Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Skerrit 12-03-06, 09:57 PM	The XECS 1.1 has been posted on the XE site.
tilloch 12-03-06, 10:01 PM	Greg, Thanks for handling all of our "issues" with the new CS. I hate to be the one to bring this up, but is there still going to be re-tool? Will it be before the WF level bump or after? Tilloch
Harliquinn 12-03-06, 11:53 PM	Wow, let me just say "Thank you!" The FactionMasters (And anyone else who helped make them official) have created a very solid and versatile set of campaign rules. This should definitely allow players to play pretty much anything they could think of! Thanks again for all your hard work! John
Skerrit 12-04-06, 09:13 AM	Yes there will be a character retooling so you can comply with the new (and greatly expanded rules). You should not expect this kind of thing with every rules update, but the changes were so broad that it is necessary this time around. Hopefully we will have an announcement up on the XE site in the next few days describing the retooling.
Harliquinn 12-04-06, 10:58 AM	Question, does taking a Racial or Class Substition Level behave in much the same way as adding a Class or Prestige Class to your list? The main question is, if the Racial or Class Substitution level gives you a feat, allows you to pick a particular spell/ability, or some other choice, are the choices then considered unlocked for the specific purpose of choice for this substitution? The case in point: A Dragon Shaman Class Substitution allows the Dragon Shaman to lose one Draconic Aura for a Least Invocation from the Warlock list. Does doing this require 2 Expansion Slots only and the player gets to pick an Invocation or does this require 2 Expansion Slots and the player must spend another expansion slot to unlock the particular Invocation chosen? Thanks! Harliquinn
Skerrit 12-04-06, 02:34 PM	Yours is an unusual case that I think the rules cover, but poorly at the moment. The way it works now is you get the substituation level, and then you have access to any invocation which you already have unlocked or is unlimited. Since this probably means none, you need to also unlock an invocation. Now, I don't have the exact wording in front of me. If it says you can pick any invocation from the Warlock base list (meaning anything from Complete Arcane) then you may do just that without extra expansion slots. If it reads that way and you wanted an invocation from a different book you need the expansion slots. I think this is something that I will look into for XECS 2.0.
Harliquinn 12-04-06, 02:52 PM	I don't have the books in front of me, but I think it was a generic "You may choose any Warlock least invocation."
Harliquinn 12-04-06, 05:00 PM	Okay I was somewhat incorrect. The Dragon Shaman substitution is this: Give up the new Draconic Aura at 5th level. The benefit is that "you learn one of the least draconic invocations available to dragonfire adepts (in Dragon Magic)." So given that, which way would it go? Using 2 or 4 expansion slots? Given the cost and 1st level only of the class substitution, I would think that fulfilling that substitution level would open up the single invocation you choose, but that's just my opinion. I assume that similar wording in other classes would be adjudicated the same way (For instance some of the substitution levels give a mount or animal companion from Dragon Magic as well). Thanks again Harliquinn
Skerrit 12-04-06, 11:14 PM	It specifies a class and book, so without reading it, I would say that sounds like 2 slots based on what you have written.
Harliquinn 12-05-06, 08:22 AM	Okay sounds good to me (Was hoping that was the answer). I'll plan it out that way and if it turns out to be the other way I can always change it (It doesn't come into play until level 5 anyways). Thanks much for the feedback! The book name is actually just a page number, but still a very specific reference. Harliquinn
SirArion 12-05-06, 01:26 PM	Where are those Dragon Shaman class substitution options from? Which book?
Butterface 12-05-06, 03:10 PM	Where are those Dragon Shaman class substitution options from? Which book? I'm curious as well. :)
Harliquinn 12-05-06, 03:10 PM	Dragon Magic, and there's only the one that I'm aware of.
Madfox11 12-06-06, 05:56 AM	Which brings me to the question: can the alternate class features of Dragon Magic be used or not? If so, is it only available to the Crimson Codex or all factions? As far as I can see nothing is mentioned about it in Xecs 1.1....
Harliquinn 12-06-06, 09:09 AM	Dragon Magic is on the list of approved optional sources and it includes class subsitutions, which are allowed by the Campaign Standards. Therefore, it is my understanding that you can unlock one of those as your 1st expansion slot the same as you would something from a Races of book or anything else. That said, only Crimson Codex members could technically unlock the Dragon Shaman alternate features because the Dragon Shaman is only available to CC without a card or expansion slot. Therefore if say a Blackwheel Company wanted to do a Dragon Shaman, they would have to spend their 1st expansion slots on unlocking that class, thereby preventing them from using their 1st expansion slots to unlock the class substitution. I think this works nicely as it allows people to play different classes that other factions unlock but without all the options available. Harliquinn
Madfox11 12-07-06, 05:01 AM	If true, I advice the Faction Masters to change the wording of Xecs next version ;) Right now it specifically talks about the alternate class features from PHBII and not any other sourse. Can you actually take multiple class substitutions at first level?
Harliquinn 12-07-06, 08:50 AM	If true, I advice the Faction Masters to change the wording of Xecs next version ;) Right now it specifically talks about the alternate class features from PHBII and not any other sourse. Can you actually take multiple class substitutions at first level? Hmm well it's possible then that I was wrong. I remember reading about Player's Handbook II in the XECS, but I guess I assumed that class or racial substitutions in any of the optional books were allowed. The Dragon Shaman substitution is in Dragon Magic, so it may be true it's not allowed. I guess I will wait a bit before getting excited. Perhaps the faction masters can clear up the intent and say whether only PHBII class substitutions are allowed or if those from other optional sources are allowed as well. As for the other question, you can't take multiple class substitutions since you only have one expansion unlock at 1st level and it has to be a class substitution of your starting class. Harli
Skerrit 12-07-06, 09:44 AM	All the other sources are allowed. The part that lists PHBII was supposed to be an example, but not the end all of the list. It doesn't really read that way however and it will be changed in v2.0
Harliquinn 12-07-06, 12:46 PM	Schweet!!! You guys rock. Seriously, thanks for the fast replies. I know this isn't your full time job, so your efforts are much appreciated! Harliquinn
Madfox11 12-08-06, 09:59 AM	Good. But what about my second question: Can you take 2 substitutions? Or for that matter, take a new feat AND a class substitution (many of the class substitutions in the Dragon Magic require Dragon Blood feat)?
Skerrit 12-08-06, 12:42 PM	You cannot. You could for example unlock the racial subsitutions for (all levels of) Dragon Shaman, but you could not unlock the racial substitutions for Dragon Shamon and say cleric. If you mean alternate class abilities, no, you only unlock one. I don't have Dragon Magic with me, so its hard to comment on the substitutions and the feat, but I believe you would likely have to unlock the substituations first and then the feat later. If you need both at first level, then it is not possible with the current rules.
Harliquinn 12-12-06, 09:02 AM	Just to clarify, we can only unlock an alternate class feature for the class we take at 1st level correct? I know it states this, but I wasn't sure if that was the intention. Thanks!
Skerrit 12-12-06, 07:34 PM	Correct
Harliquinn 12-14-06, 10:07 AM	Another question: Are Siberys Dragonshards allowed to be purchased with our gold? If they are used as consummable items (In the Dragon Totem Rituals for instance), are they purchased at 5x the normal cost and then they renew at the end of each adventure? I guess another question is, are the Dragon Totem Rituals going to be allowed? They aren't restricted in the XECS 1.1, but that could have been because they were not considered when the document was written.
Istaran 12-14-06, 03:29 PM	On a semi-related note, there was a spell in complete arcane (ring of blades or something like that. Dont' have the book here) that used a dagger as a material component. Do you need to pay 5x for the dagger if you want it to replenish, and face gold loss if you use a dagger not bought at 5x cost to cast the spell? I ask because it's a wierd corner case where the material component is used up, but is an item normally used as a non-consumable. There could be other such cases that I haven't noticed yet.
Skerrit 12-14-06, 04:06 PM	Indeed, Ring of Blades (CA) does use a dagger for a material componant (not a focus) so this item goes away everytime you cast the spell. This means, since it is not a currancy if you want it to come back everytime you play, you do need to pay x5 for the spell componant dagger, or list its cost as lost gold (2 gp) each time. Both would be acceptable. Here's the relavent part from the XECS v1.1: Expensive Spell Components: Spell components that are expended in the casting of a spell (i.e. they are components and not foci) are considered consumable items and cost five times normal cost. The exceptions to this rule are those components that can be treated as currency, such as coins and gems. These components can be purchased for book value at normal cost and are not subject to the times five multiple for other consumables.