Post/Author/DateTime	Post
echoota 08-16-07, 11:03 PM	So, how will this impact the campaign? Will the final slew of modules be converted over to the new rules set or will we be finishing the campaign out in 3.5? I'd assume it would be the later, but wouldn't put it past WotC to want to push the latest version of the rules.
JJeff 08-16-07, 11:38 PM	Well, given that they did say that it is suggested to restart a 3.5 game to use 4.0 instead of trying to convert, I would say we finish XE in 3.5 and then we play.... err... Living FR in 4.0??
Evanta 08-16-07, 11:54 PM	Xendrik will probably end in 2008 anyway, it's supposed to be a 3-year run (or something like that). I hope Eberron campaigns continue, I like the setting a lot more than Greyhawk.
Marcus Majarra 08-17-07, 09:09 AM	Xendrik will probably end in 2008 anyway, it's supposed to be a 3-year run (or something like that). I hope Eberron campaigns continue, I like the setting a lot more than Greyhawk. If it's a 3-year run, then you can expect the campaign to end in 2009 (since it started at GenCon 2006). Given that a level kick is worth 3 levels and that you get two per year, the campaign should hit level 19 by DDXP 2009. In any case, I too prefer Eberron to Greyhawk (and even the Forgotten Realms). I'm all for another campaign in this setting, once Xen'drik Expeditions are over.
WolfStar76 08-18-07, 11:03 AM	Rumors here at GenCon are that XE will expire at GenCon next year. Tonight's RPGA member's meeting is supposed to cover what's going to happen to RPGA and 4E.
TMoonshadow 08-18-07, 11:12 PM	It sounds like the final adventures for Xen'drick will be at Origins 2008, and they will still use the 3.5 rules for the finale.
Ishorn 08-19-07, 10:15 AM	It sounds like the final adventures for Xen'drick will be at Origins 2008, and they will still use the 3.5 rules for the finale. You are right it ends at Origins 2008. The whole D&D campaigns come to a halt. The RPGA will stop Living Kalamar then too. The only campaign will be Living Forgotten Realms the Vanilla of campaign settings.
Nuddawan 08-19-07, 01:54 PM	You are right it ends at Origins 2008. The whole D&D campaigns come to a halt. The RPGA will stop Living Kalamar then too. The only campaign will be Living Forgotten Realms the Vanilla of campaign settings. No, there will be a new "D&D Campaigns" as well, they just haven't announced the specifics of it yet. Robert Little
Ishorn 08-19-07, 02:02 PM	No, there will be a new "D&D Campaigns" as well, they just haven't announced the specifics of it yet. Robert Little Why can'it be a Forgotten Realms campaign and Eberron get the Living Campaign right out of the gate of 4th editions wake.
WolfStar76 08-19-07, 03:52 PM	Why can'it be a Forgotten Realms campaign and Eberron get the Living Campaign right out of the gate of 4th editions wake. I can think of a few reasons - they may or may not be the right ones, but here's what I can come up with: 1) Resources. Living campaigns appear (from, admittedly, an outsider's point of view) to take a good chunk of RPGA resources (time, people, etc). Running a 2nd Living campaign might well just be beyond the current means available to the RPGA. 2) Eberron rather lends itself more to the D&D Campaigns if you ask me. Given the pulp nature of Eberron, action points, and other bits of the Eberron flavor, that might lose something in a Living system. I dunno that those are necisarrily *good* reasons, and #2 could be overcome with a little work I'm sure, but they're probably why we won't see Living Eberron out of the gates. If you really like Living *and* Eberron, keep your fingers crossed and let the RPGA know. Maybe they can cook something up for 09. :)
Vigabrand 08-20-07, 05:08 PM	Wizards just removed any reason to play RPGA for me. I hate the FR, and I despise level bumps. I was really hoping for a Living Eberron. To have a character that I actually might care for, and work towards. To have Eberron divided into regions that we could help develop and grow with. I don't even care about AR's, the online tracking is fine with me, but earning your advancement and your gold is a huge part of D&D. Apparently Eberron is where Wizards wants to attract the lazy noobs. I'd bet that most of us play it because its the only Eberron out there(non home game) and we love Eberron, not because every six months we get a free ride. Anyone know what the rationale is? A lot of disgruntled LG fans would come to a Living Eberron over a Living FR (most of my friends and acquaintances), but they would rather watch Dungeons and Dragons the Movie again, rather than mess with level bumps.
DBlizzard 08-20-07, 05:45 PM	Here is the quote from the this thread (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=908402) (for some reason they decided to put it in the Living Greyhawk forum only): Xen’drik Expeditions will also be concluding at Origins 2008. As the D&D Campaigns programs use 2-year story arcs, the campaign pulls into its last stop right on time. The Factionmasters have prepared a great final story arc that really engages all of the factions into a final two-round spectacular at Origins next year. Stormreach will never be the same after it’s over. With Xen’drik Expeditions ending, a new D&D Campaigns program will take its place. As it is scheduled to begin in late summer/fall 2008, we can’t yet announce what it will be, but it will improve upon the success of Xen’drik. (Of course, we’ll be looking for help with that as well – once again, check on the website in a few weeks for more info.)
githmorien 08-20-07, 08:09 PM	Man, I'm personally horrified by all this! I still don't have the 3.5 rules under control yet (granted, I'm a tad slow with these things). But the bigger kicker to me is that whereas LG groups grow on trees 'round here, I've had one helluva time trying to find an XE group to play with...which means I've only gotten to play at GenCon '06 and '07. I love this campaign -- and the mag drops! -- I'm not ready for it to go away yet! Prior to Undermountain, I'd never played in the Realms before, and it's something I've been wanting to do for a couple years now; so I'm very much okay with WotC reviving it as a campaign setting. But I soooooo hope the next regular campaign will be set in Eberron! When it launched, and I saw the (poor) warforged and all the other techy-looking stuff in it, I just *knew* I was going to hate it: don't like steampunk; can't stand mecha...why would this be any different? Boy, was I ever wrong. So if Da Powers That Be are listening: I'd really think I deserve to wallow in my wrong-ness for a few more years. Just in case I haven't learned my lesson yet.....
kiddoc 08-20-07, 10:13 PM	Man, I'm personally horrified by all this! I still don't have the 3.5 rules under control yet (granted, I'm a tad slow with these things). But the bigger kicker to me is that whereas LG groups grow on trees 'round here, I've had one helluva time trying to find an XE group to play with...which means I've only gotten to play at GenCon '06 and '07. I love this campaign -- and the mag drops! -- I'm not ready for it to go away yet! . This is exactly the reason that the next Eberron campaign needs to be 4th edition. Hell, I've been DM'ing since 1985 and I still don't have 3.5 rules down. 4th is both simpler and more elegant. It was designed so that DM's and players could run adventures cold, with a minimum of rule-lawyer preparation. MAD drops, crazy Xen'drik features, and wild monsters are far more usable at both ends--and this is a good thing. While I love what you enjoy so much about this campaign, the factionmasters are just going to use what we've learned from players like you and combine it with the new, amazing 4th edition mechanics to make an even better campaign.
Harliquinn 08-21-07, 09:29 AM	From what I gathered at the RPGA Members Meeting is that the next D&D Campaigns will also be set in Eberron. I don't know if anyone can confirm or deny this. I like the D&D Campaigns style of game as well. The thing that always frustrated me in LG and LC before that was going to a convention and standing around saying "Level 2 bard looking for a table." No one at cons wanted to group with the newer characters and it was always a chore to find the 'right mix' that could survive. At least with Xen'drik, you have Fast Plays and can sit down at a table with almost any 5 other characters and have a decent shot at success. Everyone is 'around' the same level and the modules can really tell an advancing story. I have come to enjoy and care about my XE characters more than any other campaign I've played through the RPGA. This is due to both the support given to the campaign by the factionmasters, the wonderful adventures, and the faction-based system that lets me experience several different types of play without having to choose which adventures to play with which character. John
githmorien 08-22-07, 12:20 AM	Factionmaster, Sir! *Finally* got a chance to put a face to your name at Indy this year. Ah, awesome toys; extra cash; and a FM that's as good-looking as he is skillful: folks, it's goo-o-o-o-o-d to be Blackwheel! :ayyyy!: Thank you for the spelling correction. :doh: Just don't put me on KP. Contrary to popular belief, all us girl-types can't cook.... "Elegant" is definitely not a word that gets tossed around very much on these'ere boards, so to hear you actually use it to descibe 4th makes me feel a whole lot better about what's coming. If it will somehow take an already amazing setting and make it even better, then I'm all for it. I totally agree with John: there's sooo much stuff that's been done right here. And if it ain't broke.... - Jackie
Ishorn 08-22-07, 06:28 AM	From what I gathered at the RPGA Members Meeting is that the next D&D Campaigns will also be set in Eberron. I don't know if anyone can confirm or deny this. I like the D&D Campaigns style of game as well. The thing that always frustrated me in LG and LC before that was going to a convention and standing around saying "Level 2 bard looking for a table." No one at cons wanted to group with the newer characters and it was always a chore to find the 'right mix' that could survive. At least with Xen'drik, you have Fast Plays and can sit down at a table with almost any 5 other characters and have a decent shot at success. Everyone is 'around' the same level and the modules can really tell an advancing story. I have come to enjoy and care about my XE characters more than any other campaign I've played through the RPGA. This is due to both the support given to the campaign by the factionmasters, the wonderful adventures, and the faction-based system that lets me experience several different types of play without having to choose which adventures to play with which character. John The things you like about XE are the things I dislike about the D&D campaigns. I do not play D&D just for the sake of playing the game. I am into building a character and growing that character from level 1 onward. I made this point before and was told that was what my home campaign that my friend DMs is for not the responsibility of the RPGA. See I DM because no one in my area wants to. I would love to play a character but I find that unlike Hollywood everyone wants to act and no one wants to direct. Maybe things will change with 4th edition because WoTC is saying they will dummy down the process of DMing but I highly doubt it. I like Eberron and wish I could play a character in the setting. I guess I will keep supporting the setting by DMing adventures. By the way if you have trouble at the Rallying points at Cons tell the RPGA members running the events and they should be able to seat you with a group no matter what the others at the table say.
Harliquinn 08-22-07, 10:09 AM	The things you like about XE are the things I dislike about the D&D campaigns. I do not play D&D just for the sake of playing the game. I am into building a character and growing that character from level 1 onward. I made this point before and was told that was what my home campaign that my friend DMs is for not the responsibility of the RPGA. See I DM because no one in my area wants to. I would love to play a character but I find that unlike Hollywood everyone wants to act and no one wants to direct. Maybe things will change with 4th edition because WoTC is saying they will dummy down the process of DMing but I highly doubt it. I like Eberron and wish I could play a character in the setting. I guess I will keep supporting the setting by DMing adventures. By the way if you have trouble at the Rallying points at Cons tell the RPGA members running the events and they should be able to seat you with a group no matter what the others at the table say. There does seem to be two groups: Those that like the Living Campaigns and those that like the D&D Campaigns. I happen to fall in the middle. I do hear the argument "I like to grow and build a character." a lot from those in the Living Campaign group. However, that hasn't been a problem for me and for many others, since we came on board when it started. I have spent a lot of time on my Xen'drik characters; moreso than on some home game characters. I have carefully cultivated their personalities, their skills, and their style of play for over a year. Except for the first level bump (Where the Well of Woe was a 3-round adventure), all my characters have kept up with the bumps and it doesn't feel as if I've lost anything. Now, for those just coming into Xen'drik Expeditions, I can see how it might feel that you have lost out on that opportunity. I sometimes feel the same way when I think about starting a Living Greyhawk character. Though others are lower level, many of them are 'decked' out in lots of gear due to dying or getting ahead of the 'gold curve' as it were. And while sure a marshal can get you into a game at a con, it may or may not have a detrimental affect on the rest of the group. Eventually everyone gets to play, but if you are forced to sit and watch while a group of higher levels kills things or you need to babysit a lower level character, it's not always fun. What I like about the level bumps is if for some reason I was unable to play for a while, I could still be assured of being able to group with everyone else at the next Con. Some suggestions for those just starting Xen'drik Expeditions and want to have more of a 'I built this character from the ground up' feel: 1) Do some research into the past Xen'drik happenings and write a short story that explains your characters exploits, contributions, adventures, and contacts in the context of what has happened in the campaign so far. 2) Find a GM with the old adventures and request that he run them for you. You won't obviously get any GP/XP from them (or story objects) but you can at least play them and advance your character as if you were playing them in order. 3) Create a backstory of why you are just now arriving in Stormreach from other areas. A nice history of your character outside of Xen'drik Expeditions could add a lot of depth to a character at a table. This would let you be different from characters who have played in the campaign a while. Choose some exotic items, spells, or feats/abilities to highlight this further. These aren't perfect solutions, but they should help spark some ideas of your own as well. Also keep in mind that almost all Xen'drik Expeditions are playable online. I have had some wonderful online gaming experiences. The games tend to run long, but I have found that you can get a lot more RP going online sometimes than around the gaming table. Check out warhorn.net (AdHoc Game Day) as well as these forums for notices of games. John
Istaran 08-22-07, 03:40 PM	For me level bumps have made the difference between being able to play and not being able to play. That is because the main XE group in my area mysteriously dissappeared around the time of the first level bump (I literally have not seen any of those players in months and was never informed as to what happened to them). I was able to get in with another group that runs only two factions and doesn't meet often enough to have the option of running the other two, leaving me with highly skewed progress for my characters. Finally, just before this last level bump, I was able to pull together a group of players and judges to run/play all of the mods, just in time to rush through most of the non-DMs mark games before they expired. Now, after all the hickups, we're all level 7 (as opposed to Eyes of the Lich Queen 1/2 where we had levels 7, 5, 4, 4, 4 for example) and can move foreward from there with a balanced and fun set of parties. Also, I think the fact that everything was bumped to level 4 already made a big difference in recruitment, as some of the players were already tired of making new level 1 LG characters and struggling to hit level 3. (LG can get frustrating when the dice are against you. My former roommate had his first LG character die in the surprise round of his first ever combat. I lost one of my favorite chars permanently because we were forced to play up to APL 4 by the addition of a sixth player, a level 1 wizard who didn't have a clue what he was doing. Right now in LG I'm about where I was a year ago because of endless setbacks caused by assorted character deaths. In XE I've gone from playing around with level 1s to tearing it up with level 7s that are a great fun to play with in less time than it took me in LG to go from level 5 to.. well.. level 5.) I for one am glad the RPGA has both the level bumped D&D Campaigns and the Living campaigns running side by side. They definitely have different appeals which give more players what they want than if we were limited to only one style or the other.
Gargs454 08-22-07, 05:43 PM	This is exactly the reason that the next Eberron campaign needs to be 4th edition. Hell, I've been DM'ing since 1985 and I still don't have 3.5 rules down. 4th is both simpler and more elegant. It was designed so that DM's and players could run adventures cold, with a minimum of rule-lawyer preparation. MAD drops, crazy Xen'drik features, and wild monsters are far more usable at both ends--and this is a good thing. While I love what you enjoy so much about this campaign, the factionmasters are just going to use what we've learned from players like you and combine it with the new, amazing 4th edition mechanics to make an even better campaign. First off Kiddoc, let me say thanks for a great job at GenCon. I particularly appreciated your willingness to ensure that we last 3 standing generic ticket holders got seated Sunday morning for the Cabal faction adventure. As for Campaigns vs. Living, I think that my preference would be for a living campaign. The problem though is that I cannot seem to find a group around here to have a regular living campaign, so the XE system works well for me as I can continue to play and be relatively the same level as everyone else. In any event, I think its great that there are both options. As for 4th Edition, I have to admit that I was not exactly thrilled to learn that it was coming out. Personally, I have no problems with 3.5, though I understand the rationale. As for "streamlining" the system and making it less rules intensive, I just hope that it doesn't go the D&D Miniatures route whereby most of the rules are at best really dumbed down so to speak. I hope that it is more like 3.5 in the ability to customize the character with skills, feats, etc., than like the miniatures game. Obviously, not much can be said at this point, but that's just my 2 coppers. So long as everyone's character can be more or less unique and not forced to follow one of just a few templates in order to be effective, I'll be happy. Oh and on a side note, if Wizards wants to limit the necessity of a rules-lawyer, they can always remember not to publish 36 different supplements which all implement new rules and mechanics. ;)
smerwin29 08-22-07, 08:09 PM	To answer the original question, if there is still any uncertainty, Xen'drik Expeditions ends at Origins 2008 with the 3.5 rules. The D&D Campaign that replaces it (as yet announced) will use 4e. Shawn
Gargs454 08-22-07, 08:44 PM	I guess one follow up to that would be if the new D&D campaign will be launched at GenCon or if GenCon will only be featuring Living Forgotten Realms. Personally I hope its both if for no other reason than to provide for more games to try to get into. :)
smerwin29 08-22-07, 08:57 PM	To the best of my knowledge, the new D&D Campaign is scheduled for a GenCon debut, but nothing about it is set in stone until Chris Tulach says so.
lseelba 08-26-07, 03:16 AM	Xen'drik might not be the best setting for the next Campaign, but I'd love to stick with Eberron. Maybe Sarlona Expeditions or (gasp) Argonnessen Expeditions lol
Marcus Majarra 08-27-07, 01:56 PM	Or maybe something more generalistic. Something that could take you anywhere you needed to be. That was one of the good things I enjoyed about MoH's Digger's Union. You went to plenty of places (and even to the past).
Hellcast 09-02-07, 10:22 AM	I agree with Marcus. Eberron is too big just to use one continent and one city.
Harliquinn 09-02-07, 11:21 AM	Or maybe something more generalistic. Something that could take you anywhere you needed to be. That was one of the good things I enjoyed about MoH's Digger's Union. You went to plenty of places (and even to the past). I think we'll see something like this. Though, we have gone to a few different places even in Xen'drik. If you did the Eyes of the Lich Queen especially. I would like to see something in the Lhazaar area with Mror Holds, Q'bara and the SE part of Khorvaire.