Dragon Fire Adept and Metabreath Feats [Archive] - Wizards Community

Dragon Fire Adept and Metabreath Feats [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Fiery_Fighter_Drake
05-06-07, 10:31 AM Hey all. I''ll be playing a Dragon Fire Adept soon as was wondering how metabreath feats are applied to a DFA's breath weapon. As you probably know, a DFA's breath weapon has no recharge time unlike a Dragon Shaman, and the drawback of metabreath feats is that they increase the recharge time for the breath weapon when applied. This means that metabreath weapons like Heighten Breath would be great for a DFA since the class can reap the benefits without any drawbacks.

I'm asking this in all fairness as I may be the only person playing a Dragon Fire Adept but what to see if this loop-hole will be resolved.
pedr
05-06-07, 11:03 AM Some opinions here: http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=821233

In short, the conclusion of that thread was 'no'. Not XE-specific, of course, and I've not checked the accuracy of the quotations of the source material, but if that's the wording of the two different abilities then I'd agree that a DfA is ineligible to take them, or at the very least can't apply them to the main breath weapon.
Fiery_Fighter_Drake
05-06-07, 11:53 AM Well, thanks. Guess that's a no then.

I have another question though; what's the starting equipment GP for a Dragonfire Adept? In fact, DFA isn't listed in the Campaign Standards though it's nor restricted either. *sigh* What's a DFA player to do?
Skerrit
05-07-07, 10:33 AM Good question, I will look into it.
Istaran
05-07-07, 10:44 PM I'm asking this in all fairness as I may be the only person playing a Dragon Fire Adept but what to see if this loop-hole will be resolved.

Nope. My Cabal character is a warforged DFA. That makes him a dragonblooded construct.. don't think too hard about that.

As you probably know, a DFA's breath weapon has no recharge time unlike a Dragon Shaman, and the drawback of metabreath feats is that they increase the recharge time for the breath weapon when applied. This means that metabreath weapons like Heighten Breath would be great for a DFA since the class can reap the benefits without any drawbacks.

It seems like the most generous ruling would be that you go from 0 rounds delay ("at will") to a delay equal to the added delay from the feats. So some metabreath feats would be "free" such as a round of Clinging Breath, while others would not be (if you breath then Quicken Breath to breath again, you're out of breath for quite some time).

In short, the conclusion of that thread was 'no'. Not XE-specific, of course, and I've not checked the accuracy of the quotations of the source material, but if that's the wording of the two different abilities then I'd agree that a DfA is ineligible to take them, or at the very least can't apply them to the main breath weapon.

As a DFA, you have only one breath weapon; the breath effects modify your breath weapon, they don't give you addition alternate breath weapons. It's a nitpick point, but then so is the "You don't qualify for breath weapons because yours is at will" point. Technically, nothing in the RAW says a DFA 4/ dragon shaman 4 can't take a metabreath feat and apply it to both classes' breath weapons. It only says you have to 'have' a breath weapon with a delay expressed in rounds. For that matter I don't see why a DFA can't use the recent campaign card to apply a metabreath feat he doesn't qualify for.
KShaver
05-08-07, 04:42 PM It seems like the most generous ruling would be that you go from 0 rounds delay ("at will") to a delay equal to the added delay from the feats. So some metabreath feats would be "free" such as a round of Clinging Breath, while others would not be (if you breath then Quicken Breath to breath again, you're out of breath for quite some time).

While good in theory you have to be carefull, there is more to consider than just the DFA. A sorc with draconic breath is also about the same as at will and is not significantly effected by having their breath weapon out of commision for a few rounds (generally thier nukes are almost identical to their breath weapon). The real consideration is x/day breath weapon usage (which existed at the time the feats were written and I assume is why the limitation was put on them), whom generally have powerful breath weapons and would not be affected by any sort of increase in rounds of cool down (take clinging breath as every feat and press the 'I Win' button x times per day).

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Fiery_Fighter_Drake 05-06-07, 10:31 AM	Hey all. I''ll be playing a Dragon Fire Adept soon as was wondering how metabreath feats are applied to a DFA's breath weapon. As you probably know, a DFA's breath weapon has no recharge time unlike a Dragon Shaman, and the drawback of metabreath feats is that they increase the recharge time for the breath weapon when applied. This means that metabreath weapons like Heighten Breath would be great for a DFA since the class can reap the benefits without any drawbacks. I'm asking this in all fairness as I may be the only person playing a Dragon Fire Adept but what to see if this loop-hole will be resolved.
pedr 05-06-07, 11:03 AM	Some opinions here: http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=821233 In short, the conclusion of that thread was 'no'. Not XE-specific, of course, and I've not checked the accuracy of the quotations of the source material, but if that's the wording of the two different abilities then I'd agree that a DfA is ineligible to take them, or at the very least can't apply them to the main breath weapon.
Fiery_Fighter_Drake 05-06-07, 11:53 AM	Well, thanks. Guess that's a no then. I have another question though; what's the starting equipment GP for a Dragonfire Adept? In fact, DFA isn't listed in the Campaign Standards though it's nor restricted either. sigh What's a DFA player to do?
Skerrit 05-07-07, 10:33 AM	Good question, I will look into it.
Istaran 05-07-07, 10:44 PM	I'm asking this in all fairness as I may be the only person playing a Dragon Fire Adept but what to see if this loop-hole will be resolved. Nope. My Cabal character is a warforged DFA. That makes him a dragonblooded construct.. don't think too hard about that. As you probably know, a DFA's breath weapon has no recharge time unlike a Dragon Shaman, and the drawback of metabreath feats is that they increase the recharge time for the breath weapon when applied. This means that metabreath weapons like Heighten Breath would be great for a DFA since the class can reap the benefits without any drawbacks. It seems like the most generous ruling would be that you go from 0 rounds delay ("at will") to a delay equal to the added delay from the feats. So some metabreath feats would be "free" such as a round of Clinging Breath, while others would not be (if you breath then Quicken Breath to breath again, you're out of breath for quite some time). In short, the conclusion of that thread was 'no'. Not XE-specific, of course, and I've not checked the accuracy of the quotations of the source material, but if that's the wording of the two different abilities then I'd agree that a DfA is ineligible to take them, or at the very least can't apply them to the main breath weapon. As a DFA, you have only one breath weapon; the breath effects modify your breath weapon, they don't give you addition alternate breath weapons. It's a nitpick point, but then so is the "You don't qualify for breath weapons because yours is at will" point. Technically, nothing in the RAW says a DFA 4/ dragon shaman 4 can't take a metabreath feat and apply it to both classes' breath weapons. It only says you have to 'have' a breath weapon with a delay expressed in rounds. For that matter I don't see why a DFA can't use the recent campaign card to apply a metabreath feat he doesn't qualify for.
KShaver 05-08-07, 04:42 PM	It seems like the most generous ruling would be that you go from 0 rounds delay ("at will") to a delay equal to the added delay from the feats. So some metabreath feats would be "free" such as a round of Clinging Breath, while others would not be (if you breath then Quicken Breath to breath again, you're out of breath for quite some time). While good in theory you have to be carefull, there is more to consider than just the DFA. A sorc with draconic breath is also about the same as at will and is not significantly effected by having their breath weapon out of commision for a few rounds (generally thier nukes are almost identical to their breath weapon). The real consideration is x/day breath weapon usage (which existed at the time the feats were written and I assume is why the limitation was put on them), whom generally have powerful breath weapons and would not be affected by any sort of increase in rounds of cool down (take clinging breath as every feat and press the 'I Win' button x times per day).