's making a huge deal on how dangerous it is to get there and no one would bother with the time. Then again he's also convinced that the mournlands is high level only since you can't use magical healing. I'm thinking he's just digging in his heels becuase he doesn't want to play rather than a fact of he doesn't want to go there. Thanks for the input seems he's not really accurate about how much he knows about the setting. Well disproving that about the Mournland is really easy. The first published Eberron adventure http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/eb/20040702a has you go there. At like lvl 2 or 3. The easiest argument to use on him about Xendrik is to just say if no one wanted to go to Xendrik then Stormreach could not exist. If he doesn't want to play why is he even there?
Meloncov 06-19-07, 06:03 PM	Xen'drik is survivable at low levels. Not necessarily "beatable" but survivable. You just have to gather information about what parts of the continent are relatively safe, and be willing to run when necessary.
Nived 06-19-07, 08:36 PM	Have you considered doing something inside Stormreach? It is called "The City of Dungeons". Just as Sharn has The Cogs and the Depths which could be full of the Host knows what... the ruins Stormreach was built on extend down for miles. Could be many many many things hiding down there. (Just look at Dungeons & Dragons Online: Stormreach) Or some of the coastal islands could be the sight of some adventures, that would give you a still foreign and dangerous though more managable eco-system.
Yakman 06-20-07, 12:02 PM	xen'drik was carefully designed to be a gigantic dungeon, customized to the DM's choosing. it can be the ultimate low-level as well as the ultimate-high level encounter area.
kentonblack 06-20-07, 07:35 PM	Have you considered doing something inside Stormreach? It is called "The City of Dungeons". Just as Sharn has The Cogs and the Depths which could be full of the Host knows what... the ruins Stormreach was built on extend down for miles. Could be many many many things hiding down there. (Just look at Dungeons & Dragons Online: Stormreach) Or some of the coastal islands could be the sight of some adventures, that would give you a still foreign and dangerous though more managable eco-system. duuuuude, i forgot about the ruins. i have a party of 5th-7th players. they need a boost before tackling a Yuan-ti slaver/cult. I FORGOT about the undercity! THANKS (that and the kobold sorcerer or necromancer or warlock or WHATEVER that has his own keep there!)
Symar 06-24-07, 12:36 AM	Have you considered doing something inside Stormreach? It is called "The City of Dungeons". Just as Sharn has The Cogs and the Depths which could be full of the Host knows what... the ruins Stormreach was built on extend down for miles. Could be many many many things hiding down there. (Just look at Dungeons & Dragons Online: Stormreach) Or some of the coastal islands could be the sight of some adventures, that would give you a still foreign and dangerous though more managable eco-system. Ah, never knew that about Stormreach. Helps me rationalize the fact half of Dungeons and Dragons Online takes place inside of it. If you want DDO as an example, here's a sample of it's quest stories:The low level quests have you doing such things as clearing out kobold infestations from the sewers, and variants off of that. There's a quest for the Silver Flame to shut down a gambling hall. There's a merchant who had a "special shipment" (a dragonshard) stolen and you have to attack the rival's warehouse and defend the main guys warehouse, and it even wraps up at high levels where you assault the rival's HQ directly. Mid levels have you journeying to nearby ruins to do things such as help "friendly" hobgoblins and bugbears reclaim their ancestral ruins from a rival tribe, or go assist an outpost from an invasion of giants. Higher levels you head to the Menechtarun desert where there's a number of quests relating to both the drow and a marilith who has plans of conquering. There's a dragon that invaded one of House Kundarak's vaults and you need to take care of it. You get involved with the draconic prophecy some, too, at the current end game locations (which is only level 14). There's plenty to do in Xend'rik, and it's not all high level. That's like saying it's like most MMOs, where even the deer and boar and rabbits are level 50 at the level 50 areas. D&D isn't an MMO, and you're bound to run into challenges of all levels all over, at the DM's discretion of course.
Kreistor2 06-24-07, 02:46 AM	Xen'drik has a reputation as a place of Giants and Drow, and that's fine. You player knows that, and his character having that impression is just as fine. You, as the DM, can do whatever you want. You are no forced by anyone to place a Storm Giant in the path of a 3rd level party. You can, if you wish, but the suggestion that the party has to face giants is woefully inaccurate. Your player is automatically wrong, because Eberron is your world to do with as you please. BTW, there is nothing outright wrong about a 3rd level party meeting a giant in Xen'drik, but it's wrong to wind up with the Storm Giant stomping the PC's into mush. Instead, the PC's should be inclined to talk to it, one way or another. It may have an interesting deal for them.