Copying Epic Spells from spellbooks? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Copying Epic Spells from spellbooks? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Arturius1
04-29-08, 05:22 PM I'm a wizard and just defeated an epic wizard and learned he had an epic spell in his spellbook. I have the Epic Spellcasting feat, but haven't made any spells yet. Would I be able to copy the spell from the spellbook and use it right away? Or would I have to go through the normal creation costs for epic spells? I'm level 26.
Eldritch_Lord
04-29-08, 07:50 PM I'm a wizard and just defeated an epic wizard and learned he had an epic spell in his spellbook. I have the Epic Spellcasting feat, but haven't made any spells yet. Would I be able to copy the spell from the spellbook and use it right away? Or would I have to go through the normal creation costs for epic spells? I'm level 26.

So far as I know, the only way to copy a spell is to get it from a stone tablet; there's an option in creation to copy it on a tablet for easy research by others, and a spellbook won't cut it. It says that, at the cost of x2 DC, "Epic spells may only be inscribed on stone tablets or other substances of equal or greater hardness. Once a spell is so inscribed, another epic spellcaster can learn it without going through the process of development. Once an inscribed epic spell is learned by another epic spellcaster in this fashion, the tablet upon which it is inscribed is destroyed and cannot be mended."

So if it's just a spellbook, you can't learn it and it won't help unless your DM houserules that it'll work.
Taeldrin Laesrash
04-29-08, 09:22 PM Presuming your DM has the book work like a stone tablet, then you can just copy it down without cost.
Loren Pechtel
05-01-08, 02:16 PM Presuming your DM has the book work like a stone tablet, then you can just copy it down without cost.

But that's *NOT* how it's supposed to work. You don't get his epic spells, period.
Tequila_Sunrise
05-01-08, 07:59 PM Obviously, that IS how it works in Arturius' game.

TS
Jaerom Darkwind
05-15-08, 09:10 AM Given that epic spells cannot be recorded in spellbooks at all under normal rules, one really cannot make any absolute statements about how this situation works.
Selgard
05-15-08, 10:08 AM Agreed.

Ask your DM.

Or, if your campaign is of the medium-to-heavy RP sort, find a sage or library and research the answer. :)
Bloodsoul
05-15-08, 08:34 PM Transmute paper to stone? :shifty:
BillTheManiac
05-16-08, 09:45 PM Or, if your campaign is of the medium-to-heavy RP sort, find a sage or library and research the answer. :)

Just trying to read the spell seems like a reasonable approach. Using the same mindset of copying an ordinary spell should work.
elondir
05-19-08, 11:47 AM Questions:

If you incsribe it on a stone tablet, do you have to cast it at that DC when you cast it your x times per day?

Is the DC just a one-time cost for the tablet?

Can you cast it normally once you learn it, even though you put it on a tablet?

Can you make multiple tablets?

What is the DC of the spellcraft check to learn an epic spell on a tablet? Is it the casting DC?
rob_douglas
05-20-08, 11:59 AM They really messed up the Stone Tablet thing. The only purpose of that feature is to make it so someone else can learn the spell for no cost - and how do you get that? You pay double the cost. Cost of development is preserved. And by the RAW, yes, it would then require you to meet the higher DC to cast, which also makes no sense since presumably Stone Tablets are for teaching weaker casters, but you just handicapped the spell DC.

I think it should be a one time cost. The story reason I would use the Stone Tablet is to give epic spells to PCs as a reward. So you would just increase the cost of development, but not the actual Spell DC for any other purpose. Then I would allow more than 1 other person to learn from the Stone Tablet - which then makes it worth doing. It can't be infinite other learners, because then you get lots and lots of epic spells running around...

ROB
elondir
05-21-08, 09:00 AM Sounds like a good idea to me. Basically make the spell normally, then whenever you want to make a stone tablet of it, you just pay the R&D cost in gp and xp. That puts it more in line with scrolls.
Jaerom Darkwind
05-21-08, 09:13 AM Indeed. Though I would limit it to one person learning the spell per tablet. I believe there was a factor someone invented (x5 or x10) to record an epic spell onto a gold or platinum (or equivalent) tablet, which allowed unlimited learning.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Arturius1 04-29-08, 05:22 PM	I'm a wizard and just defeated an epic wizard and learned he had an epic spell in his spellbook. I have the Epic Spellcasting feat, but haven't made any spells yet. Would I be able to copy the spell from the spellbook and use it right away? Or would I have to go through the normal creation costs for epic spells? I'm level 26.
Eldritch_Lord 04-29-08, 07:50 PM	I'm a wizard and just defeated an epic wizard and learned he had an epic spell in his spellbook. I have the Epic Spellcasting feat, but haven't made any spells yet. Would I be able to copy the spell from the spellbook and use it right away? Or would I have to go through the normal creation costs for epic spells? I'm level 26. So far as I know, the only way to copy a spell is to get it from a stone tablet; there's an option in creation to copy it on a tablet for easy research by others, and a spellbook won't cut it. It says that, at the cost of x2 DC, "Epic spells may only be inscribed on stone tablets or other substances of equal or greater hardness. Once a spell is so inscribed, another epic spellcaster can learn it without going through the process of development. Once an inscribed epic spell is learned by another epic spellcaster in this fashion, the tablet upon which it is inscribed is destroyed and cannot be mended." So if it's just a spellbook, you can't learn it and it won't help unless your DM houserules that it'll work.
Taeldrin Laesrash 04-29-08, 09:22 PM	Presuming your DM has the book work like a stone tablet, then you can just copy it down without cost.
Loren Pechtel 05-01-08, 02:16 PM	Presuming your DM has the book work like a stone tablet, then you can just copy it down without cost. But that's NOT how it's supposed to work. You don't get his epic spells, period.
Tequila_Sunrise 05-01-08, 07:59 PM	Obviously, that IS how it works in Arturius' game. TS
Jaerom Darkwind 05-15-08, 09:10 AM	Given that epic spells cannot be recorded in spellbooks at all under normal rules, one really cannot make any absolute statements about how this situation works.
Selgard 05-15-08, 10:08 AM	Agreed. Ask your DM. Or, if your campaign is of the medium-to-heavy RP sort, find a sage or library and research the answer. :)
Bloodsoul 05-15-08, 08:34 PM	Transmute paper to stone? :shifty:
BillTheManiac 05-16-08, 09:45 PM	Or, if your campaign is of the medium-to-heavy RP sort, find a sage or library and research the answer. :) Just trying to read the spell seems like a reasonable approach. Using the same mindset of copying an ordinary spell should work.
elondir 05-19-08, 11:47 AM	Questions: If you incsribe it on a stone tablet, do you have to cast it at that DC when you cast it your x times per day? Is the DC just a one-time cost for the tablet? Can you cast it normally once you learn it, even though you put it on a tablet? Can you make multiple tablets? What is the DC of the spellcraft check to learn an epic spell on a tablet? Is it the casting DC?
rob_douglas 05-20-08, 11:59 AM	They really messed up the Stone Tablet thing. The only purpose of that feature is to make it so someone else can learn the spell for no cost - and how do you get that? You pay double the cost. Cost of development is preserved. And by the RAW, yes, it would then require you to meet the higher DC to cast, which also makes no sense since presumably Stone Tablets are for teaching weaker casters, but you just handicapped the spell DC. I think it should be a one time cost. The story reason I would use the Stone Tablet is to give epic spells to PCs as a reward. So you would just increase the cost of development, but not the actual Spell DC for any other purpose. Then I would allow more than 1 other person to learn from the Stone Tablet - which then makes it worth doing. It can't be infinite other learners, because then you get lots and lots of epic spells running around... ROB
elondir 05-21-08, 09:00 AM	Sounds like a good idea to me. Basically make the spell normally, then whenever you want to make a stone tablet of it, you just pay the R&D cost in gp and xp. That puts it more in line with scrolls.
Jaerom Darkwind 05-21-08, 09:13 AM	Indeed. Though I would limit it to one person learning the spell per tablet. I believe there was a factor someone invented (x5 or x10) to record an epic spell onto a gold or platinum (or equivalent) tablet, which allowed unlimited learning.