Post/Author/DateTime	Post
HazardousIndex 07-30-06, 06:06 PM	I'm sure there's a better place for this thread, but I thought my fellow cabal members would have more knowledge on the dark arts. So, how do undead work in the RPGA, and how will they work in XE and our faction? Animate Dead is normally a costly spell, so I imagine it's even more so here. Also, will we be able to run around with a legion of the dead following us without the proper authorities or the CoL getting on our case? I just can't fathom how this is going to work! Thanks in advance.
jeffpicard 07-30-06, 07:39 PM	Gee yet another thing the standards are silent on... The MoH standards though did give a reference for Create deathless, so hopefully we'll get that section back in this one: as far as those spells were concerned: the material component was the same price as in ECS, had to come from CoH (a distinction not made in this campaign, so doubt that will apply) it's confusing as to whether you could ONLY do it at the beginning of a given adventure, or if you could do it again later if the desire /need arose I think the wording was to imply that you could start the adventure with the creature, but it was spent from your first day's spell slots if you did so Likely, animate dead and the create undead spells will work the same way, you can make a single casting (probably of each) just before you start (thus those spells are spent that first day) and not cost any extra As for how NPCs and Other faction players will react to your skeletal army, I can make no guesses ;-)
LachlarlanIII 07-31-06, 10:02 AM	As for how NPCs and Other faction players will react to your skeletal army, I can make no guesses ;-) Just tell em you're from Kharrnath (sp?) and that it is "normal" for your people.
DragonDai 08-04-06, 03:40 AM	yeah, so I have all sorts of questions about this, cause this is the sort of character I want to play. And of course, the one area the Xen'Drake Campain Standard needed to elaborate on, the never before done evil part, they didn't. I am not saying they won't, but it sure does make it hard to plan properly... I want to play a True Necromancer. This class is most deffenetly Restricted in the MoH CS, but I don't see any reason that the Cabal Members shouldn't have access to it. However, it doesn't require you to be evil, just non-good, so it isn't auto-limited, and since we have no Restricted List yet, I can't effectivily play my Cabal Character. See, a True Necromancer needs both a high Int/Cha and a high Wis, cause he has to be both a divine and arcane caster. So I am spending almost all of my measily 25 points (LORD I LOVE Greyhawk, 28 point buy is 1mil times better than 25...mine as well have 24) on my Int and Wis (wizard/cleric combo). But if I cannot Prestige into that, for whatever reason, then I am spending a buttload of my 25 points into a (nearly) worthless Int. So if I go and play a mod with this guy, and then later learn that I cannot play a True Necromancer down the line, can I retool my stats??? If I can't, I guess I just get to either play a Warlock, like everyone else, or I get to sit around and not play the Cabal games while everyone else in my town goes and plays those mods with thier Warlocks. So there is question one. Question two is, how do we determine the cost of a Animate Dead Scroll? In the DMG, it cost 625, which I assume is to pay for the 25g gem you have to use per hit die of the monsters you want to raise. Subtracting 375g from the price (the price of a normal 3rd lvl spell) and then dividing the 250 left by 25g means that the DMG scroll charges you for 10 hit dice of undead as per the spell (25g per hit die*10 hit die=250g+375g for 3rd lvl scroll=625g). So does this mean that the scroll will only animate 10hd worth of undead no matter how much the caster could normally cast (likely)? Does this mean the scroll will raise as many hit die as the caster can control (unlikely)? And if the likely situation wins out, could you make the scroll to raise more/less hit die by changing the cost (25g per hit die*5 hit die=125g+375g for 3rd lvl scroll=500g)? It is late and the unfinished state of the Xen'Drake CS has me a little aggitated (no offence to the Faction Masters who I am sure are working their butts off) so even though there were a bunch of other questions I had about this topic, I am just gana go for now cause I can't remember anymore. But if I do, I will be back to post them... Thanks for the help in advance, Ciao, DragonDai
Sianger 08-05-06, 12:21 AM	Question two is, how do we determine the cost of a Animate Dead Scroll? In the DMG, it cost 625, which I assume is to pay for the 25g gem you have to use per hit die of the monsters you want to raise. Subtracting 375g from the price (the price of a normal 3rd lvl spell) and then dividing the 250 left by 25g means that the DMG scroll charges you for 10 hit dice of undead as per the spell (25g per hit die*10 hit die=250g+375g for 3rd lvl scroll=625g). So does this mean that the scroll will only animate 10hd worth of undead no matter how much the caster could normally cast (likely)? Does this mean the scroll will raise as many hit die as the caster can control (unlikely)? And if the likely situation wins out, could you make the scroll to raise more/less hit die by changing the cost (25g per hit die*5 hit die=125g+375g for 3rd lvl scroll=500g)? 625 is 375 as for a normal scroll (Level 3 spell x CL 5 minimum x 25 gp), plus 250 for 25 gp x 10 HD of undead (2 per caster level). The scroll will act as if cast by the scriber, not the user, so it will animate up to 10 HD of undead. As per the animate dead spell, if that's more than the user can control, then the user loses control of some undead. I doubt you can make the scroll raise fewer hit dice than 10, because of the minimum caster level requirement; to make the scroll raise more, just raise the caster level (and the cost) accordingly, so for instance to get a 12-HD animate dead scroll would cost 3 x 6 x 25 for the spell, plus 25 x 12 for the components, a total of 750 gp. Do note that an animate dead scroll, like any other consumable magic item, would cost 5 times the published cost, as per the Campaign Standards. The Campaign Standards also specifically mention raising undead as one of the things the world would react badly to. So.
DragonDai 08-05-06, 10:18 PM	Yeah, I figured as much that most of the world would consider raising the dead evil, but hey, we are the Cabal, and besides, Karrnath is only a hop skip and a jump away...sorta hehehehe...Gnome Necromancers Forever! (now if we could just get a little offical help on this) Thanks in advance, Ciao, DragonDai
HazardousIndex 08-06-06, 12:40 AM	I wonder how a class like "True Necromancer" could require "any nongood" when every spell to raise the dead (excluding deathless) has an evil descriptor. I want to play a neutral cleric of the cabal, but I still want to raise dead because my character would see them as tools and nothing more. But, I'm thinking maybe this is going to be impossible. So I either have to choose to be evil and get the undead (maaaybe), or I have to choose to be neutral (and have a much more playable character) but totally change my character idea. Ugh, you know, being evil is ultimately turning out to be way more trouble than it's worth. Not to mention, evil Cabal members don't get access to any power besides being evil? That's totally lame, especially considering that every other faction gets a power, regardless of alignment. I just don't think being evil is going to be the great reward that people see it as. Maybe I should go bring a backup Crimson Codex character...just in case.
jeffpicard 08-06-06, 01:17 AM	I wonder how a class like "True Necromancer" could require "any nongood" when every spell to raise the dead (excluding deathless) has an evil descriptor. I want to play a neutral cleric of the cabal, but I still want to raise dead because my character would see them as tools and nothing more. But, I'm thinking maybe this is going to be impossible. So I either have to choose to be evil and get the undead (maaaybe), or I have to choose to be neutral (and have a much more playable character) but totally change my character idea. Ugh, you know, being evil is ultimately turning out to be way more trouble than it's worth. Not to mention, evil Cabal members don't get access to any power besides being evil? That's totally lame, especially considering that every other faction gets a power, regardless of alignment. I just don't think being evil is going to be the great reward that people see it as. Maybe I should go bring a backup Crimson Codex character...just in case. ??? Your logic has confused me True necromancer requires nongood, are you planning on having a good alignment? the only characters that can't cast spells with the evil descriptor (on their spell lists) are Good Clerics and Good Druids (yeah there's NO mechanicla restriction keeping a good wizard frlom casting Animate Dead if he needs some cheap disposable guards) and the ECS removes that restriction from Clerics Your Neutral True Necromancer should work just fine, just because people won't like you doing it won't necessarily stop you.
DragonDai 08-06-06, 11:17 AM	Yeah, I agree with Jeffpicard, but the big question is, are these non-good prestige classes gana even be allowed? I sure hope so. Cookie cutter parties filled with lots of warlocks don't make for the most interesting group hehehehe Ciao, DragonDai
HazardousIndex 08-09-06, 01:37 AM	Oh, ok. So, neutral PCs (the alignment of my character) are still allowed to cast evil spells? Good. I thought that if you cast them, it generated one of those crazy Living Greyhawk alignment shift thingies and you became evil. (Which would make being a neutral undead-raiser pointless since casting all those evil spells would eventually just turn you evil) Thanks, everyone. I think I understand now.... ...not that I understand how XE is even going to handle undead, yet! But I guess I don't really need to know until about 5th level anyways...
lordtiberiusfoxx 08-09-06, 01:53 AM	The Cabal doesn't suffer from alignment shift story objects anyway... although I was reading that one of the test groups for the Cabal DEMANDED that one of the members get an alignment shift object towards being good for not being evil enough, and got teased as the "paladin" of the group.
RLRapp 10-19-06, 08:04 PM	So, was any of this answered in the new draft of the campaign standards?
Butterface 10-19-06, 11:54 PM	Yeah, I'm playing a future True Necromancer as well. I'd like hear Greg Marks elaborate on the role he sees undead-raising PC's playing in the Cabal. Side note - If it's not listed as restricted, and it's not in a primary sourcebook (ECS, PH, DMG, MM), it's limited, and can be opened up with expansion slots. Such is the case with True Necromancer (someone correct me if I'm wrong here).
Skerrit 10-20-06, 10:02 AM	Yeah, I'm playing a future True Necromancer as well. I'd like hear Greg Marks elaborate on the role he sees undead-raising PC's playing in the Cabal. There's no problem with raising, controlling, commanding undead. You don't get to keep them between mods, and you can't raise a fallen PC since they will be raised by the Cabal, but there's nothing to say you can't have other undead. That said, don't expect people in Stormreach to say "Oh, it's okay that he commands that pack of ghouls. His faction gets to be evil." Course if you are in the jungle and no one can see you... knock yourself out.
Butterface 10-20-06, 10:23 AM	There's no problem with raising, controlling, commanding undead. You don't get to keep them between mods, and you can't raise a fallen PC since they will be raised by the Cabal, but there's nothing to say you can't have other undead. That said, don't expect people in Stormreach to say "Oh, it's okay that he commands that pack of ghouls. His faction gets to be evil." Course if you are in the jungle and no one can see you... knock yourself out. Excellent. Libris Mortis, here I come. :evillaugh