Gnoll HD [Archive] - Wizards Community - Pages Merged by Solauren

Gnoll HD [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
warderbrad
11-18-06, 04:15 PM I could have sworn that I read something that said that a Gnoll from the Blackwheel Company is +1 LA but does not get the 2 HD. Am I totally of here or was that written somewhere?
Skerrit
11-19-06, 10:39 AM That is correct. Gnolls are +1 LA and get all the gnoll racial traits, but gain no extra HD or skill points.
ispq
11-21-06, 05:07 AM Which will hopefully be explicitly stated in the posted Campaign Standards Document soon.
Skerrit
11-21-06, 09:05 AM It is.
ispq
11-22-06, 03:23 AM I didn't much care for the proposed gnoll listing in the 1.1A draft document. It read oddly and seemed ambigious on points.

I personally feel gnolls for Xen'Drick Expiditions should simply be a custom race with a +1 LA with a PHB style entry in the campaign document. This would end confusion. The current system requires people to edit the monster manual entry to fully understand the race.
smerwin29
11-22-06, 08:52 AM The invitation is still open for someone to write it so it reads perfectly and everyone will understand it.

Shawn
Marcus Majarra
11-22-06, 07:03 PM The invitation is still open for someone to write it so it reads perfectly and everyone will understand it.

Here I go:

GNOLL
Relentless hunters, gnoll characters often begin their adventures by tracking a quarry into the world of humankind. There, they take up the role of bounty hunters and mercenaries.

Gnoll characters possess the following racial traits.

—+4 Strength, +2 Constitution, -2 Intelligence, -2 Charisma.
—Medium: As Medium creatures, gnolls have no special bonuses or penalties due to their size.
—Humanoid (gnoll): Gnolls are humanoids with the gnoll subtype.
—Gnoll base land speed is 30 feet.
—+1 natural armor bonus.
—Darkvision: Gnolls can see in the dark up to 60 feet. Darkvision is black and white only, but it is otherwise like normal sight, and gnolls can function just fine with no light at all.
—Automatic Language: Gnoll. Bonus Languages: Common, Draconic, Elven, Goblin, Orc. A gnoll in the Blackwheel Company is expected to be able to communicate with his peers and superiors. As such, gnoll characters must be able to speak the Common language.
—Favored Class: Ranger.
—Level adjustment +1.
ispq
11-23-06, 04:53 AM Looks good to me.
pedr
11-23-06, 07:52 AM One very minor alteration: under languages, it's acceptable for a BC Gnoll to have a 12 Int and therefore a bonus language to spend on Common.

So perhaps: "As such, players with gnoll characters must begin the campaign knowing Common, either by spending a bonus language or spending skill points on 'Speak Language: Common'.
Butterface
11-23-06, 12:01 PM I think the Gnoll write up in the draft was fine, I honestly don't know what people are having trouble understanding.

The write up that Marcus did doesn't clear up any of the confusion over things that BWC gnolls DON'T get, like extra HD or extra skill points. I think the point that Shawn Merwin was making (and if I'm putting words in your mouth please correct me) is that it may be impossible to write everything up exactly right so that everyone understands it perfectly. It's in the draft as plain as can be!

You don't have to edit the Monster Manual version of Gnoll - the draft write up tells you exactly what you DO and DON'T have. Is the majority of your beef with it that it doesn't have the benefits you receive in a list style with dashes to the side? If so, that kind of gets into the realm of nitpicking IMO.
Marcus Majarra
11-23-06, 05:56 PM The write up that Marcus did doesn't clear up any of the confusion over things that BWC gnolls DON'T get, like extra HD or extra skill points.
It wasn't meant to correlate to the MM gnoll. It's stand-alone, and reads pretty well on its own.
ispq
11-24-06, 12:45 AM I think the Gnoll write up in the draft was fine, I honestly don't know what people are having trouble understanding.

The write up that Marcus did doesn't clear up any of the confusion over things that BWC gnolls DON'T get, like extra HD or extra skill points. I think the point that Shawn Merwin was making (and if I'm putting words in your mouth please correct me) is that it may be impossible to write everything up exactly right so that everyone understands it perfectly. It's in the draft as plain as can be!

The draft did not clear things up. The one Marcus just posted is exactly what gnolls needed to have, a PHB style listing of exactly what you get.
kiddoc
11-24-06, 10:58 AM The draft did not clear things up. The one Marcus just posted is exactly what gnolls needed to have, a PHB style listing of exactly what you get.

And I certainly appreciate Marcus' effort--it looks fantastic. One of the reasons that entry was added (and I admit, I am only so good at so many things, and adventure writing is my strong point :blush: ), was because of the glut of "OMFG!@!$!@#)(*#* ken u pla a gnoll w/33 hp at lev3l 1!!!!" statements that came even when the issue was clarified. There were a great many players that simply referenced the MM first, thinking a gnoll is a gnoll is a gnoll. So in any entry, particularly one as parsimonious as Marcus' there probably should be a statement in there that quickly points out that this information is the "complete" gnoll package and supercedes any MM entry/text. I guarantee we will see people saying, "WTF this gnoll entry sUx0rs!!! it's missing all the stuff from the MM--somebody made a typo!!!" At least if we mention that in the entry, the direction we point those people after they ask is obvious. ;)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
warderbrad 11-18-06, 04:15 PM	I could have sworn that I read something that said that a Gnoll from the Blackwheel Company is +1 LA but does not get the 2 HD. Am I totally of here or was that written somewhere?
Skerrit 11-19-06, 10:39 AM	That is correct. Gnolls are +1 LA and get all the gnoll racial traits, but gain no extra HD or skill points.
ispq 11-21-06, 05:07 AM	Which will hopefully be explicitly stated in the posted Campaign Standards Document soon.
Skerrit 11-21-06, 09:05 AM	It is.
ispq 11-22-06, 03:23 AM	I didn't much care for the proposed gnoll listing in the 1.1A draft document. It read oddly and seemed ambigious on points. I personally feel gnolls for Xen'Drick Expiditions should simply be a custom race with a +1 LA with a PHB style entry in the campaign document. This would end confusion. The current system requires people to edit the monster manual entry to fully understand the race.
smerwin29 11-22-06, 08:52 AM	The invitation is still open for someone to write it so it reads perfectly and everyone will understand it. Shawn
Marcus Majarra 11-22-06, 07:03 PM	The invitation is still open for someone to write it so it reads perfectly and everyone will understand it. Here I go: GNOLL Relentless hunters, gnoll characters often begin their adventures by tracking a quarry into the world of humankind. There, they take up the role of bounty hunters and mercenaries. Gnoll characters possess the following racial traits. —+4 Strength, +2 Constitution, -2 Intelligence, -2 Charisma. —Medium: As Medium creatures, gnolls have no special bonuses or penalties due to their size. —Humanoid (gnoll): Gnolls are humanoids with the gnoll subtype. —Gnoll base land speed is 30 feet. —+1 natural armor bonus. —Darkvision: Gnolls can see in the dark up to 60 feet. Darkvision is black and white only, but it is otherwise like normal sight, and gnolls can function just fine with no light at all. —Automatic Language: Gnoll. Bonus Languages: Common, Draconic, Elven, Goblin, Orc. A gnoll in the Blackwheel Company is expected to be able to communicate with his peers and superiors. As such, gnoll characters must be able to speak the Common language. —Favored Class: Ranger. —Level adjustment +1.
ispq 11-23-06, 04:53 AM	Looks good to me.
pedr 11-23-06, 07:52 AM	One very minor alteration: under languages, it's acceptable for a BC Gnoll to have a 12 Int and therefore a bonus language to spend on Common. So perhaps: "As such, players with gnoll characters must begin the campaign knowing Common, either by spending a bonus language or spending skill points on 'Speak Language: Common'.
Butterface 11-23-06, 12:01 PM	I think the Gnoll write up in the draft was fine, I honestly don't know what people are having trouble understanding. The write up that Marcus did doesn't clear up any of the confusion over things that BWC gnolls DON'T get, like extra HD or extra skill points. I think the point that Shawn Merwin was making (and if I'm putting words in your mouth please correct me) is that it may be impossible to write everything up exactly right so that everyone understands it perfectly. It's in the draft as plain as can be! You don't have to edit the Monster Manual version of Gnoll - the draft write up tells you exactly what you DO and DON'T have. Is the majority of your beef with it that it doesn't have the benefits you receive in a list style with dashes to the side? If so, that kind of gets into the realm of nitpicking IMO.
Marcus Majarra 11-23-06, 05:56 PM	The write up that Marcus did doesn't clear up any of the confusion over things that BWC gnolls DON'T get, like extra HD or extra skill points. It wasn't meant to correlate to the MM gnoll. It's stand-alone, and reads pretty well on its own.
ispq 11-24-06, 12:45 AM	I think the Gnoll write up in the draft was fine, I honestly don't know what people are having trouble understanding. The write up that Marcus did doesn't clear up any of the confusion over things that BWC gnolls DON'T get, like extra HD or extra skill points. I think the point that Shawn Merwin was making (and if I'm putting words in your mouth please correct me) is that it may be impossible to write everything up exactly right so that everyone understands it perfectly. It's in the draft as plain as can be! The draft did not clear things up. The one Marcus just posted is exactly what gnolls needed to have, a PHB style listing of exactly what you get.
kiddoc 11-24-06, 10:58 AM	The draft did not clear things up. The one Marcus just posted is exactly what gnolls needed to have, a PHB style listing of exactly what you get. And I certainly appreciate Marcus' effort--it looks fantastic. One of the reasons that entry was added (and I admit, I am only so good at so many things, and adventure writing is my strong point :blush: ), was because of the glut of "OMFG!@!$!@#)(# ken u pla a gnoll w/33 hp at lev3l 1!!!!" statements that came even when the issue was clarified. There were a great many players that simply referenced the MM first, thinking a gnoll is a gnoll is a gnoll. So in any entry, particularly one as parsimonious as Marcus' there probably should be a statement in there that quickly points out that this information is the "complete" gnoll package and supercedes any MM entry/text. I guarantee we will see people saying, "WTF this gnoll entry sUx0rs!!! it's missing all the stuff from the MM--somebody made a typo!!!" At least if we mention that in the entry, the direction we point those people after they ask is obvious. ;)